see ya moody boy!!!!! :) :) :) bye bye mr. negitive!!!

What happened????????:eek: :confused: :shocked: :eyes: Give me details, I have not heard anything!!!!!:confused:

Nomar is heading to the cubs as part of a 4 team trade.....Sox get Orlando Cabrera and Doug Minkevich sp?

4 team trade we gave up mr. clutch and in return we get ss cabrera from montreal and 1b meinkeniczw(SP) from minn.:happy: :happy: :happy: :happy: both good gloves!

:happy: Am I happy????:happy: You better believe it!:D Not only do I not have to see him flick his freakin' wrists anymore, I don't even have to see him play the Sox!!!:happy: Yeah, I am happy!!!:bounce: The only place I am gonna have to see Nomahhhhhhh any moahhhhhhh is on the ESPN highlight reel and I don't expect to see him too often there unless he boots a boucer hit right at him or drops a can-of-corn!!!!:happy: Yesireeeee.....no moahhhhhhh Nomahhhhhhhhh!!!!:btu:

it's a good day!! now i can go out tonite and kick some fin with s---t eating grin:D

Were gonna win more games now right ?? :rolleyes: :confused:

skd, he sucked in the clutch and he sulked in the clubhouse, and YES we will win more games. his negitive attitude effected his team mates. it,s pom pom time!

I hope your right...:) ...But he could end up like Clemens after he was run out of town and have an excellent career elsewhere...

he just might. a change of scenery might do him good. i think clemens wouldn't have flourished if he stayed in boston. like a bad marriage it was time to part. sox-cubs series!

I just think we lost a lot of offense..

yeah, we lost some o, but we gained some d and i hear that meinchawiczh(sp) is a super clubhouse leader. i'm tellin' ya i got a good feeling now.

btw, did i see ortiz starting to do the nomahhh thing with his gloves?

Oh jeezzzzzzz.. I hope not..especialy for BF'S sake..:D

:D :D :D

Still tough seeing a guy go that many of us watched in Pawtucket (well, at least read about). Good luck #5 (unless wee see you in October)...

Maybe the trade will in fact round out the talent on this club. The Sox are leading most meaningful offense stats, including runs scored, but are only playing .500 ball since May. Sure, we will lose some offense but things just defensively got better.

No we have someone making better throws to 1st, better scoops at 1st, soon sandwiching Reese, gonna be a good defensive outfield. And of course, Mr Clutch now becomes out full time (nearly) D.H. ....

Hope it goes well... Now to tell son his baseball player is gone day (well, really just his favorite #5) after his goldfish went belly up :smash:

Good riddance,glad to see him go.
To bad Lowe is still around:(

What offense are we gonna miss????:confused: The guy had horrible numbers and outside of that grandslam, made no noticeable contribution to this team what so ever!!!! Here, I will go check his numbers.....Nomahhhh Garciapara was a paper tiger folks!!! All you "I think he was a "great" player cry-babies give me one reason that you think he was a "great" player. By that I mean "GREAT"! Was he an Ernie Banks type of shortstop? Or an Ozzie Smith type of shortstop? I think he was a shortstop the same way Pete Runnels was second baseman.....basically just pretty good with flashes of "GREAT"! Nomahhhh won back to back batting championships, however in 1999 he only played in 135 games and in 2000 he only played in 143 games.....so what....those two batting championships were pretty cheesey if you ask me....the guy, as I have said many times, had hands of stone in the field.....he made #^&#^&#^&#^& Stuart look like a goldglover out there......Nomahhhhh never won a Gold Glove and his fielding percentage was not exactly awesome!!! His power numbers have been on a steady drop every year and his fielding gets worse by the game!!!:smash:

Bye Nomahhhh....nice knowin' ya!!!!:happy:

Well at least we got something for Nomar?

IF we had kept him we would have lost him in free agency!

But we needed a Pitcher??? That we didnt get!!

Truthfully I thought the trade sucked.....we got boned hard!!! We need a first baseman that can't hit like we need a hole in the head and we really don't need another shortstop....we got Pokey, hopefully they put Pokey at short and the new guy at second....that would be fine....and another outfielder????:confused: We really got nothing out of the deal that will improve this club except you got Nomahhhhhs stagnant bat out of the lineup which will help and a more competent fielder in there full-time whether it be Pokey or the other dude??? (I keep forgetting his name):smash:

But as I have said many times.....I would trade Nomahhh for a six pack and a sandwich!!!! So all in all I think it was the right move!:D

Nomars #'s were horrible??? Check his average since he has been back.321 for the year...Didn't know that sucked ..:smash:

No question Nomar is a better player than what the sox got in return but as of late Nomars attitude has sucked and he was not going re sign with the Sox at the end of the year anyway. At least we got something for him and he didnt just walk at the end of the year and the sox get jack for him.....Makes sense to me! Hope he does well with the cubbies.

Only 156 AB's SKD.....big deal! The guy was more a liability than a help! What was his BA with men in scoring position? :confused: I bet that stat is quite telling!:rolleyes:

Don't let the door hit ya where the lord split ya Nomahhhh!:happy:

I am sure my attitude would suck at my job if I had heard while on vacation they were looking to get rid of me.Especially if that is the only company I have ever worked for...It woud'nt be very fun at all..Relocating my family ect..It's gotta play on you..I know they make a lot of money and it should'nt bother them physicaly or mentaly but everyone is different..I wish him luck..Can anyone argue against that he was one of the best short stops and one of the most popular players the sox have ever had??

Hey...Lets get rid of Manny too...He is 8 for 43...:rolleyes:

One of the best shortstops they ever had??? Maybe, but not one of the greatest!:rolleyes:

i wish nomahhhh and that guy mia hammmm the very best in CHICAGO.

:huh: The end,,,Who was the greatest??

hes gone good they didnt adress the needs of the team though. they adressed needing him outta here but NOT needin a pitcher or an outfielder if nixon is in fact gone for the year.damn astros are like 10 back and still didnt give up carlos beltran....who knows maybe in a couple weeks when they're 20 back they'll do away with him ;P mebbe a waiver deal can be worked.
i would've liked the move a lot more if i didnt want pedro and lowe outta here(lowe for obvious reasons and pedro i think he wont ever be the same fastball in the mid 80's wont cut it =[)

Sox got OF Dave Roberts from the Dodgers.

Some of you may know this, other's may not......but I played professional baseball at a high level for a few years.....when I was in college I remember a scout telling me (and I'll never forgert this) when I asked him what it takes to be drafted....he said, "ability to hit, good arm, good speed, and a good attitude.....not necessarily in that order".

Nomar killed himself here in Boston with his baby attitude......he had the other three things for sure.

When you play shortstop, or expect to at a high level, one also needs good hands/soft hands! Nomahhhh does not have great hands for a shortstop and in my opinion his offensive numbers have been on a steady slide! Horrible with men in scoring position and as far as being a smart hitter....Nomahhhh is not!:)

Best hitting shortstop.....Ernie Banks (Mr. Cub by the way......no fear Nomahhhh will be earning that monicker)

Best fielding shortstop......Ozzie!;)

When you play shortstop, or expect to at a high level, one also needs good hands/soft hands

Scouts never look at defensive skills when scouting an athlete.....the theory is that good defense can be learned....soft hands, proper positioning, etc. can be taught through repetition, and therefore are not considered "natural" abilities.....

Sorry HR04, I have to disagree with you on that one......no team can afford to have a shortstop in there who has a decent bat and bad hands....I would rather have an average bat and a good defensive glove in the hole! Just my opinion!

PS-There never have been too many power packed shortstops out there......Aparicio was a fair hitter at best, Banks...well he was in a class by himself! Ozzie...not a great hitter, think his lifetime average was about .260 at best maybe lower.....Yount had some pop and of course had over 3000 hits, about a .310 average I think (I will check those numbers though);)

Most shortstops are in the hole for their glove my friend....not the bat and if a team gets both, consider it the exception and not the rule.:uhuh:

BigFish - you're missing my poiint....OBVIOUSLY every shortstop needs to have soft hands......but NO ONE is drafted for that reason....soft hands can be taught.....soft hands has NOTHING to do with natural abilities.....BTW - I was drafted as a shortstop.

You don't believe shortstops are drafted for their ability to hit do you?:confused: I have got the numbers to prove my point if need be but being that short is such a critical position in a teams defense, don't you agree that the ability to field is tops on the list when a scout is observing potential draftees?:huh:

Hitting as I have said would only be a plus as most HOF shortstops barely hit their weight!

No, it's not.

Defense alone won't get a shortstop to the HOF. Mark Belanger was arguably the best glove at short until Ozzie came along, and he never received serious consideration for the Hall. Same with Larry Bowa, Freddie Patek, Don Kessinger who succeeded Banks as the Cubs' shortstop, and Davey Concepcion of the Big Red Machine. Their offensive numbers weren't good enough to get them to Cooperstown.

Ozzie hit .260 for his career and he could also steal a base, plus he drew walks. He wasn't just a glove.

Which shortstop for the Sox was a better all-around player than Nomar? Rico Petrocelli? He wasn't out there for his glove and range and played more games at third than short over his career. Rick Burleson? Great arm, but not as good a hitter and limited range. Glenn Hoffman? Certainly not Don Buddin or Eddie Brossoud ;)

Show us the #'s BF..

oh jeeez skd, prepare for the onslaught!

HR04 and especially MikeP....I gotta start smokin' some of the stuff you guys are smokin'.....cause Defense is all that got any shortstops with the only exception of Ernie Banks into the hall of fame!!!!:smash: Ozzie hit .262 lifetime and you are telling me it was not his glove that got him into the hall?????:confused: How many .262 hitters are in the hall of fame guys????? Guaranteed the only ones in there have over 500 homers!!!! I have looked at the numbers for the other hall of fame shortstops guys......and they are all defensive oriented players who hit less than .260......oooooppppssss sorry I forgot Yount and he played the last 6 or 7 years at first base and in the outfield! Check the stats guys on the hall of fame shortstops and then come talk to me.......cause you ain't makin' any sense. There are only 5 or 6 modern day shortstops in the hall and only about ten all together......modern day are Lou Boudreau, Ernie Banks, Pee Wee Reese, Aparicio, Banks, Smith and Yount!!!! I have done my homework guys......check it out!:read:

:D

Plus...."He drew walks"?????? Is that a new criteria for shortstops to get into the hall of fame?:walk:

:smokin: :smokin: :smokin:

The onslaught has begun.....now duck!:hidin:

When I coached Little League a walk was as goog as a hit..

Lets see....where is my hall of fame book???? I know there was a guy that got election to the hall of fame based solely on the fact that he walked.....well I know it is in there somewhere!:rolleyes:

CAUTION-Sarcasm can become addictive when taken in large doses. Do not take sarcasm on an empty stomach!:D

I just ate..No empty stomach here

Remdog was saying on the air today that Nomar asked Francona this week for a week off to recoup. Nomar was also quoted by teamates as saying he wanted to be on the DL for August so he could be ready for September. Larry Luchino called him up the other day, to let him know he was being shopped to the Cubs, and he asked him how he felt. Nomar's reply was that he was great. He has been an unhappy sandbagger, probably part of the reason the team has had a bad funk lately. GOOD RIDDENCE.

That applies to his attitude ,which sucked...I agree, but not to his ability

Oh yee of too much faith!:smash:

Man, you guys must have flunked out of school.....not a single one of you can read....so I will only say this one more time......NO ONE IS EVER DRAFTED BECAUSE OF THEIR DEFENSIVE SKILLS. DEFENSE CAN BE TAUGHT. SO SCOUTS DO NOT CONSIDER IT WHEN EVALUATING TALENT. SURE, IN ORDER TO STAY IN THE BIG LEAGUES YOU NEED TO BE ABLE TO PLAY DEFENSE (NO KIDDING), BUT IT IS NOT A PREREQUISITE TO BEING DRAFTED.

Was that plain enough english for you?

I would like to meet just one scout that would agree with you on that one HR04.......do you by any chance scout for the Sox?:smash: They are constantly drafting players with no talent!:smash:

Then if the scouts do not evaluate a player for their talent.....:confused: .....then what the heck do they bother looking at them for???? To see how good they look in tight pants???:eek:

If defense can be taught as you say, then why are there so many terrible defensive players in the Major leagues???:smash: (Other than the fact that the player knows how to swing a bat?):smash:

Players must have some degree of talent to "be" drafted or even be eligible HR04......are you telling me that you were drafted simply because you had "no" talent or because you "had" talent?:huh:

By the way....when you say you played baseball at a "high" level....what exactly does that mean? Semi-pro....College.....or did you play in the minors at some level?:confused:

I ended up playing Triple A for two seasons.....

nomar's got hands of stone or has lately anyway. hes hit well(above 300) but in the clutch.......eww......his attitude sucked cabrera is a great glove as is pokey derek lowe will benefit much from this trade. no more booted double play balls that end up costing him 3 runs in an inning :D *dodges the onslaught*

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Surfcastinglife
*dodges the onslaught*
don't know about that.... :hidin:

haha i dont think its possible to dodge the coming onslaught :laughs:

I always liked the guy and, Granted this year he has been a whiner, But he always worked hard for the team. It seems he had a bad playoff last year and all of a sudden people wanted to run him out of town on a rail.

Here some stats on the guy

2 time Batting Champ and finished in the top ten two other times
5 times top 10 in MVP voting
6 times top 10 in hits including last season
4 times top 10 in total bases
4 times top 10 in doubles
3 times top 10 in triples including last season
6 times top 10 in Extra base hits including last season

He was a career .323 Post Season hitter with a career Post Season slugging percentage of .625.

So you may agree w/ the trade (i do, I mean at least we got someting before he walked) but don't make it seem like the guy did nothing but screw us over for the past 9 years. Since he's been here we've been enjoying some pretty good baseball.......its not his fault for the past 86 years...

BF: I think what HR04 meant to say is that he was high when he played baseball. :happy:

Aren't you guys like NINE AND A HALF games out of first place. I'm thinking NOmar isn't your only problem here.....

Boudreau's career BA was .295 and Yount's was .285. Of the HOF shortstops you listed who were elected by the BWAA, Ozzie and Aparicio are tied for the lowest BA at .262. Rizzuto was voted in by the Veterans' Committee after years of being by-passed by the writers and his lifetime BA is .273, .004 points higher than Reese's. And by the way, Yount's average plummetted the last 4-5 years of his career playing the outfield--he hit .331 one year playing short.

So, is Mark Belanger not in the Hall because he "only" won 8 Gold Gloves with a lifetime fielding pct of .977, .001 lower than Ozzie's, or is it because of his career .228 BA? After all, they get in there on defense and their hitting is just icing on the cake :rolleyes:

ice man we aren't 9.5 out of first we're 1 back of the wildcard :) divisions dont count!!!

BF: I think what HR04 meant to say is that he was high when he played baseball.

That's funny 28inches....perhaps your handle should be "28IQ" instead....:D

You want to talk about defense being the only way a shortstop gets into the Hall. Check out the lifetime fielding percentages of those in the HOF as opposed to some of the gloves who aren't there:

Boudreau--.973
Aparicio-----.972
Reese-------.962
Banks-------.962
Yount-------.969
Smith--------.978
Rizzuto------.968

Now the non-HOFers:


Larry Bowa---.980
Belanger------.977
Concepcion--.971


These are their fielding averages at short, not the other positions they may have played.

Garciaparra--------------.969

I think this deal sucks. Granted I know they were going to lose him next year but for what they got in return there is no way I would have done this deal. Cabera is a free agent next year also and now they have 3 first baseman. Millar is an average 1st baseman and his bat has been hot, now his playing time is going to get cut. The sox had one of the best 3,4,5 lineups in the league, now their lineup has taken a major hit.

i would have perferred pitching in return for nomore. chicago knew theo was instructed to dump nomore and made out, i understand that 2 wks ago they were willing to deal clement(so so record, good era).

HR04....don't get me wrong, not looking to take a cheap shot at you, just curious about your baseball background. Two years triple A, thats pretty good stuff!;) What Major League team was the triple A team affiliated with?

MikeP....I absolutely agree with you about Concepcion, Belanger, Bowa and other guys like Bobby Grich......those guys could throw some leather......I grew up watching them, they were great! Great stats on Belanger MikeP....8 gold gloves....now that is impressive! I gotta tell you though, and maybe you will agree and maybe not, but Nomar does not have a snowballs chance in hell of making the hall unless he steps up his fielding and catches a few gold gloves himself........a shortstop with a better than average bat ain't much unless he can throw some decent glove.:huh:

I have tickets to a Patriots game this year :happy:


Red Sox? :confused: :laughs: haven't been to a game yet this year and it doesn't look like I will :yak6:

Mike knows what he speaks about

;) Of that I have no doubt!:D

Maybe Nomar has a chance now in the NL for a Gold Glove. Tougher competition in the AL. Vizquel has practically owned it the last 10 years, with an A-Rod throw-in.

Betcha Vizquel doen't make it to the HOF either :D

Yo Bruce, i got sox tick's(blue jays).....wanna trade??:hee: