View Full Version : We are committing suicide


Hooper
02-21-2006, 06:30 AM
I could not believe what I heard on the radio yesterday and confirmed online when I got home.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11188272/


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10704051


An Arab owned company is being put in charge of SECURITY of many of this nation's largest and most important shipping ports??!! WTF is that?! This is the most insane decision ever made in the history of mankind. There has to be more to this story than what is being written right now because this just defies any form of logic. What's next, TSA recruitment drives in the Middle East???

Ask any terrorism expert and they will tell you that our shipping ports are the most vunerable points of entry into the US. With millions of containers moving everyday it is virtually impossible to safeguard against a WMD placed inside, and apparently now it will be even easier.

Call me what you will, but this seems like letting the fox into the henhouse. It's official, W has lost me on this one:hs:

afterhours
02-21-2006, 07:12 AM
no matter what spin they put on it- thay's effin' insane.

JohnR
02-21-2006, 08:58 AM
This is pretty silly but it is a trend. As a country, we are abdicating many tactical and strategic national security interests. Port security locally. Port ownership globally like when a Chinese state owned company bought the rights to manage the Panama Canal under the last administration... The sad thing is that the current administration throws the previous under the bus for Panama, then goes and does something hypocritical like this :lossinit:...

Hardly anybody is looking at the long term interests of this country, very few in Government, very few in Business...

Folks - I fear the Great Amercia as we know it is getting sold down the road for short term profits and influence and it makes me ill.

Skip N
02-21-2006, 12:36 PM
The Arab company is buying the British company who usually does the port stuff for us if im not mistaking. Its not as if the US went out of thier way to have an Arab country do this. Just so happens that when the Brits sell, the Arabs will have control becuase they are the new owners. But the US wont let the arabs run the show so dont worry. It wont happen. The US will find someone else.

But just so ya know. The arabs wont have any control over the security at the ports. It will still all be done by customs and the coast guard.

But the the port take over wont happen. Even if thier is no security risk it just looks dumb to hand over anything to the Fing arabs! Screw them they suck. Let them slice each others throats and stay away from our ports.

And Jimmy Carter likes the idea so it must be foolish. Thats guys a nut too.

Raven
02-22-2006, 11:51 AM
but...think about it....and the latest apprehension of three (would be) terrorists looking for a trainer in OHIO
who was known to be a muslim since 2004 was the
only way they were caught....he was our undercover man.

it's quite difficult to infiltrate the specific Arabic groups that are the bad guys....
the Jhadists...... unless your also an Arab....

the only way you can fight them is with the support of the arab community ....which is where President Bush is coming from...

it's all a very mute point really when you consider the fact ...that the shipping industry no matter who's in charge...pick a country off of one of those spinning wheels (like on wheel of fortune)
is only able to check a very small percentage of the containers...

i think they said some rediculous number -> like 6% and the outragious thing is...about this...that the press is ignoring this because its OLD news but still perfectly relevant and that since september 11th
2001
the exact same number of containers are still being checked.:doh:

justplugit
02-22-2006, 02:12 PM
..

Hardly anybody is looking at the long term interests of this country, very few in Government, very few in Business...

Yup John ya hit the nail on the head there. Most are out for #1 and as long as their future is secured that's all that matters to them.
Where are the Statesman and the ethical Business Leaders? I'm afraid they went the way of the dinasour. :( We are on the wrong path.

Hooper
02-22-2006, 07:06 PM
It all makes me sick to my stomach, I think I want to puke.

I am terrified when I look down the road 20 years, where is this country going to be then?

Nebe
02-22-2006, 07:23 PM
I am terrified when I look down the road 20 years, where is this country going to be then?

Me too, but when i speak my mind about these problems i am often labled a 'liberal'. If you ask me what label i fall under it would probably be a social conservative who has been polarized from being 'bushwacked'.. anyway i digress.

What we are witnessing as i have been pointing out all along is the grand sell out of our nation's natural resources in the form of de-privitization of our goverment's services and goverment contracts to the current administration's allies. wether its oil, logging, fisheries (menhaden especially) You have and will keep on seeing a total short sighted aproach to achieve fast profit for the corperations who are feeding $$ to the republicans to keep getting them re-elected..

But hey, we all got our tax cuts, so when we all save a couple grand every year on our taxes, remember how much more we will have to pay in the long run :hs:

JohnR
02-22-2006, 08:48 PM
But hey, we all got our tax cuts, so when we all save a couple grand every year on our taxes, remember how much more we will have to pay in the long run :hs:

If you are saving a couple grand a year you must be in a higher tax bracket than me... I beneift from the reduction of the Marriage Tax and that's all. That tax cuts to the uberwealthy were wrong to begin with and they still are. Taxes did not need to be raised nor did they need to be cut - other than the unjust marriage tax and some provisions of the death tax.



For someone to say there is no squeeze on the middle or lower classes would be an absolute joke. The excessive cuts in basic social programs but the turning the other cheek on the illegal imigration that fuels the need for lots of social programs is an absolute hypocracy. They're effing with the middle class by moving quality manufacturing overseas and replacing those jobs with "service" jobs is a joke too. Not everyone can sell pharmacueticals and there are not enough IT jobs or "service" jobs to go around and make up for it. This is all a farce, a sham writ on large scale and we AMERICANS are paying the price for it... Makes me sick

Nebe
02-22-2006, 09:05 PM
not only is the middle class being squeezed by employment problems, look at the real estate markets these days. Down here in south county, a person earning 35 G a year can not buy a house down here unless you have a big down payment. I think the average price for a house is around 350,000. I know this is not the fault of the goverment, but it just goes to show that the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer. soon there will be no middle class, only the haves and the have nots.

Skitterpop
02-22-2006, 09:45 PM
Sorry to say Nebe but that happened already...before you were born.

Haven`t seen you on line lately...busy season?

Be well,
Mike

Karl F
02-22-2006, 09:47 PM
350K :bc: :bc:
why couldn't I talk my wife into sellin out up here and moving down there last winter... can't even broach the subject with her for a coupla more years.
place will be all discovered like here, by then, (startin already, ain't it?), and right down the chit-chute it'll go, for the workin guy.

SocalStriper
02-22-2006, 11:15 PM
maybe W got brain damage from that Pretzel?

Probably just a distraction so nobody remembers Cheney shot some guy in the face with a shotgun. lol

and i'm a Rep. happy days for democrats

mekcotuit
02-23-2006, 11:29 AM
Bush: No need to worry about port security
President tries to calm uproar over planned UAE takeover

Thursday, February 23, 2006; Posted: 11:12 a.m. EST (16:12 GMT)

President Bush said Thursday the deal with Dubai Ports World would not compromise U.S. security.

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- President Bush on Thursday defended his administration's decision to allow a company from an Arab country to operate six major U.S. ports, saying, "People don't need to worry about security."

"This deal wouldn't go forward if we were concerned about the security of the United States of America," Bush told reporters during a Cabinet meeting.

Next month, the United Arab Emirates-based Dubai Ports World is set to finalize a $6.8 billion purchase of the British firm Peninsular and Oriental Steam Navigation Co., which manages the six U.S. ports, which includes New York and Miami, Florida. (See where the ports are)

The administration's blessing of its purchase by the state-owned UAE firm has triggered an avalanche of criticism on Capitol Hill.

Bush on Thursday questioned whether a double standard was being applied to a Middle East company, saying, "It's OK for a British company to manage ports, but not OK for a company from a country that's also a valuable partner" in the war on terror.

Bush added, "It's really important that we not send mixed messages to allies."

He said that administration officials will continue talks with members of Congress so that "people understand the logic of this decision."

Critics of the deal have raised concerns about the company's status as a state-owned venture, accusing the UAE of having ties to terrorism. Two of the hijackers involved in the September 11, 2001, attacks came from the Persian Gulf country, and most of the money for the plot was funneled through the banking center of Dubai.

Critics also note that Dubai was a key transfer point for illicit nuclear technology sales to North Korea, Iran and Libya that were led by Pakistani scientist A.Q. Khan.

"At a time when we're faced with this terror threat, we should not be surrendering any port to any foreign government, let alone the UAE," said Baltimore, Maryland, Mayor Martin O'Malley, whose city is one of the ports involved in the deal.

The dispute pits Bush against many of his allies in the congressional leadership, including House Speaker Dennis Hastert, R-Illinois, and Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, R-Tennessee.

Top Democrats have opposed the deal as well, calling on Bush to rescind his administration's approval pending further review. (Watch how members of both parties oppose deal -- 1:14)

Bush has threatened to veto any congressional attempt to block the deal. White House spokesman Scott McClellan said Wednesday that critics are misinformed but conceded that members of Congress should have been consulted earlier.

On Thursday, the president emphasized that "port security will be run by U.S. customs and the U.S. Coast Guard."

Dubai firm: 'Security ... is a marketing tool'
Ted Bilkey, chief operating officer of Dubai Ports World, said the company "will fully cooperate in putting into place whatever is necessary to protect the terminals."

"We're going to do anything possible to be sure that this deal goes through," Bilkey said. (Watch a company official defend the deal -- 7:39/)

Senior officials in the Department of Homeland Security said late Wednesday that Dubai Ports World was being held to a higher standard than other international companies that operate in U.S. ports.

Foreign-owned companies operate many ports in the United States. For example, in Los Angeles, California, companies from China, Denmark, Japan, Singapore and Taiwan lease operations.

Bilkey said U.S. customs officers in Dubai inspect cargo containers headed for American ports as part of a port-security effort his company supports.

"We have given them the sovereign right to inspect any container they wish to before it's loaded on a vessel," he said, calling fears that officials would turn a blind eye to terrorists "nonsense."

"Security now in our business is a marketing tool," he said. "The shipping companies want to know that you run a secure operation."

Company hires Dole to lobby
The UAE has a high-level delegation in Washington to garner support for the deal, and the company has hired former Senate Majority Leader Bob Dole to lobby for it. Dole was the Republican presidential candidate in 1996, and his wife, Elizabeth, is a U.S. senator from North Carolina.

Bush picked up support Wednesday from Sen. John McCain, R-Arizona, who urged his fellow lawmakers not to rush to judgment.

The chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee, Sen. John Warner, R-Virginia, said the UAE is a vital American ally in the Persian Gulf, a frequent stop for the U.S. Navy and Air Force, and a supply station for U.S. troops in Iraq.

Treasury Secretary John Snow, whose department chairs the review panel -- known as the Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States -- said any shortcoming in the committee's work "was in explaining this process and in having this process understood by our critics."

'This is scare politics'
Abdel Khaleq Abdullah, a professor at UAE University, said the opposition appears to include "a bit of bigotry."

"If it was an African country or a European country or an Asian country, it would not have been subjected to this kind of scrutiny," he said.

"But since this is just purely an Arab country, I think it just stopped some of the lawmakers who are making a big deal out of a purely legitimate business transaction."

Edward Kelly, executive director of the Maritime Association of the Port of New York and New Jersey, also said, "I think this is scare politics. The business community had no problem with this."

CNN's Jeanne Meserve contributed to this report

Hooper
02-23-2006, 01:10 PM
I voted for that jerk twice, who is really the jerk. Although, there was no viable alternative in Kerry. Unless the Dems start fielding better candidates voting will continue to be a batter of "who will hurt me less?"

Nebe
02-23-2006, 07:03 PM
Sorry to say Nebe but that happened already...before you were born.

Haven`t seen you on line lately...busy season?

Be well,
Mike

very busy with the glass, plus i am busy working on that you know what :faga:

Navy Chief
02-24-2006, 08:13 AM
I'm not a big fan of selling our ports to other countries, but I don't get to make those decisions. It's way too late anyways.

Lets take a reality check here, the port of Long Beach is owned by the chinese, this sale is from the British to Dubai. Our ports are not run by us! There are only about 200 U.S. flagged merchant ships in the world. We (as a country) got out of the shipping business in the 70's and other countries do it way better than we do.

Having been to the UAE more times than I can count, I will say that Dubai Port Authority is easily the best in the world at running these types of operations. Through the ports of Fallujah and Jebel Ali, almost a third of our oil flows. They have run this massive operations for years and are extremely effective. The UAE is easily our best friend in the middle east. If you have seen this company in action, you would NOT oppose this sale. Greater efficiency of our ports means lower prices on imported goods for you and me.

U.S. Customs and the Coast Guard will still be in charge of security.
This entire thing is a non-issue developed by the left wing to appear right of the administration on a issue that the democratic party has proven itself completly ineffective and inept over the past 20 years.

That's all I have to say about that.

JohnR
02-24-2006, 08:25 AM
I'm not a big fan of selling our ports to other countries, but I don't get to make those decisions. It's way too late anyways.

Lets take a reality check here, the port of Long Beach is owned by the chinese, this sale is from the British to Dubai. Our ports are not run by us! There are only about 200 U.S. flagged merchant ships in the world. We (as a country) got out of the shipping business in the 70's and other countries do it way better than we do.

Having been to the UAE more times than I can count, I will say that Dubai Port Authority is easily the best in the world at running these types of operations. Through the ports of Fallujah and Jebel Ali, almost a third of our oil flows. They have run this massive operations for years and are extremely effective. The UAE is easily our best friend in the middle east. If you have seen this company in action, you would NOT oppose this sale. Greater efficiency of our ports means lower prices on imported goods for you and me.

U.S. Customs and the Coast Guard will still be in charge of security.
This entire thing is a non-issue developed by the left wing to appear right of the administration on a issue that the democratic party has proven itself completly ineffective and inept over the past 20 years.

That's all I have to say about that.
I am not for or against this Port thing yet but leaning against at the moment but I have heard snippets of good things about the UAE port company amongst all the negative. I for one am not a fan of having a company, owned by a government, operating a US port. Same goes for China as most of their major companies are State owned.

I know the Navy significanlty uses UAE ports in the Gulf... Are they an ally of ours in the class of a Germany or a UK? I would be more comfortable that way.

spence
02-24-2006, 08:35 AM
This entire thing is a non-issue developed by the left wing to appear right of the administration on a issue that the democratic party has proven itself completly ineffective and inept over the past 20 years.
Yea, that's why so many Republican Senators are against it :doh:

It's not even really an issue of security. The question really is why should we reward a nation that's been on the wrong side of the terrorisim issue so many times.

The inside scoop is that we have CIA and Special Ops positioned right across the straight from Iran, wink, wink...

But to call this liberal fluff is pretty silly.

-spence

Backbeach Jake
02-24-2006, 09:17 AM
I can understand that we should reward our allies. But this constant sliding things like this under the radar screen by "W" is getting stale. What else ain't he telling us?

Skip N
02-24-2006, 10:26 AM
Yea, that's why so many Republican Senators are against it :doh:

It's not even really an issue of security. The question really is why should we reward a nation that's been on the wrong side of the terrorisim issue so many times.

The inside scoop is that we have CIA and Special Ops positioned right across the straight from Iran, wink, wink...

But to call this liberal fluff is pretty silly.

-spence

The left is using this to make it look like they are tough on national security. But really both partys look like freakin idiots right now with all this fake outrage.The initial reaction to this was pure emotion, they knew nothing about the deal or how the ports will be run. Now that the fact are coming out about how the UAE will not have anything to do with security and really nothing will change i think people are starting to understand the whole thing better. I know i am.

But you and Nebe should LOVE this! We are being kind to our Middle East friends like you guys aways talk about. Now that more facts are coming out i dont see what the big deal is. nothing will change security wise so who cares. If they run the best ports in world they should get the deal. Sure it sucks to see a middle east country doing this but if there's no security concerns and they do the job the best i really cant object.