Everyone is missing the boat!! With all the bullcrap that ron arra has sold everyone, all of a sudden evryone wants to cast 100+ yards.

The truth is and, I have fished a long time,I would like you to tell me how you set-up on a fish that far out?? Its crazy, what good is getting the hit if you cant set the hook??
I have landed many,many 30+pound fish within 20 feet of the shore!!

Another fact, more fish are cast over than cast too!! At night,90percent of the fish caught are right in the wash at your feet.

Those guys are strickly distance casters for compatition!! They are not "fisherman".Distance casting for competative reasons is totaly and completly different form surf casting.Everything for those guys is perfect,special weights,casting in a field, no wind etc,etc,etc.....

I have caught thousands of fish with levelwind reels without a problem.I have never,in 17plus years of surfcasting seen anyone surfcasting with a non-levelwind reel ever!! The only rare exection being chunkers who do not have to cast repetedly.

It is wise to worry about catching fish and not distance tournement casting.

Bill I think I can answer your question. come on down to hatteras and watch what guys throwing 75 yards catch and then watch what the guys throwing 125 yards catch. Bill I am guessing that oyu have not traveled much, your post would enflame any board that deals with things south of NJ where there is a premium on being able to whip it out there. I know a few guys who can toss 500 or 600 feet or more and would quite enflamed if you told them they were not "real"fisherman. BTW the catch loads of stripers down sout throwing really far, gott athrow to where the stucture is, in RI an many NE haunts its in close......but thats not always true.......

The tone (critical and condecending)of your post seems to be we are fools for wanting to throw far, but who is the fool Bill? The guy who learns to throw far or the guy who slams those who do learn to throw far because he doesnt understand?

There's a time and place for everything. True most of the time the bass will hit a bomber 10 feet out. However , I have been standing on the shore in the fall watching stripers breaking out about 150 yards and wished I could reach. Now with the Breakaway 11'9" , I can. One of my best recollections of feeling helpless to reach fish comes from about 1988. In those days I did several trips each fall to Montauk. I can remember on morning when I started at the light and just walked the beach towards Shagwong point following a school of 30 plus pound bass as they drifted along the shore. They were too far out and I just had to be there incase they came in close. Well they never did. But If had the rod to launch a popper150 yards , I would have been into them fish for hours.
Another vivid memory comes from East Beach. In the late eighties and early 90's , I used to go down to East beach about 3 PM in Sept. I would fish the surface plugs through sunset (mostly poppers and kastmasters with teasers). On thing I would have to often do was to wade out on my tippy toes to a sand bar that formed to the east of Fresh Pond Rock. Despite the same people seeing me do this 3 afternoons a week , nobody would wade out with me. It was the only way I could reach the stripers that would get hung up busting menhaden way out towards the end of the visible bolders. Now , 10 to 12 years later , I'm older and fatter and wiser and I won't wade out there anymore. However , with the Breakaway 11'9" rod and the Mag casting reel , Ican reach that area without wading out.
The last time I wished i had a long caster came in mid August last year. The Breakaway was on order already but I hadn't gotten it yet. I sttod on east beach watching Albies and bonito go by about every half hour. Couldn't reach any of them as they were just out of range. That's about when I put up my "I need" post on Tres' board in hopes of getting that rod as soon as I could. this year , I'm hoping that late August and early sept fishing from the beach for Albies and bonitos will be a great time. I know they don't have stripes but its fun anyway.
As far as levelwind vs nonlevelwind , I'm a confirmed levelwind type. I have been looking at the Penn 525's lately but if I get one , it will be a reel that might get used only 3 to 4 times a year. Only when that extra 10% casting distance will mean fish or no fish. Anywhere I can , I'll stick with the levelwind. I have two nonlevelwinds on my boat (4/0 Penns) and hate to level the line . I could never stand to do it all night while casting and retrieving.
BTW , It sounds as though #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& and John M will be banging heads over this one. Should be Fun!! <img src="/Images/Happy_Face.gif"><!--e1-->

Bill, you just have to tweak them "mid-atlantic types", eh <img src="/Images/Tounge_Wink_Face.gif"><!--e5-->?

Different areas require different methods. We are fortunate to have most of our fish in close to shore and alot of our fish are in fact cast over (I'm often guilty of this myself) up here in New England. Of course, it is also very convenient to get a hopkins or kastmaster 350' from shore when the blues are breaking out of a normal casting difference with normal northeast gear.

John M - you know Bill's focus is local and that with a few exceptions, distance is overrated up northeast here... Your knees tremble when you see some of the spots up here <img src="/Images/biggrin.gif"><!--e7-->...The gear tends to be a little different down south too, longer rods with big leads and chunked bait... BTW-When are you getting up here?

I don't think Bill is being condecending as much as he feels that too much attention is paid to long distance fishing up these parts...

Before I switched over to an Abu 7000 I used a Penn Sqidder for years. I used it plugging from Boston to the Canal and surprise no levelwind. I would never go back to using it though. It is to slow of a retreive but I caught some big fish on it. I got some strange looks years ago around Boston Harbor but I could outcast everyone but at long distances the hookup ratio drops dramaticly.

I hear ya John, I have heard the gospel according to Bill many times and I agree usually, but this latest passage was just wrong plain and simple. <img src="/Images/Happy_Face.gif"><!--e1--> I hope some day we are standing there with 40#s rolling 150 yards and I drop my jig on them. It was a situation like that that opened my eyes........Anyway I just snapped back some.

You right thought they use different gear down south. Long rods and distance is a good thing.......

As for coming up I might do a weekend up there this summer/fall, I have seen some of your spots and my knees do shake. I ahd a week scheduled on the cape in Sept but it looks like thats goign to be canceled. We are installing SAP and my budgets are due in Sept as well, so I have bene put on notice that my vacation will have to be canceld <img src="/Images/Sad.gif"><!--e2-->

JohnM, a major enterprise roll out of SAP? Might as well forget the fall... How are the wife and new baby doing????

John Wife is fine baby is fine all are fine <img src="/Images/Happy_Face.gif"><!--e1-->Whe is yours due? thanks for asking......as for the fall, if this job turns into what you say I wil be looking for a new job the market is hot here, I have been approached to go elsewhere and I am sorely tempted some times....... I am not goign to put up with that crap. I am an accountant and if the system doesnt work thats not my problem, I am sick and tired of crap like that eating away at MY time.

Hey john M,As you should well know,I could care less who I "enflame" I realy dont. You still have not told me how you set up on a fish that far out.

If you need to catch fish 150+ yards from shore,Then I would suggest you have a hidden need to become a boat fisherman. Surf means Surf!! Next you guys will tell me the fish were 300 yards out and you need that 20foot pole to reach them.Get a tin boat , you may enjoy it.And you will be able to use a nice 7 or 8 foot rod.Then all you have to do is flip your lure right into the fish.

BTW, Glad to hear you new baby is doing good.Best of luck!!

Bill you fish where the structure is its that simple. In RI the structure is close, down other places its further out, thats all. As for fishing 150 yards out first off its bait fishing, the line is kept tight, the hooks are sharp and the rod is in your hand. At least most guys keep it in their hand. Also we are talking about fish that are large and hit with authority. Braids while frowned on are very helpful in keeping touch with your bait. Really its not much different than bait fishin anywhere you just do it over alonger distance. The whole key is to keep it tight and pay attention its really not that hard.....

Whoa guys. #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& you make a valid point that most fish are caught close in (but at night). Saltheart and John M also have made valid points too. Many times I have stood on the beach wishing I could reach the fish I knew were out there, thats one of the reasons I took to casting a conventional. I do use a levelwind for plugs on the open beach only, but guess what! I still bucktail the inlet with a Penn 980 for the last 15 years on an 11 foot Fenglass rod and before that a Squidder ( no levelwinds). These reels are bulletproof with drags far superior to any reel with a levelwind and in a pinch can cast very good also. Actually my 980 with a 3 to 4 oz jig can give my 6500CS a run for the money. I think what it all comes down to is personal preference, whats comfortable for you in a given situation. People still think I'm crazy using the old clunker on the jetty instead of my newer rods and reels, whatever winds your clock guys. Prospector

Let's not forget that fishing is a leisure activity. Hopefully we all do this for fun and a little R&R from our lives, jobs, etc... Granted we are all probably a bit obsessive about it (after all, here we are talking about it on the internet), but bottom line, its supposed to be fun.

And its what we make of it. We all have our own preferences.

If one guy gets all geared up, spends a few grand on gear and accessories, casts further than anyone on the beach and catches zip... if he's happy, good for him! If I like flyfishing, or chunkin' mackerel (bass repellent) or prefer catching a thousand schoolies and could care less about keepers, or like reeling with my spinning reel upside down, if I'm freakin' happy, good for me. We can still poke fun at each other for these things, but it doesn't make them wrong or stupid.

I've only been doing serious saltwater fishing for a couple years... but I've been fishing for over 20 years. I'll put my largemouth bass or trout fishing skills against anyone out there. Does this make me better? Certainly not. Worse? No.

I'm only 30 years old and I've caught largemouth bass, smallmouth bass, striped bass, white bass, bluegill, crappie, white perch, yellow perch, walleye, northern pike, musky, brown trout, brook trout, rainbow trout, lake trout, bluefish, sharks, cod, scup, flounder, shad, hooked a couple albies (no, I haven't caught one of those bastards yet) and yes, even a damn wagger (aka skate) or two. Guess what, I've enjoyed every damn one of them and do myself good every time I get out there.

And I hope I can double that by the time I'm 60. What's my point? If didn't get it by now, you likely never will.

Take it easy.

Hey, Bill, stirring the pot again? Someone has to do it, all these group hugs get boring after awhile<img src="http://striped-bass.com/Images/Happy.gif" border="0" align="middle">. Now, I have to add my 2 cents.

First, on the how do you set up at 150 yards deal, simple answer--you don't. You can't, there's too much stretch in mono. To prove the point, step off 100 yards on the beach, and tie off a bank sinker on the line. Have a buddy hold the sinker at 100 yards from you, and take your best shot at yanking it out of his hand. Odds are, you can't do it. So, at anything over 100 yards, either the fish hooks itself or you lose it, plain and simple. The bait guys down south, who have to put their baits out those distances (either by casting or by kayak) use sharp, thin wire hooks, mainly circle hooks, to up the odds of a solid hook-up. I've hooked fish at the end of my cast, both in the Canal and off the beach--a good half come off, and I carry a file in my pocket and keep the hooks as sharp as I can. I've never hooked a fish at 150 yards because I can't cast that far, at least not with anything that's going to catch a fish. 450 feet is a long way to throw any plug, and I doubt many people can actualy do it. A torpedo sinker is one thing, a lure is another. Maybe a 4 oz diamond jig will fly that far, but few plugs will. I read posts on the internet all the time of guys claiming to throw 1 oz bucktails with pork over 100 yards and I laugh. The 100 yard cast in fishing is like the 300 yard drive in golf--many people say they can do it, few can. I fish the Canal a lot, have for over 30 years. Its width is a known fact, it's betwen 550 to 600 feet between the two bridges--the distance between the abutments of the Sagamore is exactly 544 feet and both are dry at low tide. If you can cast 100 yards, you should be able to pass the middle and reach breaking fish there--everyone who fishes the Ditch claims to be able to throw over 100, and very few of them manage to hit those fish breaking in the middle. I've seen guys opposite each other throw at the same fish and neither plug got within 40' of the fish. If guys routinely threw over 100, you'd see guys fishing across from each other tangle all the time, a 600' tug of war--in 30+ years of fishing the place, I've never seen it happen, not even once. Judging distance over water is a very difficult thing to do for many people.

As to the original issue of level-wind versus non-level wind, the gain in distance for the lure fisherman isn't worth the trade-off in convenience--you're talking 10 yards added distance at best, and as Saltheart already mentioned, many times, you will actually throw a level wind farther because if you retrieve line unevenly, you'll have to thumb more on the next cast when it fluffs. I grew up doing it the hard way, Penn Squidder, with nylon squidding line. When the Abu 7000 first appeared on the Cape, the old-timers hooted at it, they said one or two grains of sand in the level-wind gear and you'd throw it away in disgust. They turned out to be wrong. I can fish plugs and eels at night without a level wind--but, why should I? With swimmers and eels, I lose nothing in distance, I lose nothing in reliability, and I have one less thing to concentrate on--I can concentrate 100% on working the plug, not 95% on that and 5% on leveling the line. Even throwing poppers in the Ditch, in daylight, why sweat leveling the line just to get another 10 yards on the cast so you can try to reach a fish you only have a 50/50 shot of hooking and landing?

Bill, I have to say, in many of the places I've fished, I see guys using the old Squidder and the Newells and Daiwa SLOSHs without level-winds, for plugging and jigging. I still like a reel without one for jigging, I find it's easier to keep the line level on a narrow reel like a 6500CT, or a Penn 525, than on a wide one like a Squidder or a Newell 235. The shorter your thumb travels, the less likely you are to pile up peaks and valleys.

Hi Mike. Let me Know when you get to the Canal maybe we can hook up. Just my last 2cents. Almost all my fish that I have taken in the Canal on Poppers have been 50 yards or less. Even when they are breaking in the middle it is extremely difficult to reach let alone hook one most times you will not land these fish.