Last Saturday was cold and windy, but Ron Arra's distance casting was red hot. Ron and I got together for a few photo opportunities at Beavertail and then proceeded to the Andrea Hotel where Ron demonstrated the casting technique that led him to five National Distance Casting Championships.

Here's a look at Saturday:

http://fisheye.striped-bass.com/images/april/ronpainting6.jpg

http://fisheye.striped-bass.com/images/april/backload6.jpg

http://fisheye.striped-bass.com/images/april/tightload6.jpg

http://fisheye.striped-bass.com/images/april/sidecast6.jpg

http://fisheye.striped-bass.com/images/april/offbeach6.jpg

Mike

Get off MY ROCK! ;) ...

I actually have a question for Ron, Mike, & everyone else:

We all know that live Eels are the best thing since sliced bread, so how far can you cast one?

Anyone figure out the best distance casting eel stick?

I'm serious here :smash: . We pretty much all know that eels are horrible casters so that if one can gain a 10 percent advantage in casting, that will translate into real distance gained. Personally, I have no real measure of how far I can cast an eel but I think I'm pretty decent with it but I have never actually measured the cast.

Thanks...

John,

Great question...I'll see if I can coax Ron into giving us his thoughts. I know his line of signature rods are pretty fast action which is great for lures but not always the best for tossing a live offering. Ron will often use an off the beach cast for tossing chunk bait, but that would eventually buff your eel to a nice blue sheen...that might not be so bad ;).

I would think most anglers would be making a typical back cast. A few eel slingers I've met like the softer, more parabolic action of a glass rod to slingshot their eel into the suds. The problem with a lot of glass rods is they can get pretty heavy by the end of the night.

I'm sure there are a lot of qualified folks on the board that can give us some great input.

Mike

John, I fished next to Ron one night about 5 years ago in Chatham and I can't give you a distance but I can tell you it was a lot farther than me. However, I did catch more fish than him:p.
Which proves distance isn't everything. :D

you know this brings up a good question. oh, like the pics fisheye. DISTANCE. the only time distance is required is when the fish is way offshore or for checking what is around.my point of wiew is . if your fishing structure the fish will not be 200 yards away, they will be in tight trying to catch the bait that is hideing .im sure distance has its use, but 90% of the time there is no need. ived cautgh fish at 100 yds away and some at pole lenght. go figure. i hope just to make a point, not condoning long distance as it has its place in fishing.

I know that I am not alone when I say I wish I could reach those braking fish in the middle of the canal!!!!!!

Just a few more yards.....damn.


DISTANCE definatley has it's place in where I fish, and the way I fish.

I agree completely that distance is not a requirement here in the northeast. At times, that's where the fish are and I'm sure we've all been in situations where the fish were breaking another 10 yards beyond our best & smoothest cast. There is a time & place for it.

My question is fishin' eels. I think that most of us would agree ;) that the eel is pretty effective and that all of us that fish eels will often find hits & runs coming at the last few feet of the cast. Not always at the end of the cast but like S-J said, a lot of fish are caught at your feet too.

But getting back to fish at the end of the cast, if I were able to find another 10-20 reliable feet in a cast, I'm thinking a 10+ percent hit rate - knowhadimean?

I agree with both points of view -- a time and a place for everything and every technique. More times than not...the fish will be in tight, especially at night. HOWEVER, I know of lots of spots that hold fish -- day and night -- that require a long cast to get at them. Another value to distance casting is that you don't always have to pitch your offering at 12 o'clock, a long cast to 9 o'clock or 4 o'clock can allow you to work a lot of productive territory -- assuming there aren't any anglers to your left or right.

http://fisheye.striped-bass.com/images/april/alone.jpg

tattoo, im sure distance is a priorty with your place of fishing, let me asked another question. would you rather catch fish 100yds away or at your feet? since we were kids we tend to overcast fish especially fresh water. wouldnt it be the same with salt water fish. if you trow a mile you catch the fish that is a mile away.JOHN maybe 10 or 20 yds wouldnt make much of a difference. ive seen bass in 1ft curl of wave in the middle of the day. and i think they are really not that far at night either. just my opinion.

You can never cast further than your best cast. you can always cast shorter. The fact that the fish are often at your feet doesn't have much to do with having long casting ability. In fact its the fish that are not at your feet that you are after when long casting.

Anyway , its nice to be able to cast 150 yards if you need to. If you don't need too , you don't have too. I'm glad I know how to drive a car. So what if i can walk to most of the places i go to. It's still nice to be able to do it when I need it.

Places where long casts come in handy..... fall blitzing bass , Albies and Bonito in August are almost always "just out of reach , casting to a rip at a point when the surf is high and you can't get out on a rock , breaking fish in the center of the Ditch , etc.

Anyway , being able to cast far never hurts , not being able to cast far sometimes hurts.

S-J - I agree for the most part. However, often at places I fish (one place in particular ;) - right Schoolie Monster?) I've had 90% of the action at the last 20' of the cast and a little inside. Now this isn't an all or nothin' statement but what I am looking to do is gain an extra 20 feet somehow on my existing, decent eel cast... Based on my experience & gut feeling - especially at this spot, that would result in additional fish.

I'm often amused at people overcasting (been known to do that myself on occasion) depending on the location but to have that little extra capability does work in some situations....

StriperJerk -

It's a catch 22. Fish the canal and you want to reach the fish on the other side, fish barrington beach and you can pick bluefish up with your hands, some places you need it, some places you don't.

Being able to put a plug into orbit is sometimes a good trick to have in your back pocket.

What do I know, I'm a googan.

Oh yeah , I almost forgot John's questions. Long casting eels? Because of the windage of eels and the extra windage of alive eel twisting during a cast , the only good way i know of to go for long distance with and eel is to go to a spinner where you can whip it good and not have to worry what happens if the wind gets it. Of course this means you'll have to fight the fish using the spinner which doesn't thrill me.

Guys I know who have certain spots where they must cast eels far go to spinners with thin braid for line.

The MOST IMPORTANT aspect of Ron's technique is not necessarily distance -- it's that he uses FAR LESS EFFORT than the average angler uses.

Like so many other sports, when you're doing it RIGHT, it looks effortless.

Ron and Lefty Kreh can both cast for hours without the pain and suffering that goes along with poor technique. They have mastered the ability to let the rod do all the work...and that goes for shorter casts as well.

When I watched Lefty at work, I noticed he would cast to where he taught the fish were holding; he wasn't trying to dump all the fly line on every cast, yet on many casts all the line flew through the guides...and he did it for hours on end.

Mike

Originally posted by striperjerk1
let me asked another question. would you rather catch fish 100yds away or at your feet


.....I know you asked him that question and not me......but.....:D


...let me reply with my own question....

..Would you rather fight a fish for 30 seconds or 5 minutes???.....


..As much as I don't want to tire a fish out completely...so that he can't be released successfully. My goal is to have "Fun" while fishing...and where does the fun lie for me??....In the battle.


.....I may be alone on this....but I'd rather hook up at 100' than at my feet. :happy: .....but I'm a googer too:rolleyes:

...I know I should pick up Ron's book.....but ;)


....how does that method of casting effect your break-offs??....


.......What I mean is, my longest casts are the ones that bend the rod back like that.....but the lure never returns....:smash: ...SNAP!....


...how do you know how much force......is ummmm.....Too much??...Ron, are you out there??...:)

Hey bloo - a googer????


That anything like a booger?

geez im starting to think i shouldnt of put up the question. oh well, youre right saltheart it does make a difference when in certain areas. i dont disagree, and i did get off the original question , which was getting extra footage on slinging eels. and that to you are right . the only way is to change line or reel and maybe technique. or a new pole which we all think we need. for what i use i guess distance aint much of a factor but im sure it will be in the future. thanks guys for all the feed back. i guess im still learning and may need to evaluate my own way of fishing.

S-J, I agree with your points and you didn't steer anything wrong, MOF - it was semi-lively debate ;) ... More fish are probably cast beyong then too, that was hammered into me a while ago - believe me. And I've not met many distance pluggers that way outfish a comparably skilled eeler on average (I do think eeling is a little easier).

One of the reasons for my question revolves around a particular spot. It that has a continually changin structure as the tide drops. I want to better take advantage of this spot (and others) by having the ability to cast an eel a little farther than I can now. I'm still working the same 100+ feet from the surfline and not distance casting 400+ feet like some at the canal where getting to the middle or beyond is huge in site casting to those breaking fish (and a lot of fun too)...

I like the sound the reel makes on the long cast zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzz plunk . I dont care about the fish its just the sound I like , Im like a kid at the park when I go to the ball field to cast . zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzz
I love the sound of bearings in the morning !

there are soooo many factors that go into casting for distance that we could have this thread go on for days. rod length, power, action and guides, reel size and type, lure/bait weight and aerodynamics, and what i think is one of the most important factors, line choice as far as diameter. as with all these options and points, there are variables. you can cast farther w/ 15# line, but you'll have more drag pressure with 30#. braid has come a long way and i've seen guys cast pretty far with braid on a spinner. you can cast a pencil popper farther than a bomber, but i'll put money that the bomber catches more fish.

generally, a casting reel will get you more distance w/ greater drag pressure due to increased line size. 11' rods are nice for distance, but not applicable everywhere. most of arra's rods are labled as fast action, but i would consider them more of a true moderate action. they are nice rods though.

as far as casting eels farther, cast a larger eel, use lighter line, wade out farthr, or get a wet suit. and don't be afraid to put some power into your cast with an eel. you may cast off occasionally, but they are stronger than you think.

with all this said, most comes down to the angler in his experiences and personally preference. i may like an 8' rod and 4/0 senator for distance, another guy may like a naut...naut...nauti...(i can't even say that reel) and a 14' rod. so, too each his own...

my .02

John maybe look at a moderate action (live bait) rod with a foot more length than your currently using. For cost you can't beat the Lamiglass GLB series for live bait blanks, maybe the GLB1081MH or 1082MH. A reel change maybe, but I'd guess just some of those retrofits I saw in those Abu's at the MSBA meeting a couple weeks back would do the trick. Note also one of those reels had Tectan line which would help also. Tectan must be tied carefully because a good knot ain't easy in the lighter test, but it's very thin line as compared to anything of similar test. Hey I know where you can get a good 10 foot conventional that will throw a nice big fatty a long way with the right reel :).

Having read Ron's books, viewed Fish_Eye's video, and...gotten a hands-on lesson with Ron himself, I can say that I am better off than I was before.

True, distance can be counterproductive sometimes. Most of you Rhody guys are BLESSED with water that has rocky structure and deep water not far from shore (and you should feel fortunate!).

1) But there are times and places, even in New England when and where I want to reach fish 500 or more feet out...usually big water with lots of sand. South Beach @ MV is one. South Cape Beach. A few other sandy spots in RI even. Furthermore...

2) As Mike said, I cast more with FAR LESS EFFORT than I did before (less back and knee pain too which is a plus for me)

3) I can cover more water with a plug than before!

4) I've learned and adopted techniques specifically intended for pluggging, chunking, and sending bank sinkers into orbit (if you're into that kind of thing). And they work! If you learn and practice...

I wouldn't see any of you complain if you accomplish the feat in below picture...Ron can effortlessly dump 600+ feet of 25 lb. Berkley Mono (Newell P-220 w/ aluminum spool) repeatedly. And yes, catch fish.

Does it HURT to have this skill? NO!

I'm no expert angler, but lately even I have been able to push 700 feet (seven hundred) measured with a five ounce bank sinker! No amount of hardware can compensate for lack of technique.

Get the book, watch Fish_Eye's video, GO SEE RON...you guys have a living treasure trove of knowledge in your own back yard!

Just my own $0.02.

http://striped-bass.com/images/220_spooled.jpg

John, I have been throwing live eels down at the GRAVEYARD for many years. The graveyard is a massive set of ledges that extend out to approx. 500 yards from shore. While learning my own casting curve with live eels I experimented with several types of spinning rods. Thr best combination I could come up with is a 9.5' medium/heavy graphite rod with a medium action. This rig enables me to get good casts of 80-90 yards with live eels. To get that range I went to 12lbs. test premium grade line on a penn 5500. This rig works good for me bcause the relative softness of the rod action absorbs a lot of the cast shock which rips the eel from the hook. Hope that is of some help.

Mal

You can get over 200, almost 300 feet with a live eel? This I've got to see! Mal - We're fishing Maine bubba ;) because that would be double the best eel cast I've ever seen.

FWW - I agree on the smooth, efficient cast being far better than the jerk it approach so commonly used when fishing...

John forgive me if I didn't see it earlier in the thread, but what blank do you currently use for eels? I've been using a Lami 1201L wrapped spinning and really like it. I think it has a moderate taper but still has some backbone. I think for shear areodynamics, you're only going to be able to cast a live eel so far. After that, the riggies come into play.

CSK

hi csk,how do you like the rod ? im thinking about having one made, what do use on it?as far as lures and reels. just curious.

CSK - I have a few I use depending on conditions:

XRA1205 with a Mag-Elite (yeh, I realize the 1204 would be better)
Batson 1088/PB 1089 with a Calcutta 400

I'm considering the All-Star 1266/2, the XRA1204 and I have several rods still to build :eek: but I'm interesting in eeking out the best options here...

I would also rather stay conventional as I'm so comfortable with conventionals that spinning feels weird and I look like a wounded blind duck when casting a spinner...

This a a trap many fisherman fall into.Distance isnt everything.eels do not cast that far at all but, there is no need to cast them 200yds.Most fish are cast over than cast too,thats a fact.Casting far looks pretty but does not equell success.The other factor that is often overlooked is the hookset? How in the world are you going to set up on fish 100yds from shore? By the time you reel up the slack and take into account the stretch of the mono,good luck.


If the fish are that far out,Get a boat! I only fish conventional tackle and get more distance than spin gear but, Sometimes the fish are only 30yds or less of the shore,many, many hits come midway into the retrive.

So if your on a football field in a casting contest or on the beach on a bluebird day and want to look good,cast for the moon but, at night in the suds its not needed.

John , the Allstar1265/2 would be the eel stick not the 1266/2. Its comparable to an XRA 1204 but longer and faster action. Its one of the nicest rods out there.

The 1266/2 is pretty heavy duty for eels. People use it to throw jigs at the ditch. You can kill 4 OZ with the 1266 but an eel would barely load it IMO.

The 1266/2 that I use eeling is the Loomis , not the Allstar. the Allstar 1266 is heavier than the loomis 1266. You can start to load the Loomis with 1 oz but need two to start to load the Allstar. The Allstar is rated to 5 OZ (2-5) but the Loomis is rated to only 4 (1-4). If you want to wiggle an Allstar 1265 and 1266 and the Lami 1204 side by side before you buy , let me know. I have all those blanks in stock. I can bring them over when we meet with Mr Sauza. :)

very nicely put #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&.;)

Striperjerk, I really like the 1201L. It's extremely versatile. I've used it to cast as light as a 5/8 redfin, and as much as a 4oz jig. It can throw 4oz fine, but it's not quite up to jigging it in the canal. IMHO. I'd say the sweet spot is aroung 2oz. but it will still throw a 7/8 bomber pretty damn well.

CSK

This a a trap many fisherman fall into.Distance isnt everything.eels do not cast that far at all but, there is no need to cast them 200yds.Most fish are cast over than cast too,thats a fact.Casting far looks pretty but does not equell success.

Is this the same #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& who I see at Squibbie every few autumns who swims out a few hundred yards to fling an eel to land large fish? :p

Your point on hooksets is well taken, I guess you just have to be more careful if you're gunning for distance DURING THE DAY.

With fresh and sharp trebles, I haven't had any difficulties getting solid hooksets on fish taken on surface poppers from over 300 feet, but the nice thing was (come to think of it) I was fishing on the backside of a jetty with the current going AWAY from me, so there was always good amount of tension in the line. One for the notebooks.

Wrong guy there fishwee,I dont swim out to rocks.

thanks cks, is yours a factory rod or custom.? you also said spin right? hmmm, very interesting.

My bad #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&...

John, the 80-90 yard casts I refurred to are with the use of a clear casting bubble which you can partially fill with water to give wieght to help get distance. This rig is preffered hear to cast on top of ledges as the bubble keeps the eel on the surface where you want it. Just casting a 12" eel with a bare hook I am lucky to hit 35 yards . Sorry about not explaining fully (thought you used bubbles too).

Mal :smash:

StriperJerk, My 1201L is a factory spinner. A custom one is on my list. I've also cast one conventional and that was sweet as well. I got it from Mike at CC Tackle, his price was by far the best.

CSK

thanks csk, this rod is definately on my list. appreciate the info.:)