Off the RISAA list.

Just received from Bob Ballou, Chief of Marine Fisheries:

Steve --

I have just signed, and we are now filing with the Secretary of State,
the regulation that closes the commercial menhaden fishery in the
Narragansett Bay Management Area, effective midnight tonight (Thursday,
6/18). The closure is based on information revealing that the 50% cap
on landings has been reached. (Total landings through yesterday =
1,275,000 pounds). The total biomass estimate is data poor, based on
limited flyover information. But we feel compelled to act on the best
information available.

The fishery is closed until further notice. We will continue to
coordinate with Everett from ArcBait regarding continuing flyover
opportunities. We will also seek to undertake independent surveys using
the state helicopter, if available. If, on the basis of new
information, we have reason to believe that there are enough fish in the
Bay to allow for a reopening, we will recommend that such action be taken.

Let me know if anyone has any questions.

Bob

:shocked:

one million two hundred seventy five thousand pounds

I can't see them are they over by quonset? They're not over by sakonett or down by the War College, I go past those waters everyday and don't see anything.

Those numbers are absolutely staggering.

Now add those numbers to the rest of the Pogie fleet in New England, and you wonder why their (pogie) numbers are dwindling. Guess I know why every bass I catch seems to contain everything but pogies in their gut.

Those numbers are absolutely staggering.

Now add those numbers to the rest of the Pogie fleet in New England, and you wonder why their (pogie) numbers are dwindling. Guess I know why every bass I catch seems to contain everything but pogies in their gut.

Where are pogy numbers dwindling?
the last ASMFC reports differed, no?

Dont get Bryan going.

Just don't twist the science Jim.... and I'm OK :D

Dwindling or not I wish we could keep the pogy boats out of our bay.

Well the pogy boats are gone for this year. Now all we have to deal with is the 50,000 nitwits up there snagging and thinking they know what they are doing.
I have never witnessed a more disfunctional group of individuals than most of the the "snaggers". I am not saying everone so don't get your panties in a bunch over my remark.

But the fact of the matter is I have been there every morning for almost 3 weeks and sometimes, when I am late (like after 3:00 AM) I have to deal with the crowds. I have had my boat hit by snagging hooks, almost been rammed several times, had my snagging line cut by another boat, had my snagging line snagged by another snagger.

There is absolutely no respect given to the other persons space. It's like a friggin' war. This will end when someone gets hurt and DEM starts sending a boat to police the crowds. Meanwhile, I just make sure I am in Prov by 2:00-2:15 AM and gone by 3:30 AM.

Later
P

Well the pogy boats are gone for this year. Now all we have to deal with is the 50,000 nitwits up there snagging and thinking they know what they are doing.
I have never witnessed a more disfunctional group of individuals than most of the the "snaggers". I am not saying everone so don't get your panties in a bunch over my remark.

But the fact of the matter is I have been there every morning for almost 3 weeks and sometimes, when I am late (like after 3:00 AM) I have to deal with the crowds. I have had my boat hit by snagging hooks, almost been rammed several times, had my snagging line cut by another boat, had my snagging line snagged by another snagger.

There is absolutely no respect given to the other persons space. It's like a friggin' war. This will end when someone gets hurt and DEM starts sending a boat to police the crowds. Meanwhile, I just make sure I am in Prov by 2:00-2:15 AM and gone by 3:30 AM.

Later
P

Paul,

If you're first on the scene perhaps everybody is just following you?

-spence

I don't think I am tracking here...Does this mean essentially that all of the pogies that have been harvested are going to have to last for the rest of the year? Thanks.

one million two hundred seventy five thousand pounds

WOW. That's a HUGE number. It's hard to grasp and visualize that much poundage. Sounds like you could fill the a box the size of a football field that is 9 feet high with all those soon-to-be-fertilizer-etc pogies.

mayday, it means that the comercial sein netters arent allowed to fish for them in the bay anymore. recreational guys fishing can continue to use them for personal use but the commercial game is all done until further notice

WOW. That's a HUGE number. It's hard to grasp and visualize that much poundage. Sounds like you could fill the a box the size of a football field that is 9 feet high with all those soon-to-be-fertilizer-etc pogies.

Well, assuming a pogie has a slightly higher specific gravity of sea water (let's say 70 pounds per cubic foot, minus 10% because they don't stack perfectly) that's still about 16,000 cubic feet of fish.

According to my quick calculation that's an entire football field of fish filled over a yard deep.

Considering that a pogie is mostly oil, which is lighter than sea water, my calculations could be off, but that would only make the pile of fish deeper.

-spence

Well, assuming a pogie has a slightly higher specific gravity of sea water (let's say 70 pounds per cubic foot, minus 10% because they don't stack perfectly) that's still about 16,000 cubic feet of fish.

According to my quick calculation that's an entire football field of fish filled over a yard deep.

Considering that a pogie is mostly oil, which is lighter than sea water, my calculations could be off, but that would only make the pile of fish deeper.

-spence

You've got way too much time on your hands.:hee:

Assume each pogie weighs 1 lb.
Size per pogie is 1" x 2" x 10" = 20 cu.in. = .011574 cu.ft per pogie
Total volume is 2,275,000 pogies x .011574 cu.ft./pogie = 14756 cu.ft.

Football field is 160 ft by 300 ft which is 48000 sq.ft

The depth of pogies that cover the field
14,756 cu.ft./48,000 sq.ft = .30741 ft = 3.689 inches

Close to 4 pogie depth of football field.

According to my quick calculation that's an entire football field of fish filled over a yard deep.
-spence

Spence, nice work. That really helps to visualize the quantify of fish we are talking about here.

Sounds like you have a math/physics background.

No, just fine arts...I'm sure my math is off, but I'd wager the visual is still pretty close.

-spence

1:53 AM and off to pogie land:wavey::wavey::wavey:

If you were a player on that field 4 deep you'd have 2,843,750 little fish eyes looking at you thinking "Dude, what the f**k are we doing here?"

And if you get all them pogies to fart at the same time and tune their tiny little pogy butt holes to the right frequency you could set up a resonant sound wave in the concrete and bring the stadium walls around that football field down on their cute little pogy heads. :)

How's that for a visual? :spin:

Spence,

Sounds like you have a math/physics background.

No, But he did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night

mayday, it means that the comercial sein netters arent allowed to fish for them in the bay anymore. recreational guys fishing can continue to use them for personal use but the commercial game is all done until further notice

just a question based on this statement...

are the commercial seiners selling ALL of their catch to the local bait stores to be used as bait for either fishing or lobstering??

if so, why then are recreationals allowed to continue to snag them and use them as bait if the commercials are now banned from taking them? i don't get that logic. if the reason for the closure is to PROTECT the species, why oh why are people still snagging them and using them for bait?

i guess it's just one of the those double standards. either that or you think just by snagging a few you're not really putting a dent in the population. but then you see that net and it makes you sick. well, they all end up in the same place, on the end of someone's line hunting for striped bass...

if so, why then are recreationals allowed to continue to snag them and use them as bait if the commercials are now banned from taking them? i don't get that logic. if the reason for the closure is to PROTECT the species, why oh why are people still snagging them and using them for bait?

Or it might be because a few rec guys can't wipe out an entire school, leaving no forage for the resident bass like some commercial outfits can.

No, just fine arts...I'm sure my math is off, but I'd wager the visual is still pretty close.

-spence
art fag.. I bet you listened to rush and morrisey... :angel:

just a question based on this statement...

are the commercial seiners selling ALL of their catch to the local bait stores to be used as bait for either fishing or lobstering??

if so, why then are recreationals allowed to continue to snag them and use them as bait if the commercials are now banned from taking them? i don't get that logic. if the reason for the closure is to PROTECT the species, why oh why are people still snagging them and using them for bait?

i guess it's just one of the those double standards. either that or you think just by snagging a few you're not really putting a dent in the population. but then you see that net and it makes you sick. well, they all end up in the same place, on the end of someone's line hunting for striped bass...

no different than for other fish. Commercial and recreational are not always open at the same time. Most species the season is driven by dates. For pogies, there is a limit on the amount that the draggers can take, the estimate is they have reached that limit so now it is closed.

no different than for other fish. Commercial and recreational are not always open at the same time. Most species the season is driven by dates. For pogies, there is a limit on the amount that the draggers can take, the estimate is they have reached that limit so now it is closed.
So there is an open/closed season for recreational use of pogies?

And I will agree that the commercial operations do take their share..hence the numbers. But don't be niave and think there aren't a whole lot of recs netting and snagging more then a "few". Those numbers add up.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

So there is an open/closed season for recreational use of pogies?

And I will agree that the commercial operations do take their share..hence the numbers. But don't be niave and think there aren't a whole lot of recs netting and snagging more then a "few". Those numbers add up.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

The motivations of someone performing an action for profit or for recreation are unmistakably different. As demonstrated numerous times throughout history, when man is allowed to mine a resource for profit unrestricted, he will take the resource to the brink of extinction in order to maximize his profits and without consideration of the effects on other aspects of the environment or other people.

Recreational fishermen have not invested millions of dollars fine-tuning, upgrading and making their fish mining equipment the most efficient in the seas. Commercial pogy vessels have.

If we want stripers to flourish (or all marine life, minus the seals), we must protect the bait. Allowing the unrestricted mining of the forage is asking to screw up the whole balance of the oceans.

Please don't compare apples to oranges.

So there is an open/closed season for recreational use of pogies?

And I will agree that the commercial operations do take their share..hence the numbers. But don't be niave and think there aren't a whole lot of recs netting and snagging more then a "few". Those numbers add up.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

there is no recreationsal closed season for stripers or bluefish either.

This only means that for now the commercial taking of pogies in Narragansett Bay is stopped. That could change if they find more coming into the bay.The most likely scenario is that the boats will go to Jersey and get them there and truck the bait back.There will be pogies for bait ,it just won't be in as good shape as the local ones.It's been this way for many moons.

The motivations of someone performing an action for profit or for recreation are unmistakably different. As demonstrated numerous times throughout history, when man is allowed to mine a resource for profit unrestricted, he will take the resource to the brink of extinction in order to maximize his profits and without consideration of the effects on other aspects of the environment or other people.

Recreational fishermen have not invested millions of dollars fine-tuning, upgrading and making their fish mining equipment the most efficient in the seas. Commercial pogy vessels have.

If we want stripers to flourish (or all marine life, minus the seals), we must protect the bait. Allowing the unrestricted mining of the forage is asking to screw up the whole balance of the oceans.

Please don't compare apples to oranges.


it is not apples to oranges. we are talking about the same thing. i am not advocating for more commercial harvesting. i want the same thing you do, more pogies.

the sad part of this whole thing is that the recreational fishermen who harvest pogies for their own use are not bound to report any of that. so who is to know how much is actually being taken.

Now maybe some of them can get past your gauntlet of nets and make it up here for christsakes.

commfisherman = greedfishermen

There hasn't been a bunker here (in any real number) in 20+ years.

I thought the reduction boats were outta the Bay..... that Arc was there for bait purposes only???? over a million pounds sure seems like a LOT of friggin baits.......

Well whatever the boats didn't get is gone now anyway. This crappy weather , NE wind for 24 days, considerable runoff, sewage, etc has turned the Bay into a coffee colored garbage dump. There are no pogies to be found, at least right now.

Maybe if Summer ever shows up they may come back but I have my doubts. The good thing is, at present, there are very few bass in the upper Bay. This clearly will prevent the loosers who snag and drop from killing anymore bass.

Maybe if Summer ever shows up they may come back but I have my doubts. The good thing is, at present, there are very few bass in the upper Bay. This clearly will prevent the loosers who snag and drop from killing anymore bass.

I guess you didn't get the memo, Paul

:soon::soon::soon:

Same thing down these parts - the bait done flew the coop

But the good news is, the gibronies up there bailing bass like stocked trout will be gone too

I thought the reduction boats were outta the Bay..... that Arc was there for bait purposes only???? over a million pounds sure seems like a LOT of friggin baits.......


There are no reduction boats (and haven't been for a long while) but boats like Arc bait and one out of Gloucester (I think) that get the pogies primarily for bait for lobsterman and fish shops. I don't think the local pogies go much towards Omega 3 pills