Any good .. You think it increases you catch rate . I'm still making leaders out of regular mono. I know offshore line shy tuna guys like it . What about from shore bass fishing ?

50 pound fluro for me......maybe its a "comfort zone" thing but it works for me!:kewl:

Nope, went from Fluro to Mono and didn't skip a beat. I hate tying knots with Fluro and it's not worth the extra $$$ IMO.

yep i use it 50-65 for bass cept if i'm on the flats then 20.
i'll take every edge i can.

Mono for stripers and blues :kewl:

this has been talked about many times....flouro is a waste of money..mono has worked for many decades with no problems...some people just like to buy into hype and thats exactly what the companies want...your money....But from using the stuff vs using mono for over 20 years and catching many nice bass....I can say there is no difference...Its a waste...it doesnt give you any edge..

this has been talked about many times....flouro is a waste of money..mono has worked for many decades with no problems...some people just like to buy into hype and thats exactly what the companies want...your money....But from using the stuff vs using mono for over 20 years and catching many nice bass....I can say there is no difference...Its a waste...it doesnt give you any edge..
Yup, just another thing to catch fisherman's $$$

I have been wondering about this too. I have used fluro in the past mostly when fly fishing. When using surf casting gear - I have stuck with 30 - 40lb Ande or Big Game mono. Was thinking of picking up some Ande fluro for this season. Always seem to think that you are using larger plugs, rubber, tins, etc., sometimes a swivel and a duolock snap, so how stealthy are you going to be if you just switch the mono to fluro? Is it really going to make a difference? That said, i did see some underwater fishing pictures where fluro was used and you could not see the line in the pictures - it did blend it. The line in the picutes was something like 10lb test though, so tough to judge what 40lb diameter line would look like in comparison.

It is expensive for the amount of line you get, but on the other hand - we spend a lot of money traveling to fish, on other equipment, etc. - so if it did make a difference the extra expense is very small especially if it meant more fish, or the difference in catching fish or getting skunked.

Have always used fluro, but just yesterday picked up 50 yard roll of Ande clear mono 30# for just 3.99. Time to start tying leaders. Still have some heavier weight Seguar fluro from last year's MSBA show sale.

I have been wondering about this too. I have used fluro in the past mostly when fly fishing. When using surf casting gear - I have stuck with 30 - 40lb Ande or Big Game mono. Was thinking of picking up some Ande fluro for this season. Always seem to think that you are using larger plugs, rubber, tins, etc., sometimes a swivel and a duolock snap, so how stealthy are you going to be if you just switch the mono to fluro? Is it really going to make a difference? That said, i did see some underwater fishing pictures where fluro was used and you could not see the line in the pictures - it did blend it. The line in the picutes was something like 10lb test though, so tough to judge what 40lb diameter line would look like in comparison.

It is expensive for the amount of line you get, but on the other hand - we spend a lot of money traveling to fish, on other equipment, etc. - so if it did make a difference the extra expense is very small especially if it meant more fish, or the difference in catching fish or getting skunked.


Ya but...It doesnt make a difference its all bull%$%$%$%$.......especially if you do any night fishing...I tell the truth and the truth is the stuff aint worth the money.....use the xtra money in your gas tank and go try a new spot instead...To many people are way to anal over this crap with striped bass..I have 20 fish over 40lbs in my surf years.....none of those fish came with using flouro....Its like saying a "Van -Stall" at $800 dollars somehow makes you a better fisherman just because you baught it.....I can outfish most guys with a $800 reel with an off the shelf Wally world special for 30 bucks....People are far to worried with there "gear" nowadays than acually catching fish...I saw guys in south county dressed up like a catalog for every accesory on the market...complete with boga grips , wet suits,drysuits,snorkels...its so ridiculas....hangin off there belts..they looked so lame I almost had to laugh..acually I did...Things in some respects have changed to a fisherman who is more concerned with what name brands he wears on his body or fishes with than acually catching fish...I would say all this new stuff was great if the new genaration outfished the old or the fish were somehow easier tyo catch...the truth is wearing 3000 bucks worth of accesories isnt catching anyone any more fish then the old times did with the penn 704 and handy ande line..

This is the age of the Materialistic fisherman indeed...suckered in at every turn by some "must have name".....

"And the truth shall set you free"

Ya but...It doesnt make a difference its all bull%$%$%$%$.......especially if you do any night fishing...I tell the truth and the truth is the stuff aint worth the money.....use the xtra money in your gas tank and go try a new spot instead...To many people are way to anal over this crap with striped bass..I have 20 fish over 40lbs in my surf years.....none of those fish came with using flouro....Its like saying a "Van -Stall" at $800 dollars somehow makes you a better fisherman just because you baught it.....I can outfish most guys with a $800 reel with an off the shelf Wally world special for 30 bucks....People are far to worried with there "gear" nowadays than acually catching fish...I saw guys in south county dressed up like a catalog for every accesory on the market...complete with boga grips hangin off there belts..they looked so lame I almost had to laugh..acually I did...Things in some respects have changed to a fisherman who is more concerned with what name brands he wears on his body or fishes with than acually catching fish...

This is the age of the Materialistic fisherman indeed...suckered in at every turn by some "must have name".....
GQ surf fisherman, gotta love that, what a joke. Keeps LLBEAN in bus. though..:spidey:

I bet my VS can kick your Wally World reels azz..:rotfl:
http://googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=Van+Staal&word2=Wally+World+reel

The reason I write this stuff is because there simply is alot of people who cant afford that stuff but are led to think without it, they cant catch fish?? It isnt true at all...but people by into it...just like they buy into that a certain plug is the only way to catch a fish or if you fish bait your a lowlife or that flouro is the only leader worth using...It is a joke .

If your not in the crowd that fishes van stalls or uses flouro or owns boga and a wetsuit your laughed at....

If you want to beleve that a 10 yard spool of $30lb flouro will catch more fish have at it..........

Its all bull

50 pound fluro for me......maybe its a "comfort zone" thing but it works for me!:kewl:


Ditto!!OOps #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& your entitled to your opinion and i wear alot of gear at some of the places that i fish because if you don't bring it with you its along way back to get it if you need it.With that being said i agree with Larry its all in your comfort zone.So if you please thats just my opinion.

#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& is 100% correct. i am guilty of getting caught up in the hype too. but the bottom line is all the fancy gear in the world will not catch you more fish. example; my father uses all second hand gear and always outfishes me. and he's caught more fish in his lifetime than i can only dream about.

I'll concur that flouro is an absolute waste of money
We are not exactly fishing in crystal water of Caribbean when you are targeting few fish on the flats.
Few reason why I wont bother wasting my $ on flouro

High sediment -murky water
Plankton bloom -murky water
fast current carrying both -more cloudy water
massive schools of fish instead of single fish on the flats
massive schools of bait
Crashing white water mixing bait ,sediment and plankton.
Fish that don't care about leader ,snaps or swivels ,only presentation of a lure

The original question was "Do you think it increases your catch rate?"

Here is what increases your catch reate:

Time on the water
Learning to read water , learning currets and tides and winds
More time on the water...
Learning the habits of the fish your after and the prey they seek
Time on the water.......

If you do that, go ahead and use mono leader, I gurantee you will catch as many if not more than the guy who parades around at every sportsman show in the northeast and who beleves what he reads and who gets suckered into buying what he doesnt need.

Its one thing in my brief seminar stints that I stress...Learning how to fish is much more important than what you buy or beleve you think you need.Its also one of the reasons I am jaded from doing seminars, see so many lost souls out thre really trying to make sense of it all...When in reality its so easy to catch a sriped bass.

I also see that the guys who pump products from manufactures go a bit further....thats fine if selling your soul is what its all abaout....I dont do that, in fact when I talk, I do the oppisite...Trust me it ruffeles feathers when I will not conform...I dont give a %$%$%$%$...I would rather tell the truth than kiss some tackle shops arse or suck up to a plug builder etc...I tell it like it is...

At least with me you get a true picture not someone looking for the next speaking engadgement...I will never kiss arse...

The truth is that its a fish with a tiny brain....They need two things....one is to eat and the other is to spawn..there not hard to catch...They used to use cloth line...think about that...

One more thing, When I do accept a seminar, I take it serious, very much so and I only tell the truth and I honestly tell people what has worked for me...They get the real deal...I would rahther see that than someone talk about all the books they have written or paste pictures of all the fish they caught in the old days..

Of course everyone has an opinon...My advice would be however to be carefull which opinion you listen to....

I think the leaders I tie from seaguar flouro are more abrasion resistant than any when I used mono.

Never had a blue cut me off w/the 50 lb seaguar bite leader

when and if I can afford to buy good gear be it leader material or goretex waders I've done so and have been better off across the board...you know you've got to pay for quality(i.e.DURABILITY)

No, of course nice clothing does'nt make you a better fisherman but you'll be more comfortable so what the heck...

I have about 4 seasons' worth of leader material in my Canal jig bag, which cost me about half the price of 25 yards of flourocarbon--which would probably last me a month in the Canal, and then only if I used it for plugging. It's called a 1/4 pound spool of 40 pound clear Ande mono. I easily use 10 yards of leader a night in that junkyard, between what I lose and what I wind up cutting back. Even flourocarbon nicks, and one nick is all it takes for me to decide to cut back.

Greater abrasion resistance? Maybe, but it's margainal. It's not abrasion-proof. Nothing's abrasion proof for some of the places on the Canal--except maybe wire.

And all of the abrasion resistance in the world doesn't help when you leave a yard of leader at a clip, attached to a jig hung on the bottom, after you break off at the swivel knot.

Losing a few hundred bucks worth of lead a year stinks, but adding another deuce to it in lost leader material is just plain silly in my book. Not when I've never been sold on the benefits of it :hs:

I think the leaders I tie from seaguar flouro are more abrasion resistant than any when I used mono.

Never had a blue cut me off w/the 50 lb seaguar bite leader

when and if I can afford to buy good gear be it leader material or goretex waders I've done so and have been better off across the board...you know you've got to pay for quality(i.e.DURABILITY)

No, of course nice clothing does'nt make you a better fisherman but you'll be more comfortable so what the heck...
I agree, your right...The problem is that comfort,etc is not why these guys buy the stuff...its all about status..:doh:

I fished for many years in hip boots and bibs...caught plenty

I have about 4 seasons' worth of leader material in my Canal jig bag, which cost me about half the price of 25 yards of flourocarbon--which would probably last me a month in the Canal, and then only if I used it for plugging. It's called a 1/4 pound spool of 40 pound clear Ande mono. I easily use 10 yards of leader a night in that junkyard, between what I lose and what I wind up cutting back. Even flourocarbon nicks, and one nick is all it takes for me to decide to cut back.

Greater abrasion resistance? Maybe, but it's margainal. It's not abrasion-proof. Nothing's abrasion proof for some of the places on the Canal--except maybe wire.

And all of the abrasion resistance in the world doesn't help when you leave a yard of leader at a clip, attached to a jig hung on the bottom, after you break off at the swivel knot.

Losing a few hundred bucks worth of lead a year stinks, but adding another deuce to it in lost leader material is just plain silly in my book. Not when I've never been sold on the benefits of it :hs:


well said mike....yet more good advice from someone else who has been to the rodeo more than once!

we went through this last week its on page 2

we went through this last week its on page 2
I know.........funny isnt it?:bl:

now its rite up top

. never really payed attention ,,, Like to stay open minded about things ,even though I do tend to get set in my ways . I always lagg behind ,,braid ,, reels ,,rods .. I caught many fish on squid line .. Thanks for updating my brain .

I agree, your right...The problem is that comfort,etc is not why these guys buy the stuff...its all about status..:doh:

I fished for many years in hip boots and bibs...caught plenty

Seems pretty judgemental to say that. Unless your in someones head, you have no idea why they do what they do. Do some do it for status? maybe. For others I'm sure it just increases there enjoyment. For whatever reason, to each his own.

Does anyone really think buying this stuff gives them status?


Back to the topic... for me flouro is a waste of money.

Seems pretty judgemental to say that. Unless your in someones head, you have no idea why they do what they do. Do some do it for status? maybe. For others I'm sure it just increases there enjoyment. For whatever reason, to each his own.

Does anyone really think buying this stuff gives them status?


Back to the topic... for me flouro is a waste of money.

Me? Judgemental?? No way,Opinionated,,,,,yup,,,,....Having said that , I still think its high school mentality...I have it so now you need to get it...I call it the way I see it and thats how I see it....Like in the 80s when everyone had to hav Nike with the red swoosh....Made them run faster I guess:rotf2:

its always goOd to get off topic..

Be yourself, buy what you want, why should anyone care what anyone else thinks about you.
I use orvis mirage fluro, its not that much more money but has good qaulitys, whether or not you put me in any catagory I could careless.
We don't click on this site all day all week and all year for chits and giggles, we want an edge....for a little more money, guess what it is edge,, that same money you chose to spend on a lure thats been hangin around (literaly) for years. I'm not the brightest bulb on the tree but if your gonna fish in daylight conditions for BIG fish then fluro will give you the edge you need.

I like fluorocarbon for shockleaders when plugging in daylight.

I like fluorocarbon for shockleaders when plugging in daylight.

Ditto

Bernzy

I like flouro for fishing the crystal clear flats with sluggo's or sandeels and for fluke fishing in shallow water. In daylight.

The problem is that comfort,etc is not why these guys buy the stuff...its all about status..:doh:


Status? Places I fish I very rarely run into anyone. & if I do, Its @ night & they don't see what I'm using. And I dont say Hey there, Im using a Spro Power Swivel with Yo Zuri Hybrid & and Rosco Snap. I can speak on behalf of most of "These Guys that buy the stuff", that the last reason they buy stuff is for the status. Of course there are always the "ginkers" as Leo N. Orsi, Jr. called them in Striper Chronicles. The fisherman wannabes that go to the tackle shop & buy all the best gear but have no idea how to use it. Maybe then you could say someone is buying something for the status. But anyone that knows anything knows status in the Surfcasting community comes with what you have done, who you are, the knowledge you have & of course the fish you have caught (and landed), consistently. NOT the gear that you use.

As with any broad based question, there are too many variables to be considered. In the canal, at night, with jigs, probably no edge. At Monomoy trying to get a Bonito to hit on a size 1 fly in broad daylight in crystal clear water, absolutly! What I`m trying to say is, you have to narrow down the parameters for any answer to have validity. Thirty years ago I had the exact answer for everything, now any answer starts with, "Well it depends,". No stock answer can cover all situations. I generally fish out of my boat in skinny water during the day, so I use 16# flouro but if I went to the big beach at night with eels I`d use 30# mono.
Another pet beef of mine is people that are allways trying to scrimp on the line. For a long time I fished the beach for money, I met lots of guys that used equipment that looked like it came from the Salvation Army. You can catch fish on allmost any kind of reel and rod, but the ones that consistently scored were meticulos about thier line. I`ve seen rods broken and the fish was still caught, I`ve seen reels freeze up and still the fish came in but I`ve never seen a fish that broke the line landed. How can someone justify spending hundreds and hundreds of dollars on equip. and then skimp on the one thing that connects you directly to the fish? But then again, like I allways say "Well it depends...".
Slinger

There is anintersting article in the 2006 IGFA Yearbook about fish sight and the way they view things like color and motion. It made me think about some things and make some changes.

First is the real value of Fluorocarbon. Acuity in fish (acuity = ability to see detail) differs in relation to water clarity and amount of light. We think of fish seeing as we do. Not even close.

Even in the clearest of waters fishes acuity is way less than ours. Add turbidity ( the amount of suspended silt/plant life and/or other organisms) and it's even less. I used to use 40 pound big game green for all my leaders and caught tons of fish day and night in flats water and deeper realms. Then I caught the Fluorocarbon bug, disapears in the water! Great! that will get me more fish I thought. Turns out it just ain't so.

Fishes ability to see varies from species to species. Some fish because of the way thier eyes are set see better from the side and some see better from the front ( our beloved Striped Bass see better from the front and slightly upward at that).

Some see the same color range as we do. Most do not. Marlin for example which I found really intriging, see only blues and greens, reds, browns and dirivitives there of are only seen as shades of gray.

Lures as we know, and thier coloration decrease in intensity the deeper the lure goes. After 15 feet color starts to rapidly loose inetensity. Greens and blues go first and reds/orange go after that but that is based on our eyes. Not fishes eyes.

The gist of the article was to debunk some myths about clear leaders and lure colors and detail of a lures design. No reason really to get very fine detail. It seems the number one deterrent or attractant is motion. It either moves like something edible or it doesn't and that they found triggers the most response of all.

Look it up they give some cool examples of how well fish can see and they have come up with a lot of new data.

I don't need it....maybe if I fished the flats during the day...and when I do fish during the day the fish are usually going after something that I'm spashing all over the place anyway so I doubt they would be spooked by maybe being able to see mono.

There is anintersting article in the 2006 IGFA Yearbook about fish sight and the way they view things like color and motion. It made me think about some things and make some changes.

First is the real value of Fluorocarbon. Acuity in fish (acuity = ability to see detail) differs in relation to water clarity and amount of light. We think of fish seeing as we do. Not even close.

Even in the clearest of waters fishes acuity is way less than ours. Add turbidity ( the amount of suspended silt/plant life and/or other organisms) and it's even less. I used to use 40 pound big game green for all my leaders and caught tons of fish day and night in flats water and deeper realms. Then I caught the Fluorocarbon bug, disapears in the water! Great! that will get me more fish I thought. Turns out it just ain't so.

Fishes ability to see varies from species to species. Some fish because of the way thier eyes are set see better from the side and some see better from the front ( our beloved Striped Bass see better from the front and slightly upward at that).

Some see the same color range as we do. Most do not. Marlin for example which I found really intriging, see only blues and greens, reds, browns and dirivitives there of are only seen as shades of gray.

Lures as we know, and thier coloration decrease in intensity the deeper the lure goes. After 15 feet color starts to rapidly loose inetensity. Greens and blues go first and reds/orange go after that but that is based on our eyes. Not fishes eyes.

The gist of the article was to debunk some myths about clear leaders and lure colors and detail of a lures design. No reason really to get very fine detail. It seems the number one deterrent or attractant is motion. It either moves like something edible or it doesn't and that they found triggers the most response of all.

Look it up they give some cool examples of how well fish can see and they have come up with a lot of new data.
Nice work!

anyone use yo zuri Hybrid in 50 lb for leader? 1000 yds for about 25.00?

anyone use yo zuri Hybrid in 50 lb for leader? 1000 yds for about 25.00?

Are you selling it? Is that what that means?

No, using it. Its a good deal no?

No, using it. Its a good deal no?

Absolutely. Where did you find that deal. Unless its classified

PM sent

In case anyone needs some Orvis mirage at very good prices check here.
http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/,70866_Orvis-Mirage-Fluorocarbon-Tippet-Material-30m.html

Pound test can be determined here
http://www.orvis.com/intro_newwindow.asp?subject=1281

Both fluoro and mono have their applications, I use fluoro more, has good abrasion resistance, but mono works too...hmmm

I use flouro.I have this little river by my house where I was given a lesson.The lesson was if u did not have 30 flouro u where not getting bit, plain an simple.
Say what u want.I also fish a lot of sticky area's an have landed fish with my line looking like it had gone thru a cheese grater..
There's no doubt in my mind that if i fished with a similar # test mono line leader i would not have landed the fish..
I use it for everthing.up to 80 lb test.Cept' for pencils i use 100 lb Big Game. Cabela's usta sell 100 yd spools for 28 dollars but i don't see em anymore.While i was in the catalog though i did order a snorkel :D
I don't understand the eletist attitude of beating down of todays catalog angler.I have seen todays angler they are bullet proof.usta be u had to have balls of stone to stand in the surfline for a tide in 45 degree water while u waders leaked.If someone wants the best gear what difference does it make.I'm happy I don't have to fish in canvas or rubber waders with the plastic bags around my feet anymore.
Cause ur waders always leaked..
#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& Why don't u go thru ur list of catalog favorites.
Lets see if i can help, if I remember correctly.
400 dollar Simms waders............Check
Some kinda shoe with korkers 200$
225 dollar simms dry top w/ eel slime...Check
300 dollar Gloomis rod................Check
250 dollar Shimano Calcutta reel..Check.
3 dollar plastic eel pail..:D
Boy it don't look like linen line an calcutta rod with a penn 155 now does it..
It's looks like the best available. Pretty much can't blame u for using the best.
Why get on someone else..
Further more no one ever accused u of being a product cheerleader..If someone like me wants to help a friend sell a product that I know works well where is the crime in that..

Does the practice go on to new levels on the internet??
Sure it does..It's like any lesson in life.It's ultimately up to the individual
to make there own choice's..

i use orvis mirage flourocarbin because i get it at a good price and because it's just a habit to use flouro that i got from trout fishing. put it this way. it can't hurt. and it's definately not for the status.

I use flouro.I have this little river by my house where I was given a lesson.The lesson was if u did not have 30 flouro u where not getting bit, plain an simple.
Say what u want.I also fish a lot of sticky area's an have landed fish with my line looking like it had gone thru a cheese grater..
There's no doubt in my mind that if i fished with a similar # test mono line leader i would not have landed the fish..
I use it for everthing.up to 80 lb test.Cept' for pencils i use 100 lb Big Game. Cabela's usta sell 100 yd spools for 28 dollars but i don't see em anymore.While i was in the catalog though i did order a snorkel :D
I don't understand the eletist attitude of beating down of todays catalog angler.I have seen todays angler they are bullet proof.usta be u had to have balls of stone to stand in the surfline for a tide in 45 degree water while u waders leaked.If someone wants the best gear what difference does it make.I'm happy I don't have to fish in canvas or rubber waders with the plastic bags around my feet anymore.
Cause ur waders always leaked..
#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& Why don't u go thru ur list of catalog favorites.
Lets see if i can help, if I remember correctly.
400 dollar Simms waders............Check
Some kinda shoe with korkers 200$
225 dollar simms dry top w/ eel slime...Check
300 dollar Gloomis rod................Check
250 dollar Shimano Calcutta reel..Check.
3 dollar plastic eel pail..:D
Boy it don't look like linen line an calcutta rod with a penn 155 now does it..
It's looks like the best available. Pretty much can't blame u for using the best.
Why get on someone else..
Further more no one ever accused u of being a product cheerleader..If someone like me wants to help a friend sell a product that I know works well where is the crime in that..

Does the practice go on to new levels on the internet??
Sure it does..It's like any lesson in life.It's ultimately up to the individual
to make there own choice's..



Check your facts bud....Gloomis rods...Gifts...free..did not buy...Gloomis rep gave me several rods...and McKenna gave me the rest...not a penny spent....

Shimano calcutta reel...$150.00 (discount friends)..

Some kind of shoes with korkers $200?? Nope...My wading shoes were $50.00 bucks...Korkers...well yes....I would think any fool would agree that $75.00 is well spent money to avoid a long hospital stay and possibly paraylasis from a broken neck...which gives me a good idea...save the wasted money that flouro wouyld have cost and buy korkers...now thats a wise purchase..

Simms top....$199.00 Xmas gift money

Only one your correct on is the waders and I think I mentioned that in an earlier post , that was a comfort buy...Got huge discount on that also....paid wholesale....

And most of these "Luxery" surf items...I waited 20 years to buy....


I stick by my comment earlier.....Its the reasons for buying....I still say most buy the top end because they somehow think it will make them instant striper sharpies...And I am saying its not so...

One other thing....I fished a Quantum Iron most of last season...$89.00 bucks....................



Man I guess no one ever caught a bass before flouro...must be in the new century here that the bass decided to change....The fish I caught last year must have been geriatrics from a by gone era...cause I caught them pretty much at will day and night without flouro...Maybe the ones I fish for need glasses:hihi:

The best of both worlds in my use is Yozuri Hybrid in clear. It;s tough and has that added touch of Fluoro. I use 30lb mostly.

On flats and Albies I use ten pound fluoro. Tunoids have the best of fishdom's acuity senses.

There is anintersting article in the 2006 IGFA Yearbook about fish sight and the way they view things like color and motion. It made me think about some things and make some changes.

First is the real value of Fluorocarbon. Acuity in fish (acuity = ability to see detail) differs in relation to water clarity and amount of light. We think of fish seeing as we do. Not even close.

Even in the clearest of waters fishes acuity is way less than ours. Add turbidity ( the amount of suspended silt/plant life and/or other organisms) and it's even less. I used to use 40 pound big game green for all my leaders and caught tons of fish day and night in flats water and deeper realms. Then I caught the Fluorocarbon bug, disapears in the water! Great! that will get me more fish I thought. Turns out it just ain't so.

Fishes ability to see varies from species to species. Some fish because of the way thier eyes are set see better from the side and some see better from the front ( our beloved Striped Bass see better from the front and slightly upward at that).

Some see the same color range as we do. Most do not. Marlin for example which I found really intriging, see only blues and greens, reds, browns and dirivitives there of are only seen as shades of gray.

Lures as we know, and thier coloration decrease in intensity the deeper the lure goes. After 15 feet color starts to rapidly loose inetensity. Greens and blues go first and reds/orange go after that but that is based on our eyes. Not fishes eyes.

The gist of the article was to debunk some myths about clear leaders and lure colors and detail of a lures design. No reason really to get very fine detail. It seems the number one deterrent or attractant is motion. It either moves like something edible or it doesn't and that they found triggers the most response of all.

Look it up they give some cool examples of how well fish can see and they have come up with a lot of new data.

Since a guy like Flap carries with him a ton of crediblity around these parts...re-read his post..Good job!

OK ! Since I do so well with live eels, I will tell you the secret...Its my leaders:hihi:

I will tie them up for you at a cost of $10.00 a leader, I promise you will catch more bass...:hee:

Check your facts bud....Gloomis rods...Gifts...free..did not buy...Gloomis rep gave me several rods...and McKenna gave me the rest...not a penny spent....

Shimano calcutta reel...$150.00 (discount friends)..

Some kind of shoes with korkers $200?? Nope...My wading shoes were $50.00 bucks...Korkers...well yes....I would think any fool would agree that $75.00 is well spent money to avoid a long hospital stay and possibly paraylasis from a broken neck...which gives me a good idea...save the wasted money that flouro wouyld have cost and buy korkers...now thats a wise purchase..

Simms top....$199.00 Xmas gift money

Only one your correct on is the waders and I think I mentioned that in an earlier post , that was a comfort buy...Got huge discount on that also....paid wholesale....

And most of these "Luxery" surf items...I waited 20 years to buy....


I stick by my comment earlier.....Its the reasons for buying....I still say most buy the top end because they somehow think it will make them instant striper sharpies...And I am saying its not so...

One other thing....I fished a Quantum Iron most of last season...$89.00 bucks....................



Man I guess no one ever caught a bass before flouro...must be in the new century here that the bass decided to change....The fish I caught last year must have been geriatrics from a by gone era...cause I caught them pretty much at will day and night without flouro...Maybe the ones I fish for need glasses:hihi:

I have no idea how u aquired ur fishing gear. The fact is as it is well documented.Here an in ur seminars..If i chose to emulate u.It would cost quite a bit of money.Not excactly entry level expenditures...
Hey, U use what u like. an I'll use what I like..If someone ask's i will tell em..
I cannot argue with ur success but it won't change my mind..
Test's are good reading.There's always lots of variables to consider..
I like the conclusions I have come to in my own tests.
Sure fishing today is loaded with weekend warriors.Guys who do not have the time for whatever reason to hit it hard.They work hard so they have perhaps some surplus cash.Is it such a horror for them to have decent gear.not in my book.I never judge a book by it's cover.I really have no interest in running into anyone when i fish.I certainly don't pay attention to what they are wearing...
Oh an thanks for the offer of tieng my leaders..
I'll have to decline as I can only trust my own knots...

I have no idea how u aquired ur fishing gear. The fact is as it is well documented.Here an in ur seminars..If i chose to emulate u.It would cost quite a bit of money.Not excactly entry level expenditures...
Hey, U use what u like. an I'll use what I like..If someone ask's i will tell em..
I cannot argue with ur success but it won't change my mind..
Test's are good reading.There's always lots of variables to consider..
I like the conclusions I have come to in my own tests.
Sure fishing today is loaded with weekend warriors.Guys who do not have the time for whatever reason to hit it hard.They work hard so they have perhaps some surplus cash.Is it such a horror for them to have decent gear.not in my book.I never judge a book by it's cover.I really have no interest in running into anyone when i fish.I certainly don't pay attention to what they are wearing...
Oh an thanks for the offer of tieng my leaders..
I'll have to decline as I can only trust my own knots...

Brutal, just brutal...Fot the last time I said that the gear does not make the fisherman...I have good gear? yes...Do is let me catch more fish? Nope....To many guys are SOLD on the notion that a certain product is going to make them better...doesnt work that way..

I never said in my seminars that a guy needs to go out and buy a calcutta..I only say it is my choice reel and that I only recomend conventional for slingin eels...

I Would also decline in return...as my knots are the only ones I trust...

man I'am glad gifts and dicounts don't count becuase I almost thought I was a stuates fisherman.:huh: then the good news I found out I'am a sharpie becuase I just bought a Quantum iron (used$40):thanks:

I can outfish most guys with a $800 reel with an off the shelf Wally world special for 30 bucks....People are far to worried with there "gear" nowadays than acually catching fish...I saw guys in south county dressed up like a catalog for every accesory on the market...complete with boga grips , wet suits,drysuits,snorkels...its so ridiculas....hangin off there belts..they looked so lame I almost had to laugh..acually I did...Things in some respects have changed to a fisherman who is more concerned with what name brands he wears on his body or fishes with than acually catching fish...I would say all this new stuff was great if the new genaration outfished the old or the fish were somehow easier tyo catch...the truth is wearing 3000 bucks worth of accesories isnt catching anyone any more fish then the old times did with the penn 704 and handy ande line..

This is the age of the Materialistic fisherman indeed...suckered in at every turn by some "must have name".....

"And the truth shall set you free"

Brutal,This is brutal....
I was just trying to make a point..
U just don't get it.

I'm making Aglio oil over flouro tonight if anyone wants to come by for dinner. Bring all your old stuff. Make sure its at least 40# so it doesn't get caught in your teeth.

My .02 cents. I have used fluro leaders and never found a difference. I fish almost completely in the dark as does my partner Bryan. He too tried fluro leaders and never found a difference. In fact I use 50 mono I buy at Wally World for $1.95 for 150 yards. I have caught a ton of bass on them and never had a problem.
For me, I cannot justify the additional cost of fluro. Maybe there is a difference if you are fishing in daylight but then you are probably not using eels either

man I'am glad gifts and dicounts don't count becuase I almost thought I was a stuates fisherman.:huh: then the good news I found out I'am a sharpie becuase I just bought a Quantum iron (used$40):thanks:

:laugha: :kewl: :hihi:

This is like deja vue all over again, thought this was discussed a couple of months ago, anyway, buy a spool of 50# big game, save your $$ on the flouro, go fishing more than you now do and you'll see your "luck" improve...

Well, let me just go on the record here with this: let it be known far and wide that Mike P is very open to freebies and discounted stuff. :rtfm:

Sure, I have tons of my own, but if anyone wants to grease me, I'll certainly be amenable to using the stuff :humpty: :hihi: :laughs: :rotfl:

I also see that the guys who pump products from manufactures go a bit further....thats fine if selling your soul is what its all abaout....I dont do that, in fact when I talk, I do the oppisite...Trust me it ruffeles feathers when I will not conform...I dont give a %$%$%$%$...I would rather tell the truth than kiss some tackle shops arse or suck up to a plug builder etc...I tell it like it is...

At least with me you get a true picture not someone looking for the next speaking engadgement...I will never kiss arse...

....
Sluggos, sluggos, sluggos.............. Check

:lm: just bustin' chops dude :faga:

I use flouro, maybe it works, maybe it dont. Any edge helps though, perceived or not. I wont leave it to chance.
I also use some fancy gear, it certainly helps the overall enjoyment factor of the fishing experience

mike you beat me to it .

but its a good thing there is all kinds of different gear for all the different opinions there are .

use what works best for you and so will I .

I use fruit of the loom mostly . I find the cheaper brands loose their elasticity over a short period of time . hanes work well but there is nothing better than fruit around your bung when you deep in suds while chaffing with sharks circling near by . not to mention the ease of skid mark removal .

walk well !

The best of both worlds in my use is Yozuri Hybrid in clear. It;s tough and has that added touch of Fluoro. I use 30lb mostly.

On flats and Albies I use ten pound fluoro. Tunoids have the best of fishdom's acuity senses.

Yup, fluoro will give you a measurable edge when fishing for the tunoids (albies, bones, yellowfin and bluefin and albacore). I actually tested the difference on a daytime charter during an October albie blitz and a few offshore trips. Fluoro outperformed clear mono by something like 2:1.

I also think that fluoro is better than mono for certain bottomfishing applications. Fluke and blackfish come to mind. I can't explain why (you're dropping your offering right on its head?).

As far as bluefish go, fluoro is obviously a waste. But there's always a spool in my plugbag for the bass at night, not that I am terribly religious about using it over plain mono leader.

The best of both worlds in my use is Yozuri Hybrid in clear. It;s tough and has that added touch of Fluoro. I use 30lb mostly.

On flats and Albies I use ten pound fluoro. Tunoids have the best of fishdom's acuity senses.

I've played with the clear Hybrid and it's good, but the knot strength isn't even near what the purple stuff has. The clear may have an optical advantage, depending how much you believe in that.

Take 50 clear and then take 50 pound purple. Tie the same knot in 2 leaders with the same hardware and then attach one end of the leader to something you can get a good grip on, and then attach the other end to something solid. Then smoothly pull.

Compared to pretty much every 50# test fluoro and mono we had on hand, the purple Hybrid dominates due to knot strength almost every time. It wasn't the most scientific of tests, but the advantage is typically so obvious you'll never need a scale to notice it.

It was a slow afternoon in the SWE a few years ago when we took the time to figure this one out... :hee:

The bonus is obviously that Yozuri Hybrid is as cheap as anything out there and it's awfully tough among the rocks.

I'm will always be loyal to true fluoro for tuna though.

50 pound Ande pink or 60 pound Ande green. Worked for me for as far back as I can remember. Tried flouro once at the canal. It sucked.

I'm making Aglio oil over flouro tonight if anyone wants to come by for dinner. Bring all your old stuff. Make sure its at least 40# so it doesn't get caught in your teeth.

U probably wash it down with white wine spritzers..

im bassmaster

im bassmaster

Fluoro or Mono????:grins:

building moon black and chrome bomber %$%$%$%$ the line

building moon black and chrome bomber %$%$%$%$ the line

:eyes: