:ss: Hi all, Some of you know me an some don't. I'm the Stripermaineiac from up in Maine-- Ron . I was wondering if there is gonna be any movement to shut down the comercial rod -n-reel striper season or not. Ever since it started back up in the mid 90's the numbers of large stripers around has been getting fewer an fewer each year. It's gotten so bad that few people are finding them an up here in Maine they have become almost non existant.
The small number of big bass being seen all up and down the coast is a bad sign. Between all the by catch killing huge numbers of big bass an the comercial rod n reelers selling 30 fish apiece every day well the toll is becoming huge with big fish being wiped out. The sad part is the majority of those doing the comercial rod n reel have regular jobs an often brag about all the new toys they have gotten with the money they make from the sales.
I remeber all the steps an sacrafices we made back in the 80's to bring these great fish back from the brink an here we are again back on the same road so a small few can make a quick buck. at least we should look at doing as Florida does. If you aren't providing 25 percent of your income from it you don't get a liscence to do it.
Either way something needs to be done about the control that the comercials have over fisheries in Mass. Shut down the scup season to non-comercials an give comercial fishermen a longer season. Extend the squid season 2 weeks because the comercials can't fill their quota. Good idea when there is a shortage of them to extend the season. Then the damage being done to the herring by the pair trawlers an other netters so shut down the taking of herring to sportfisherman. MMMM then tell the comercials they can have a 2500 lb per day by catch. Do we even use that much herring for bait for most of the season what they have as a weekly bycatch.
Well for my 2 cents its time to start pushing for action before things get too bad again. I'm for gamefish status yes but I'm also for smarter management an tell the greedy no a little more often before there's nothing left to fish for. Tight lines all., Ron

first of all, commercial fisherman in mass have no say in the scup or the squid regs. the scup are regulated by the ASMFC, and the squid are regulated by NMFS. so if you have a beef about the regs in those two species, take it up with those agencies, don't dump on mass commercial fisherman.

as for the striped bass fishery, i agree with you in a sense that folks should have to prove they are making at least half their income off fishing in order to obtain a commercial license.

how are you gonna get 25% of income in RI /when the spring quota is 4 fish per license & the fall is 3 fish // typical RI style // They cut the spring season super short /& the one on Labor day weekend they cut after only 5 days / & that weekend had 3 days /just about unfishable ;;;; now they can,t fill the quota // is it added on to next years / or is the quota cut because it wasn,t reached ...

But go figure =herring are in trouble / Mass, RI &Conn / banned the take of them /// yet the inshore trawlers do a number on them in N,D & J ;;;

The striper is already in trouble ;;;

in RI the trap size is considerably less that the R & R //

&&&&&& Gods not even sure of the Bycatch kill ;;;

what,s Marylands size limit /// it was 12" when the rest of the coast was 16"

If th law states you can keep two 28" fish or you can sell so many when ------ & how its a law & I don,t have a problem with it ;; It would be nice if we all on the same playing field ;;;

there is talk of a scup & summer Flounder Cutback for 2007 ===who will benefit from that ??????????

My biggest beef is the continuing on people talking shorts to eat & [or] sell ;;;;

DEM is sooooooooooo f$%^&*( cut in RI now // its just about simple to break any law & get away with it //

I can count on two hand how many times I,ve seen the dem aroung this year & on [no] hands the times that they were actually engaged in some kind of work // besides bodie,s searches & boating accidents ..

Fifteen years ago I would see them on a daily basis on the water & agian the same day at the S/F dealers ;; I havn,t been checked in the last 15 years ;;;


they could even the yearly budget /just by fining those that go over the 10 ten fish limit on blues [[ its kinda ok]] cuz I hate them ///
how about the crews that line up all over the place , men ,woman & kids / taking everysingle thing that swims // BUT at least they waste nothing ====== they could even go broke paying fines for littering ....

its a losing battle ;;

think about this ;; WHAT Happened

frost fish at nite with a flashlifht & spear

Tom cod // still being caught /but noway like they were ;;

White perch // XL & jumbo,s by the tote / now ya lucky if ya catch one ;;

winter flounder by the buckets

Baloonfish fish /// I Ve seen you in a lobster tank a few years ago // use to catch them regularly /while Bottom fishing ;;

GIant B/F tuna = use tobe catch within sight on RI,s S/C beaches & off beavertail ----- now C/C or a small window approx 75-100 miles offshore ;;;;;

the s hits deeper than thet realize ><><><:behead:

Hey Ron :wavey:

This debate always happens. The comms don't catch 15% of what we do. The problem is the bait. These fish need more to eat and more protection in the size classes. I'm not very pro or anti comm fishing for stripers but I am for fixing the bait...

:ss: Hi all, Some of you know me an some don't. I'm the Stripermaineiac from up in Maine-- Ron . I was wondering if there is gonna be any movement to shut down the comercial rod -n-reel striper season or not. Ever since it started back up in the mid 90's the numbers of large stripers around has been getting fewer an fewer each year. It's gotten so bad that few people are finding them an up here in Maine they have become almost non existant.
The small number of big bass being seen all up and down the coast is a bad sign. Between all the by catch killing huge numbers of big bass an the comercial rod n reelers selling 30 fish apiece every day well the toll is becoming huge with big fish being wiped out. The sad part is the majority of those doing the comercial rod n reel have regular jobs an often brag about all the new toys they have gotten with the money they make from the sales.
I remeber all the steps an sacrafices we made back in the 80's to bring these great fish back from the brink an here we are again back on the same road so a small few can make a quick buck. at least we should look at doing as Florida does. If you aren't providing 25 percent of your income from it you don't get a liscence to do it.
Either way something needs to be done about the control that the comercials have over fisheries in Mass. Shut down the scup season to non-comercials an give comercial fishermen a longer season. Extend the squid season 2 weeks because the comercials can't fill their quota. Good idea when there is a shortage of them to extend the season. Then the damage being done to the herring by the pair trawlers an other netters so shut down the taking of herring to sportfisherman. MMMM then tell the comercials they can have a 2500 lb per day by catch. Do we even use that much herring for bait for most of the season what they have as a weekly bycatch.
Well for my 2 cents its time to start pushing for action before things get too bad again. I'm for gamefish status yes but I'm also for smarter management an tell the greedy no a little more often before there's nothing left to fish for. Tight lines all., Ron

Three things Ron:

1. Get the facts before you post this stuff.

2. Come in off the ledge.

3. Nothing personal, but these types of well intentioned posts usually contain zero fact and 100 percent emotion/self interest, just like this one.We do have some problems, but it isn't due to a lack of bass,especially the small ones. When you see the little ones(replacement fish) disappear, its panic time.

You make some good points!!!
What needs to be done is for all these States to get together
and discuss each others regs. for fishing!!!
Maybe a compromise can be worked out!!!
:smash:

Didn't you have the same discussion over on SOL a few months ago? You'll get the same answers here--why start it again unless it's just to stir the pot?

When I, in my other identity as Ditch Jigger, threw some facts up there, you seemed to accept them as valid. Go back and read them--I don't have the patience to rehash this stuff. :doh:

Lack of big fish the last 2 years during comm. season wasn't due to me. I suck.

Like John R said this arguement comes up every year.:lurk:

I believe, but don't take this as fact, I have heard that if you do the research gathered from the State that the average size commercial bass sold is not that "large"...I believe it is around 20 pounds.

What I really can't stand is when the arguement comes about only comm fisherman should have a license etc.....lots of people have more than one source of income whether it is 50% 10% or 2%. Lots of comm fisherman say have a plow on the truck in the winter. This is like saying only true plow drivers can plow. That arguement just doesn't hold water.

Dear Ron, Maine is such a nice place, why not stay the %$%$%$%$ up there and mind your own house instead of coming on this board and starting trouble. Are you a StripersForever plant or informant? Like the Recreational Fishing Alliance who based all thier scinece (junk science) on a supposed "expert" who was found to have falsefied his resume' and never ever actually observed on any boats, by his own admission a week ago, is actually a phony.

Now, get this right for once and for all, then go back to browsing the LL Bean catalogs for the winter, commercial harvest of striped bass in this state no where near mirrors or exceeds the recreational take and poaching done by certain ethnic groups. Our problem is not bass it's bait. No herring, minimal large Menhaden, lack of sand eels inshore on the outer Cape and seals.

Now, I beg you, from now on post constructively or shut the %$%$%$%$ up.

I can't type anymore my hands are too cut up from catching bass from dawn to midnight yesterday.

Sincerely, Steve Shiraka, Falmouth Ma.:bsod:

Here's the Cliff's Notes version of my reply to you on SOL:

1) The Mass commercial season starts on the second Tuesday in July.

2) Few, if any, of the fish taken will be migrating to Maine after mid July.

3) The Mass fishery is rod and reel only and has a 34" minimum. Every female fish harvested has spawned at least once.

4) Assuming a 20 pound average, about 50,000 bass are harvested during the Mass commercial season.

5) Estimates put the current striped bass biomass at somewhere between 40 and 50 million, coast wide.

6) The Mass commercial season has a negligible effect, if any, on the numbers of bass in Maine.

Flap ::

I see your off to a wonderful f $%^&*( day :::wave:

One other point...
Squid f--- like jackrabbits... we need to be worried about pogies, sand eels, herring etc.. last numbers I heard Squid were doing OK..
Oh, and what Flap, Clammer and Mike P said too...

Although the recreational catch and release mortality likely (or certainly if you believe the standard estimates) exceeds the commerical harvest, I have a hard time believing that the recreational take of LARGE bass is greater than the commerical pressure on the same year classes. Very few recreational fisherman catch and kill large fish on a consistent basis. If I am correct, it means that the commerical season takes an inordinate toll on the largest fish in the population, year after year after year. A lower commerical size limit (say 26") would shift this pressure onto younger year classes, at the expense of killing more fish before they spawn, but with the benefit of preserving larger fish populations as a trophy fishery and genetic stock. Once fish get to a certain size, I think they should be protected more than is currently the case.

Hi all , Seems like I hit some sore spots. Well 1st I don't post on SOL.Second I base my points on both passion for the fish an for the decline in the large fish we see in Maine ever since the Rod an Reel season started in Mass. We were told it would have no affect on our fishery up here. Within a year of it starting in the mid 90's the number of large fish we saw up here started to decline.My catch totals of stripers over 40 in went from almost 500 fish in a season to less than 250 the next. Most of which were released, many with ALS tags in them, one over 50lb.The tag returns that I got were landed right in the middle of the commercial season in Mass. The next season it was under 200 fish an from then till now it's gone down to just a tad over 3 dozen stripers over 40 in landed. Sad part is I'm one of the hard cores thats out there beating the water all the time. Remember the name stripermaineiac. Few people up here in Maine even see a fish over 40 in anymore. As far as the migration goes well the fish will follow the food and migrate as long as they feel like it due to water temps,food an sun angles.Remember the seasons are changing thats why we are seeing stripers up here as later as December now.
The numbers are showing as to whats landed by the number of comercial fishermen that were in the Striper cup winners. The affect is seen in the things like the MV Derby when there are few stripers over 40 inches even weighed in. Good thing they dropped their size limits to 32 inches. There wouldn't have been very many stripers weighed in if they hadn't.
The point is that thanks to electronics we have become way to efficient at killing off the fish that we love. You add this to the by-catch issues an well reality is we are on our ways backwards. I fish the coast from Conn to Maine regularly.When I hear many of the charter guides complaining that the number of large fish is way down then I start to worry. They are on the water daily and if they are having a hard time finding large breeders then we need to take a pause at what we are doing.
As far as comparing commercial fishing to sportfishing well lets really compare notes. how many weekend or evening fishermen really catch more than a few fish a yr.I do beleive they statistic people say there are several million sportfishermen out there.The season was what around 30 days with 30 fish per seller. An how many were in the selling game? 1000 maybe 2000. Thats a lot of breeder size striped bass killed for some extra cash like the new stellas an custom rods some used the money for,or the new motor on a couple center consoles. remember I know a lot of you that are doing the commercial rod n reel so don't go gettin pious on me. I' know I'm starting a big debate on this. I'm gonna do this as much as I can to see if things can be changed. I don't want to go back to the times like the moritoium.
Yes there are some serious issues like the bait an so on. These need to be taken care of also. With out food the striper population will continue to dwindle. We have all seen an destroyed sick stripers that are deseased or starving. I feel very strongly on this as I have seen the results ist hand. Yup I have had some nice fishing with the small fish but even these are starting to dwindle in numbers.
Hey listen guys we need to be smart an don't shoot ourselves in the foot for a little greed. It happened before an guess what it's starting to happen again. As far as me staying up here in Maine well I fish the Mass waters more than a lot of you that live down there. These are all of our fish not just a select few that want to add to the wallet. We need to make some changes . I'd love to see the big fish return but it won't happen if they are wipped out for a buck. As far as Stripers Forever well I'm a member of that as I've been a member of Stripers Unlimited for almost 40 yrs now and CCA along with being a member of MSBA a few times an MBBA a few times along with several other clubs. Funny though it seems that a lot of these clubs all were active in the restoration an are also active with each other for the preservation of the fish of our passion. The Striped Bass
Take the time to really stop and think about it. Tight lines Ron

I thought I posted on this earlier, but I don't see it... Anyway, if you are really concerned you should recognize and address the fact that according to the 2002-2004 numbers, including adjustments for bycatch for comms and release mortality for recs, recs take roughly 70% of the catch by numbers and total weight. One can argue that comms take bigger fish, bycatch is greater than calculated etc, but there is really no denying that the rec impact is dramatically, awesomely greater. Get rid of all commercial bassing and you still have huge #'s of bass killed. I have the same general concerns about the fishery as you, but believe we (recs) are the ones who may need greater restraints and asmfc and nmfc needs its ashstesh arranged for the pathetic bunker limits and other actions. Blaming it on the comms, let alone rod and reel comms will do nothing to fix a huge ecological problem.

Wow!!!
Nothing like inviting new members to post on this site???
And you wonder why with all these members that only a few post comments?
:smash:

Hi Ron...Didnt see you this year on MV.....:wave:

Listen to what is being said. IT'S THE BAIT!!!

For the first time in 20 years plus we had large bunker in upper Narragansett Bay late in the season. If you snagged a few and knew where to go you could catch 25 to 30 pound fish till your arms fell off.
Now the bunker have migrated out of the Bay and down the Coast and everyone is saying that the Bass are in trouble.
There are tons of Bass. I caught more 30 pound fish this year than ever in my life because I found the big bunker. If we get the Ark Bait boats out of the bay there will be more and more large Bass. You can't support a large bio-mass on peanut bunker. A 40# fish needs a lot of food to sustain itself and Bunker have the highest protein and fat content of any forage available in the NE. It's just common sense.

The Bass will go to where the food is. BI is close to dead this Fall...at least from shore... because there is no large bait present. We use to have the Blueback Herring in the Fall all around the Island. Now the Russian trawlers have suck all of them up. Thus no bait...no bass.
Look at the Outer beaches. Worse season in years. WHY??? The Seals have scooped up all the bait. Common thread here. BAIT BAIT BAIT!!!! Solve the bait problem and the Striper population will take care of itself. The commercial fishing community has virtually no affect on the Bass population.

:sleeps:

Ron - read what Piemma said - Bait = Bass. In RI for a while it was dead unless you had the bunker, NJ had unbelievable fishing (I'm told) for far longer than normal because they had tons of bait. Boston had mediocre fishing because of lack of bait, Block, lack of bait, Cape lack of bait. \

THAT is the trend. These guys hit the nail with the fact that the overwhelming take is from Rec fishing. If you reduce / remove the comm fishing of large fish (Mass) you will slightly improve that stock. If you REALLY want to reduce the culling of larger bass put on a 40% reduction of take to COMs AND Recs.

If you REALLY Want to fix the fishery - FIX THE BAIT...

Hi all, see Ron a few times a year, at shows, fishing somewhere, out at The Derby. He is as passionate about bassing as any of us. So give him a little break (not too much though :fishslap: :hihi: ). I don't think he has been through this exhaustive drag out battle before....

If we are going to go with the bait = large bass theory (which I wholeheartedly agree) why don't you look at the bait situation in Maine.
Starting in the early to mid 90's (your downturn) midwater herring trawlers were introduced to the Gulf of Maine. 120 ft draggers have been pairtrawling inshore waters grabbing every piece of bait in the GOM for 10 years now. Over 1/2 of these boats are based in Me and Portland has the highest landings of herring in the country. Giant Bluefin catches have crashed in ME over the last 5 years and most involved in the fishery believe this is directly linked to the herring-- think this may have effected your Bass fishing as well?

Take away your big bait, take away your big fish. There are alot of groups working on the herring situation - obviously you are passionate about the fishery, maybe you can direct some of your effort here.

There is a pretty interesting article in Yankee Magazine this month about saving the fishing industry in Maine. Mostly groundfish but worth the read. P.