http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/02/palins-church-may-have-sh_n_123205.html

Watch the entire video, you decide.

-spence

I'll admit I didn't watch the whole vid. But then again I don't care. Religious views aren't being voted on. And we are voting for the President, not Vice President.

Maybe the MESSIAH will want to be sworn in on the Koran instead of a bible if he wins?? If we bring up HIS religion or parents we are labeled racists for picking on them. But bring a white woman on the ticket and it is a field day...... Everyone has a skeleton or 2 in their closet. Obama is no different I'd bet.

I hope McCain/ Palin knock em out of the water come Nov. 4th. I really am getting sick of looking and seeing Obamas picture EVERYWHERE

Palin painted the current war in Iraq as a messianic affair in which the United States could act out the will of the Lord.

riiiiiiight

kool aid anyone?

I'll admit I didn't watch the whole vid. But then again I don't care. Religious views aren't being voted on. And we are voting for the President, not Vice President.

Maybe the MESSIAH will want to be sworn in on the Koran instead of a bible if he wins?? If we bring up HIS religion or parents we are labeled racists for picking on them. But bring a white woman on the ticket and it is a field day...... Everyone has a skeleton or 2 in their closet. Obama is no different I'd bet.
I don't think Obama has ever said that he's the messiah, his detractors did, yet it's clear that Palin believes the war in Iraq is the United States of America following her GOD's word.

-spence

I don't think Obama has ever said that he's the messiah, his detractors did, yet it's clear that Palin believes the war in Iraq is the United States of America following her GOD's word.

-spence


Putting religion aside. Are you telling me you are for socialism ? Because that is what Obama wants to bring.

My god moonbats are scary. You really don't want to compare religious views and associations between VP candidate Palin and Presiential candidate Barak Hussein Obama Reverend Wright do you?

I'll tell you what. At a minimum McCain has the left and the pajama-hadeen bloggers scrambling.

My god moonbats are scary. You really don't want to compare religious views and associations between VP candidate Palin and Presiential candidate Barak Hussein Obama Reverend Wright do you?

Hello, its September, Wright is long gone.

I'll tell you what. At a minimum McCain has the left and the pajama-hadeen bloggers scrambling.

NVA wore pajamas and look at what they did to the US military.

Gotta respect the pajamas.

Mac, time to get a few of these

http://www.goptrunk.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=21

:uhuh:

Mac, time to get a few of these

http://www.goptrunk.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=21

:uhuh:

good idea. And maybe a couple of these http://www.democraticstuff.com/Obama-08-Yard-Sign-p/ys23239.htm

That way when Obama loses ya can put one on the lawn and maybe the house won't get ransacked:tooth:

Funny, I bring up something I saw about Palin, and Palin alone...

And you can't bring yourselves to deal with the issue.

John McCain (the real John McCain) once remarked about evangelical conservatives as "agents of intolerance" and yet he's picked one to be his number two...

-spence

I just watched her speach in that link Spence.. Yes i am afraid. Anyone who thinks that the war in Iraq is God's wishes and that we are acting on the word of god is a quack in my book. Unless of course, goverment contractors are the true God.. :hs:


* Oh and what struck me as exceptionally wierd was the fact that the Chruch's drumset was behind a lexan barricade. Things must get pretty rowdy in alaska if a Church has to protect its drummer from flying beer bottles.... :hihi:

I don't think Obama has ever said that he's the messiah, his detractors did...

-spence

The Karl Rove school of politics 2008 edition:eyes:. Opponents press ideas of the "messiah Obama...descending from the heavens" professing to be savior of the american people and credit this to his campaign. This is an attempt to drive a wedge right in between evangelicals and widespread support for Obama. Now my recollection of the bible is a bit hazy but I vaguely recall that upon his arrival it will be the anti-christ who will claim to be christ. This undermines Obama's widespread appeal in the mind of the devout christian voter.

This is a bit of a stretch but a similar trangression in Islam would be the depiction/illustration of god in human form, its blasphemy. Obama fixtured amongst the likes of the holy is a trangression against the faith of practicing christians & evangelicals eventhough it is Sean Hannity who has christened him "the annointed one"

Now my recollection of the bible is a bit hazy but I vaguely recall that upon his arrival it will be the anti-christ who will claim to be christ.

That would be 'dubya' :hihi:

I just watched her speach in that link Spence.. Yes i am afraid. Anyone who thinks that the war in Iraq is God's wishes and that we are acting on the word of god is a quack in my book. Unless of course, goverment contractors are the true God.. :hs:


* Oh and what struck me as exceptionally wierd was the fact that the Chruch's drumset was behind a lexan barricade. Things must get pretty rowdy in alaska if a Church has to protect its drummer from flying beer bottles.... :hihi:


Ok, first things first . the drums. the drums are behind the plexiglass for miking purposes. That way the sound of the drums does not bleed into the other instruments microphones.

Now, Palin, I listened and guess I missed the part that the war was a messianic quest. She said that you need to pray for the troops, that the troops are sent by their leaders to do the work of god. She didnt say it in some hate filled wacky religious way, she said in in the sense that our country is doing the right thing. Is that wrong? My little girl starts first grade today and will stand up and say "One nation, UNDER GOD, indivisible.....
so, isnt Palin just saying that. How many times as Barak spoke about god? What do people mean when the say bless our troops? Its really a HUGE strtch to paint her as a religious wacko, she was presenting to a CHURCH's graduating class.

My observation is that she was all over the place and not a very good speaker

Putting religion aside. Are you telling me you are for socialism ? Because that is what Obama wants to bring.

I want to answer this question NO, but I first I need you to define socialism for me if you would please. Are we talking socialism in all its facets or are we talking the VA Hospital system, social security or welfare?

That Eisenhower is a religious kook too, ......blessing of God, what a nut job!

Soldiers, Sailors and Airmen of the Allied Expeditionary Force!
You are about to embark upon the Great Crusade, toward which we have
striven these many months. The eyes of the world are upon you. The
hopes and prayers of liberty-loving people everywhere march with you.
In company with our brave Allies and brothers-in-arms on
other Fronts, you will bring about the destruction of the German war
machine, the elimination of Nazi tyranny over the oppressed peoples of
Europe, and security for ourselves in a free world.

Your task will not be an easy one. Your enemy is well trained, well
equipped and battle hardened. He will fight savagely.

But this is the year 1944! Much has happened since the Nazi triumphs of
1940-41. The United Nations have inflicted upon the Germans great defeats,
in open battle, man-to-man. Our air offensive has seriously reduced their
strength in the air and their capacity to wage war on the ground. Our Home
Fronts have given us an overwhelming superiority in weapons and munitions
of war, and placed at our disposal great reserves of trained fighting men.
The tide has turned! The free men of the world are marching together to
Victory!

I have full confidence in your courage and devotion to duty and skill in
battle. We will accept nothing less than full Victory!

Good luck! And let us beseech the blessing of Almighty God upon this great
and noble undertaking.


SIGNED: Dwight D. Eisenhower

Eisenhower is dead and there's no Nazis.

There are commies.:hihi:

Eisenhower is dead and there's no Nazis.

However, throughout history, US leaders have invoked God in their speeches. Its in our pledge and on our currency. I am not religious but have no fear of religion, unless its followers try to impose their beliefs on me.

Fear of religion is a tactic used by the Democrats. Plain and simple.
Its never worked in the past and it wont work now.

There are commies.:hihi:

Are you respecting the pajamas yet?

However, throughout history, US leaders have invoked God in their speeches. Its in our pledge and on our currency. I am not religious but have no fear of religion, unless its followers try to impose their beliefs on me.

It worked great when the majority was god fearing and went to church every Sunday.

Fear of religion is a tactic used by the Democrats. Plain and simple.
Its never worked in the past and it wont work now.

I'm pretty sure a hot topic on the right is fear of muslim extremists, who just happen to be doing what they're doing in the name of religion.
Would you like to cite examples of the left using fear of religion?

thanks for clearing up the drum thing Jim. That makes sense. However, her speech did not. Regardless of wether she said it was Gods will or not....Anyone who speaks the word of god with certainty makes no sense to me. Furthermore, anyone who SAYS that they speak the word of god while pushing any agenda other than one that is 100% religious is not to be trusted... especially in politics. End of story. When was the last time you had a beer with god and worked out a game plan?? what did he say? hey, go invade Iraq please.. i want you to tell everyone I said it was OK.... What a crock.

Lord help us

Nebe,

Dubya is the sitting republican president right, why was he not at the Republican convention, its the most important event on his parties political event calendar and he's not even in the nosebleeds. He did not have to do hurricane duty this time around (not that he did it during the first "huge storm"). The rumor mill is saying he was disinvited by McCain after Rove's initial dissapproval of Palin as VP.

I know. I must give props to Mccain for distancing himself from Bush..

thanks for clearing up the drum thing Jim. That makes sense. However, her speech did not. Regardless of wether she said it was Gods will or not....Anyone who speaks the word of god with certainty makes no sense to me. Furthermore, anyone who SAYS that they speak the word of god while pushing any agenda other than one that is 100% religious is not to be trusted... especially in politics. End of story. When was the last time you had a beer with god and worked out a game plan?? what did he say? hey, go invade Iraq please.. i want you to tell everyone I said it was OK.... What a crock.

Lord help us

You need to read the Declaration of Indepenence and the Constitution, also, hand over you $ to me, its all printed with the name God on it :lm:

apples and oranges. God does not tell me how i should spend my money, nor when I spend it, Do I tell others that I am spending it under god's will... perhaps you should give me some of yours for some spiritual guidance :hihi:

Your $ says "In God we Trust" which implies divine intervention in this countries direction. Listen to the Big O -
"No matter how religious they may or may not be," Obama said, "people are tired of seeing faith used as a tool of attack. They don't want faith used to belittle or to divide. They're tired of hearing folks deliver more screed than sermon."

and I agree 110%

Why has the left made God out to be such a bad thing? Then they get their panties in a bunch when an American treats the Coran in a disrespectful way. I'm not very spiritual but I see no harm in being spiritual. To each his or her own. Are you saying Obama is only spiritual for political purposes? Do you believe him when he says he follows God?

God shouldn't even come into the equation...remember you need to Seperate Church from State

Why has the left made God out to be such a bad thing?

The left doesnt believe God is a bad thing at all...The issue is how the religious right has sort of taken hold of the GOP. Add the fact that Bush and now Palin have said publicly that the war in IRAQ is God's wishes and we might as well have the taliban in office..

Religion should be kept out of politics plain and simple..

The left doesnt believe God is a bad thing at all...The issue is how the religious right has sort of taken hold of the GOP. Add the fact that Bush and now Palin have said publicly that the war in IRAQ is God's wishes and we might as well have the taliban in office..

Religion should be kept out of politics plain and simple..

dude, thats blatant crap, listen to what Palin said!
She said the troops are doing gods work. No comment that the war was gods wish. If American is a Nation Under God, as EVERY ONE OF THE DEMOCRATS PLEDGE IN CONGRES EVERY DAY , and the troops are sent by America, the troops must be doing the good work of god. Christ, its not that hard of a concept. You said you agree with Obama 110%, why not give Palin HER RIGHT to beleive that the troops are doing the right thing and blessed by god?

here is what she said - I have ZERO problem with this and I am an agnostic/atheist/naturalist/buddhist
Pray for our military men and women who are striving to do what is right. Also, for this country, that our leaders, our national leaders, are sending [U.S. soldiers] out on a task that is from God," she exhorted the congregants. "That's what we have to make sure that we're praying for, that there is a plan and that that plan is God's plan."

You don't have a problem with her saying that the Iraq War was a task assigned to us by God?

Thats my problem.
Asking for her to pray for the soldiers safe return, etc. I think is fine. If it is a task from God, I end up hearing it as a blues brothers quote. That talk has no place in politics IMHO.
Belief in God is not a bad thing, it's not my thing, but I have Zero problem with it.

I have huge issues with the evangelical and similar influence on the Repubs. while at the basic level, we are a Judeo-Christian based society, we still need to not be saying we are tasked by god to go to war!

http://attendingtheworld.files.wordpress.com/2007/08/crusades.jpg

ps: they lost.

we still need to not be saying we are tasked by god to go to war!

Osama (thats right yall, not Obama) & Zawahiri feel the same way about what they do... god has ordained them to fight Americans and yada yada yada... its all gods will. And that is considered by most (including muslims) to be radical sunni islam with no place in 21st century islam.

Now by the same standard Jim, Is Sara Palin a radical pentecostal?

you ALL assume she meant the war. Did you consider she may have meant bringing peace to a nation that has been oppressed for decades? Isnt protecting innocent people a task for God?
She CHOOSES to be religious, she BELIEVES her country is right in the war, she believes God favors her country. This was NOT a political speech, it WAS A CHURCH GRADUATION!

I will end with another quote by IMHO the only democrat worth metioning, this is his innauguration address - Can you Imagine if he said this today?

We do not distrust the future of essential democracy. The people of the United States have not failed. In their need they have registered a mandate that they want direct, vigorous action. They have asked for discipline and direction under leadership. They have made me the present instrument of their wishes. In the spirit of the gift I take it.

In this dedication of a Nation we humbly ask the blessing of God. May He protect each and every one of us. May He guide me in the days to come.

Source: Franklin D. Roosevelt, Inaugural Address, March 4, 1933

In this dedication of a Nation we humbly ask the blessing of God. May He protect each and every one of us. May He guide me in the days to come.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzkiSgU1fvQ


Thy will be done, almight God, Amen - FDR

Hmm.......

you ALL assume she meant the war. Did you consider she may have meant bringing peace to a nation that has been oppressed for decades?


No Spin There....:spin:

So when Bush Declared "Mission Accomplished".....Peace was reigning throughout the Land

No Spin There....:spin:

So when Bush Declared "Mission Accomplished".....Peace was reigning throughout the Land

Can you guys stay on topic? What the heck does that have to do with it?

I wonder how much food, shelter and other neccesities our troops in Afghanistan and Iraq have brought to the people there?

Lincoln's second innuaural address, another wacko like FDR that got us in a war! Look how many times he mentions God! Like freeing the slaves was God's work! Somehow history forgot this guy was republican.......and VERY religious

One-eighth of the whole population were colored slaves, not distributed generally over the Union, but localized in the southern part of it. These slaves constituted a peculiar and powerful interest. All knew that this interest was somehow the cause of the war. To strengthen, perpetuate, and extend this interest was the object for which the insurgents would rend the Union even by war, while the Government claimed no right to do more than to restrict the territorial enlargement of it. Neither party expected for the war the magnitude or the duration which it has already attained. Neither anticipated that the cause of the conflict might cease with or even before the conflict itself should cease. Each looked for an easier triumph, and a result less fundamental and astounding. Both read the same Bible and pray to the same God, and each invokes His aid against the other. It may seem strange that any men should dare to ask a just God's assistance in wringing their bread from the sweat of other men's faces, but let us judge not, that we be not judged. The prayers of both could not be answered. That of neither has been answered fully. The Almighty has His own purposes.

"Woe unto the world because of offenses; for it must needs be that offenses come, but woe to that man by whom the offense cometh." If we shall suppose that American slavery is one of those offenses which, in the providence of God, must needs come, but which, having continued through His appointed time, He now wills to remove, and that He gives to both North and South this terrible war as the woe due to those by whom the offense came, shall we discern therein any departure from those divine attributes which the believers in a living God always ascribe to Him?

Fondly do we hope, fervently do we pray, that this mighty scourge of war may speedily pass away. Yet, if God wills that it continue until all the wealth piled by the bondsman's two hundred and fifty years of unrequited toil shall be sunk, and until every drop of blood drawn with the lash shall be paid by another drawn with the sword, as was said three thousand years ago, so still it must be said "the judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether."

With malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in, to bind up the nation's wounds, to care for him who shall have borne the battle and for his widow and his orphan, to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace among ourselves and with all nations.

The food and shelter part of the game has all been privatized, even with respect to housing troops. Not to mention, I don't think the US Military should be the red cross either or for that matter providing social services and humanitarian assistance. Rather they are ensuring the security of the place so that these services can be provided by other organizations.

Bill Clinton - another religious wacko!
So in this pulpit, on this day, let me ask all of you in your heart to say: We will honor the life and the work of Martin Luther King. We will honor the meaning of our church. We will, somehow, by God's grace, we will turn this around. We will give these children a future. We will take away their guns and give them books. We will take away their despair and give them hope. We will rebuild the families and the neighborhoods and the communities. We won't make all the work that has gone on here benefit just a few. We will do it together by the grace of God.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYvcY1E7SvA

Now compare this to what you've posted. After all, like minded individuals pray alike....


"I think God's will has to be done in unifying people and companies to get the gas line built, so pray for that."
-Sarah Palin

Nothing like a little help from the man upstairs...

my "anger" with the religious angle was sarcasm. I was proving to you that some of the most famous, and liberal, politicians have used God and prayer in the speeches, Clinton, Lincoln and FDR speak of his (or her?) will.
However Palin si some crazy religious sealot that believes the war is a task of god to destroy muslims.....

my "anger" with the religious angle was sarcasm. I was proving to you that some of the most famous, and liberal, politicians have used God and prayer in the speeches, Clinton, Lincoln and FDR speak of his (or her?) will.
However Palin si some crazy religious sealot that believes the war is a task of god to destroy muslims.....
RIJIMMY, you're completely missing the point and mixing references to god.

A big difference between doing right by God, and believing you're doing God's will. Sure reads to me like she was thinking the later, and every government official who's said anything similar has taken it hard for their words. She's speaking to a lot of influential minds in that video.

There are a lot of influential evangelicals (and non evangelicals) who do believe this is a Christian vs Muslim issue.

-spence

My point being, that if Gods task was to bring peace to the region why did the guy running the show declare that task was achieved when it was obvious that the worse was yet to come. he was more than happy just going there and making things go Boom.....he wasn't thinking about peace in the area....just a piece of the area.

so let me get this straight too...its OK for us to go over there and give "hand-outs" to the people in Afghanistan and Iraq...hmmm thats so Liberal of you.

Can you guys stay on topic? What the heck does that have to do with it?

I wonder how much food, shelter and other neccesities our troops in Afghanistan and Iraq have brought to the people there?

I think Jim is close to snapping... :hihi:

For what its worth, Bush stated that we are in war under gods will as well.. he said it a few years ago and my head almost exploded..

Under god's will is a heck of a lot diferent than saying 'let god guide us' gods will means some whack job thinks he has a special Tom Tom that can comunicate with the man upstairs.. sorry... But.. all of the christian radicals who read the bible word for word are having orgasms over all of this talk... :yak:

religion should stay at home and in the church... not in the whitehouse. Same thing goes for oral sex and cigars..

religion should stay at home and in the church... not in the whitehouse. Same thing goes for oral sex and cigars..

In religious homes.

What about road head?
Is that allowed?

only on straight roads.


not homo roads... :hihi:

only on straight roads.


not homo roads... :hihi:

:lama:

Remember, just don't inhale, or swallow.

European or African swallow?

European or African swallow?

You freaking new ager!
With your crocs

AND SOCKS :eek5:

damn straight. I dont give a crap what people think of what I look like... those crocs and my smart wool socks are the footwear of the future.

I want to answer this question NO, but I first I need you to define socialism for me if you would please. Are we talking socialism in all its facets or are we talking the VA Hospital system, social security or welfare?

http://www.conservapedia.com/Socialism

This is the extreme. But right up about where Obama wants US. I feel he is a believer in the "people of the world crap". And wants US to fall into step with the UN on everything. But to do so would have to gut some of the things in our Constitution.

damn straight. I dont give a crap what people think of what I look like... those crocs and my smart wool socks are the footwear of the future.

Smart wool has been around for like 20 years.

You're committing a party foul dude.

the main issue is that her speech was not about one issue concerning this country...only attacks, slogans and spin...how about the economy? how about how we are actually going to 'win' the war in iraq since 'victory is in sight', or about energy policy since there is no greater friend to the saudis and the oil industry than the republican party, how about regaining our standing in the world which has been so bungled these past 8 years...great speech? maybe well delivered but absolutely void of anything important...scary that this country could be swayed by that...

I think your post should be in the other thread about the speech, but amen to that! and what the hell is she talking about "Obama wants to make sure we read them their rights"
yeah and he's also for increasing troops in Afghanistan to actually go after Al-Queda, something this adminstration has pretty much put on the back burner

he's also for increasing troops in Afghanistan to actually go after Al-Queda, something this adminstration has pretty much put on the back burner

Afghani-who?
C'mon man, the right can only keep track of one war at a time.
You're confusing the poor old man and the school mom.

The problem we are having in Afghanastan, and I may be wrong is that the areas we secure are fine. But the areas that are being secured by other nations are a problem. Pakastan is also the problem because we can't go in there. I'm not sure it's as simple as just sending over a few thousand more troops and problem solved. Jeez, this Obama sounds like he's a war munger.

http://www.conservapedia.com/Socialism

This is the extreme. But right up about where Obama wants US. I feel he is a believer in the "people of the world crap". And wants US to fall into step with the UN on everything. But to do so would have to gut some of the things in our Constitution.

Mac, your right. The Obama administration would have to gut the constitution. However, the constitution cannot be gutted, at least that is not how it was intended under the compromises of our founding fathers. Unfortunately, the application of the constitutional principle of due process has been bled a bit. Hopefully, this will be reconciled, but if not, then we should indeed worry about the powers of the government for we will all be hemophiliacs, cut off from the blood transfusions of disent. A powerful all knowing- no holds barred centralized authority is a prerequisite of socialism on one end of the spectrum and royalism on the other.

Now all that aside (about the constitutional bloodletting of the current administration) I would not worry to much about the socialism predictions underscoring the mantra of Obama opponents. Federalism, as mandated by constitution, places exceptional limitations on any sweeping changes in the direction of socialism/communism in America. Socialism has always been fringe ideology on the political spectrum and even FDR faced considerable opposition to his New Deal Policies which at the time were viewed not as economic jumpstarters but rank socialist expansionism by some on the Supreme Court. With 80,000 governments of varying size and scope in this country coupled with a majority stacked textualist supreme court bench, the likelihood of socialism in it extremes acquiring any serious foothold is next to nothing.

I do think social programs and incentives for reinvigorating math, science and the engineering disciplines are on the horizon, as well as curbing some of this free trade undercutting american made products. This type of government expansion, aimed at strengthening education and the economy are not all that distasteful in my opinion, but again this all in theory.

For reality far more complicated, unpredicatable and variable than what the books & experts say...

He could just change the face of the supreme court and undercut the Constitution and the will of the people that way.

The problem we are having in Afghanastan, and I may be wrong is that the areas we secure are fine. But the areas that are being secured by other nations are a problem. Pakastan is also the problem because we can't go in there. I'm not sure it's as simple as just sending over a few thousand more troops and problem solved. Jeez, this Obama sounds like he's a war munger.
The problem we're having in Afghanistan is that it's a tribal country where everybody is out for their own interest. Take a few hundred thou from the CIA then laugh while you sell opium and let the Taliban run through your back yard.

We can't be everywhere at once, it's why they call Karzi the Mayor of Kabul!

-spence

and w ran against the idea of 'nation building'...now we have 2 of these such projects going on...

and w ran against the idea of 'nation building'...now we have 2 of these such projects going on...
I think he specifically said that US troops would never be used for nation building.

Hence another reason why I don't trust a think Palin says.

It looks like McCain's first pick for VP was Joe Liberman, which set the far right into a tizzy. Instead he went 180 degrees and chose a social conservative...simple to please the BASE.

This indicates her presence is to get votes rather than add substance to the Administration. Why should she practice anything she preaches?

Bush sure as heck sold us a bill of goods, then flipped on most of it.

-spence

He could just change the face of the supreme court and undercut the Constitution and the will of the people that way.

Judges are nominated by the president, which has to be affirmed by Senate. So "He" can't change the face of Court by sheer will. There records are intensively scrutinized as we saw with Alito. Judges can also be impeached.

and w ran against the idea of 'nation building'...now we have 2 of these such projects going on...

The issue with Afghanistan was we DIDN'T do this and left them in shambles and allowed the Taliban to run buck wild through the country.