#^&#^&#^&#^& Chenney just shot someone :hs: :hihi:

Please Tell us it was Hillary.

Sorry Nebe it wasnt Cheany who was shot....I know you'd be happy if that was the case:hs: Hopefully the injured hunter is OK

so why would you expect him to shoot straight in the field!
DUFUS.:rocketem:

You have to read the account of the ACCIDENT on MSNBC.He "got peppered pretty good".Holy Moly!

It was a millionaire lawyer friend from Texas whose hands are dirty I`m sure.

Got out ahead on a quail hunt. ouch!

You know what they say about lawyers :usd:

So it was only another Replubican. All kidding aside, accidents with firearms are inexcusable.

because they drove around in a car to find the quail
then they sneak out quick and start shooting ill prepared...

lucky they were on a private property...

but that wasnt hunting....it wasnt sport ...it was :yak:

Please Tell us it was Hillary.


Even though I admire her as a woman who has accomplished much with a heap of adversity to deal with

admire her as a woman....:rotf3:

thats like getting ready to worship the porcelan god...

missing it altogether.... and then patting yourself on the back
while saying....thats the most magnificient pile of puke i ever saw..:rotf2:

:yak::think::kewl:

who would be your choice....?

i vote for Jennifer Garner ...
she and ben affleck can go running
around naked in the whitehouse....:D

It took 24 hours before it got leakes to the press....Happened Saturday and we didn't here about ity until Sunday.

And if someone is in front of you hunting and you shoot them wouldn't you shoot them in the back.....This guy was shot in the Face and Chest.

My guess is Cheney got pissed because this guy forgot the 30 pack and the Pork Rinds.

NBK---------Republican-----

Natural Born Killers !!!!

admire her as a woman....:rotf3:

thats like getting ready to worship the porcelan god...

missing it altogether.... and then patting yourself on the back
while saying....thats the most magnificient pile of puke i ever saw..:rotf2:

:yak::think::kewl:
A little strong for a nice guy like me don`t you think :angel:

but with Hillary we must remain tough
vigalent...
she is a death sentence heading our way...
indante....
you i'm sure meant that in a Noble way
but....let her go write books...and entertain..

i want a hotty (woman) for president
if its gonna be a woman..
someone with a very sexy body
so she can use it as a weapon....
and flash some clevage at the far east.:grins:

Just so you all know the guy Cheney shot is adamant death penalty opponent and a left wing liberal to boot. In Texas he is considered a dinosaur.

i want a hotty (woman) for president
if its gonna be a woman..
someone with a very sexy body
so she can use it as a weapon....
and flash some clevage at the far east.:grins:

Talk about diplomacy... :hee:

Cheney and crew probably needed a day to sober up. If the guy died they would have still delayed informimg others. Do you see the same pattern of this double standard unaccountable administration.

All kidding aside, accidents with firearms are inexcusable.

you got that right! Know your "backdrop" and be aware of your surroundings. If there is a hint of doubt you shouldnt be shooting!

There is NO excuse and I dont care if I offend someone either. If my best friend wants to show me their new gun and assures me its unloaded....it still gets checked and treated as if it were, no matter how much I trust them.

Its too bad responsible gun owners once again have to feel the heat of a irresponsible act.

My Dad was a stickler for firearm safety. There were no "unloaded" guns. Ammo was stored properly. You don't need to chamber it for it to go off. I once worked on Police cruisers, some of those guys had shotshells, slugs and 9mm rounds rolling all over the floor. I'd box them up and hand them back with my best"IDIOT BOY!" look. One of the reasons that I gave up hunting was that I couldn't tolerate the casual handling of firearms of others.

in firearm safety
for the most part
by a guy who had personally
blown his own leg off with his shotgun...
out in a boat....
so you can believe i got the message.

One of the reasons that I gave up hunting was that I couldn't tolerate the casual handling of firearms of others.


It's quite obvious how casually our VP handles firearms, don't you think?:eek: :rocketem:

So it was only another Replubican. All kidding aside, accidents with firearms are inexcusable.
Making a statement like this is inexcusable.Accidents of any kind are inevitable.This is not xanadu we are living in.

Why are accidents called accidents? Most acciedents are preventable to a point, but odds are there will be accidents. From what I heard it was a miscommunication between members of the party. The guy who got hit left to chase a wounded bird, and returned as the VP was swinging and aiming on a bird, the guy never let them know he was back in the line. Could it have been avoided, yes had the guy called out that he was back at the line, or had he been paying attention to what was going on, he could have stopped where he was, or moved. The press is making a big deal about it because the story went out in a local Texas paper first, and the bigshot White House Press Corp did not get it till later. I have been hit by shot before, it happens, granted I was 70 or 80 yards away in a duck blind.

Making a statement like this is inexcusable.Accidents of any kind are inevitable.This is not xanadu we are living in.


Inexcusable...its just a forum...Jake rules!

%$%$%$%$ happens but one must try to be very careful :nailem: :buds: :liquify:

Please Tell us it was Hillary.

She all most got it, she was flushing the birds;) look at the bright side, now our VP has some combat experience.:skulz:

She all most got it, she was flushing the birds;)



**** look at the bright side, now our VP has some combat experience.:skulz:


Now thats funny:bl2:

The guy didn't even shoot back!!:nailem:

The guy didn't even shoot back!!:nailem:
Sure 5 guys with SMGs were surrounding #^&#^&#^&#^&...

Important that nobody was seriously hurt - but the jokes coming off of this are hilarious...

But this is some of what we've heard:

The quail were "stocked" and "released" before the VP rat patrol vehicles, the "Lawyer" was coming back from a shoot, did not announce it, and apparently, the VP did not visually confirm the quarry was a legal "cock" or "hen" and just managed to take the shot on the lawyer instead... Or is he that bad of a shot??

Its sad and I for one feel bad for Cheney and his buddy. How the hell would you guys feel if you shot your good friend by mistake? Knowing your buddy is in the hospital with all sorts of crap inside his body. And have to sit back and listen to the media joke about you and your buddy in the hospital. Nothing funny about this if you ask me. Some people are enjoying this and its rather sad and pathetic.:hs:

Skip. I'd feel like an absolute arse. In my life, I've had slugs whiz by me 3 times. 2 were avoidable accidents, was was on purpose by a "misguided misanthrope". Lemme tell ya right freakin' now, without strict discipline in firearm safety, accidents are bound to happen. Deadly accidents. Cheney's hunting bud had a "mild heart attack" today from irritation from birdshot. Sounds like he got blasted pretty good. The "Only a Replublican" crack was just that , a wisecrack, nothing more. Hillary would be a good pointer tho...

The dude was in the line of fire , in Texas Quail hunting the rule of thumb is shoot right to left from 12 to 9 o'clock he was in the line of fire I heard this on OLN ?????????????????
ml:sleeps:

By now everyone has heard that the guy that Cheney shot has run into complications. Apparantly, one shot either got lodged in his heart intially, or has migrated there, causing an irregular rythym or something (atrial fibrillation) that has been classified as a mild heart attack.
If it had been Ted Kennedy or Barney Frank Or Billy C that had shot someone, I doubt if the reaction from the media/entertainment world would have been any different. It's all umm...
*ahem*
...fair game.

:uhuh:

I had an idiot take a shot over my head as I went out to change a target.
Once.
He won't ever do that again.
And I read today the sheriff or SP was notified within 1 hour.
The mainstream press is just pissed because the locals were notified before they were.

And I read today the sheriff or SP was notified within 1 hour.
So why did he wait 14 hours to interview the VP?

The mainstream press is just pissed because the locals were notified before they were.
Why did it take so long to notify even the local press?

And of course, everyone knows by now that Cheney didn't even have the proper endorsement on his hunting licence.

So why did he wait 14 hours to interview the VP?


Why did it take so long to notify even the local press?

And of course, everyone knows by now that Cheney didn't even have the proper endorsement on his hunting licence.


it was the ole chappaquid -#^&#^&#^&#^& trick :rolleyes:

By now everyone has heard that the guy that Cheney shot has run into complications. Apparantly, one shot either got lodged in his heart intially, or has migrated there, causing an irregular rythym or something (atrial fibrillation) that has been classified as a mild heart attack.
If it had been Ted Kennedy or Barney Frank Or Billy C that had shot someone, I doubt if the reaction from the media/entertainment world would have been any different. It's all umm...
*ahem*
...fair game.

:uhuh:

I haven't been following this news story too closely, but "peppered with buckshot" as was reported by the ranch owner is whole lot different then having a piece of buckshot either in the proximity of your heart or migrating towards it and causing a heart attack.

It was an accident but it shouldn't be taken so lightly. The truth would be nice. You'd think they'd know that if it looks like they're hiding something people are of course going to be suspicious.

The article I saw (with a timeline) said "they" scheduled an interview for 9:00AM the next morning at the time of the report.
Accident happened at 6:30pm. Reported at 7:50.
The article did not specify who "they" were.
Secret service or local sheriff.
I checked the Mass regs.
"Any hunting accident MUST be reported to state,local and or environmental police."
MA DFWELE
I would guess THAT law is pretty much the same from state to state.
Not trying to be a wiseass,just defending my post; but if I get winged in a hunting accident am I required to notify the AP? Or the local paper?

Is there some kind of Law that says you or the VP or whoever involved in an accident must notify anyone besides the Police? I doubt it. Big deal, they told the press the next day. What difference does it make.

Here you have a 78 year old man expecting to announce his precense at 30 yards away. The aging process of life limits some to speak in a loud audible tone. Chenney should have waited until he got back to his position with his retrieved quail knowing that he was out there.
Here is a silly anology which could use a little merit. Its like fishing from breachway and you hookup to a decent fish meanwhile someone decides to cast out instead of waiting for you to land the fish.
Enough said for me I just wish the former judge well.

[QUOTE=Pete_G]I haven't been following this news story too closely, but "peppered with buckshot" as was reported by the ranch owner is whole lot different then having a piece of buckshot either in the proximity of your heart or migrating towards it and causing a heart attack.

Maybe it was just shock?
A firearm being fired close to you but not by you (outside of a range when you expect it) really gets the adrenaline going.
(I know)
The guy was 78.
Bird shot out of a 28 gauge at 30 yds. 90 feet.
That's about the end of the effective range of a shotgun; isn't it?

#^&#^&#^&#^& had a roast beef sandwich before the trip

can you believe that?? :hs:










:hf1:

so if this dude croaks from complications can they charge #^&#^&#^&#^& with involuntary manslaughter?

Maybe it was just shock?
A firearm being fired close to you but not by you (outside of a range when you expect it) really gets the adrenaline going.
(I know)
The guy was 78.
Bird shot out of a 28 gauge at 30 yds. 90 feet.
That's about the end of the effective range of a shotgun; isn't it?

I don't really know anything about guns other then paintball guns. If there's penetration near or into his heart though I'd have to say that he was in the "effective range" of the weapon.

My only point was the intial description of "peppering", in my view, implies lack of penetration versus what we have here, a BB possibly lodged in his heart and others elsewhere.

No one seems to have really discussed how badly he was hit. They mention face, throat and chest, but not much else. Now we learn there was clearly penetration and I just find it odd we didn't really know that before. And since you say that he was standing at the extreme end of "effective range" yet we have serious penetration, I can't help but be a bit suspicious of the reported distance. It's just my nature...

Again, I haven't been following this too closely, I may have missed a more accurate description of what took place that was released a couple days earlier.

will never be truly accurate....

what was said was... just after he fired....

ok -> this is what we're going to say happened... :faga:

and as far as penetration your exactly right because the pellet lodged in his heart had to go thru hunting clothing first...

what scares me is ...in the event we lost our current president...
this BOZO would be the commander in chief...

I had an idiot take a shot over my head as I went out to change a target.
Once.
He won't ever do that again.
And I read today the sheriff or SP was notified within 1 hour.
The mainstream press is just pissed because the locals were notified before they were.

Right on about the mainstream press...The press briefing at the Whitehouse looked pathetic yesterday, bitching and whining that they didnt know 5 minutes after it happened. Bunch of babies...Its not like they found out a week after the fact. It was less than a freakin day! Good god...the press sucks

ok -> this is what we're going to say happened... :faga:

and as far as penetration your exactly right because the pellet lodged in his heart had to go thru hunting clothing first...


Good point. For a BB to go that deep with heavy clothing on it definitely requires some serious velocity.

its the 2nd most important person in the US, shouldn't the American public be told? We had to hear about it 2nd hand. McClellan feels its ok for a private citizen to speak for the VP!!!

Its indicative of this administrations secretiveness and heavy handiness.

Doesn't anyone own a cellphone and couldn't they contact the police right away rather than wait 1 1/2 hours. If they know he was serious enough to be helicoptored to the hospital they should have called the authorities right away.

If they had a press conference and and told us there would be no story other than a few late night jokes.

Drs say he was hit with between 6 and 200 pellets.

Full of Holes
The gossip about Cheney's bad shot.
By Paul Burka
Posted Tuesday, Feb. 14, 2006, at 6:52 PM ET

Austin, TEXAS—The headquarters of Harry Whittington, the 78-year-old Austin lawyer who was shot by Vice President #^&#^&#^&#^& Cheney in a hunting accident Saturday, is the nondescript 10-story Vaughn Building, located a block from the Texas Capitol in downtown Austin. Because of Whittington's lifelong Republican credentials, the building has always been a favorite of GOP politicos. Today, however, it has become ground zero for anyone trying to get the latest news about Harry's condition, as well as about what really happened on the Armstrong Ranch last Saturday morning.
Harry's office—he is always referred to by his first name here—is on the 10th floor, and many tenants have dropped in or called to inquire about how he's doing. None of the ones I spoke to want to be quoted by name, because many of them are questioning the official accounts of the accident. The place is aswirl in rumor and speculation, especially since Harry suffered what was described as a mild heart attack Tuesday morning. Keep in mind that hunting, especially quail hunting, is deeply embedded in the political culture of this state, and invitations to hunt on prestigious spreads like the Armstrong Ranch are among the most prized of political perks.

The talk in the Vaughn Building centers around three questions:

Who was in charge of the hunt? As many Americans are learning for the first time, quail hunting is dangerous—arguably the most dangerous type of hunting. Participants, usually a threesome, follow dogs through thick brush and tall grass seeking what Karl Rove, a dedicated quail hunter, calls "the wily bob white." When the quail flush, hunters are surrounded by panicked birds. Each hunter is supposed to fire forward, but in the adrenalin spike of the flush, it is easy to lose your bearings. That is why it's good practice for someone who is not shooting to be in charge of the hunt. The hunters are supposed to maintain a horizontal line as they move forward, but this is easier than it sounds in rough country. When someone falls behind—someone, for instance, like Harry Whittington—the person in charge calls a halt until the line forms up again. Whittington, as we know, dropped back to pick up a bird. This happens all the time in quail hunting; the question is, why did the other two hunters keep going? Perhaps, veteran quail hunters are speculating, no one was in charge on the Armstrong Ranch, leaving the three hunters in #^&#^&#^&#^& Cheney's party on their own while hostess Katharine Armstrong watched from the car that had transported them.

At what range was Harry Whittington hit? The official story is that the blast from the vice president's shotgun hit Whittington at a distance of 30 yards. Hunters at the Vaughn Building are skeptical. The hunt took place on a cold, windy afternoon. Whittington and his fellow hunters were probably wearing warm clothing—say, a jacket and a flannel shirt. Cheney was using a 28-gauge shotgun, a smaller-diameter firearm with pellets smaller than BBs. Whittington's friends question whether the pellets could have penetrated his layers of clothing and skin at that range. Yet two pellets lodged against his larynx, another was in his liver, and another migrated into the heart muscle, causing the heart attack. The pattern of wounds was between the lower chest and the forehead, a pretty tight zone for shot of 30 yards. If the range was considerably less than 30 yards, then it is likely that Whittington's injuries were worse than the initial statement by Katharine Armstrong indicated. (The blast "knocked him silly," but "he was fine.")

Whose fault was it? If there is anything that Harry's friends at the Vaughn Building are angry about, it is not the shooting itself but the attempt by White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan to place the blame on the victim. It's the shooter's duty to know what he is shooting at and where his companions are. A shooting accident is always the fault of the shooter. Always.

The scary thing is..
If the guy had died we NEVER would have heard about it... he would have 'had a heart attack' during the hunt....
Remember... the Truth is out there :D

Drs say he was hit with between 6 and 200 pellets.
a 28 gauge shot gun fired at a range of thirty yards???
thats ninty 90 feet....and he's hit chest high with 200 pellets
like this...??? :huh:
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c66/ravenob1/shoot.jpg

he'd have to be firing level or below level where your not supposed to be shooting when your in a group hunt... it makes no sense..this story...was he shooting them at what ...5 feet off the ground....:huh:
sounds like total bull s h i t lies
but thats just my opinion
my sixth sense....
is telling me ....cover-up....
and i have a very strong
sixth sense.

At least Cheney and his buddies didn't leave the guy behind in the field to die...............

The scary thing is..
If the guy had died we NEVER would have heard about it... he would have 'had a heart attack' during the hunt....
Remember... the Truth is out there :D

If they wanted to cover it up from the start they could have. Just say another hunter shot the guy. But the less than 24 hours they came out and said Cheny shot the the guy. Yeah such a big cover up. They came out and admitted what happened. If they are trying to cover it up and hide the facts why would they have told the media!? Must be one of those vast right wing conspiracys.

At least Cheney and his buddies didn't leave the guy behind in the field to die...............

Yes Kennedy is a real scumbag...he told NOBODY. But he's a liberal and a Kennedy so he gets a pass....

... but if I get winged in a hunting accident am I required to notify the AP? Or the local paper?
No. Absolutely not.
But then again, you're not the Vice President Of The United States.

#^&#^&#^&#^& had a roast beef sandwich before the trip
can you believe that?? :hs: :hf1:
There is much controversy surrounding this issue. It's still unclear whether the sandwich was made with fresh or previously frozen roast beef, and whether it had mustard or mayo on it.
There are even reports surfacing now that it may not even have BEEN roast beef, but some sort of luncheon meat.

:rolleyes:

I'm starting to agree with Raven. Too many things don't make sense. At Cheney's age, and from the pictures, wearing ear protection, his reaction time is such that he hears a flushed bird (he couldn't have just sensed it by ESP or some other man-bird telepathy), and he's so quick he can turn, locate it and shoot it less than five feet off the ground?
I can't vouch for it being true, but I saw some guy who was supposed to be hunt coordinator or organizer and he said the first rule they make sure hunters know is not to shoot level or below, this ensures the safety of the dogs, too, and not to fire unless they can identify it as a bird. Leno's sarcastic, but usually his comments are based on on some fact and he came out with an outrageous story about how the police did show up to see what was going on and were asked to come back later, and they left.

New Texas bumper sticker:

I'd rather hunt with Cheney

Than drive with Kennedy

New Texas bumper sticker:

I'd rather hunt with Cheney

Than drive with Kennedy

:rotf3: :rotf2:

:rotf3: :rotf2:

Ohhh, but NOW it's funny (OK, sheet, that was actually pretty funny)...

Skip - Kenedy gets a pass by some (and a lot of Mass voters for some reason, enough to keep him in though often unopposed).

Funny, I can't think of many people that I know who voted for Kenedy, DEM or not, but I'm wondering how many are in the older crowd. Like many of my BIRC aquaintances that loved the Kennedy "Dynasty"

I heard once from a MV legend that there is a real good bass hole within yards of where the Lincoln went off the road...

of a time that myself and a bunch of guys
were skeet shooting in a sand pit out in
Rochester mass ....getting in
some pre duck hunting season...practice.

well everyone was trying to outshoot each other!
there was a sudden friendly competition ok...
as to "who" could shoot the clay pigeon "first"
out of the trap.... and it got closer and closer
to the skeet trap....like 5 feet...til we were ...YELLIN...
...PULL -> BLAM!

well , we decided to put doubles in the skeet trap to
make it a bit more unpredictable...and was it ever.
I was almost shot in the process...when the two clay
pigeons rolled off each other and one came directly
at me...

and all i saw was, all of their gun barrels swinging
in my direction so i tossed my 12 guage and dived into a
sand pit hole....because it was just seconds after the trap
sprung....that the guns would fire.

now listening to cheneys story it makes even less sense
because he's saying harry was standing in a gully so that he
wasnt fully visable....so that means hes shooting lower than
horizontal...also he stated that he was alone with just one
other hunter ...so how did that lady witness everything....

sounds so hokey...

I think he should get a commendation or something for shooting a lawyer. That is something I have wanted to do for some time.

I think there was another shooter on a mesquite knoll :huh: :smokin:

Doesn't it bother anyone that they were essentially poaching? They both were cited for not having upland bird stamps. Kinda like fishing for stripers in the EEZ no?

Depending on the choke used it is quite conceivable that the shot was at 30 yards. The folowing picture is a 12 Gauge Gun - 28 ga insert
30 yds - 3/4 oz. #9 Shot - LM Choke
1225 fps - 69% pellet count 30 in. circle
What that is essentially is a 12 gauge shotgun with barrels inserted to make it into a 28 gauge shotgun, using a Light Modified choke 69% of the pellets hit within the 30" circle at 30 yards at a muzzle velocity as high as or higher than most handgun rounds, including 9mm, .40 S&W, and .45. This is muzzle velocity, not energy, there is not enough information to get an accurate energy. I would say that the pellets were coming straight on , not arced in like you would usually see. Therefore they would have more energy.

All you armchair quaterbacks decide for yourself, but if unless you have never had an "Accident" with any thing, powertool, car, bike, kitchen knife etc. you probably should'nt judge. An accident is an accident no matter how you slice it.

Doesn't it bother anyone that they were essentially poaching? They both were cited for not having upland bird stamps. Kinda like fishing for stripers in the EEZ no?

This is all I have to say bout that!!!