i finally got my dream setup(9"tica dolphin mh, shimano 4500b) and i am having a problem with the line. i put 40lb braid with a 30lb flouracarbon leader. all was going wel till i lost about $40 worth of tackle in the canal yesterday. i keep gettni these nots with loops in them that takes 20 mins to untie or the line burys itself under itself... anyone else have issues with it and if so what would be reccomended in place of it.

Power Pro is great line but must be handled with care. The problem is slack, this puts loose loops on your reel and then the tighter ones get buried. Assuming the line was put on tightly you should stop it when casting just before the lure hits the water. The line will straighten and you should turn the reel a few times running the line thru your fingers ensuring that it is tight.
Some anglers always seem to be having line problems even with their mono, they should probably not try braid.

I too had pp nightmares ,, cut off 2 spools of it because of line buried underneath , I'm getting along very well with fireline these days . My favirote plug to work is a spook . The jerky, slack,walk the dog action makes a mess of the spool . Keeping this in mind every so many cast I make a cast just to clean up my spool and don't let it get too bad . Or I might switch to a needle, wich I retrieve straight in , very slow .. This will also keep line on the spool from getting out of hand ,, This is all spinning gear .. still afraid of braid on conventional . Any tips on that appreciated..

Just remember, you need a large line roller on your reel when using braid, also relling in with tension helps so light lures and stuff like needles will cause trouble as the line goes on too loose. I think if you have a shimano aitrunner, that those line rollers are not good for braid, fireline would be a better choice. Also if you fish the canal, use very heavy gear, don't go undergunned.

Hi guys
new here but I have seen this problem when guys switch to pp.
Dont over full the reel and and like Plug race said flip the bail just
before it hits the water. When you cast look at the spool when you finsh casting. You might see a loop sticking out. when you start to reel the loop is sticking out and there is your next wind knot.
also if the spool feels like the line is loose make a long cast and tighten the line as you reel in . Like everthing else it takes time to learn. I have used pp for many years on my baitcasters but fond
fire line works better on my spinners

Hi guys
new here but I have seen this problem when guys switch to pp.
Dont over full the reel and and like Plug race said flip the bail just
before it hits the water. When you cast look at the spool when you finsh casting. You might see a loop sticking out. when you start to reel the loop is sticking out and there is your next wind knot.
also if the spool feels like the line is loose make a long cast and tighten the line as you reel in . Like everthing else it takes time to learn. I have used pp for many years on my baitcasters but fond
fire line works better on my spinners

Welcome. Good first post. In my experience, fireline does better than powerpro on baitcasters as well, at least in saltwater.

I like PP, but not the 30#....got windknots as mentioned above. I am using 50 and 60# PP and have very few problems on spin gear.

have never used pp w/ spinning, but I'd swear by it for conventional. theres a learning curve with it, definitely, but I'd say stick with it and try different methods of casting, retrieval, and untangling til you find what works for you. even practice on a lake, where you don't have to worry about current or actually catching a fish. if all else fails, go up in test, because it'll still be smaller than mono. hope ya get the hang of it!

what is the diffrence between pp and fireline....arent they both braid? i used to use fireline on my 7foot uglystick and never had a problem, maybe i should go back?

what is the diffrence between pp and fireline....arent they both braid? i used to use fireline on my 7foot uglystick and never had a problem, maybe i should go back?
Fireline is very hard and slick,, I think pp is soft and a little spongy .. They say fireline is not braid ?? whatever it is works for me .. They are all a little different .. Whiplash was good .. kinda soft and laid flat,,not round .. I used Callcutta too .. No problems with it ,, just seemed like a much larger diameter .. like fishing with cord .

Fireline is alot stiffer when its new so it sits on the reel better.
PP is super limp and stays that way . PP works great on my baitcasters because I am ch#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&g bait and wieght. It takes
awhile to get use to but for distance it cant be beat and once
you get use to braid you will never go back
one last thing check your drag. Braid doesnt brake like mono
the rod will brake before the line. I saw a guy brake a 7 foot pole
on a fluke trip . 50 pound pp , 6 pound fluke ,he locked down the drag (why I will never know) the fluke came off the bottom and made a run back. Snapped the pole but still got the fish

what is the diffrence between pp and fireline....arent they both braid? i used to use fireline on my 7foot uglystick and never had a problem, maybe i should go back?

There is a big difference. Powerpro is a true braid, coated with something to reduce friction. Fireline is a mess of smaller extruded filaments wound together and held with a waxy base material. Powerpro is limper, particularly when new, smaller in diameter, particularly in the line tests over 20# and when used a while, but much less abrasion resistant (like all braids) and much more prone to cut in on itself. Fireline also knots easier (and I think stronger) than Powerpro. Of the two, I find Fireline much more durable and easier to use, all though Powerpro has its advantages in casting distance and deep jigging applications.

I find that the pp & fireline get less wind knots as the line begins to fade from its original color along with techniques described above.

I find that the pp & fireline get less wind knots as the line begins to fade from its original color along with techniques described above.


For me that usually coincides with the overfilled spool getting cut back to the proper level on the spool..
I like Fireline when it's new.Gives me a feeling of invincibility.

within the last two years I swapped over to spinning reels and was dreading using braid on a spinner. I did have a few breakoffs due to the bail flipping over or the cup of the spinner rotating and catching the line but never any problems using with wind knots or the line laying on the spool.

After you close your bail by hand, try pulling down 6in or so of line down off the spool before your retrieve. Saves alot of problems of overloops that can form over the spool and cause cut offs.

After you close your bail by hand, try pulling down 6in or so of line down off the spool before your retrieve. Saves alot of problems of overloops that can form over the spool and cause cut offs.
yup....I instinctively pull the line to make sure things are good every time I close the bail.......2nd nature......also pull the opposite way(just a little tug,tug)before you open the bail to feel if braid is wrapped around the tip of the rod....so you dont have foul ups that way or cast off a beautiful plug....another good thing to do is wet PP or braid on the spool before first cast every time out.......

i will try the 6 inch pull off to make sure things are good, and i think when i get a chance i am going to make the switch back over to fireline, i never had these kind of problems, but on the other hand i was never useing this heavy of line, max of 20lb. now i have 40lb and changed brands....

well on a positive, i have never caught anything at the maratime academy and before loosing any gear i was able to pull in a 24"schoolie on a spoon. so i guess it was a learning experience on all fronts...

i thank you all for your info...


scott

There are 2 reasons why u get the so called windknots.One is the spool is overfilled.An the second is the line is laying on the spool too soft.
If the spool is overfilled the line will dig slightly when u lay into a cast an pull the line below it off the spool in coils that donot unravel on there own.these coils are what make the knots.
When using some lures that have little resistance on the retrive
like needles or some metals.U will notice the line wraps on the spool
softer than i might normally.
When u cast the line will dig in from the weight of the lure an the force of the cast.This digging into the soft line will cause the coils to pull out from underneath again.Reeling up fast or with some tension only fixes the problem for one cast.
The best thing u can do is take some line off.I know its hard to do cause it is expensive an u hate to lose any line an ur distance may suffer some.But it is usually the only thing to fix the problem.I always have the tackle shop put the line on the reel.as when u reel in on urself when u try to make it tight it has a tendencey of pulling up towards the top of the spool.So u end up with line on the spool that is narrow on the bottom an fatter towards the lip.This will also give ya trouble.

You are correct NIB, but a possible third reason.. sticky line roller.. don't ask why I know :blush:

dont get the line stuck on ur finger when you cast owe still recovering. I went back and my lure got stuck on my back pack then i went forward and cut the sh*t out of me:(

Like alot of guys have said, too much line on the spool is probably one issue. '

Take off a little line and try it again,
close bail manually when casting, it will become second nature and will prevent a loose loop deep in the spool for the next cast.

also when going from a popper or spook to something heavier, make an easy cast with the next lure, reel it in without working it, line will be tight and you will be good to go.

One more thing, after alot of trial and error, we use only 30# power pro on the light spinning reels and 50# on the biggers reels and rarely have a problem.

Hope this helps!!!

You are correct NIB, but a possible third reason.. sticky line roller.. don't ask why I know :blush:
4 th reason .maybe . My troubles have been with conventional . I just recently gone back to spinning last couple of years (braid), Before that ,,To many years to count ,most all my fishing was conventional . I was taught to wind my line on the spool as level as possible (mono) and that would improve your next cast . I think i wind the braid to neat ,, and some have suggested I cross it over itself more,, instead of laying it next to itself .. old habits are hard to break and can't afford to keep filling up and cutting it off ,,, learning curve $$$$$

I am not sure about Shimano Baitrunners but the Shimano Stradics that I have comes with a little bag of plastic spacers. Most spinning reels do. The Stradic out of the box is set up for mono and the issues of overlaps would happen. Braid would never lay evenly until I added one or two of the space washers. Once I added the washers the overlap problem went away and I can see the braid lay evenly on the spool. Occasionaly when casting into the wind with lite plugs it can overlap. Most of the time it's okay.

4 th reason .maybe . My troubles have been with conventional . I just recently gone back to spinning last couple of years (braid), Before that ,,To many years to count ,most all my fishing was conventional . I was taught to wind my line on the spool as level as possible (mono) and that would improve your next cast . I think i wind the braid to neat ,, and some have suggested I cross it over itself more,, instead of laying it next to itself .. old habits are hard to break and can't afford to keep filling up and cutting it off ,,, learning curve $$$$$


Good point Tagger.
I do this on my newells wide crosses with the tumb.makes more of a crossing pettern an keeps the line from digging in as much.Level winds are not really any good with braids under 50 lbs for this reason.the neat windings of the level wind allow for the braid to dig in pretty deep when a lot of pressure is applied to the line like when hung up.

Just needs to be handled extra carully. I havn't had any problems, but I alsways am very careful with it.

Tagger, the most important hint I can give is that once you have your braid on the reel. Tie the end to your truck or a tree and walk it all off. Then reel it back on with a lot of tension(rod bent almost double). This will eliminate the soft base. So when you get a backlash, it won't dig in deep. The first hundred yards or so will be looser from use, but , you won't have to dig deep in the spool just to find the loop that's causing the trouble. If you are leveling it yourself, cross it up more than you would mono, for the same reason.

I have been using it for 2 years on 2 reels..No problems at all..

My Shimano Spheros works great with PP 30lb very rarerly will i get a wind knot. I had 20lb that would knott up more on some crappy reel.

Tagger, the most important hint I can give is that once you have your braid on the reel. Tie the end to your truck or a tree and walk it all off. Then reel it back on with a lot of tension(rod bent almost double). This will eliminate the soft base. So when you get a backlash, it won't dig in deep. The first hundred yards or so will be looser from use, but , you won't have to dig deep in the spool just to find the loop that's causing the trouble. If you are leveling it yourself, cross it up more than you would mono, for the same reason.

That makes sense to me ,, keeping the base hard under the fluff that naturally occurs from working different plugs .. that and more crossing pattern on the spool Nib also mentioned.. Been kinda waiting until I got more knowledge before putting braid on Conventional again .. maybe I'll give it one more shot .. Thanks

Been considering a switch from mono to braid but keep hearing stories like this and keep asking myself if it's worth the trouble. So far, it seems the answer is,,, probably not.
If you guys are willing to endure all this, what the jimminy am I missing? I've no problems at all with the mono. Why would one bother?
Not trying to be argumentative, just wondering why bother?

Getting set up with a conventional and am seriously considering braid (PP). seems like braid is designed with a tilt towards conventional more than spinning,,,,, but couldbe wrong.
What say you?

Been considering a switch from mono to braid but keep hearing stories like this and keep asking myself if it's worth the trouble. So far, it seems the answer is,,, probably not.
If you guys are willing to endure all this, what the jimminy am I missing? I've no problems at all with the mono. Why would one bother?
Not trying to be argumentative, just wondering why bother?

Getting set up with a conventional and am seriously considering braid (PP). seems like braid is designed with a tilt towards conventional more than spinning,,,,, but couldbe wrong.
What say you?

Why.. Ok talking spinning ..1 braid has no memory like mono so it goes straight out thru the guides (no choking).. Huge atvantage in casting distance ,fishing heavier pound test ,while using lures that are very light.(bomber types).. 2. the feel ... no strech .. you can feel the hits and every little viration like the fish is in your hands. I have absolutely no problem with these lines on spinning gear and in fact love it .. Only draw back to these high tech lines is fishing rocks ..Under tension (fish) there are no see saw battles on the rocks .. line breaks quite easily . Mono still king of the rock pile .

Why.. Ok talking spinning ..1 braid has no memory like mono so it goes straight out thru the guides (no choking).. Huge atvantage in casting distance ,fishing heavier pound test ,while using lures that are very light.(bomber types).. 2. the feel ... no strech .. you can feel the hits and every little viration like the fish is in your hands. I have absolutely no problem with these lines on spinning gear and in fact love it .. Only draw back to these high tech lines is fishing rocks ..Under tension (fish) there are no see saw battles on the rocks .. line breaks quite easily . Mono still king of the rock pile .

Like Eddie said. Feeling the plug working is a real plus.

I can feel a fish pass gas with braid.
I primarily use 30 lb fireline around rocks an I have had good success with the abraision factor.

I can feel a fish pass gas with braid.
I primarily use 30 lb fireline around rocks an I have had good success with the abraision factor.
What kind of rocks ? When you fall down do you get up covered in blood and razor cuts ? Or like canal rocks covered in thick weed resembling big green pillows ?

Are you using a 4500 baitrunner? I have 3 of them and they do tend to have some issues with pp braid. I have multiple spools for each of them and pp does foul up far more on this reel then other shimanos. IMO The reason is that 4500 baitrunners do NOT have the "super slow ossillation" of the spool that their other reels do. It works, but not as well as the stratic and stella types. With these reels you can actaully tune the spool to lay the line on there in a certain fashion that is braid friendly and the spools lays the line on there nice and slow (like rope on a spool, instead of up and down real fast) If this is your problem you might try another braid or switch to mono...or buy another reel that works with braid. (fireline may work better...but it is not as thin as PP)

What kind of rocks ? When you fall down do you get up covered in blood and razor cuts ? Or like canal rocks covered in thick weed resembling big green pillows ?

Any kind, anywhere. Jamestown (Beavertail), Newport, Narragansett, Westerly, Block you name it. I have extreme confidence in this stuff, I have landed some very nice fish in some very boney areas.

What kind of rocks ? When you fall down do you get up covered in blood and razor cuts ? Or like canal rocks covered in thick weed resembling big green pillows ?

I fish em all Eddie.I have to show a pic of my buddies leg when he slid down along side a rock with shorts on.I've done the same thing,leg blows up an u use gallons of peroxide to keep it kleen.The kinda rocks u put ur hand on an don't slide it at all an u still get cut.Then there are pilings,steel bridge abutments.icebreakers,bulkheads,the whole nine yds.u just gotta lighten up when u feel the pressure or it's over Johnnee.I also change my fireline like most people change mono.i like it new an fresh.it's really tough when new it will break 50lb leader when new 2 days later it won't.whats that tell ya.when it gets grey i thro it away.This spring I changed or flipped it 2 0r 3 times..I usually put on around 250 yds an flip it then toss it.I don't wait for it to fail.i buy it in 1000 yd spools i will use At least one per yr.>Ya it's probably overkill.I don't like taking chances.

Are you using a 4500 baitrunner? I have 3 of them and they do tend to have some issues with pp braid. I have multiple spools for each of them and pp does foul up far more on this reel then other shimanos. IMO The reason is that 4500 baitrunners do NOT have the "super slow ossillation" of the spool that their other reels do. It works, but not as well as the stratic and stella types. With these reels you can actaully tune the spool to lay the line on there in a certain fashion that is braid friendly and the spools lays the line on there nice and slow (like rope on a spool, instead of up and down real fast) If this is your problem you might try another braid or switch to mono...or buy another reel that works with braid. (fireline may work better...but it is not as thin as PP)


I wonder how the "ossilation" on my 706z is.It does have a nice big an narrow spool.
I bet the folks over at shimano made that word up.