with all the new plug builder's today reproducing old shape's reguardless of the difference in size or not having spinner's or lip's or whatever being left off of the new shape..how about giving the original designer and builder , who also already gave it a name some credit....I'm seeing alot of old shape's being made today that being given a [pull name outta the hat] type thing...with all due respect to the new builder's it's nice to put your own label on something,,but call them what they are..a danny's a danny...atom atom...creek chub wigglefish...creek chub minnow....gibbs pencil popper....gibbs jointed.....then your own created name....some already are which shows respect to those who came before them.:kewl:

Never did otherwise. Anybody specifically or just in general? Nothin' being done that ain't been done before anyways.

with all the new plug builder's today reproducing old shape's reguardless of the difference in size or not having spinner's or lip's or whatever being left off of the new shape..how about giving the original designer and builder , who also already gave it a name some credit....I'm seeing alot of old shape's being made today that being given a [pull name outta the hat] type thing...with all due respect to the new builder's it's nice to put your own label on something,,but call them what they are..a danny's a danny...atom atom...creek chub wigglefish...creek chub minnow....gibbs pencil popper....gibbs jointed.....then your own created name....some already are which shows respect to those who came before them.:kewl:
I don't get what you're saying?

I don't get what you're saying?
Give credit where credit is due? I think.:btu:

so when I make a plug and post a picture of it I should say this is my version of a Hickey-doo and I call it a tantalizer.??

I don't sell plugs so why should I come up with a name for a plug?

I don't get it

I understand respect but if I make a plug like something old and I don't know the history of it, what am I supposed to do to give credit where credit is due, research it? :huh:

I just turn hunks of wood into stuff that I want to catch fish on.

beat a dead horse :doh:

here's a novel idea, why dont we find a new subject to dwell on, this one is getting old.

'cept alot of us new builder swill inevitably, re-create something w/o knowing it.

'cept alot of us new builder swill inevitably, re-create something w/o knowing it.


yes sir and especially TODAY .....green beer swillers...:rotfl:

Who put the bop in the bop she bob she bop ..
Who put the Ram in the ramalama-ding-dong..

Who invented the danny. ya sure ?

that atom 40 look .. i see hicky-do,,murat,,blue streak,,master lure had that look .... fuller bros had that shape 1940..Pt.jude had it just flat nose like Hicky-do.
1st bob pond lure 44
I always try to give credit where it do but ,I think those guys were a bunch of copy cats just like us .. looked like before 1940 everybody was copying eachothers flaptail ..

Agree with Taggage, but I still call em their right name, and whatever I did to it.

A little SAT analogy to bring back those cramming memories from high school.... :hs:

A polaris is to a red fin as a Superstrike Little neck is to________


A gibbs needle is to a Bomber as a Gags needle is to __________

The list goes on and on

Answers...
Gags mambo
Rapala

My next plug will be called the ballareenaseaspookhowdeysliderseapup. :err:

Agree with Taggage, but I still call em their right name, and whatever I did to it.

your right on the money...... txs.

with the reply's I see to this thread even this place has gone down the toilet...no wonder it's lost so many good builder's....hope you all enjoy each other.

:gf: :conf:

your right on the money...... txs.

with the reply's I see to this thread even this place has gone down the toilet...no wonder it's lost so many good builder's....hope you all enjoy each other.

Yikes! I think I get what you mean... but I think you're taking things a little to far or seriously... remember... this is supposed to be fun :)

funny all the look a likes ,,only one Floyd Roman Nike ,sizzler,looking plug though ... I get ya Steve..

your right on the money...... txs.

with the reply's I see to this thread even this place has gone down the toilet...no wonder it's lost so many good builder's....hope you all enjoy each other.

I guess I am thick or stupid today cuz I don't quite get what you are saying. I think I get it but not sure.

anything specific that brought this up?:huh: :gu: and what's with the new smilies?

your right on the money...... txs.

with the reply's I see to this thread even this place has gone down the toilet...no wonder it's lost so many good builder's....hope you all enjoy each other.

sorry i wasnt around 30-40 years ago, but everytime you guys say this copy thing, you are knocking all newer plug builders. i never knock you old timers, but now im getting tired of being called copy cat, and crap like that. i take alot of pride in my plugs, and i work hard on them, and i dont appreciate anyone knocking that. it is time to face REALITY, times have changed, and there is an extremely large amount of talent on this board. so instead of going off in a huff, why dont you stop and realize that it is 2006.

two changes and it's legal

Did you see that dude that made the bunker spoons? Hes got a sizzler in an ad advertising it as his own... saying its a montauk original on the ad or whatever hahaha ... see why I dont buy the rags?

CS some folks are just transparent ;) we'll leave it at that :wave: Cheer up dude its almost time :bl:

'cept alot of us new builder swill inevitably, re-create something w/o knowing it.

Minus the swilling part in my case I would have to agree.

I dont collect nor have I looked at the history much, I produce for the most part something that already exists without knowing it:bl:

For instance,
small swimmer = "hey that looks like a Hahn" Me - who's hahn?

If'n I do copy I say it up front like the TobiasCapNike I copied, from there I changed what I didnt like or didnt swim. Pissa lure:btu:

I smell what your stepping in CS. Dont know what the answer is though. Maybe "This is my version of XYZ":huh:

your right on the money...... txs.

with the reply's I see to this thread even this place has gone down the toilet...no wonder it's lost so many good builder's....hope you all enjoy each other.

:rude:

GOP FORUM PLEASE :yak6:

Geez Whats: next to complain about....Relax dude...There are only so many shapes and sizes one can make...This is supposed to fun....

Geez Whats next to complain about....Relax dude...There are only so many shapes and sizes one can make...This is supposed to fun....

Ive said it once and i'll say it agian. there are those who are innovative, and there are those who follow. There are those who are original and there are those who are un-original.

Those who copy are only stealing from thier own future. :rtfm:

Maybe I took this post to lightly ,, some of the comments ,there seems to be an old/new guy division . Maybe also a little commercial builder/hobbyist division on boards also ..The best part of this hobby has been the journey, not the finish line.. I honor the history of each builders place in time and admire there pre-internet craftsmanship.. I don't want to disrespect what came before me because I've learned and enjoyed so much from it . Besides the 2 groups I mentioned above old/new ,, commercial /hobbyist,, There is also a third group among us,, Collector/Historian ,, These are the guys who keep it real and when we think we reinvented the wheel . They give us a history lesson .. I personally have always been drawn to the history of these salty old bastages and feel I'm better for it .. To each his own .. A meal with all the fixens or fast food .. Capesams ,,,I hear you barking big dog .. :hihi:

I think anyone who started building automobiles should give props to the inventor.....Henry Ford and name all their vehicles fords.:laugha:

After all....they are all shaped "about" the same and have wheels just like his....but are they really that different? :rolleyes:

Eben....are you following in the grand tradition of rubber eel making or do you feel you are breaking new ground?

PS....not looking for a pissing contest but just trying to make a point....this is an old topic rehashed many times......how many different ways can you make a wooden stick with hooks on it?:huh:

So you don't get angry at me Eben...I was just making a point....I think your rubber eels are very cool, tastey looking and different than any I have seen......but still shaped like a rubber eel with a different twist to the character of the body...and I love it.

I can tell you this.....I do try to make my plugs a bit different than anything I have seen.....but that in itself is difficult. I make a danny...I call it a danny....I make a pencil...its different than Gibbs but still it is a pencil. I feel as though I am going in circles.

The water in this toilet is warm....come on in!

Also....I will say what I think many are afraid to say....if we have lost many "great builders" from this site I think it is due to their inflated heads and their imagined lofty stature in the plug building world!

Move over cause BigFish likes building plugs....like it or not!:af:

Ive said it once and i'll say it agian. there are those who are innovative, and there are those who follow. There are those who are original and there are those who are un-original.

Those who copy are only stealing from thier own future. :rtfm:

well that is your opinion which you are entitled to have.
some do both.

as far as copying is stealing from the future, ya, roll on the floor,
if you mean copying plugs is stealing from your future, well, you'll need to go a little deeper into an explanation of that unless your just joining PNG in stiring.;)

I think there are leaders and there are followers in life, that is true.

I think plenty of members here give credit where credit is due so I don't see any need for a novel idea.


Steve, sorry to see you think this place has gone down the toilet :( is it anything specific that makes you think that way? You seem to think people are not calling a danny plug a danny etc.? I have not noticed any of that myself. I guess I am not very observant maybe tagger can clue me in.

Bravo Sir Slipknot....keeper of the site!:)

I don't make enough plugs to qualify as a copier.
Slip=Crankenstien.
Everyone wants to be a big plugbuilder.
There's barely any one on here that hasn't dreamed of turnin the plug that they can sell thousands of.
Ralf Cramdon's get Rich quick schemes.
Perhaps sometimes some recognition should be paid.
Consider this. If I was sellin a canal special although I apreciate what Stan or whoever has done in the design dept.to thank him might lead my sales elsewhere's.So I would call it The Outlaw Or Big Bluto.:D
Metal Lip has all kinds o funny names for his Beachmaster plugs.
Its the way of the world man Not all cars are called Ford's.
Although I don't neccesarrilay agree wit capesams Idea I give due respect.I appreciate the past.I certainly think That he is entitled to his opinions an deserves more respect than what was desplayed on some of the post's I read.
I GOT A NOVEL IDEA hOW BOUT I STICK MY BOOT IN SOME WISE ASSES.

Ive said it once and i'll say it agian. there are those who are innovative, and there are those who follow. There are those who are original and there are those who are un-original.

Those who copy are only stealing from thier own future. :rtfm:
Let's see them originals.:rollem: Hasn't pretty much everything pretty much a copy of something else? Even in some small way.

well that is your opinion which you are entitled to have.
some do both.

as far as copying is stealing from the future, ya, roll on the floor,
if you mean copying plugs is stealing from your future, well, you'll need to go a little deeper into an explanation of that unless your just joining PNG in stiring.;)

I think there are leaders and there are followers in life, that is true.

I think plenty of members here give credit where credit is due so I don't see any need for a novel idea.


Steve, sorry to see you think this place has gone down the toilet :( is it anything specific that makes you think that way? You seem to think people are not calling a danny plug a danny etc.? I have not noticed any of that myself. I guess I am not very observant maybe tagger can clue me in.

:btu: :btu: :btu: :btu:

if you mean copying plugs is stealing from your future, well, you'll need to go a little deeper into an explanation of that unless your just joining PNG in stiring.;)


Sure i will ellaborate- If a person copies alot of peoples plugs, and posts pics of his copies, sells his copies, he will be labled as a copycat, and the value of his plugs will never in a million years rival the value of the original builder's plugs. Look at Lefty's plugon Ebay right now- $90 i think?? i dont see any of his flock fetching that much, and furthermore, the bigger the flock of people that copy you, the higher the price you can comand for your work, because you can claim to be the innovator. If a copycat builder had the balls to use is brain and think about why that plug he so badly wants to copy is good, and understands what makes it good, and use some of the elements of that plug, and take elements from 3 other places, presto, he's an innovator and hopefully he will be rewarded for his hard work.
Dont get me wrong even i copy, but i copy as an excercise to understand proceess. I copied some sluggo's so i could duplicate rubber density. Once the density was matched i threw the mold in the dumpster.



Bigfish- I dont make rubber eels.. I have no idea what your talking about :huh: ;)

Eben,

Let's not forget the Dannys you sell and catch fish on... there is nothing original there right? Just a Danny that you copied... just like I copied and everyone else on this site copied? Right? :huh:

Y'know... I take that back... I'm not worried about copycats... plugs are plugs whether they're a totally original creation or an old stand-by named by its name or by some other name... I know what it is, if it catches I'll fish it... bottom line. Lets talk about herring runs or something now eh? It's almost spring and we can put these pissing contests to sleep until next winter.... SMILE :eek:

I agree Canalman on getting back to fishing, almost nothing being made now that hasn't ben made before. Some make something and think wow, that has got to be the first, then someone posts a pic of something made 40 years ago that looks just like it. No biggie, some know and some don't. It ain't a religion ( though it causes enough fights to be). let's get back to having fun and taking ourselves a little less seriously.

OK.

I agree Canalman on getting back to fishing, almost nothing being made now that hasn't ben made before. Some make something and think wow, that has got to be the first, then someone posts a pic of something made 40 years ago that looks just like it. No biggie, some know and some don't. It ain't a religion ( though it causes enough fights to be). let's get back to having fun and taking ourselves a little less seriously.


sounds good :btu:

GROUP HUG :laughs:

Herring in the runs huh Steve?:heybaby:

Herring in the runs huh Steve?:heybaby:


Yup

Eben,

Let's not forget the Dannys you sell and catch fish on... there is nothing original there right? Just a Danny that you copied... just like I copied and everyone else on this site copied? Right? :huh:

I call them dannies because they resemble the form- and as far as being copies, not really I never traced an existing blank. the lip is the same diameter as a danny lip, the tail is about 1/2 of that, and its as wide a plug as i can get out of a 2x2 ballister then divide the lenght of a 3' ballister into x amount of plugs and you get the lenght... bingo- instant danny.

AS for selling them, i will probably not spin wood for profit agian. :hs:

You MAKE a profit turning wood lures? :rotf2:

Edit I'm not stirring anyones pot...just saw a great chance to poke some fun Eben :) I haven't figured out how to make money doin this stuff yet but there sure are alot of guys who think they can nowadays :)
Keeps our heads on straight though, that's all that matters in my book.:uhuh:

" Some make something and think wow, that has got to be the first, then someone posts a pic of something made 40 years ago that looks just like it. No biggie, some know and some don't. It ain't a religion" Flaptail.

Here's my 'confession'... I will copy any and all plugs that strike my fancy. I don't know all the builders and all their styles. I am willing and eager to learn. There are some styles/groups of plugs that I can't tell apart. Thanks to guys like Flaptail, Capesams, and VinyardBlues I'm learning. My chances of selling these plagerized plugs are between zero and not. I try to give credit where credit is due. I am not insulted when someone tells me that my plug looks like so-and so's, in fact I'm flattered to have come close enough to look like something. I do a few of what I might think is original for my own use. A few. I wanna go fishing. It ain't a religion.

You MAKE a profit turning wood lures? :rotf2:

Edit I'm not stirring anyones pot...just saw a great chance to poke some fun Eben :) I haven't figured out how to make money doin this stuff yet but there sure are alot of guys who think they can nowadays :)

See thats funny
U are tryin to be like NIB:hihi:
that 'll cost ya one plug.
damned if ya do ....

You MAKE a profit turning wood lures? :rotf2:



yeah.. its not rocket science. :laugha: If you need a consultant i charge $50 an hour. :spam:

yeah.. its not rocket science. :laugha: If you need a consultant i charge $50 an hour. :spam:
I'm a better consultant, I charge $100 an hour and of course your results will depend on how well you apply my recommendations, changing market conditions and the weather.
I think if someone wants to make money they need to do what Al Gags and Stetzko are doing, farm out the manufacturing as cheaply as possible and concentrate on marketing. Plug making is labor intense and who wants to work in a factory. Well some people like it, but I know I don't.
Plug designing/copying/creating is fun but production work suks:grins:

production work suks:grins:

aint that the truth. :uhuh:

So Who gtes credit for a Atoms 40 shaped plug with a Pikie Lip?:huh:

Bob Pond and Creek Chub Bait Co. Did I get it?
C'mon guys, lighten up, it's almost time and it's supposed to be fun.

I agree..Everyone lighten up...MSBA show is next weekend..Which means we will all be fishing SOON....The season is almost upon us..:bounce:

Hi my name is Ed,,, I'm a copy cat ...

LOL....

Hi my name is Ed,,, I'm a copy cat ...


a damn good copy cat :D

you told me they were all your own design and thats why they cost $52.00 each???? :smash: :smash: :smash:

Hi my name is Ed,,, I'm a copy cat ...
You're my hero! I think that, with your help, I may actually get a Nike built! Got 'm turned, hydro-oriented and have jigs worked out. I'm a happy guy. Numbskull even gave me the angle way back in the thread. THAT's what this Plug Forum is about, right? Thanks, Bud, I was stalemated for a while. Now, the neighbor's fence is lookin' good!:hihi:
Canalman, your guitar pick for hand-carved lips is mine now,thanks!

I guess I am not very observant maybe tagger can clue me in.

Many different interrest in the same hobby..
newbees = energy,, passion
old people = some wisdom, between newbe and historian
historian = remembers where we came from,
hobbyist = doesn't care how long it takes to build a plug.
Commercial = trying to make a go of it , maybe one of us.. I will never be a jealous bastagde of these guys,,alot or work ,taken a chance. American way.. God Bless America..
Its all good !!!
May be a little friction between all of above from time-time , Thats where you come in a Slip.. I think Monster Swap and Rookie Swap kept us buisy and quite this winter,, don't believe place is in the toilet . If somebody wants to say "Hey thats a danny" thats there job .. :chased:

Ya right,Thats Nice.
Did u see the Pic of my darta.?

Ya right,Thats Nice.
Did u see the Pic of my darta.?
No ... where ? did you see mine ? I call it "The John Phillip Sousa Memorial Darter" , I finally test swam it yesterday,,,comes in like a marching band.. I was on a beach, no current,, after I stopped reeling it went right around in a circle blades still turning .. I'm going to slay bluefish this year ..:drool:

:D Loooks like a clammer special...

hobbyist = doesn't care how long it takes to build a plug.


:wid: See Mac there is a category for me.:hihi:

Tagger nice U have too much time when u start makin odd ball stuff like that u should just make a normal plug an send it too me.
PM Thats my catagory also.

Its just a hobby :buds:

Hi my name is Ed,,, I'm a copy cat ...

And #1 inspiration and mentor. :btu:

hey redneck i got my first mikecc plug today

hey redneck i got my first mikecc plug today

:rude:

why i'm shocked at that. :boots:

splashnplug cut in line
and it was a long line behind ME :D:buds:

No ... where ? did you see mine ? I call it "The John Phillip Sousa Memorial Darter" , I finally test swam it yesterday,,,comes in like a marching band.. I was on a beach, no current,, after I stopped reeling it went right around in a circle blades still turning .. I'm going to slay bluefish this year ..:drool:


:laugha:

why i'm shocked at that. :boots:


:hihi:

Nicely said Tagger, I htink you still have room for a little more metal on that thing, maybe a propeller on the front.

I'm a better consultant, I charge $100 an hour and of course your results will depend on how well you apply my recommendations, changing market conditions and the weather.
I think if someone wants to make money they need to do what Al Gags and Stetzko are doing, farm out the manufacturing as cheaply as possible and concentrate on marketing. Plug making is labor intense and who wants to work in a factory. Well some people like it, but I know I don't.
Plug designing/copying/creating is fun but production work suks:grins:
I have been told by a guy who assembles lures for and with Gags that I am incorrect. I apologize.

... Hold on, let me get on this soapbox here...


So wtf is wrong with an amateur hack copying a lure to use and catch fish? If anyone is so self righteous to insinuate this is somehow unethical or otherwise, well... I guess I lost a little respect for them.

I didn't get into building to make money. I do it to pass the winter, save a few $ and make enough plugs as not to worry about losing them. I've made ~50 this year. figure an average of $15 a plug to buy them. I've at least broken even this year.

I admire those who came before me. The true inovators, but please, don't try to diminish me in any way, because I am not one of them.

And for those who choose to no-longer post here? fine. That's your decision.

ok, I'm off.

there's something wrong w/ you people :yak5:

Sometimes I would have to agree including myself as well.

Can we move on from this thread now? thanks


After thinking about it, I think what the point CS was trying to make was that Old lures that are being produced for sale ought to have the same names as the opld ones and have some credit given kinda like what Tattoo does on his site when he shows the history of the plug. But that might lead to other problems like a copyrighted name or something so I don't see a realistic solution for all this conversation in this thread. Let's discuss it again next winter :D

there's something wrong w/ you people :yak5:


Now thats funny.

you rock red neck #24
ML SR