Are we repeating the 70's and hammering the population to the brink again? Or is all the talk much ado about nothing?

What's your opinion?

Personally, I'm not sure. By far my worst season, after 2 poor seasons. I'm still seeing small fish, but not alot in areas that used to hold quite a few. BUT, I'm doing more Yak fishing this year and still getting into the groove, so my experience this year is not indicative of a "normal" season for me.

The YOY index (from the below source) while HIGHLY variable has been declining since peaking in 1996.

However, note that during the last time BIG fish were the norm, the YOY index was EXTREMELY low. Unlike now, where it is right around the 54 year average.

I wasn't fishing back then, but was the rec. pressure back then as high as it is today? If not than even though the YOY index is OK, more recs killing bass means all things being equal a higher YOY would be needed to sustain the fishery

http://www.dnr.state.md.us/dnrnews/pressrelease2007/100407c.html

What are your thoughts?

I think something is unbalanced.....definite shortage of fish, even small fish this season after last season which had plenty???? The only thing I can put ny finger on is the abundance of bait, and BIG bait, and the fact that the fish seem to be staying off shore following that bait? I hope that is the case.....other than that, I see problems.:confused:

Have not seen a lot of large fish up around here in Boston. I don't know whats going on.

from the shore*

personally, I think its just a matter of bait being offshore = fish being offshore this year. next year it may be the opposite. who knows? there are so many factors that lead to this.

bait and fish being offshore in turn makes stripers easier to catch for the boat guys who really know what they're doing out there (especially commerical guys, who keep many fish, and bigger fish pay more, which leads to word getting around that there are big fish everwhere offshore) and harder for surf guys and more novice & more shallow water focused boaters. since it is now harder for the majority of anglers, especially anglers who tend to post here, opinions sway towards "there must be something wrong".

and harder for surf guys and more novice & more shallow water focused boaters. since it is now harder for the majority of anglers, especially anglers who tend to post here, opinions sway towards "there must be something wrong".

Yeah, but when I hear accomplished rec and comm anglers thinking the same thing, my ears perk up...

The lack of small fish, and the abundance of big fish in a select few locations has me concerned...

[QUOTE=RIROCKHOUND;606980]Yeah, but when I hear accomplished rec and comm anglers thinking the same thing, my ears perk up...
QUOTE]

Me too... Especially guys that fished through the moritrum and the time leading up to it.

that's true. being "up here" where striper fishing isn't as prominent as southern MA and RI we really don't get much first hand info from commerical/very experienced guys so that probably influences my opinion. i will say that there are good numbers of smaller fish up this way.

the abundence of big fish in concentrated areas does concern me, because it makes them very vulnerable to overfishing.

Maybe some of the "oldtimers" can chime in on this, but I think this is different from the decline in the 80's. From what I've been told by my dad, back in the 70's, guys were filling their boats with 16 - 20 inch fish, or stacking them up on shore like cordwood. I've seen pictures of my dad and grandfather standing in the front yard with dozens of small fish all around them on the ground. I'm guessing that the decline in stocks had a lot to do with so many small fish being taken.

Maybe there's more people fishing now, but with the limits in place it should mean that more smaller fish are able to grow and become breeders. Even with the comms taking their limits, it's not a big percentage of the total fish taken.

Maybe I'm an optimist, but I think the fishery is in pretty decent shape now. I've caught and released more keepers in a lot fewer trips this year than in the last several years. Also, I only went out for schoolies a couple of times and I didn't think there were fewer around. Nor were they difficult to find. All that being said, I agree that a 1 fish limit at 36 inches would be best for the fishery.

I agree with clogston 29. The fisheries have never been under such a microscope is there shady stuff going on yes there is and if you think there is not I have some investments for you. Is everybody who catches fish and keeps them wrong and shady as long as they follow the law. Not in the laws eyes but maybe in yours How many off you guys keep logs of fish caught ,were they were caught , the tide , moon and year.etc? I feel if you keep these stats I bet you would be suprised that they would correspond with the yoy report or at least close to either side of the scale. I have seen so many talking about big fish kills and how they took these fish out of the gene pool etc. I am not 100 % but I also believe that the new laws that are up and coming are to allow for a better data base to keep better statictics for the future not just for the money. Will it work over night NO Will it help with the future I believe it will. The more people that supply data to the authorities in the area that need the info the better we will be. First people need to be honest on what they catch and report for it to be helpfull. I see there are numerous groups within different orginizations involved on this site. Why not be on the front and have your club keep info and basic tracks of fishing trips length weight etc. then the club can submit there findings to the proper people. A simple example is when I was involved with the turkey federation I got up at early hours to be part of a volunteer study to help with the turkey findings in this state I also was involved in helping stock some of the original birds in RI with the RI chapter. No money gained no ego gained it was a simple vlounteer effort to HELP support the things I believe in. If all the people that are asking were are the fish start doing there part now and in the future we will have fisheries for future generations to come. Also the size and possesion limits are different in certain states which is hard to help control a population on a migratory fish. as they do not know what state they are in as they swim. I believe there is a challenge presently in congress about fluke sizes etc. This is some food for thought. I also know fromall the different orginazations I have been involved in the there will always be debates, immature arguments , wars, anme calling and such. All I can say is next year when I hit the water I will have pad and pen keeping track of my fishing days as I know I will be doing the fishery good and I also will be a better fisherman as my memory is not so good. This is just my two cents.

Peace to all and happy fishing

Dar3

There are billions of little fish around up here, what we are seeing is what we hoped for, a mix of both. The pogies coming back are helping to draw the bigger fish back to the cape. Our only problem now is mung and seals.

We are definetly into the doldrums up here now, a bit early but the water temps have warmed significantly. Hoping the Bonito show soon.

The good side of the warmer weather is that the outer beaches have opened up earlier but Sandy Neck is screwed as the Terns nested late and probably won't open all the way until mid September.

I wouldn't worry too much.

Clogston's gotta right IMO, the big fish are just off shore or concentrated in certain spots where they are being slaughtered (that is cause for concern, but maybe we shoud check the YOY indices to see how many are really being caught compared to how many should be out there)
there are so many damn factors, it's hard to speculate, but that's what this site is for I guess

Truthfully, I noticed a drop off in the "schooliepalooza" we experience every year up on the North Shore, but I think it had more to do with conditions that were keeping the fish off the feed other than the sheer lack of fish. One night we watched dozens of fish swim by a dock and not eat anything....
I still had some good schoolie days in the spring though compared to years past.

Truthfully, I noticed a drop off in the "schooliepalooza" we experience every year up on the North Shore

I think the rebounding of pogie, mackeral and herring stocks has alot to do with this. The fish are still there, just not at the same place and not acting the same way.

yeah Josh and you know the spot I'm talking about too I think, only one good day there this year, granted I didn't get out as much but 1) they seemed to show up a lot later and 2) much pickier, even when they were there

There are billions of little fish around up here, what we are seeing is what we hoped for, a mix of both. The pogies coming back are helping to draw the bigger fish back to the cape.

I wouldn't worry too much.


I agree. Check out the YOY indices between 1971 and 1988, and compare them to the indices over the last 20 years. And bear in mind that between 1971 and the mid-80s, the minimum size limit was 16" fork length and there were no commercial quotas in effect anywhere.

By the way--an "average" YOY index was 8.0 until recently. Recent spawns have been so successful that an "average" YOY index is now 12.0--that's a 50% increase.

Here's something to ponder.....
What if the drop in smaller bass (schoolies) is the result of the "survival of the fittest" scenario. Since the bunker down south have been harvested for years, depleating the bass' natural food supply, why wouldn't the larger bass resort to cannibalism?
If pike will eat smaller pike, and yellow perch will eat smaller perch (seen 1st hand) why wouldn't stripers eat their own young?
It may be an indirect effect of mankind's interference.

This is only a possible theory....

Definitely plenty of schoolies around on the North Shore, I have seen massive schools of 24" fish with smaller/larger ones in the mix, and while there may be a lot of bait offshore, there is certainly no shortage inshore as well. I think shore catches around here are down due to the huge amount of natural forage available, I've been out in the skiff livelining macs and actually watched my offering been molested to death by hordes of schoolies, without being eaten. Over the past few seasons, I would say that the overall size of the bass around has increased, an estuary spot that was full of 12" - 18" stripers two or three seasons back is now holding more fish in the two-foot range, which was unthinkable there a few years ago. Long story short, I have no idea what's going to happen, but I'm very interested in how the fall run will shape up.:uhuh:

My take is that I'm worried about 10 years from now.
Declining YOY (maybe)
More disease impacting the young bass
More rec catch.

I hope I'm wrong.

JF, I agree ! This is the 3 rd season in a row for me that has been lousy. What scares me the most is that there is not alot of small bass around. I can cite alot of example, but I won't bore anyone. All I can tell you is that surf fishing for stripers was much, much better in the 80's and 90's. The fishing has been steadily declining since 1998.

There are billions of little fish around up here, what we are seeing is what we hoped for, a mix of both. The pogies coming back are helping to draw the bigger fish back to the cape. Our only problem now is mung and seals.

We are definetly into the doldrums up here now, a bit early but the water temps have warmed significantly. Hoping the Bonito show soon.

The good side of the warmer weather is that the outer beaches have opened up earlier but Sandy Neck is screwed as the Terns nested late and probably won't open all the way until mid September.

I wouldn't worry too much.

I agree. We have perhaps the best fishery right now I've seen in my lifetime. Yes, I caught a lot more giant fish in the 80's and 90' than I do now, but it was due to the fact I practically lived on the water and there was an abundance of very large fish in the areas I was most competent with in terms of finding and catching fish.

You hear the same "sky is falling" excuses every year from people who are having bad luck. I haven't taken a fish over 30" in three weeks. It’s not from lack of effort or available fish. They're just parked in a different place than they were a few weeks ago on a different pattern.

JF, I agree ! This is the 3 rd season in a row for me that has been lousy. What scares me the most is that there is not alot of small bass around. I can cite alot of example, but I won't bore anyone. All I can tell you is that surf fishing for stripers was much, much better in the 80's and 90's. The fishing has been steadily declining since 1998.

Maybe where you are. You want small fish? Come up here and I will get you sick of them, last year we caught fish in the surf in spots like Cape Cod Bay of all places right up to and including Thanksgiving eve ( course can't call the waves in CC Bay surf) but just like the last ten years or more more school bass than we can shake a stick at from mid April til December. I could go out any night I want almost and catch school bass til I get sick of them, which at this time of year is a lot sooner than I would than in April.

This year so far has been far and away the best year for 20 pound and over fish ( for me to the high 30's so far) than the last five. Last year I had 22 fish at the 30 mark or just better for the year, this year should easily eclipse that. Those fish came from hard work in locales most would not go near or nights on end in places where the majority of fisherman would leave, say, on the bottom of the tide thinking it was all over when in actuality it would just be about to begin.

The number of fisherman on the outercape beaches fishing for example in the dark wee hours is almost nil. Seems everyone is keyed in on dusk or dawn.

2nd Rip at the RACE is a perfect example. Be there at 4am til 7am standing room only trucks bumper to bumper. Be there on the right tide at 2am and you can hear an echo it's so vacant.

Christ we were catching high 20 pound to low 30 pound fish on six inch sluggos, needles and spooks on the flats in June, some days between a few of us in tin boats or wading the beaches and inlet openings we had six or seven apiece.

For years we watched you RI guys tong them, now for some reason they seem to have come our way on CC. Fish have tails and follow bait and as has been said, the best thing about Striped Bass fishing is that you can't just take straight aim at them, just when you think you have got them figured out they do something completely different. Expecting the same fishing to continue year after year is really stretching. What about your big fish bonanza on pogies this year and last? We have learned that up here on the cape. The good years always had lean years in between. The 60's then a six to 8 year gap then the Mid to late 70's then the drought of fish in the mid 80's then the boom of the early 90's on the outer cape then 2001 to 2003 we did okay.

So many factors that are not mentioned when the fishing goes bad, water quality is a big one that gets overlooked, so many oceanside trophy homes with ChemLawn treated lawns leaching into the water, water temps, bait abundance or scarcity, the ruts we get into year after year as in how we start at point a and end the season at point b like we always do putting the same footprints on the same rocks or sand at the same time each year. Bait off shore, winds predominate direction, moon phase in relation to the calender. The tides themselves, offshore storms affecting the surf conditions.Luck. Slumps. Hot streaks. etc etc.

So many things a lot of people don't even consider that they should.

I have been fishing bass for since I caught my first one at 6 years old that was 46 years ago. I put myself through college catching bass from the beach and with my skiff plus working days on a charter boat. There has never been a place that I can think of that has consistently produced bass in quantity year after year. It's always been a crap shoot as to how each year goes and where it was the best. Some places had strings of years then off years then on again.

Just gotta do a lot of detective work, be willing to put on miles and push on until it happens and then you know only one thing you can count on, it won't be the same tomorrow, next week or next year by any means 75% of the time.

I have noticed alot of the same stuff in CT guys. THis spring we had the normal schoolie fishing (fish in the 12-18 range spring stuff) but WAY few of them. Since then the smallest fish we've caught have been in the 24inch range with most of the fish we're catching being keepers. As previously mentioned, estuary type spots that are ussually full of micro bass during the summer are almost completely void of them.

The point is, things are deffinately changing....

Flap,

that's good news that the fish are on the cape... I'm not overly concerned that thery are not in my back yard, well hell, my back yard (and the hour and change between me and the ocean) is all forest anyway. Be kind of odd to find bass there.

I like hearing the bass are somewhere in numbers. Since I don't travel in your circles, nor do I drive out to the cape I wouldn't know.

Kind of the purpose of this thread, to get a feeling about "the big picture".

JF, I agree ! This is the 3 rd season in a row for me that has been lousy. What scares me the most is that there is not alot of small bass around.

By far my worst season, after 2 poor seasons. I'm still seeing small fish, but not alot in areas that used to hold quite a few.

Sounds exactly like my 2006, 2007, and 2008 seasons! 2005 was great - since then horrible...

And I know others (not fishing the bunker schools in boats) saying the same thing.

I am definitely concerned.

JF- Flaptail is lucky. He's one of the only surf guys that is having agood year so far. I work in a tackle shop and hear alot. Most I've spoken to have not done well in RI since May which was very good by the way. April was good also for schoolies in RI but they have disappeared. I guess they are on the Cape.

Look at it this way--as late as 2005, you had a spawn that would have been in the top 5 prior to anything before 1989. And last year was a solid, above average spawn. In the 60s it would have rated as a great spawn.

All of those fish couldn't have died in some cataclysmic tragedy without someone seeing the evidence of it, and they are still too small to have been legally harvested anywhere--even in MD with its 18" limit.

That YOY chart, also, is just for Chesapeake fish. It doesn't take Hudson and the minor river systems into account, and the Hudson has had some very good spawns of late.

Sounds exactly like my 2006, 2007, and 2008 seasons! 2005 was great - since then horrible...

And I know others (not fishing the bunker schools in boats) saying the same thing.

I am definitely concerned.

I'm confused...isnt the success of the boats using bunker indcaitive of plenty of fish? To the points made earlier, just because people are not catching fish doesnt mean there were no fish. The fish were in RI in large numbers from May through the first week of July.

Its seems that ever since the bunker showed up in RI, the surf fishing slowed down, its been the same discussion out here for over 3 years. I think that is a different discussion than the health of the striper population.

Jim. Without typing too much here - combine all that was said above with all the large fish being killed and what Steve is saying - as well as problems here & there all over (i.e. Maine this year): and I think there is an overall over-fishing problem brewing. Just my opinion.

Many more anglers the past several years; less restrictive size regulations (i.e. 2 fish @ 28" here in RI); gradual increase in commercial quotas; etc., etc. = the concern.

RIJimmy- I think the bunker in Gansett bay has alot to do with the surf fishing or lack there of along the narraganstt shoreline. Oh, and if you want some doom and gloom reports on striper fishing, talk to surf guys who fish Rhody's south shore, bass fishing stinks down there and has been for the last couple of years. It is not even a consideration for my surf trips anymore, not even in the fabulous fall. Also, I talk to a fishing writer every week so as to give a surf report for my area for a prominent weekly saltwater magazine. He tells me that most of the surf reports from Ct. to Maine have generally been poor for the past 6 weeks. He believes there is a real problem.

ya know it would be nice if there were fish everywhere (both on and off shore, up and down the coast) but was it ever really like that? Even in the so called "Glory Days" (I'm not being flip at all here, I'm a relative newbie just wondering)

It was much more consistent then, then it is now, believe me. Case in point- Looking and comparing logs for 1998/2008 seasons - month of april- 212 bass. 2008- so far- 143 fish.. 1998- June- 14 trips- 62 bass-- 2008- 15 trips- 13 bass. Biggest bass in June 1998- 41 pounds. Biggest bass this jUNE,'08- 18 pounds. and so on.....

Flap is lucky and gratefull the fish came this far this year and last.

And also very very lucky and gratefull to have four very close friends who network, keep thier mouths shut and go where no man goes and take me along with them as I take them with me. They are the best fishermen I ever knew in trems of combination of skill, determination and never quitting. Optimism is a central bonding trait.

One thing noticed also is that people stop fishing in the season too early be it the call afield to hunt or the cold I don't know but they do finish way too early in my opinion. Maybe they are just plain beat from the whole trip and had enough. Thankfully I can never have enough.

Thats what keeps me going. If there's one fish left, I'll try to catch 'em

IMO
the bass have been on a numbers decline since the second they lifted the morot %$%$%$%$;sp'
I know 3 schoolie monsters that choose to target schoolies ;;

ME >>> have had the worse schoolie year since we we forceed to fish large /late 70,s or early 80.s

Denis >.from this site >>>>> had a great spring >>>>> but his schoolies were from 24" tp 40 " >>n ow he,s catching nothing :;

Got Stripers Is still doing his magic jigging >>>>>>>all his fish are 26" to 33"

I never thought I,d be saying or doing this ...but to schoolie fish In Narragansett bay /right now // with plugs, lures, jigs, ;
casting /not deep trolling >>>Is the worse I,ve seen in 2 least 20 years ;;
If someone told me that at this day & time of my life /I,d be flukin & scuppin ;; I would have told them they were f #$%^&*( nuts ;;
But I havn,t seen or caught a 10 - 22 " bass since around the end of May ::

But add this to the riddle >>>>>>> the winter fishing just gets better & better .with more descent fish & numbers >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they leave in April ... I,d bet that many of those are on the end of Steve,s rod & the guys to the north & east of RI ><><><>:fishin:

Right on Clammer. If someone told me that I would be freshwater fishing daily and struggling to catch stripers in june and july when I have gone surf fishing, I would have said they were nuts. Then again, everything changes.

There were plenty of small ones in Newport tonight.:hs: I sent them on their way ...they promised to come back in 15 years.

So many factors that are not mentioned when the fishing goes bad, water quality is a big one that gets overlooked, so many oceanside trophy homes with ChemLawn treated lawns leaching into the water....

Bingo! That's dead-on-the-nuts accurate, Flap.

Three years ago I helped my wife work on a documentary on the history of the Newport waterfront for the annual meeting of Friends of the Waterfront, an organization here in Newport that fights to ensure that ROW's are maintained to continue the public's right to access the bay as guaranteed by the constitution of the State of Rhode Island. It's a great organization whose basis in law is predicated on the concept fisherman's rights dating back to the 1600's. It's amazing to me that ROW's get co-opted by developers and private landowners and then long and expensive court battles are necessary to open the access points up again. Anyway, my bride is on the board of directors and I'm proud of her efforts.

The documentary was her first effort and very well-received, a Ken Burns sort of thing that included lots of old Newport photographs and illustrations from my collection. We also interviewed and videotaped a number of older Newporters on their recollections, some of which dated back to pre-WW I. Sadly, half of those we interviewed and filmed are now dead.

Among the people we interviewed was George Mendonca now in his late eighties who formerly owned the Tallman and Mack Fish Trap Company a block from my family home. If you don't know George's company, you may know the famous 'Kissing Sailor' photo taken in Times Square that has become an iconic image of the end of the Second World War. The sailor is George and he gave my wife and I an autographed copy of that photo. But I digress -

George is also well known for having gotten into an enormous battle with recreational fishermen back in the '60's over an old comm vs. rec issue on bass. Although I am a firm believer in the comms equal rights to to our common resources, I didn't want George to know I was a rec guy in sheep's clothing right off the bat. I even asked Johanna not to reveal that to him during the interview because I didn't want to taint it. I've known him for over 50 years and still have vivid memories of George chasing us kids off his docks because we just wanted to see what came up in the traps just off Ocean Drive and Cliff Walk. Even at his age now he's still an imposing figure and I remember all to well how he intimidated us as kids.

On his own, without prompting, the man who had spent his entire life fishing the waters off Newport started to talk about the reasons for the decline in fish stocks. His parents lived on 'Portagee Island' in the Prices Neck area of Ocean Drive in the summer to be closer to the traps they worked. In the winter the family moved back to town and for several winters lived here in my family home that I still own that my Portuguese grandmother ran as a boarding house. George's mother lit the shack they lived in with oil lamps and food and casks of water had to be rowed back and forth across the cove. As a young boy he and his brother were given the task of manning the oars and ferrying the supplies over to the island. George said, " You know, the eel grass was so thick there, we could barely row through it. You couldn't have gotten an outboard through it. Today you couldn't gather enough to fill a bushel basket. And you know who the real culprit is? I'm sorry" he said to Johanna, "but it's the housewife with her detergent."

If you're looking for a culprit, as Flap said, it's the green grass on the waterfront homes, the housewife and her cleaning products, the detergents we use for our vehicles, the pesticides we use on our gardens. Oil run-off from the roads and finally, the raw sewerage from our tourist industry that flows into Newport Harbor every time it rains by the hundreds of thousands of gallons, overwhelming a system that was inadequate years ago.

If you've made it this far, God bless you. THe point is, if you want to save striped bass start with they water they live in. Water is important. After all, like WC Fields said, fish f**k in it. Let's try to see to it that they continue to do so.

Okay, time for my second pot of coffee :smokin:

U can see where there is a pattern to this.From 2003 thru maybe '06, as per flap the cape was dead..Fishing was slow in general.I remember one yr where he had one decent fish he released at RP..Could it be he was fishing within his normal means and did not expand out to new area's like he is now.Fish have fins they swim..There is a new pattern developing for sure with the increase of bunker.Our springs are slow.Fall runs are not what they used to be.Seems the smaller inshore bait patterns that used to bring the bass to our shores are not doing that.There seems to be a bigger offshore migration especially in the fall.My guess there is a abundance of big and small bait off shore to keep these fish at least 80 yds from the beach..I know for a fact in the last few yrs in NJ the amount of sand eels off shore has especially late summer thru fall has been off the charts.No real concentrations of em inshore cept for a small window when the conditions are right.
The mullet run is a 2 week window.Peanuts escape along the beach without any fish on em.It's just circumstance.IMO.
There are more guys out but they don't fish like there lives depended on it.So it is hard to judge.If they are not every cast the crowd dwindles fast..I have had some good periods in my year but the patterns do not hold up for any time like they used to.I still think it is a different fishery.If u want to have a good season U have to work to find em or be there when they show up..
Still I think regulations need a overhaul.If you guys could see what happens here in the late spring you would agree.So many 25-35 lb fish taken.These fish are basically committing suicide.The fisherman do all they can to help em drink the cool aid.They feel justified as they are fishing within the law.So the laws need some tweaking so that we do not ruin a good thing.Maybe like one fish @ 28" and one @ 48" or better if a trophy fish is caught you can keep it.In NJ you can take three fish with the application of a bonus tag.We have no commercial season so we have extra fish to be taken??.At least thats what they tell us.Recs are afraid if we give up the bonus fish it will just go to some other commercial quota.It is not unusual in the late spring to see three close to forty lb fish on any dock per man..:rollem: There is basically no respect for these great beasts that do not deserve to be taken by anyone with a boat and a snag hook..If it keeps up we will surely have a serious problem..

U can see where there is a pattern to this.From 2003 thru maybe '06, as per flap the cape was dead..Fishing was slow in general.I remember one yr where he had one decent fish he released at RP..Could it be he was fishing within his normal means and did not expand out to new area's like he is now.Fish have fins they swim..There is a new pattern developing for sure with the increase of bunker.Our springs are slow.Fall runs are not what they used to be.Seems the smaller inshore bait patterns that used to bring the bass to our shores are not doing that.There seems to be a bigger offshore migration especially in the fall.My guess there is a abundance of big and small bait off shore to keep these fish at least 80 yds from the beach..I know for a fact in the last few yrs in NJ the amount of sand eels off shore has especially late summer thru fall has been off the charts.No real concentrations of em inshore cept for a small window when the conditions are right.
The mullet run is a 2 week window.Peanuts escape along the beach without any fish on em.It's just circumstance.IMO.
There are more guys out but they don't fish like there lives depended on it.So it is hard to judge.If they are not every cast the crowd dwindles fast..I have had some good periods in my year but the patterns do not hold up for any time like they used to.I still think it is a different fishery.If u want to have a good season U have to work to find em or be there when they show up..
Still I think regulations need a overhaul.If you guys could see what happens here in the late spring you would agree.So many 25-35 lb fish taken.These fish are basically committing suicide.The fisherman do all they can to help em drink the cool aid.They feel justified as they are fishing within the law.So the laws need some tweaking so that we do not ruin a good thing.Maybe like one fish @ 28" and one @ 48" or better if a trophy fish is caught you can keep it.In NJ you can take three fish with the application of a bonus tag.We have no commercial season so we have extra fish to be taken??.At least thats what they tell us.Recs are afraid if we give up the bonus fish it will just go to some other commercial quota.It is not unusual in the late spring to see three close to forty lb fish on any dock per man..:rollem: There is basically no respect for these great beasts that do not deserve to be taken by anyone with a boat and a snag hook..If it keeps up we will surely have a serious problem..

Tony, I have always advocated a slot limit just like you mentioned. I don't like to eat the bigger fish, I don't like to kill them anymore, I killed enough and I can't bring myself to kill a fish to weigh in for a tourney ( this year I didn't even enter the Striper Cup) then be stuck with something I don't want and have to try to unload on sombody else never mind haul it off the beach or in the skiff, keep it cold etc etc.

I lkie to munch on the little ones 16 to 24 inches, the fleah is lighter, less red line, if any, just better tasting.

Give me a slot fish of that size and I will be happy.

RIJimmy- I think the bunker in Gansett bay has alot to do with the surf fishing or lack there of along the narraganstt shoreline. Oh, and if you want some doom and gloom reports on striper fishing, talk to surf guys who fish Rhody's south shore, bass fishing stinks down there and has been for the last couple of years. It is not even a consideration for my surf trips anymore, not even in the fabulous fall. Also, I talk to a fishing writer every week so as to give a surf report for my area for a prominent weekly saltwater magazine. He tells me that most of the surf reports from Ct. to Maine have generally been poor for the past 6 weeks. He believes there is a real problem.

I believe boat guys on the south shore would tell you something completely different. It's been a very consistantly good season out there for us, Steve. I'd say it's been good for the last three years, too, with this year being the best of the three. I've not seen fishing like 2000 and 2001, but I think it's more because I'm not out there nearly as much as I was in those years. Fall is always tougher out there by boat(at least during the day), as the blues show up and are hard to fish through, and I can't always get out there on windy days in my 18 ft'er, so I can't comment on the fall fishing as much. I do prefer Jun-July over the fall out there by boat, but most beach guys say they like the fall there better.

I'm tending to agree that bait is more offshore, since I've seen tons of fish nearly everytime I've been out in the boat this year. It was slow early in the year, but I believe that was water temp related more than anything. Water was cool until June. Unless I've been very lucky, SoCo's been very good by boat since early June, Steve.

I agree with Backbeach and think overall that we could be getting a bit Chicken Little here. The fisheries management is different, as is the management of the spawning grounds vs. the last decline. From reading here, it just seems as if the fish are in different areas than usual.

Ok The way that I am seeing this trend is just like deer season when we have a big crop of acorns evrybody claims the deer herd is down as it is harder hunting because they do not need to move as much. That seems to be what the general census about the bass and I would have to kind of believe that also as there is a ton of bait around not just pogies either lots of other baits. I will sit back and see how the next years unfold. Steve I appreciate the way you keep a log of your fishing activity as that was exactly what I had posted about. I just hope all the post on both sites that have been popping up make the rest of the fisherman think a little before they keep a certain amount of fish. I know it has helped me make better decisions since I got back into striper fishing this year and will defianetly reflect my decisions in the future.
THINGS THAT MAKE YOU GO HMMMM!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Dr3

but i think it's partly weather related

because now it seems

we have the big wet,,,

or monsoon season in july

weeks of rain....

that's a definite change....

it's related or in there some where...:rolleyes:

Tony, I have always advocated a slot limit just like you mentioned. I don't like to eat the bigger fish, I don't like to kill them anymore, I killed enough and I can't bring myself to kill a fish to weigh in for a tourney ( this year I didn't even enter the Striper Cup) then be stuck with something I don't want and have to try to unload on sombody else never mind haul it off the beach or in the skiff, keep it cold etc etc.

I lkie to munch on the little ones 16 to 24 inches, the fleah is lighter, less red line, if any, just better tasting.

Give me a slot fish of that size and I will be happy.


I just think the sheer numbers of newer recreational anglers who feel the need to kill every big fish they catch.Cause they have not done it before,is a good enough reason..When you get a few under your belt you start to realize the beauty of putting em back.
I am not sure the fishery can withstand the pressure it takes in this state an many others to the south of here when the big fish ball up an make themselves so readily available

... SNIPPED!
I am not sure the fishery can withstand the pressure it takes in this state an many others to the south of here when the big fish ball up an make themselves so readily available

Agreed! When so many people that have ZERO respect for the bass can snag/drop/kill, it's NOT a good thing!

I hesitate to post on these threads since most of you will forget more than I'll ever know about bass, but I have a therory to propose. The lack of schoolies in RI seems to be a concern and one that most agree on. If you analyze the posts on this thread and other reports from this year, here is what I see and if you focus purely on the data, I think its obvious.
Fact - More bluefish that ever in Narr. Bay
Fact - They showed up very early and have not left.
Fact - Flap says there are plenty of schoolies where he fishes
Fact - Flap says he only caught 4 bluefish this year.

See where I am going with this? Lots of bluefish, no schoolies, lack of bluefish, schoolies present. We all know bluefish eat anything and at the least harass any fish smaller than them. Could it be that the mass iflux of blues has pushed the schoolies North to avoid the bluefish?

another thought along the same lines, big pogies attract big bass and blues. smaller bass can't eat them, and therefore move on looking for forage that they can handle. therefore, if you're into big bass on the pogies, you're not getting smalls. if your into smalls, your not getting large. just a though, i don't have any real experience to back it up.

also, last season up on the northshore, we had schoolies for the first half of the season. Then larger fish moved in (and seamingly they were just staging, because there was no real baitfish source around) and we didn't see a fish under 20 lbs for about a month. They just don't hang out together sometimes.

the concentration of the larger fish at the pogies is what concerns me. its too easy to catch them (given that you know what you're doing, i.e. its easy for guys who are good, hard for guys that don't know) in large numbers. Don't some people attribute part of the decline of stripers in the past to them being too easy to catch around the pogies at the time?

I found this the other day and thought it might add to the discussion.

Atlantic States Marine Fisheries Commission site

http://www.asmfc.org/

Woody

PS SoCo has been lousy for the last 2 seasons. Well, except for RHM! :D

I fish the northern most of the good striper grounds....Plum Island...and there is no lack of fish of any size here..... just because they are not feeding doesnt mean they are not there....

I've seen the cycle both ways,right now, the balance of small to large couldnt be better.... I see fish that obviously have been hatched in the river, conventional wisdom says that those fish dont migrate until they get much larger, teen sized fish, something we never had alot of in the 70's and 80's, it was either large or small... A good deal of the problem isnt with lack of fish, but with an abundance of bait, the fish are naturaly more selective, different tactics are a must, even when targeting schoolies,abundance of fish in a given area is cyclical, and one area may be giving up huge numbers of a certain year class, while others appear to be in a drought.... it's part of the cycle and like all other things in life,will eventualy seek a balance......

My personal feeling is that the state of the striper is in good shape,fisherman in general, are much more aware of conservation than they were 25 or more years ago when almost every bass caught got boxed , iced,and shipped to market, quoata's and fishing/no fishing days keep comercial anglers in check, something that wasnt available back during the collapse,sure,fisherman new to "the game" are killing plenty of large, but only when opertunity presents itself and when the fishing is easy,it's new to them, but in time it will pass, this is just one mans opinion, based on over 40 years of striped bass fishing,and a good deal of that time as a comercial fisherman... and IIMHO, the fishing now is as good as it has ever been, and with the amount of small, medium and large I see come over the rail of my boat( and released) on a nightly basis, I'm sure my grandchildren will be catching ( and releasing) striped bass long after grandpop is taking a dirt nap...

My .02
Roc