View Full Version : Embarassing


scottw
04-26-2008, 05:51 AM
so the good Reverend Racist got an adoring tongue bath from Bill Moyers last night.... and from what I hear Bill will feature the members of the Weather Underground next week to explain that they were in all actuality, an organization whose rhetoric was simply taken out of context and actions misunderstood....Bill and Hillary were right, it's time for the liberal mainstream media to break out their OBAMA for PRESIDENT buttons and throw away their license to practice journalism......nah, nah, nah..GOD HELP AMERICA!

spence
04-26-2008, 08:20 AM
I'm curious, how many of Rev. Wright's sermons have you listened to in full?

-spence

scottw
04-26-2008, 08:57 AM
I love it, I knew you'd be right on that Spence, let's see, have not listened to all of the Rev. Racist speeches in full, nope...but...never listened to any Hitler, Mussolini, Castro, Chavez, Pol Pot, Mao, choose your maniacal tyrant speeches in full either but I'm sure that many were eloquently delivered to nodding approval by their followers and I know that they are/were bad guys, I have spent the time to learn about this "church", what it approves and pushes as it's agenda, black liberation theology, Marxism disguised as religeon...don't forget the Hamas Manifesto... much is/was available on it's own website, much has been removed for obvious reasons, can't make this one go away no matter how hard they try......but hey....it's just WORDS, right? don't worry, the Reverend isn't the nut, I am....

spence
04-26-2008, 10:01 AM
Wow, you're really off the deep end on this one.

So Rev. Wright who served his country in the US Marine Corps, US Navy and has spent his entire life working for the community is equated with Hitler and Pol Pot?

All because he holds a few wacky viewpoints and likes to use heated rhetoric in his sermons?

I guess now that associates Barak Obama with Hitler and Pol Pot as well.

Oh %$%$%$%$, about 1/2 of the country would probably vote for Obama. Factoring in % voters that means about 30% of the country is supporting Hitler and Pol Pot.

It's all very clear to me know why some on the Right accuse those on the Left of hating America. Considering how evil Hitler (and Pol Pot) really were, there's a lot of evil that deserves to be hated.

-spence

scottw
04-26-2008, 11:24 AM
never said he killed anyone, simply pointed out that I didn't need to hear all of the speeches of those other fellows to know that they were bad guys, I don't need to sit and listen to all of his speeches/sermons/rants to know that Rev. Racist is a bad guy, there are more than enough associations, incidents etc. that bear this out, only the Kool Aid drinkers are going to buy the new and improved Reverend on Prozac on his goodwill tour, but give them credit for trying, can't to see the interview with Bill Ayers!

spence
04-26-2008, 12:08 PM
So your premise is based on the notion that Rev. Wright is such a bad person you can just tell? Like in a Hitler or Pol Pot sort of way?

Considering all the good things the man has clearly accomplished in his life, you sir, must have pretty high standards to make such a statement.

Please explain what makes him so evil, because I just can't comprehend what you're saying, and people tend to actually think I"m a pretty sharp fellow.

-spence

scottw
04-26-2008, 12:36 PM
You are what you spew....he should be a man and stand up for what he really believes instead of this new soft spoken charade...the fact is that he is profiteering from this rhetoric, food for those with grievances real or percieved...

I never questioned your intelligence, just find it ironic that PBS and the mainstream media has plenty of time to arrange favorable, softball interviews with a man that routinely use hateful, despicable rhetoric to preach the "Word of God" to his congregation, which according to the shot that I saw last night had quite a few children in it's numbers, associates with terrorists like Khadafi and the likes of Farrakhan, more to be uncovered I'm sure, and is the "Spiritual Advisor" of the guy that wants to be president, don't know about you but I don't know too many people with those credentials(Maybe Jimmy Carter?), associations and/or proclivities...to continue to defend Snobama you will have to make excuses for the Racist Revered, the Elitist Wife and the Terrorist Sidekick....sounds like a lot of esplainin'.... how about an occasional story about an act or two of bravery by our folks over seas....somewhere???...anwhere???...nope no time for that...too busy proping up a slumping Obama......which was my original point...mainstream solidly media in the Obama camp, it's true...just ask the Clintons...they never lie...

scottw
04-26-2008, 12:42 PM
hey Spence, just so we're straight, I love talking politics because it one of the very few things that get people worked into a lather over things that they can do absolutely nothing about, my best customers are big libs and I have a ball making their eyes turn red because they really know, deep down that they are wrong...the leftys have very little sense of humor and an even shorter fuse...probably a result of knowing that they are way overmatched intellectually which is why they target the lowest common denominator....so please never get upset over things that I say, you'd like me, you really would...I'm really a fun guy and I hope that you can get out and find some fish this weekend, Scott

spence
04-26-2008, 05:00 PM
You are what you spew....he should be a man and stand up for what he really believes instead of this new soft spoken charade...the fact is that he is profiteering from this rhetoric, food for those with grievances real or percieved...
Did you actually watch the interview, or are you just parroting what Hannity or Rush said? I don't see him backing away from his statements, in fact he reinforced them.


I never questioned your intelligence, just find it ironic that PBS and the mainstream media has plenty of time to arrange favorable, softball interviews with a man that routinely use hateful, despicable rhetoric to preach the "Word of God" to his congregation
So FOX News (along with most cable news) running the same clips 24/7 with zero discussion on what Rev. Wright was actually trying to communicate is somehow ok, but to let the man speak for himself is weak? Give me a break.

associates with terrorists like Khadafi and the likes of Farrakhan
Have you ever bothered to actually look into why he went to Libya?

It appears as though he was on a peace mission with a number of ministers (including Farrakhan) who went to Libya and Syria to help free a captured US Navy pilot shot down over Lebanon.

Ronald Reagan remarked the ministers "earned our gratitude and our admiration."

But you still think the man is evil, cause you can just smell it.

What planet do you live on?

-spence

scottw
04-26-2008, 05:42 PM
Spence, Spence, Spence.....I understand your anguish buddy, I really do..." I feel Yer Pain"....yes, I did watch the interview and no I did not get marching orders from Rush or Hannity, so radical ministers on a peace mission to terrorist countries is...what? must have been some party? but back to you, look I can see that you are hurting, and I really want to help, after all, a year ago you were on top of the world with Nancy and Harry and Hillary was destined to be the next POTUS, hell, she was already talking about what she was going to be doing in ther second term, funny thing politics, then "the messiah" emerged atop his donkey and women fainted at the sound of his WORDS...oh the WORDS...too bad we can't figure out if words actually matter or don't matter depending on who you are I guess...like if you are Don Imus and you say some words....Obama condemns you ....but if you are Reverend Racist....well, let's not take those words too seriously, after all.... ya know, he's old and gets carried away...but me...I'm just a "typical white person" that likes evenhandedness, now it's all falling apart, oh the things that could have been...Universal everything for everybody...a health care system that might some day rival that of Cuba...Bill Clinton exposed as a racist and Jimmy Carter as a rabid anti-semite and Obama as a radical marxist masquerading as the saviour...Hillary is actually starting to look good to me(as a candidate that is)....but back to you Spence, you seem so angry, like I said...you've lost your sense of humor and that's a bad thing, I can help you...you and me buddy, we can get you back on the right track...first...you need to laugh more, now for me it's the three stooges or family guy, but I know from experience that libs and women don't get the humor of the stooges so for you I'd suggest something lighter, like say, Will and Grace reruns, maybe three times a week for an hour a day, just till you get your humor back, once you start to feel a chuckle you'll know that you are well on the road to recovery, once you get your chuckle back you should listen to a little conservative radio, if you are going to claim to be open-minded and fair like most of my lib friends then you should at least entertain the thoughts of those with an opposing point of view from you however distasteful that may seem at first, you can't go through life being so narrow-minded that you don't accept that there are actually others out there with a world view that may be different from yours, this is the biggest mistake that libs make, they rationalize away any facts that don't agree with their world view and it is damaging to their brains....so start slow with something that mixes in a little humor like..oh...Glenn Beck...he's pretty funny, definitely stay away from Michael Savage, you'll have a panic attack in ten minutes, I don't want you injured during your rehab, conversely, you should avoid Bill Maher and Chris Matthews, those guys are nuts, if you are feeling comfortable after a week or two you should read VISIONS OF THE ANNOINTED by Thomas Sowell, you can read that and then look at the farce Al Gore is engaged in along with countless other "crises" that have been hoist upon us and have a much better understanding of the intent...I don't want to overload you right away so to recap, Will and Grace, Glenn Beck and Thomas Sowell, this has been a proven formula for miserable liberal syndrome or MLS and while I would never try to "convert" an unwilling mind I will tell you that it will relieve daily tension, unexpected outbursts and even constipation in some instances...try if for a week or two, no charge for the consultation, my treat:btu:

spence
04-26-2008, 09:14 PM
That was a lot of words to completely avoid the issue.

-spence

scottw
04-27-2008, 06:23 AM
the Rev's a bad guy Spence, you cannot esplain' away the things that he's said, they're on tape, Obama in fully on board with this guy as well as associated with characters that make the Clinton's seedy associations look irrelevant, by the time the convention rolls around Hillary is going to have a very strong argument to make that this guy can't get elected,

if you feel that the Rev is being unfairly treated let me ask you about a few guys that led exemplary lives in every respect, served their country and carried the highest recommendations before the democrats and the left wing collectively pulled their zippers down and urinated on all that they'd accomplished in their lives, Petraeus, Alito, Roberts, Thomas, Bork...where was Bill Mayer when the character of these fine men was being assasinated and they didn't have any of the associations, ties, hateful rhetoric associated with any of them,
urban dictionary definition of Bork

1. bork

Irreversibly damaged.

My soundcard is borked.

2. bork

to have one's character assasinated;
as in the treatment by the U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee of Supreme Court Justice nominee Robert Bork.

You sure got borked on that deal.

so, stock up on Kool Aid, it's gonna be a bumpy ride, Obama has promised to bring up all of the past Clinton scandals and there's no limit to what the Clinton's will do when seeking power, it's gonna be great, McCain is the luckiest man on earth...

and try to find just a little sense of humor Spence, "TOGETHER WE CAN!"

scottw
04-27-2008, 07:33 AM
I THINK HE NEEDS A FEW HIGH PROFILE STALINISTS, YA KNOW, JUST FOR BALANCE, SORT OF AN AFFIRMATIVE ACTION FOR LEFT- WING IDEAOLOGIES WITHIN THE CAMPAIGN,



Another Obama Marxist
By Lance Fairchok
Barack Obama has a thing for Marxists. He befriends them, listens to their counsel, and he even hires them to work in his campaign. And they seem to feel the warmth. President Daniel Ortega of Nicaragua, who led a revolution there in 1979, says Barack Obama's presidential bid is a "revolutionary" phenomenon, and Americans are "laying the foundations for a revolutionary change." A captured computer revealed that an unknown person chatted with Marxist FARC guerillas on Obama's behalf (they believed), stating he would be the next President and US policy towards Columbia would change. Frank Marshall Davis, a dear Obama friend and mentor was as a member of the Communist Party USA. Barack Obama just seems to attract Marxists.
If the people he surrounds himself with are any indication of his core beliefs, a higher capital gains tax to punish the rich, even if it diminishes actual tax revenue, may be only the beginning. Obama's Official campaign blogger, Sam Graham-Felsen, a former writer for the leftist Nation magazine and a contributor to the Socialist Viewpoint, is certainly a believer in class warfare.

The capitalist ruling class of the United States exercises a virtual dictatorship not only over American society, but also over the entire world. This capitalist class rule is the basic cause of the poverty, wars and the degradation of the natural environment.


After being expelled from Socialist Action in 1999, we formed Socialist Workers Organization in an attempt to carry on the project of building a nucleus of a revolutionary party true to the historic teachings and program of Marx, Engels, Lenin and Trotsky.

Socialist Viewpoint (info@socialistviewpoint.org


The product of a Harvard education, Sam is an admirer of anti-American academic Noam Chomsky, a hypocrite and fraud masquerading as a political philosopher. Mr. Chomsky, perhaps admired by Obama as by his official blogger, is fond of visiting dictators and terrorists and giving speeches blaming all the worlds' ills on America. All while accepting defense department contract dollars as a linguist. Chomsky was an ardent supporter of Pol Pot, and to this day denies a holocaust occurred in Cambodia (1.67 million died). He is unrepentant about the horrors his vile ideology encouraged and supports Hamas and Hezbollah with the same willful blindness today.

In an article in the Harvard Crimson, Sam writes of his hero:


For me, hearing Chomsky speak for the first time was a life-changing experience. His ability to take preconceptions and destroy them-to completely remodel one's understanding of reality with cold, hard facts-blew me away. When I left what was then the ARCO Forum last fall, I felt as though I had been through the Matrix and back. Chomsky really has this effect because he bombards you with evidence and logic, not empty rhetoric. It is nearly impossible to hear him or read him-once you've actually checked his facts yourself (he even cites page numbers in public addresses)-and deny what he's saying.

For anyone who has actually endured one of Chomsky's muddled rants or tried to verify the claims in his books, young Sam's praise is comical; and a clear indication he has never actually read one. You find very quickly Chomsky is not overly concerned with "facts," as he fabricates them with abandon. He cites page numbers, to his own books, which recycle themselves with astonishing success. Hardly an example of a towering intellect, his tired canards are sufficient to impress the worshipful Sam Graham-Felsen, and endear himself to the same leftist academics that so easily embraced dictators such Ho Chi Min and Pol Pot, idolize Chavez and Castro and legitimized terrorists like Yasser Arafat. Chomsky is the master of post-modern moral relativism, quick to excuse atrocity with obfuscation.


On the day after 9-11, Chomsky wrote:


"The terrorist attacks were major atrocities. In scale they may not reach the level of many others, for example, Clinton's bombing of the Sudan with no credible pretext, destroying half its pharmaceutical supplies and killing unknown numbers of people."


IT CONTINUES, BUT YOU GET THE POINT...

"OBAMA'S Chickens...are coming home...to Rooooost"

GunnySniper
04-27-2008, 10:30 PM
And people wonder why I built a self sufficient cabin in the woods of central maine years ago...................
2 acres planted, 300 canning jars, 100 chickens, 3 dozen turkeys, a beef calf, 5 piglets, and a whole lot of ammo.
Retired Marine Force Recon Sniper

RIJIMMY
04-28-2008, 12:33 PM
SCott- Im 100% with you.

Its a simple concept to me. I dont care what he did with his life, the words he preached in the few excerpts I heard are enough for me to make up my mind.

If Rev W was white and a white candidate attended his church, that person would have been eliminated immediately from the presidential race. There are double standards in this country that really annoy me.

scottw
04-28-2008, 01:11 PM
I don't look at it as a racial thing, it more an ideaology issue, Wright uses race and religeon to further his ideaology . I've told any number of people that of the three left in the race, I believe that Obama is the most honest, Hillary is intellectually dishonest and a congenital liar was how I think William Sapphire described her, Mc Cain to me is much like Clinton, he'll tell you one thing one minute and then tell you that he never saind it the next minute, both are pretty skilled at, spinning? One of Obama's problems is that he's a very inept liar, when he's not on the teleprompter and faced with questions that are not of the softball variety he stumbles and bumbles, the mainstream media should have been on all of these stories more than a year ago but they were too busy pleasuring themselves with multiple Obama-gasms to offer any real scrutiny of the man, yesterday and today should be giving ole' Spence fits!!!

scottw
04-28-2008, 01:24 PM
that sounds like an outstanding place to "cling to your Bible and guns" sir, ever fished Grand Lake Stream?











And people wonder why I built a self sufficient cabin in the woods of central maine years ago...................
2 acres planted, 300 canning jars, 100 chickens, 3 dozen turkeys, a beef calf, 5 piglets, and a whole lot of ammo.
Retired Marine Force Recon Sniper

stripersnipr
04-28-2008, 07:47 PM
SCott- Im 100% with you.

Its a simple concept to me. I dont care what he did with his life, the words he preached in the few excerpts I heard are enough for me to make up my mind.

If Rev W was white and a white candidate attended his church, that person would have been eliminated immediately from the presidential race. There are double standards in this country that really annoy me.

Funny how Liberals refuse to hold the Rev to the same standards of political correctness they demand of us.

spence
04-28-2008, 09:53 PM
What's funny is how some people can't imagine reforming an opinion when new information becomes available. Wright as wacky as he may be didn't go to Libya to fraternize with terrorists, many of his comments were taken out of context, Obama has distanced himself from many of Wrights comments and yet I hear the same accusations repeated over and over. You guys aren't even focused on the really odd things he's said and rather seem to peseverate on the refutable!

What's even funnier is how all this anti-Wright opinion has simply given the man a national platform from which to speak! He's laughing all the way to the bank.

Wright is the devil, he's evil and ScottW can smell it. Nothing can change this, and if you don't reject him in whole then you're endorsing his positions :rtfm:

One of the primary reasons the republican party has lost so many moderate voters is precisely the failure to recognize publicly that many issues do indeed fall on a spectrum...that the world is not black and white, good an evil etc...Bush's foreign policy should make that perfectly clear.

Now you're turning this same intolerance for critical thought on our own country, perhaps to the demise of us all.

-spence

scottw
04-29-2008, 06:26 AM
critical thought huh? that's really funny, you must be double-jointed Spence to be able to accomplish the gymnastics required to to defend this stuff, just gets better every day...Obama fandom has been wringing it's collectivist hands for the past few days, Who let the Rev, out again????, I now know why they bought him a 1.6 million dollar home in a gated , predominantly white community with a 10 million dollar credit line, they figure it's best to lock him IN, he can stay in his mansion and live out his days screaming profanity at his neighbors...heh heh...you should read Salon.com "Wright is wrong" from yesterday and anything by Juan Williams over the past few months just to make you aware that there are a lot of, I guess, "intolerant folks" as you describe anyone that doesn't follow your so-called critical thought, on the left that aren't down with the Rev. and his star pupil, to calm your fears and concerns which have developed in your near appaplectic state I want you to know that if our demise is near and the world is to end tomorrow, with women and monirities being hardest hit of course, I will take full responsibility... don't be angry( I mean angrier) but while clinging to my Bible on Sunday I prayed for you, you really should follow my advice from earlier, you clearly have not started your regimin which I so generously perscribed at no cost to you, so I'm going to try to locate some full season DVD's of Will and Grace for you, because I care Spence....I really do, PEACE BROTHER

scottw
04-29-2008, 07:35 AM
couldn't resist sharing

What is Bill Richardson thinking?
Thomas Lifson
Investor's Business Daily highlights the very problematic private South American diplomatic initiative of Bill Richardson, who has endorse Barack Obama and is generally considered as a possible running mate on the Democrats' ticket, or perhaps a Secretary of State in an Obama Administration.


Ostensibly he is seeking release of several hostages being held by the FARC guerillas in Colombia's jungle. But, against the wishes of the Colombian government, a democratic ally of the United States led by very popular President Uribe, Richardson is insisting on meeting with Venezuela's Marxist dictator wannabe, Hugo Chavez.


let's see...
Carter and Hamas(and a host of other thugs)
Pelosi and Asad of Syria
Albright, Carter, Clinton, Richardson and Kim Jong something of North Korea
Joe Kennedy, many Dems and Richardson and Chavez
the Hollywood left and Cuba
was it Leslie Staal and her kissy faced interview with Amadenijad(forgive my spelling)?
don't forget Neville Chamberlain and Hitler
Jame Fonda and the North Vietnamese
a few dem members of congeress and Hussein on a trip funded by Hussein to criticize their own country and president
the dem party and every Soviet leader prior to the fall of the wall
the Clinton's and anyone from China with cash

and on and on...


but never, ever, call them unpatriotic...they're just critical thinkers...

RIJIMMY
04-29-2008, 07:49 AM
scottw is my new hero.

BTW, I have now heard Wrights two interviews and speeches and I must admit, my opinion of him is lower than before. Not only is he a hateful racist, he is an arrogant jerk. Did you hear his imitation of Kennedy? His point is so childish, its embarrassing. Thats said, he has every right to speak his mind. I just can't for the life of me understand how a "friend" of Obama can contunie to dig a deeper hole? All he had to do was shut up for 6 months. Maybe if Obama became president Wright, Sharpton and Jackson would be out of a job? There would be no more need for hate and fear mongering among the races if we had a black president. I hope the day does come, I want equality and justice and want these loud mouth racists to go away.

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 08:54 AM
SCott- Im 100% with you.

Its a simple concept to me. I dont care what he did with his life, the words he preached in the few excerpts I heard are enough for me to make up my mind.

If Rev W was white and a white candidate attended his church, that person would have been eliminated immediately from the presidential race. There are double standards in this country that really annoy me.

I guess you didnt har what Rev. Hagee said about catholics, gays and jewish disobedience, who of course, as we know, endorsed McCain.

You can mask your opinions in this double standard nonsense, but you know as well as I do that we dont like to hear angry black men.

And as far as double standards are concerned women probably suffer the most as a result of such things, not you and me.

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 09:02 AM
Speaking of double standards, not once....NOT ONCE, have I heard of a catholic candidate running for public office enduring such a smear campaign because of a handful of pederast priest or the archbishop who condoned the behavior.

And to this association with Obama and Farakhan he denounced his endorsement...

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 09:03 AM
John Hagee and McCain... I dont think so

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 09:08 AM
oh and 1 more thing...

his church feeds over 5000 homeless people.... roughly the population of central parks resident homeless in the summertime

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 09:09 AM
Rev. Racist that is.

scottw
04-29-2008, 09:11 AM
so much anger on the left....SERENITY NOW....SERENITY NOW...

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 10:01 AM
angry.... I prefer objective, perhaps even enlightened, but you might label me an "elitist" or something offensive like that. I will leave it up to you to maintain the cancerous strain of anti-intellectual partisan sentiment that has gripped much of the right wing media. I will leave it up to you to go back to debating the sanctity of Hanna Montana's extracurricular activities.

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 10:13 AM
you know what slaves did when the constitutional convention failed them the first time. Most of them turned to the bible, thereby embracing subservience, servitude and complacency. Those that didnt cling to there religion while the planter class kept them in chains turned to guns. That is exactly what people do when the government fails them. Now the present state of the american proleteriat in no way compares to that of the american slave, but just ride through a poor community, be it black, white or latino. You will see dopedealers, armed stick up kids and churches. Those that dont bide there time in church, pray to the P&N, the pipe and needle. The others religious traditions are rooted in swigs from 40oz's of old english 800, zima, MD 20/20 among other spirits. I promise you, if things keep up, this will all be coming to a neighborhood near you if it already hasnt.

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 10:19 AM
...but just like jeremiah wrights statements, you'd prefer these things didnt exist. You can remain insulated all you want, but you should think of your own self interest. That is what kills me about ordinary folks who side with the priviledged right. You are siding against your own self interest in every respect, the economic security of your children are at stake.

scottw
04-29-2008, 11:04 AM
ENLIGHTENED? haaaaaaaaa I love it when someone refers to themselves as enlightened ........ewwww.. you are sooo special and smart too, you must look in the mirror and just gaze at yourself admiringly every morning...tell me, when you become ENLIGHTENED do they take away your sense of humor, because I've noticed that the two rarely co-exist...


ENLIGHTENED is sufficient to tell me all I need to know, how do you get ENLIGHTENED? Do you have to drink something for that, Kool Aid maybe, probably RED KOOL AID?...I guess if you expect the government to provide everything for you, then you should also expect to be failed, it's a choice you know or maybe you don't... I think I erred when I mentioned the interview with Amadenijad, I think that was actually Dianne Sawyer licking his boots, sorry Leslie if you are reading this, and then Dan Rather swapping spit with Saddam Hussein, that was priceless...COURAGE...my children will be fine, what you propose is more of exactly what has caused all of the ills that you speak of, but the left never examines the results of their crappy socialist programs, just claim that they are simply underfunded and need to get bigger...the only things that get bigger are the beaurocracies and the suffering for those that "depend" on them...but without a mass dependency on government programs there wouldn't be much of a reason to vote for the dems...so sign em' up!!!

Swimmer
04-29-2008, 11:24 AM
you know what slaves did when the constitutional convention failed them the first time. Most of them turned to the bible, thereby embracing subservience, servitude and complacency. Those that didnt cling to there religion while the planter class kept them in chains turned to guns. That is exactly what people do when the government fails them. Now the present state of the american proleteriat in no way compares to that of the american slave, but just ride through a poor community, be it black, white or latino. You will see dopedealers, armed stick up kids and churches. Those that dont bide there time in church, pray to the P&N, the pipe and needle. The others religious traditions are rooted in swigs from 40oz's of old english 800, zima, MD 20/20 among other spirits. I promise you, if things keep up, this will all be coming to a neighborhood near you if it already hasnt.

I think your making excuses for unlawful abhorent behavior that even the poor members of the community don't make. Coloring too many people with the same broad brush by giving or making excuses for thier behavior only shows that you may even condone the poor peoples so-called desperate behavior as a means to a quicker end (some went to the bible some took to thier guns). Stop blaming anyone of us for slavery that our forebearers particpated in. You're much more condescending to the poor people than we are.

Don't for one minute think that none of us do not understand anyones plight in America. Even the media yesterday publicly ridiculed some of the statements Reverend Wright made after giving his initial presentation at a press club speech. It is his right however to say what he wants. I may not embrace it, but I'll defend his right to say whatever he'd like.

Swimmer
04-29-2008, 11:28 AM
I guess you didnt har what Rev. Hagee said about catholics, gays and jewish disobedience, who of course, as we know, endorsed McCain.

You can mask your opinions in this double standard nonsense, but you know as well as I do that we dont like to hear angry black men.

And as far as double standards are concerned women probably suffer the most as a result of such things, not you and me.

Thats because McCain immediately refuted what he said and his endorsement.

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 12:31 PM
I think your making excuses for unlawful abhorent behavior that even the poor members of the community don't make. Coloring too many people with the same broad brush by giving or making excuses for thier behavior only shows that you may even condone the poor peoples so-called desperate behavior as a means to a quicker end (some went to the bible some took to thier guns). Stop blaming anyone of us for slavery that our forebearers particpated in. You're much more condescending to the poor people than we are.

Don't think for one minute that none of us do not understand anyones plight in America. Even the media yesterday publicly ridiculed some of the statements Reverend Wright made after giving his initial presentation at a press club speech. It is his right however to say what he wants. I may not embrace it, but I'll defend his right to say whatever he'd like.

You do not understand what oppression is when you are poor and black. It has nothing to do with being condescending. The travesty hear is dismissing my statement as a broad generalization of poor communities. There are good people in the ghetto, no doubt about it, but religion in many circumstances, has a medicating effect and nurtures complacency, good and bad. As does alcohol and drugs, good people and bad. There is a liquor for every traffic light on every corner in South Washington DC. I have seen it with my own eyes.

Tell me why unemployment in the poor black communities of southside of chicago is upwards of 50 percent... what else are people to do when there are no jobs. There are more drug dealers than are street corners which may explain 300+ caskets a year in North Philadelphia. I think your more out of touch than I am. Moving a couple of eightballs a weekend consistently is the equivalent of 30,000 dollars a year. Sounds better than the GAP, oh..but thats right, corporate lay offs and outsourcing our the new business models.

Well maybe you are not out of touch, it may very well be that you understand, but the tone of your response is at the very least an apathetic point of view. So I am to assume you dont care, neither does the government. Sure there are good people in ghetto, but is it fair for them to work hard for nothing. For their children to turn to crime and drugs because of widespread public school failures. I can give lists of examples of how blacks, by and large, were kept out of the american dream. And Im talking NOW not then.

And as far as the slavery issues come. It has never been reconciled. You cant chain a man up and then set him free and expect him to compete... but if you prefer to lay the blame squarely on the shoulders of forebearers rather than acknowledge the devestating social economic and psychological impact it has had our black brethren, then you should stick your thumb up your arse farther.

Remember, it is not the statements that are made, it is the state of affairs.

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 12:32 PM
McCain did not denounce Hagee's endorsement to the same extent that Obama did against Farakhan. You know that as well as I do!!!

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 12:35 PM
Liqour stores on every corner* in SW D.C.

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 12:49 PM
now you've really got my juices flowing...

I just would like to congratulate the right for the widespread acceptance of blackballing the free speech of citizens of this country as "anti-american". You all have worked very hard at accomplishing such a triumph in addition to trampeling among other things, the constitution protections. My, my, my.... such a nice precedent.

Speaking of all of this anti-american rhetoric being fomenting by Mr. Wright, its ironic that black surnames almost sound more american than some of the name of these pundits crying foul. I mean how anti-american can people with last names like "Jones, Jefferson, Williams, Carter, Roberts, etc" be after all.

RIJIMMY
04-29-2008, 12:52 PM
You do not understand what oppression is when you are poor and black. It has nothing to do with being condescending. The travesty hear is dismissing my statement as a broad generalization of poor communities. There are good people in the ghetto, no doubt about it, but religion in many circumstances, has a medicating effect and nurtures complacency, good and bad. As does alcohol and drugs, good people and bad. There is a liquor for every traffic light on every corner in South Washington DC. I have seen it with my own eyes.

Tell me why unemployment in the poor black communities of southside of chicago is upwards of 50 percent... what else are people to do when there are no jobs. There are more drug dealers than are street corners which may explain 300+ caskets a year in North Philadelphia. I think your more out of touch than I am. Moving a couple of eightballs a weekend consistently is the equivalent of 30,000 dollars a year. Sounds better than the GAP, oh..but thats right, corporate lay offs and outsourcing our the new business models.

Well maybe you are not out of touch, it may very well be that you understand, but the tone of your response is at the very least an apathetic point of view. So I am to assume you dont care, neither does the government. Sure there are good people in ghetto, but is it fair for them to work hard for nothing. For their children to turn to crime and drugs because of widespread public school failures. I can give lists of examples of how blacks, by and large, were kept out of the american dream. And Im talking NOW not then.

And as far as the slavery issues come. It has never been reconciled. You cant chain a man up and then set him free and expect him to compete... but if you prefer to lay the blame squarely on the shoulders of forebearers rather than acknowledge the devestating social economic and psychological impact it has had our black brethren, then you should stick your thumb up your arse farther.

Remember, it is not the statements that are made, it is the state of affairs.

here we get to the root of it all. These problems exist becasue of opprsssion or because people (regardless of color) dont get off their arses and get to work. Do you know why there are large african american populations in Oakland CA, Coastal Texas and Louisianna? becasue in WWII, thats where the jobs were. They moved to where the could work and support their family. I'd love to move to a warmer climate, but I cannot support my level of living at the salaries offered in other parts of the country...its a choice, so I live in the Northeast. I dont believe ANYONE is oppressed in this country. Hard work and creativity are always rewarded and there are always jobs for those willing to work. ES44 - you give in to the "victimization" that pluages black America, its a blame game and it hurts more than it helps. Look at the history of asian americans, although not 1000X as bad as slavery, many were brought to this country as near-slaves to build the railroads. but through hard work and tenacity, this culture has become a key contributing componenet to America today. There is no need for an Asian Al Sharpton. As much as African AMericans have truly suffered in this country, its time to move on and accept resposbility for our actions, liquour stores, drugs, proverty are all symptoms of a need, stop the need, stop the symptms. Have you every heard Bill Cosby's take? He puts the accountability at the family level. Thats where the solution is

scottw
04-29-2008, 01:02 PM
I can't believe how easy it is for a knuckle dragging nanderthal to tweak Enlightened Elitists, I have a great idea for a new thread.....

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 01:32 PM
here we get to the root of it all. These problems exist becasue of opprsssion or because people (regardless of color) dont get off their arses and get to work. Do you know why there are large african american populations in Oakland CA, Coastal Texas and Louisianna? becasue in WWII, thats where the jobs were. They moved to where the could work and support their family. I'd love to move to a warmer climate, but I cannot support my level of living at the salaries offered in other parts of the country...its a choice, so I live in the Northeast. I dont believe ANYONE is oppressed in this country. Hard work and creativity are always rewarded and there are always jobs for those willing to work. ES44 - you give in to the "victimization" that pluages black America, its a blame game and it hurts more than it helps. Look at the history of asian americans, although not 1000X as bad as slavery, many were brought to this country as near-slaves to build the railroads. but through hard work and tenacity, this culture has become a key contributing componenet to America today. There is no need for an Asian Al Sharpton. As much as African AMericans have truly suffered in this country, its time to move on and accept resposbility for our actions, liquour stores, drugs, proverty are all symptoms of a need, stop the need, stop the symptms. Have you every heard Bill Cosby's take? He puts the accountability at the family level. Thats where the solution is

No, there are large populations of blacks in coastal louisiana because the French planters brought them there. Not to mention when New Orleans became a part of the US it was a port of entry for wholesale human cargo, as was Charleston SC and Savannah GA. Pick up your history book. Same goes for Texas my friend. Blacks didnt move to major cities (like Oakland, Philly, Baltimore) until WW1 and later WW2. Ask your parents, thats probably when they moved to Levittown from Bed-Stuy.

And as far as achievement gaps come, they have made unbelievable strides. There has never been an Asian candidate for president. It is just a shame that this Wright is trashing that any hopes for 1st black president who is credible and qualified. Not to mention there are large populations of middle class blacks in Atlanta and Chicago.

And unarmed asians arent gunned down by police (be they black cops or white cops), and Al Sharpton is a parody if you ask me. MLK, Malcolm X, DuBois... those are real black leaders, all exterminated or exhiled....

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 01:41 PM
but Jim... at the very least you do acknowledge that the conditions faced by blacks are somewhat unique. We made reparations to Asians and fundamentally, I think the two cultures are different. Black culture has African roots whereas Asian culture is something entirely different. The notion of self help is a conservative American principle that some will find is easier to adopt than others. Not that it is wrong by no means, but its application must be calibrated.

scottw
04-29-2008, 01:49 PM
a little poetry to soothe the enlightened


OBAMA, OBAMA
When you trashed your grandmama
I thought it pathetic and sad
but now, this is sinister
you've just trashed your minister
the guy loved you like he was your dad

RIJIMMY
04-29-2008, 01:52 PM
I guess I dont, but I may be ignorant. There are affirmitive action laws, quotas, equal opportunity laws which favor minorities. I truly feel every person has equal opportunity in this country regardless of race. It may mean getting rid of the gang tatoos, cutting your dreadlocks and putting on a suit, but if you want to play the game, thems the rules. EVERY culture in America has morphed into the mainstream in order to succeed. No one wears kilts, wooden shoes, or garlic around their necks where I work.

scottw
04-29-2008, 02:03 PM
noone wears garlic around their necks anymore because everyone knows that vampires aren't real......

RIJIMMY
04-29-2008, 02:11 PM
:kewl::kewl::kewl:

CNN) -- Sen. Barack Obama said he is "outraged" by comments his former minister, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, made Monday at the National Press Club and "saddened by the spectacle."


Sen. Barack Obama on Tuesday denounced comments made by the Rev. Jeremiah Wright.

1 of 2 "I have been a member of Trinity Church since 1992. I have known Rev. Wright for almost 20 years," he said at a news conference in Winston-Salem, North Carolina. "The person I saw yesterday is not the person I met 20 years ago."

Obama said he is outraged by Wright's remarks that seemed to suggest the U.S. government might be responsible for the spread of AIDS in the black community, and his equation of some American wartime efforts with terrorism.

"What particularly angered me was his suggestion somehow that my previous denunciation of his remarks were somehow political posturing," said Obama, who added that Wright had shown "little regard for me" and seemed more concerned with "taking center stage."

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 02:52 PM
I guess I dont, but I may be ignorant. There are affirmitive action laws, quotas, equal opportunity laws which favor minorities. I truly feel every person has equal opportunity in this country regardless of race. It may mean getting rid of the gang tatoos, cutting your dreadlocks and putting on a suit, but if you want to play the game, thems the rules. EVERY culture in America has morphed into the mainstream in order to succeed. No one wears kilts, wooden shoes, or garlic around their necks where I work.

Affirmative action laws are on the way out. Additionally, the greatest beneficiaries of affirmative action have been women (regardless of race).

There are still things your forgetting. Your culture (and mine) at work and the one you know at home are for the most part 1 and the same. Its not the case for everyone else. Some people live in 2 worlds, the suit and tie world and the chicken and grits worlds. I think were seeing that with Obama. He had his reverend and the southside of Chicago, and the Ivy Leaguers.

And every culture morphing into the "mainstream", thats a little intolerant dont you think. And "success", your going to have to operationalize that for me. Sounds like talking points from some British Immigration official.

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 03:05 PM
oh... and why isnt all of sudden Obama agrees with you, he has trying to distance himself for over a month now to no avail. The media wont let it die just as sure as you will not.

Did you know a Clinton supporter organized and set up the National Press Club conference with Mr Wright. Brilliant political move and the media are picking it to pieces like vultures over a rotting carcass. Clinton is very cunning and exceptionally cutthroat. She is like a political mob boss, and her hands are clean. You guys should think critically, look at the motives behind all of this. This is all calculated.

Mr Wright should have saw this coming, but I think the Obama-Wright bridge has long burned.

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 03:08 PM
I just hope that the next time a catholics runs for office, you think of the innocent altar boys.

EarnedStripes44
04-29-2008, 03:43 PM
ENLIGHTENED? haaaaaaaaa I love it when someone refers to themselves as enlightened ........ewwww.. you are sooo special and smart too, you must look in the mirror and just gaze at yourself admiringly every morning...tell me, when you become ENLIGHTENED do they take away your sense of humor, because I've noticed that the two rarely co-exist...


ENLIGHTENED is sufficient to tell me all I need to know, how do you get ENLIGHTENED? Do you have to drink something for that, Kool Aid maybe, probably RED KOOL AID?...I guess if you expect the government to provide everything for you, then you should also expect to be failed, it's a choice you know or maybe you don't... I think I erred when I mentioned the interview with Amadenijad, I think that was actually Dianne Sawyer licking his boots, sorry Leslie if you are reading this, and then Dan Rather swapping spit with Saddam Hussein, that was priceless...COURAGE...my children will be fine, what you propose is more of exactly what has caused all of the ills that you speak of, but the left never examines the results of their crappy socialist programs, just claim that they are simply underfunded and need to get bigger...the only things that get bigger are the beaurocracies and the suffering for those that "depend" on them...but without a mass dependency on government programs there wouldn't be much of a reason to vote for the dems...so sign em' up!!!

to become enlightened, you just have to read. Both sides of the argument too. Objectivity is paramount.

As far bureaucracy and its dependents, tell that to Bear Stearns. The Federal Reserve Bank provided a 28 billion something life vest. Sounds like dependents suffering to me. What did you get, a 500 dollar rebate check. I bet it cost 50 dollars to fill your car wit gas. That'll get you through 10 weeks.

We have mixed economy for a reason Scott. Without regulation, capitalism will degenerate into its cancerous stage. Look at the mortgage industry and energy, heavily deregulated under Pube administrations, the resul; price fixing and monopolies and the like and subsequent market collapse. Your being bamboozled. If I drink red kool aid, your drinking something thick and brown and its is not Mocha.

scottw
04-29-2008, 03:59 PM
must be great to be enlightened and know it all, the Press Club claims that it was not a Clinton operative that set it up, and I'm sure you'll applaud Clinton for any tactics that she uses against the repubs. , so you're saying poor ole' Obama is just an innocent victim of a devious plot?? that's the problem with you enlightened individuals, you way overthink things, did Hillary's operative write the Rev's speech too, I think they were exactly the same things he's been saying all along, just looped over and over like he says, Obama has been defending him for weeks and suddenly he's gone too far saying exactly what he's always said???...pretty funny, oh, well...high 5's all around at Clinton headquarters, Bill's lighting up a big fat Monicanudo cigar right about now with visions of naked interns dancing in his head...

scottw
04-29-2008, 05:35 PM
[QUOTE=EarnedStripes44;586033]to become enlightened, you just have to read. Both sides of the argument too. Objectivity is paramount.

I just read that again, that is great because I thought maybe there was some ceremony or something, virgin sacrafice, out of body experience, trip to the desert...it's that simple huh? I'm in, guess I'll have to learn to read though :cheers:

wait a minute.....you aren't suggesting that you are in any way objective, are you 44? Cause, you've written a whole lot and I don't see you grasping both sides of anything:jester:

stripersnipr
04-29-2008, 06:39 PM
Obama denounced the Rev and his hate filled lunacy today. Time for the old but,but, but Bush routine isn't it?

Joe
04-29-2008, 07:54 PM
Somebody got to Rev Wright....could have been anybody. Between the people who think Obama could beat McCain but not Cinton, to the Clinton supporters, or the Clinton's via an agent, to all the people who don't want to see a black president - it's a big list.

scottw
04-29-2008, 09:57 PM
April 29, 2008
No, It's Not All Wright
Marc Sheppard

"Last go round, the media and other apologists insisted we were overreacting to out of context "snippets," misrepresentative of Jeremiah Wright's 30 years of preaching. Yesterday's disgraceful showcase at the NPC shredded all such pretext."

"So let the apologists shift gears from contextual excuses to those of megalomania and vindictiveness as they continue to shield their beloved candidate"

spence
04-30-2008, 05:50 AM
We have mixed economy for a reason Scott. Without regulation, capitalism will degenerate into its cancerous stage. Look at the mortgage industry and energy, heavily deregulated under Pube administrations, the resul; price fixing and monopolies and the like and subsequent market collapse. Your being bamboozled. If I drink red kool aid, your drinking something thick and brown and its is not Mocha.
Sorry, I'm on the road all week and just can't afford the time to keep stringing Scott along :hihi:

But this seems to be a fundamendal issue here. Some (and not a Liberal some mind you) are more willing than others to realize the world can't be seen in black and white terms.

Our economy is not a "free market" but rather a "regulated market". Wealth redistribution isn't a Liberal evil but rather a necessity that's supported the middle class for over half a century via a progressive tax system and formed the structure for a consumer driven society.

It's like the pundits have whipped people into a frenzy where by anything not focused on some Conservative or Liberal "brand ideal" can't be a good thing because it's not on the critical path to nirvanna, all the time knowing themselves that their mantras are the result of ego and advertisement revenues rather than pragmatic and learned thought. While there may be wisdom in their words, it's not a playbook for life and certianly not something you could base a successful society around alone.

Any good engineer knows you make something better by taking it to the extreme to see where it breaks, and as such there are really no conservative or liberal ideas that would work in their pure forms.

Yet our leadership, to appease a base, pretends to behave as thought this is true to serve not you or me but ultimately the corporate machine.

Enlightenment is a relative term and in this information age it can be difficult to know how good your data is, but I'd still rather take some enlightenment over none.

The simple fact is, making the effort to understand or even appreciate a viewpoint that's not your own is a very liberal thing, and a very good thing. In some cases it might help you know your enemy, and in others it may give you better appreciation for another perspective on life.

God forbid it indicates your %$%$%$%$ does indeed stink. If so perhaps you should listen to your body and change your diet.

-spence

Bill L
04-30-2008, 07:23 AM
The thing about Wright is that when he states and amplifies such ridiculous propositions as the U.S. government somehow being involved in AIDS, when he suggests Minister Farrakhan somehow represents one of the greatest voices of the 20th and 21st centuries, when he equates the United State's wartime efforts with terrorism, there are no excuses. I dont need to hear any more or research his sermons to decide I dont like the guy.

scottw
04-30-2008, 08:33 AM
Sorry, I'm on the road all week and just can't afford the time to keep stringing Scott along :hihi:

But this seems to be a fundamendal issue here. Some (and not a Liberal some mind you) are more willing than others to realize the world can't be seen in black and white terms.

Our economy is not a "free market" but rather a "regulated market". Wealth redistribution isn't a Liberal evil but rather a necessity that's supported the middle class for over half a century via a progressive tax system and formed the structure for a consumer driven society.

It's like the pundits have whipped people into a frenzy where by anything not focused on some Conservative or Liberal "brand ideal" can't be a good thing because it's not on the critical path to nirvanna, all the time knowing themselves that their mantras are the result of ego and advertisement revenues rather than pragmatic and learned thought. While there may be wisdom in their words, it's not a playbook for life and certianly not something you could base a successful society around alone.

Any good engineer knows you make something better by taking it to the extreme to see where it breaks, and as such there are really no conservative or liberal ideas that would work in their pure forms.

Yet our leadership, to appease a base, pretends to behave as thought this is true to serve not you or me but ultimately the corporate machine.

Enlightenment is a relative term and in this information age it can be difficult to know how good your data is, but I'd still rather take some enlightenment over none.

The simple fact is, making the effort to understand or even appreciate a viewpoint that's not your own is a very liberal thing, and a very good thing. In some cases it might help you know your enemy, and in others it may give you better appreciation for another perspective on life.

God forbid it indicates your %$%$%$%$ does indeed stink. If so perhaps you should listen to your body and change your diet.

-spence

when all else fails...dazzle them with arrogant condecension:sleeps:

enlightenment= narciscistic delusion :musc:

black/white right/wrong truth/lies
I perfer absolutes, :angel:

EarnedStripes44
04-30-2008, 12:21 PM
Also, to put some closure on the Obama thing.

Note that he did not immediately panic and throw the reverend under the bus. That, I do respect. He distanced himself and severed ties only now that the reverend is playing into the hands of the foes that insist on distracting us with Bubbleyum rather than provide the political sustenance we need in order choose which candidate to support. Rather than not support Obama because of vague proposals, people will not support Obame because of soundbytes.

This is by no means a smoking gun but rather for those who are so quick to reject the possibility that this Press Club conference is a just another function of Clinton political calculus, please refer to the link below:

EarnedStripes44
04-30-2008, 12:23 PM
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/29/clinton-booster-organized_n_99129.html

EarnedStripes44
04-30-2008, 12:24 PM
Clinton, is slick. No doubt about it. She keeps daggers not broad swords.

spence
04-30-2008, 01:11 PM
I perfer absolutes, :angel:
That's pretty clear. So does President Bush, and look were it's taking this country of ours.

And I think you just reinforced my point.

-spence

Bronko
04-30-2008, 01:24 PM
Scott W, I like the cut of your jib!

stripersnipr
04-30-2008, 07:07 PM
That's pretty clear. So does President Bush, and look were it's taking this country of ours.

And I think you just reinforced my point.

-spence

:D Thank you.

spence
04-30-2008, 07:24 PM
:D Thank you.

For what you threat squatter? Add some substance will ya.

-spence

stripersnipr
04-30-2008, 07:43 PM
For what you threat squatter? Add some substance will ya.

-spence

Threat squatter? I like that. So where are you now, Reverend defense mode or in agreement with BHO on the Rev? Keep in mind you can't be both.

scottw
04-30-2008, 07:56 PM
Spence can be whatever he wants to be, shades of gray, allows you to excuse/ support nearly anything an any time, moral relativity, facts don't matter it's only the Spirt of the Intent, whatever best suits his argument at any given moment.....allows you to support Marxist principles despite the failures that they've produced through the last century...probably got him through 8 years of Clinton, now the ship is sinking and he's clinging to the side, claiming it wasn't an iceberg at all, just an unusually large swell... MAN OVEBOARD!!:rotf3:

spence
05-01-2008, 05:35 AM
Threat squatter? I like that. So where are you now, Reverend defense mode or in agreement with BHO on the Rev? Keep in mind you can't be both.
Yes, and you don't determine my position either :bshake:

Never been defending the Rev, just pragmatic principals.

-spence