Emergency rescue effort is launched for teen sailor Abby Sunderland (http://www.grindtv.com/outdoor/blog/17943/emergency+rescue+effort+is+launched+for+teen+sailo r+abby+sunderland/)


For some reason sailors see this youngest kid to sail the globe claim as some holy grail and it causes many to chase it....when in effect most of these kids have never seen or sailed in real heavy weather in the mid ocean for months on end. My question is...who pays for her rescue? This is a pointless award and since she pursued it on her own...Send the bill to her folks. I hope she is OK... she has more balls than I do.
(I can tell you I would not let my kid sail the globe alone...I don't care how good a sailor he/she was, too much can (and will) go wrong.)

Any parent who would even consider allowing their 16 year-old to do this is bonkers. This is a case of parents wanting their kids to think they're "cool", instead of being parents, which is about more than being liked.

I can easily see why a kid would want to do this. That's precisely why kids need parents, and the parents are supposed to be wiser than the kids. Not in this case.

This really, really frosts me. They are unimaginable morons. They'll probably react by saying "it's great she got to die doing what she loved", or some other such nonsense.

Solo offshore voyage goes against any premise of good seamanship in my book. Nevermind a circumnavigation.... and that goes for the whole lot of them, from Joshua Slocum, to Chichester, and Dodge Morgan too.....

By the time I was 16 I had more miles offshore (and standing watches on my own) than most people ever will in their lifetimes.

To make blanket judgements upon the parents or whomever is ignorant and stupid.

So Sandman, according to who is RTW by 16 a "holy grail to sailors"?

Where's the outrage over the 14yo or whatever climbing Everest? Thats pretty stupid considering you ARE dying at that altitude.

[QUOTE=likwid;772979]By the time I was 16 I had more miles offshore (and standing watches on my own) than most people ever will in their lifetimes.

QUOTE]

You know my resume, I know yours... But we're not talking solos... I would not put a kid in the Southern Ocean alone at this time of year. I saw it once, in the summer. That was enough to convince me I need never go back there. And that was on a 60', with 11 in crew.

You know my resume, I know yours... But we're not talking solos... I would not put a kid in the Southern Ocean alone at this time of year. I saw it once, in the summer. That was enough to convince me I need never go back there. And that was on a 60', with 11 in crew.

My weather router says "its a bit rough but manageable".
Been on the sat for 2 days trying to fix the engine, maybe she's giving up?

Likwid, I'm not ignorant, nor am I stupid. I'd be more than hapy to trade wits with you in any manner you wish.

I'm glad you didn't get hurt when you were doing those things at 16. However, if you think that means anything at all about the recklessness of other kids sailing around the world solo, you are the one who is ignorant and stupid. My grandfather smoked 2 packs a day, and lived to be 100. Does that mean cigarettes aren't dangerous? Just because YOU got through something unscathed, doesn't mean it's not asenine for someone else to attempt it. Try taking statistics 101, you can't draw conculsions from one observation.

And I'm equally critical of anyone who would allow a young teenager to climb Everest. This post was about sailing around the world, so I'm sorry I didn't mention every other idiotic thing some dumb parents let their kids do, like climbing everest, flying solo around the world, doing deepwater freedive competitions, etc...

This kid should have been thinking about the prom, going to pop concerts, going on dates, and otherwise driving her parents crazy the way teenagers do. She had a whole life ahead of her, presumably snuffed out because her parents were grotesquely negligent in keeping her safe, which is the first and foremost job of any parent.

Likwid....I'd just knew you would reply!!!:rotf2:

Again, I don't care how many at sea hours a person has... solo RTW contests are not a good idea. I agree with you on Everest but most of those are not solo. I also think if they rescue someone from extreme mountain climbing they should pass on the rescue bill to them. Same thing for the guy who rowed across.

As you know from all your hours at sea, unforeseen stuff can happen which can not easily be resolved with one person on board...even with the best planning and best equipment. It will be days before they reach her and cost hundreds of thousands of dollars in rescue operations.

The girl from Australia recently made it and I followed her all winter online. Thought she was nuts as well as her parents but it was entertaining.

I would like to know what experience this kid has to warrant allowing her to do this alone. I can't believe that at 16 she has had enough experience to venture out solo. I know people have had sea-worthy experiences in their early teens, but I doubt they were solo ventures out into the open ocean for a intercontinental voyage.

I also thought that the 14 yr. old climbing Everest was idiotic as well.
Hell, it's idiotic for adults as well.
They had a show on a year or so ago about one expedition on Everest where people died and almost everyone suffered disfiguring frostbite on their face, hands and feet. These same people say they don't regret it (Sure, one adventure has changed your life FOREVER, and not in a good way, and you don't regret doing it?)

But back to the oceanic adventure....If she is found and rescued safely, she and her family should be MADE to pay for the rescue.
If she isn't found, they should pay for the attempt just the same.

If you can't afford to pay, you can't afford to play!

Likwid....I'd just knew you would reply!!!:rotf2:

Yup. Just waiting for his reply to being referred to as ignorant and stupid:rotf2:

As you know from all your hours at sea, unforeseen stuff can happen which can not easily be resolved with one person on board...even with the best planning and best equipment. It will be days before they reach her and cost hundreds of thousands of dollars in rescue operations.

Yeah, so? Itsh happens. Boats break. Things break down. Suck it up with a cool head. Welcome to the game.

And I'd bet the number of stupid calls the USCG gets between BB and Vineyard Sound each summer costs more than this one girl will cost the French Navy.

So likwid, you weren't even talking about solo time offshore?

I was once on an aircraft carrier in the Persial Gulf with the USMC. No one drowned that day. Can I therefore claim that it's reasonable for a 16 year old to sail solo around the world?

I hope they find her safe.

I would not know about the number of rescue calls but personally, I don't see a BB buoy and mid ocean rescue in the same category.

Sittin in that raft in a 60kn blow for days is not fun. But I hope she made it into the raft!

I could have done this at 16 too. What likwid isn't saying and should, is that there are some kids born into sailing and others are not. I have no knowledge about this girl, but at 16, i could have done it, and I know likwid could have too.
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I could have done this at 16 too. What likwid isn't saying and should, is that there are some kids born into sailing and others are not. I have no knowledge about this girl, but at 16, i could have done it, and I know likwid could have too.
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Except you would have gotten sea sick :D:D:D:D:D:D:D

hopefully she makes it out.

I don't understand the solo rtw mentality, but won't criticize it here.

yeah i would have gotten seasick, but it only lasts for 2 days then i am fine :)

Eben, I have been on sailboats maybe 5 times in my life, so I can't claim any technical knowledge. I'll assume that at 16, you and likwid had the technical sailing skills to handle most situations.

That you "could" have done it at 16 is not the same thing as saying it would have been a good idea. That's where parents are supposed to step in, because the extra wisdom and experience that parents are supposed to have, enables them to differentiate between what's possible, and what's advisable.

I have a 15 year-old. I could kick her out of the house, and she could get a job somewhere and make enough to pay her rent and buy food. And even though there are times when I'm sure that idea is appealing to her (every time I say "no"), I wouldn't let her do it. It would not be in her best interests, it would not improve her chances of having a fulfilling future. She may not agree with that, but I know it for a fact. I know that, and she doesn't, because I'm more mature and more experienced than she is.

Finally, how long does it take to sail around the world solo? A few months? I'd question the saity of any parent who could be without their 16 year-old for that long, under any circumstances.

This is all just my $0.02 obviously. Maybe reasonable people can disagree, but I don't see it. I can usually see both sides of any issue, but not here. Rarely do I see things as obviously right or wrong, but this is to me.

Anyway, you do know how to disagree respectfully, and that's rare. And I envy your vast marine experience, I'm pretty new to all this.

God Bless.

Eben, continuing on the "just cuz you could do it, doesn't mean I'll let you do it" theme...

My 15 year old daughter goes to a private school, and is really into classical music. Her music class wanted to do an UNSUPERVISED, OVERNIGHT trip to NYC (to see 3 concerts over 2 days). Again, these were high school sophomores, unsupervised.

Now, my daughter is pefrectly capable of getting on a train, getting off at the right stop, walking to a hotel, feeding herself, finding the concert, etc...There was no one skill required that she doesn't have. That being said, never in a million years would I have ever let her do it. Buit there were parents who said OK. I was simply stunned.

Too over-protective for you? You seem very thoughtful, so I'm curious what your opinion is...

Her boat is frigging tiny. If I was on the Southern Ocean I would want to be on the NIMITZ. I think her parents are morons. Hopefully they did not allow her to kill herself.

I hope she is rescued alive. I don't understand why this would interest a 16 year old unless she has $$$$$$$$$$$$$ and is looking for thrills.


She should be in school. I agree these parents allowing teenagers to climb everest and RTW solo are stupid. Then again taking drugs is stupid and at one time I was pretty stupid.

Eben, continuing on the "just cuz you could do it, doesn't mean I'll let you do it" theme...

My 15 year old daughter goes to a private school, and is really into classical music. Her music class wanted to do an UNSUPERVISED, OVERNIGHT trip to NYC (to see 3 concerts over 2 days). Again, these were high school sophomores, unsupervised.

Now, my daughter is pefrectly capable of getting on a train, getting off at the right stop, walking to a hotel, feeding herself, finding the concert, etc...There was no one skill required that she doesn't have. That being said, never in a million years would I have ever let her do it. Buit there were parents who said OK. I was simply stunned.

Too over-protective for you? You seem very thoughtful, so I'm curious what your opinion is...

My thoughts are that there will be a time in your life where you will have to let go of your daughter. The earlier you allow your child to think on his/her own, the stronger person that they will grow to be. Some learn by experience, some learn by failure. The longer you hold your daugther by the reigns, the more you risk extreme failure later on.. For example.. When you see college kids going nuts at spring weekend down south, binge drinking and acting wild, I guarantee you that these people are people who were actively held back in their early teens. Like I said, I grew up on boats- my family would rent out our house in the summer and we would live on our 60 foot steel ketch, but when i was in highschool, I was trusted by my parents to run free.. my friends and I all drank on the weekends, and we all hung out with the local colllege kids... when it was time for me to go to college, I felt like a grad student. I watched all of my peers go crazy because this was their first taste of freedom..
My point is that when parents dont let their kids think for themselves, they are in effect, not letting their kids learn how to think.

getting back to sailing around the world... The first person to sail around the world alone at a young age was Robin Lee Grahm.. he was my idol as a child. While other kids worshiped football players, i was thinking that I could have done what he had done.. he wasn't `16 though.. i think he was a bit older.

What i want to know about this girl is how much experience did she have before she set off on this trip? what sort of long distance sailing did she have before this? If its not much, i will agree with you guys that this is irresponsible. If she has grown up on the water and has a lot fo bluewater sailing under her belt, i say kudos to her.

I just hope she is OK

Her boat is frigging tiny. If I was on the Southern Ocean I would want to be on the NIMITZ.

Tiny?
I'd rather be in a "tiny" well built boat than a cruise ship on which half the electronics don't even work.

But thats just me.

Except you would have gotten sea sick :D:D:D:D:D:D:D

hopefully she makes it out.

I don't understand the solo rtw mentality, but won't criticize it here.

A wiser person once said "if you've never been seasick, you've never been in a real sea". They're right. :hihi:

Tiny?
I'd rather be in a "tiny" well built boat than a cruise ship on which half the electronics don't even work.

But thats just me.

I looked at her boat, and I would pass on it and choose something heavier with a full keel. Her boat is built to go fast, not be super safe.
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Wild Eyes is a VERY well built Open 40 (she's been in Newport a couple times and I've been on her) and is Cat 0.

Wild Eyes is designed for travel in the Southern Ocean and is equipped with 5 air-tight bulkheads to keep her buoyant in the event of major hull damage. It is built to Category 0 standards and is designed to self-right in the event of capsize.

So far what I'm hearing is she went through a couple knockdowns. Probably lost the rig.

watertight bulkheads don't keep you from being knocked down. Open 40's are giant lasers
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watertight bulkheads don't keep you from being knocked down. Open 40's are giant lasers
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But Open 40's certainly right a hell of alot better than lasers do when knocked down. :hihi:.

So you loose the rig and electronics? Seal her up, hang out in your bunk and light off the epirb.

Psychiatrists once said that it was mentally impossible to go around the world solo non-stop. Then they said it was impossible to go around in under 80 days.

Boy were they all wrong.

Are you sure about not super safe Nebe? I mean it's all realative but that thing has 5 air tight bulkheads plus a detatchable pod that is fully enclosed if any part of the hull is breached. It looked solid to me for what she is doing. Her background is solid with parents and siblings that are on their game. Take a look at this link. As a parent of a 13 year old girl I feel for these parents. I must say though I grew up around sailboats but by no means did I do anything in this class but I can relate to these parents and this kid having something special inside that drives them to do this. If you have never done or experienced this drive to accomplish something tuly amazing you wouldn't know how much it can consume you. I think these parents did ok and I don't criticize them. The ocean has a power that can affect us all in different ways. This family lives to be on the water and it is their life. God I hope they find her safe though. She seems like a special girl.

Abby Sunderland, 16-year-old Thousand Oaks, Cal... - Bing Video (http://www.bing.com/videos/watch/video/abby-sunderland-16-year-old-thousand-oaks-cal/349e0f785c95e3ea5623349e0f785c95e3ea5623-35076572489)

An open 40 is designed to plane downwind, or in otherwords skim across the surface. While not as glorious or fancy, a deep keeled tank if a boat would be safer for someone like her. Just my opinion.
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There's something to be said about a boat that can outrun or get the hell out of the way of weather systems comfortably. Wild Eyes can do that.

I've been in both. I like being able to avoid sub 1000mb systems, less time considering taking up gardening.

There's an airbus on its way to the boat (another 2 hours or so).

The current sailworld articles are PURE SPECULATION AND UNFOUNDED. Please do not believe them until its all actually been confirmed.

frickin blowboaters http://www.saltwaterplugs.com/saltyforum/Smileys/fantasticsmileys/tongue.gif

Australian authorities contact missing American teen sailor - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/06/11/missing.teen.sailor/index.html?hpt=T1)

Tiny?
I'd rather be in a "tiny" well built boat than a cruise ship on which half the electronics don't even work.

But thats just me.

She is the worlds largest aircraft carrier sir.

74.48E 40.48S paste that into google map. Her last know location. Thank God they have contacted her. Now God willing they will rescue her. Robin Graham was 17, he was my hero as well.

I heard they made contact and that she's OK, thank God. In my opinion (just one man's humble opinion),I hope this scvare gives parents pause about things like this, climbing Everest, etc...

Eben, as I said before, you are certainly someone who knows how disagree thoughtfully, and I think that's rare and very respectable. And I hear you about stifling kids, and I agree that if you suffocate teenagers too much, they might rebel that much more wildly when they are eventually on their own...I could not agree more.

I try to find the balance. We let our 15 year-old do more and more things on her own every year, and I have let her sip wine a couple of times so there's not as much mystery about alcohol.

Hard for me to say where I draw the line, but suffice to say no unsupervised overnights to NYC, and no way I'd let her live on her own, in potentially life-threatening situations, for months and months.

I did 2 tours in Iraq with the USMC, I was in for-real combat a few times. I'd bet a 1 year hitch with the Marines is statistically much safer that a soloo circumnavigation, although I'd love to see the statistics on mortality rates among teenagers who try it (I'm an actuary, I always need statistics).

Good debate.

it starts in elementary school when kids are told to STOP day dreaming

I did 2 tours in Iraq with the USMC, I was in for-real combat a few times. I'd bet a 1 year hitch with the Marines is statistically much safer that a soloo circumnavigation, although I'd love to see the statistics on mortality rates among teenagers who try it (I'm an actuary, I always need statistics).

Good debate.

Regardless of the number of people who go around the world solo non-stop being a pretty small and exclusive group, you'd be right. Most are still alive and well and going around the marble still.

I honestly cannot recall a single person under the age of 20 that has died making a RTW attempt.

But how many kids die per year getting drunk and driving a car?

By the way Duke, we purposely drive the big 70+ foot race boats, ORMA 60 trimarans, IMOCA 60's to the top of big low pressure systems to find lots of wind and cover more ground than even the Enterprise can in 24 hours.

My thoughts are that there will be a time in your life where you will have to let go of your daughter. The earlier you allow your child to think on his/her own, the stronger person that they will grow to be. Some learn by experience, some learn by failure.

Actually, kids learn primarily by example.

Great News! This whole situation will stoke her fire to complete this journey more. I'll bet she'll be planning her next trip soon and going over the details of what happened and use that knowledge & experience to try it again. All indications of this incident point to how well prepared she was going in to a trip of this magnitude and that her safety measures worked according to design. It takes a clear head, intelligence and, bravery to be able to do what she has done in those seas. I really respect her and her family. I can't wait to hear her interview when she is safely on land.

should be interestin

Growing up on sailboats and now going to sea for a profession, granted my work is 2+ football fields long, I have always regarded people who want to go solo around the world as mostly nuts whether your 16 or 60 on a great built boat or pos. To each his own.

Boats head to teen sailor drifting in Indian Ocean - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100611/ap_on_sp_ot/lost_sailor_found)

planes, ships ... all for a kid wanting some recoginition from the sailing community.
Send the bill to:
Mr & Mrs. Sunderland

I'm sick of the extreme culture - somebody needs to poison some Mountain Dew.

I'm sick of the extreme culture - somebody needs to poison some Mountain Dew.

Make sure to bitch at the guys wetsuiting MTK and Brenton Reef. :rotf2:

In today's crazy society. One could argue that being on alone on a boat in the middle of the ocean is a lot safer than being alone in a city at 16. And to say that a stint in Iraq is safer than a round the world trip is just not comparable. No one is shooting at you, no one is trying to blow you up. I still think the choice of boat was a mistake. That's a lot of boat to handle.
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Question.

If this girl were really "qualified" to make this trip, wouldn't she set a sea anchor, ride out the storm, clear the mess, then rig an an A-frame, use her boom as a jury rig, then turn and head downwind for safety.

Dragging other people into danger to save your own skin from trouble of your own making hardly seems like a great life lesson. Isn't the real value of a solo circumnavigation to test one's self-sufficiency?

Boats head to teen sailor drifting in Indian Ocean - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100611/ap_on_sp_ot/lost_sailor_found)

planes, ships ... all for a kid wanting some recoginition from the sailing community.
Send the bill to:
Mr & Mrs. Sunderland


Not even close to the truth. She openly says she doesn't care about records, etc. Plus the record wasn't even going to be broken because she stopped at Cape Town for repairs. She could have ended the quest there if it was all about the recognition and records. She's doing it for your passion of the sea and accomplishing and testing her inner strength. It's got nothing to do with recognition from the sailing community IMO. In regards to the bill....that's why we have rescue services for this. Does the Coast Guard charge for their rescues around here?

Not even close to the truth. She openly says she doesn't care about records, etc.


Then why do it this time of year?


Does the Coast Guard charge for their rescues around here?


The should for some of them

I heard they made contact and that she's OK, thank God. In my opinion (just one man's humble opinion),I hope this scvare gives parents pause about things like this, climbing Everest, etc...

Eben, as I said before, you are certainly someone who knows how disagree thoughtfully, and I think that's rare and very respectable. And I hear you about stifling kids, and I agree that if you suffocate teenagers too much, they might rebel that much more wildly when they are eventually on their own...I could not agree more.

I try to find the balance. We let our 15 year-old do more and more things on her own every year, and I have let her sip wine a couple of times so there's not as much mystery about alcohol.

Hard for me to say where I draw the line, but suffice to say no unsupervised overnights to NYC, and no way I'd let her live on her own, in potentially life-threatening situations, for months and months.

I did 2 tours in Iraq with the USMC, I was in for-real combat a few times. I'd bet a 1 year hitch with the Marines is statistically much safer that a soloo circumnavigation, although I'd love to see the statistics on mortality rates among teenagers who try it (I'm an actuary, I always need statistics).

Good debate.


I remember being 16 and telling my dad I wanted to join the Army on my first possible opportunity. He never tried to talk me out of it. I was passionate and focused on making it happen. I did all my homework on early entry, pro's and con's covered and I had a recruiter come over for dinner. My mom was sick about it. At 17 I joined with parental consent. My Mom kept asking will he be safe, etc. The recruiter pointed out at 17 when I go out with my friends in their cars, etc will my parents know what I'm doing, where I'm going, etc. At least they would know exactly where I am and the training I am receiving would empower me for my future. I was so focused on making that happen in my life. That summer before my senior year I did basic and then after graduation I completed my MOS training and went to college. How many parents today would let their 17 year old join the military while still in high school? I give my parents credit for having faith in my dreams. That and I think it also helped that my dad was a Vietanm era vet and I was a royal PIA back then, so he thought I could use the dicipline from good ole uncle sam! I respect your views on this big time but I can relate to this kid somehow and also to the parents now that I have a kid approaching that age.

Oh, and thanks for your service man! I never saw or experienced what you did in Iraq and I'm thankful for guys and gals like you that served during troubled times. Thanks man!

[QUOTE=RIROCKHOUND;773170]Then why do it this time of year?



It had to do with her school work and being able to graduate with her class. Otherwise her graduation would have been delayed a year. She took her school work for the rest of the year with her on board so she could get credit to complete her Junior year.

Again, her boat is sound and afloat. Why is anyone going to get her? Shouldn't she set a jury rig and limp home? She loves the ocean, she wanted to test herself, ....well here is her test....and she is opting out at significant expense, danger, and inconvience to others. Any test you can opt out of is child's play.......which is exactly what this stunt is.

Again, her boat is sound and afloat. Why is anyone going to get her? Shouldn't she set a jury rig and limp home? She loves the ocean, she wanted to test herself, ....well here is her test....and she is opting out at significant expense, danger, and inconvience to others. Any test you can opt out of is child's play.......which is exactly what this stunt is.

Respectfully, I couldn't disagree with you more. She wants help why do you have to chastize her for that?

Dragging other people into danger to save your own skin from trouble of your own making hardly seems like a great life lesson. Isn't the real value of a solo circumnavigation to test one's self-sufficiency?

Nobody has been dragged into it, the fishing vessel VOLUNTEERED to divert to her location as did the other vessels. The Airbus was PRIVATELY chartered.

Marshcappa, in the military, you're part of a team, and help is almost always minutes away. Not so in the case of what this girl and her parents exposed her to.

Furthermore, in my own experience, even in combat, we were able to control a lot of what took place, so that we could minimize the real danger. I'm not a sailor, but I'm guessing she is (or potentially is) exposed to a lot of things she casn't control.

Finally, even if you concede that being in the military is riskier than what this girl did (and I don't concede that), those risks are taken to ensure national security. This girl's motivation is irrefutably a lot more self-serving.

Likwid, you say the rescuers aren't "forced" to try to help her. True. Nor are rescuers forced to climb Mt McKinley to help folks who get stuck up there. But in my opinion, taking advantage of the bravery of those who work in rescue, in pursuit of a reckless, purely self-serving goal, is very selfish.

No one forced me to join the Marines. I felt that for a worthy mission, I'd take the risks. I would not have wanted to risk the lives of kids under my command, to save some teenager who went off half-cocked on some thrill ride.

Some people go to war, some people go to sea. Its as simple as that.

Btw, the Coast Guard will not render assistance unless its a life or death situation.

Some people go to war, some people go to sea. Its as simple as that.

Btw, the Coast Guard will not render assistance unless its a life or death situation.

Agreed. But another simple concept is that parents are supposed to be wiser and more experienced than their teenage kids, and thus are in a better position to decide what's good for a kid and what's not. I'm sure you agree with that, we just disagree on the appropriateness of this particular adventure.

Thank God for the outcome...

Agreed. But another simple concept is that parents are supposed to be wiser and more experienced than their teenage kids, and thus are in a better position to decide what's good for a kid and what's not. I'm sure you agree with that, we just disagree on the appropriateness of this particular adventure.

Thank God for the outcome...

Given the number of soldiers that have died the past few years in Iraq and Afghanistan, is it ignorant for parents to let their kids go into the military?

If the kid proved she could handle the boat then why would you deny her doing what she wanted?

She is the worlds largest aircraft carrier sir.

And these stupid little things race across the Atlantic every year:

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i113/lazergunpewpew/sailing/open01.jpg

Bigger being safer is a myth.

Given the number of soldiers that have died the past few years in Iraq and Afghanistan, is it ignorant for parents to let their kids go into the military?

If the kid proved she could handle the boat then why would you deny her doing what she wanted?

Clueless. This saga has more in common with the "Balloon Boy" stunt than with a child deciding to serve his/her country. The country also recognizes that a 16 yo is not mature enough to make those sort of judgements.

Judgement, not boat handling, is what kids need to learn to survive. Tackling the S Indian Ocean alone in winter at age 16 is not good judgement. Gambling the life of your 16 yo to affirm your/their opinion that they are special isn't good judgement, either.

How'd a kid that age afford this boat anyways? Her parents buy it for her?

Bigger being safer is a myth.

But a good rule of thumb when it comes to the ocean.

If the kid proved she could handle the boat then why would you deny her doing what she wanted?

Seriously? I deny my kids something they want, all the time. I don't let my 10 year old eat candy bars for dinner, I don't let him choose not to do his homework. I don't let my teenager buy a convertible with her college savings. You see, there's a reason why kids need parents.

As to your other point, you speculated that if more soldiers die in combat than kids drown who sail solo, military life is more dangerous? You can't compare it that way, because I assume many more folks are in the military.

In other words, more people will get killed today driving cars than by playing russian roulette. Does that mean driving is more dangerous? No, it means that there are a lot of drivers, and not many kooks playing russian roulette. You need to look at percentages.

In any event, 16 year olds can't join the military, for good reason. Nor can 16 year-olds drive a car by themselves (here in CT) also for very good reason.

The country also recognizes that a 16 yo is not mature enough to make those sort of judgements.

Its sad when its this easy to make blanket judgements on people without having met them.

I'm glad I never had anyone in my life like you telling me "you can't do that, thats too risky, thats too dangerous, you're not mature enough".

Seriously? I deny my kids something they want, all the time. I don't let my 10 year old eat candy bars for dinner, I don't let him choose not to do his homework. I don't let my teenager buy a convertible with her college savings. You see, there's a reason why kids need parents.

So how much time did you spend with Abby offshore in the Open 40 determining she's not capable of this then?

.

Judgement, not boat handling, is what kids need to learn to survive. Tackling the S Indian Ocean alone in winter at age 16 is not good judgement. Gambling the life of your 16 yo to affirm your/their opinion that they are special isn't good judgement, either.



Exactly. In a written test of seamenship, maybe this kid scores better than, say, Dennis Connor (the only sailor I know). Does that mean she's better equipped to decide for herself to sail around the world, solo, than he is?

Nope. Maturity and wisdom are a function of age and experience.

I can easily see why this kid wanted to do it. I cannot comprehend any parent even considering agreeing to it. But as I said before, I see 12 year-olds shipped off to boarding schools, which I wouldn't do to my little guy, no matter how smart he was, even if you put a gun to my head.

Likwid...

"I'm glad I never had anyone in my life like you telling me "you can't do that, thats too risky,"

Did you have parents? Do you have kids (God I hope not)?

"So how much time did you spend with Abby offshore in the Open 40 determining she's not capable of this then?"

I spent exactly zero time with her. But I know that there's great reasons why 16 year-olds can't even drive a car in many states without adult supervision. I know that 16 year-olds aren't allowed to drink or even vote. Because they aren't developed enough, aren't mature enough, to make those kinds of decisions.

I'm glad I never had anyone in my life like you telling me "you can't do that, thats too risky, thats too dangerous, you're not mature enough".




OK, so you're saying parents are never justified in saying "no" to teenagers because what they want is too risky...that's what you're seriously saying?

What color is the sky on the planet you live on? Here on Earth, where I live, parents are supposed to watch kids, especially teenagers, like a hawk. Teenagers have very little appreciation for long-term consequences.

According to your logic, the next time my 10 year-old asks if he can drive the car, I shuold just hand over the keys. And he can decide whether or not to wear his seat belt, things like that?

Did you have parents?

I was raised by an angry group of bowmen known as the bowmen's union. By the time I was 5 I was being chased by pro ho's. At 6 I scaled by hand my first 100+ foot rig in the middle of a gale to retrieve a halyard. By 12 they unveiled the ancient scripts from NYYC saying the one with the monkey feet would be the herald of the bowmen, which was me.

Ask Nebe, he'll vouch.

I was raised by extremely accomplished offshore sailors. My mother has more miles than most Navy folks will ever have.

Do you have kids (God I hope not)?

They would certainly get in the way of fishin and sailin.

I spent exactly zero time with her. But I know that there's great reasons why 16 year-olds can't even drive a car in many states without adult supervision. I know that 16 year-olds aren't allowed to drink or even vote. Because they aren't developed enough, aren't mature enough, to make those kinds of decisions.

So tell me what voting, drinking, or driving a car has to do with sailing solo? Other than absolutely NOTHING.

I'm sure you're a great dad and your kids love you, but don't ever tell anyone else what they can or can't do or what their kids can or can't do. They just might do it anyhow and make you look bad.

OK, so you're saying parents are never justified in saying "no" to teenagers because what they want is too risky...that's what you're seriously saying?

Lets put this bluntly.
You have exactly zero knowledge of what it takes to sail offshore solo.
You have exactly zero knowledge of this kid's background.

You have no right to judge her or the parents.

likwid, have you raised any teenaged children?
Until you do, you know nothing.
This is not about offshore sailing. This is about parental judgement....something you have no direct experience with it appears.

This is not about offshore sailing.

Yes actually it is.
Since you have zero knowledge of it in GENERAL, never mind sailing an Open 40, you have no concept to decide whether a 16 year old could or couldn't do it.

And parent's judgement? Its their kid. Its their decision to say go or no go. Not yours. And none of your business.

Likwid...

"So tell me what voting, drinking, or driving a car has to do with sailing solo? Other than absolutely NOTHING."

Wrong. Those things (to do them safely and knowledgably) all require experience, maturity, wisdom, and the ability to understand the consequences of decisions.

"You have exactly zero knowledge of what it takes to sail offshore solo."

In terms of technical ability and seamenship, you are 100% correct in your assessment.

"You have exactly zero knowledge of this kid's background."

I assume (don't know for sure) she has spent an awful lot of time on the water. And I know for damn sure her parents are morons.

"You have no right to judge her or the parents"

Sorry, in your first post you called me "ignorant" and "stupid". So naturally I assumed that you were comfortable in judging others. I guessed I missed the announcement that you, and only you, were qualified to judge others.

Wrong. Those things (to do them safely and knowledgably) all require experience, maturity, wisdom, and the ability to understand the consequences of decisions.

Better go after basically every european family in the world who serves their kids wine at dinner!
Better go after countries with lower drinking ages too! Obviously they're all ignorant and their children are not 'mature' enough to do those things!

Sorry, in your first post you called me "ignorant" and "stupid". So naturally I assumed that you were comfortable in judging others. I guessed I missed the announcement that you, and only you, were qualified to judge others.

Ignorant was making blanket statements with zero knowledge of the boat, girl, or parents.

Ignorant is making blanket statements about what people can or can't do.

I see nobody has realized that she was being routed by professional weather routers. (Commanders, I'm sure NF is familiar with them. I personally hate them and think they're awful, but to each their own.) She was not making course decisions.

But I suppose you'd actually have to research and educate yourself on her attempt to know that.

Yes actually it is.

And parent's judgement? Its their kid. Its their decision to say go or no go. Not yours. And none of your business.


Here's what you can't understand. If this kid had died, I would feel awful about that, and I'd feel angry at the waste. I've seen too many teenagers die for noble causes, to comprehend why parents would allow such risks for something as meaningless as 15 minutes of fame (and she had a blog and website, so don't tell me that's not what motivated her in some fashion, which, by the way, is understandable for a kid).

In some way, all of us, even you, have a vested interest in the safety and quality of life of future generations.

And don't give me that "who are you to judge" crap, that's the last-ditch effort of someone who would never admit that someone else might have a point.

Here's what you can't understand. If this kid had died, I would feel awful about that, and I'd feel angry at the waste. I've seen too many teenagers die for noble causes, to comprehend why parents would allow such risks for something as meaningless as 15 minutes of fame (and she had a blog and website, so don't tell me that's not what motivated her in some fashion, which, by the way, is understandable for a kid).

In some way, all of us, even you, have a vested interest in the safety and quality of life of future generations.

And don't give me that "who are you to judge" crap, that's the last-ditch effort of someone who would never admit that someone else might have a point.

People lose their lives doing all kinds of things, hell even crossing the street, nevermind sitting infront of the TV getting fat and never doing anything with their life and having their heart go on revolt.

You DON'T have a point because you cannot put yourself into her shoes or anyone elses. You live in a little world that things need to be "safe" and "secure" where things are served to you in appropriate portions and nothing bad ever happens.

Thats not living.

Better go after basically every european family in the world who serves their kids wine at dinner!
Better go after countries with lower drinking ages too! Obviously they're all ignorant and their children are not 'mature' enough to do those things!



Ignorant was making blanket statements with zero knowledge of the boat, girl, or parents.

Ignorant is making blanket statements about what people can or can't do.

I see nobody has realized that she was being routed by professional weather routers. (Commanders, I'm sure NF is familiar with them. I personally hate them and think they're awful, but to each their own.) She was not making course decisions.

But I suppose you'd actually have to research and educate yourself on her attempt to know that.

Likwid...

"Better go after basically every european family in the world who serves their kids wine at dinner!"

If they give the kids unsupervised access to the liquor cabinet, OK, I'll do that...

I stated previously that I've let my teenager drink wine a few times. I don't let her decide when she can drink, or how much she can drink, or whether or not she can drive after she drinks. I get to decide that. Adults and kids have different decision-making abilities, but not to you I guess.

People lose their lives doing all kinds of things, hell even crossing the street, nevermind sitting infront of the TV getting fat and never doing anything with their life and having their heart go on revolt.

You DON'T have a point because you cannot put yourself into her shoes or anyone elses. You live in a little world that things need to be "safe" and "secure" where things are served to you in appropriate portions and nothing bad ever happens.

Thats not living.

Can you read likwid?

"People lose their lives doing all kinds of things, hell even crossing the street"

People have to cross the street. No one has to do something as dangerous as sailing solo around the world, much less a teenager. Your arguments just don't make sense.

"nevermind sitting infront of the TV getting fat and never doing anything with their life and having their heart go on revolt."

Oh, I see. So anyone who doesn't sail around the world solo at 16, is a sedentary couch potato with no reason to live.

I don't have to know her personally to care about her and wish her well. Nor do I have to know her personally to know when her parents are needlessly endangering her.

Likwid...

"Better go after basically every european family in the world who serves their kids wine at dinner!"

If they give the kids unsupervised access to the liquor cabinet, OK, I'll do that...

I stated previously that I've let my teenager drink wine a few times. I don't let her decide when she can drink, or how much she can drink, or whether or not she can drive after she drinks. I get to decide that. Adults and kids have different decision-making abilities, but not to you I guess.

Do you lock your liquor cabinet in fear of your children?
If so, you did something wrong.

People lose their lives doing all kinds of things, hell even crossing the street, nevermind sitting infront of the TV getting fat and never doing anything with their life and having their heart go on revolt.

You DON'T have a point because you cannot put yourself into her shoes or anyone elses. You live in a little world that things need to be "safe" and "secure" where things are served to you in appropriate portions and nothing bad ever happens.

Thats not living.

My last post on this thread...

"You live in a little world that things need to be "safe" and "secure" where things are served to you in appropriate portions and nothing bad ever happens. "

Let's see, I did 2 combat tours in Iraq with the USMC as the CO of a weapons company. I've been in for-real combat, and I lost 2 kids under my command. I bet I know ALMOST AS WELL AS YOU, that bad things do happen.

In fact, it's precisely because I know that bad things happen, that I see no reason to go begging for trouble. Children's lives are about the most precious thing I can imagine, I don't see the value in risking it for a bit of notoriety.

I also don't like it when someone insults me right off the bat, then has the hutzpah to tell me I have no right to judge others, just because you know you don't have the logical ability to defend your position.

Don't worry, I called my parents and let them know they should be in jail for child abuse due to letting me and my sister do alot of things that most people would consider "abusive and dumb". :rotf2:

Fishing Woods Hole when I was 15 in a RIB by myself after dark for one.

(Note: I did have a handheld vhf, knew how to use it, and how to call properly, unlike most d**kwagons on the water these days three times the age)

Don't worry, I called my parents and let them know they should be in jail for child abuse due to letting me and my sister do alot of things that most people would consider "abusive and dumb". :rotf2:

Fishing Woods Hole when I was 15 in a RIB by myself after dark for one.

(Note: I did have a handheld vhf, knew how to use it, and how to call properly, unlike most d**kwagons on the water these days three times the age)

Sorry, I can't resist.

You criticize me for not knowing what it takes to sail across the world solo (and I admitted I had no such knowledge). And then you (the self-proclaimed maritime expert) compare THAT RISK to fishing in Woods Hole at night in a RIB? That's comparable to sailing around the southern tip of Africa in the winter? Really?

Sorry, I can't resist.

You criticize me for not knowing what it takes to sail across the world solo (and I admitted I had no such knowledge). And then you (the self-proclaimed maritime expert) compare THAT RISK to fishing in Woods Hole at night in a RIB? That's comparable to sailing around the southern tip of Africa in the winter? Really?

Aren't we discussing parental responsibility? Thats what YOU said we were discussing, not offshore ability.

Alright, I think this event has brought out some interesting debate and may have gotten a little to personal but I think we're all big boys here and can take it. We have 2 camps here with valid points made on both sides.

This is a sailing family we're talking about here that feels they made the right decisions for a kid that obviously is talented and mature beyond her actual age. I support their judgement and in some ways I am envious that they have kids that have drive, intelligence, and the guts to do something with their lives instead of sitting on the sidelines and watching the world go by on the tv or computer.

The other camp seems to be made up of people that don't come from a sailing background or believe that the parents made a mistake and that Abby herself isn't capable or wasn't prepared for this journey. I'm not saying their wrong but it comes from a different angle.

I think we all need to agree to disagree but respect eachothers views without personally attacking someones opinions. There are some interesting perspectives here(on this thread) from people that have real experience on both sides of this issue.

I'm done debating this but man it is a very interesting story and I can't help but become inspired by this girls drive and maturity. I think other kids should take a look at what she and her brother have accomplished and take it as a lesson and dare i say role model of what you can do in life when you put your mind to it. Hard work, dedication, appreciation of our planet, mother nature, and it's inhabitants and how it all is connected are the messages that kids need these days. Too many kids today are lazy, unmotiviated, and unappreciative of what makes this world go round and this girl represents the exact opposite of what our society is turning into.

I'm out but will keep reading the responses. Thanks for the interesting views. Now i think it's time for a :gh:

As someone else put it, I suppose she made it from California around Cape Horn and the Cape of Good Hope on blind f***ing luck?

You could have put the best Volvo ocean race sailors in the boat and the outcome would have been the same.

They said 50-60 ft seas. I watched the documentary on PBS about the last Volvo ocean race and only a handful were able to complete the race with multi-multi-multi million dollar backing. They were in every port doing structural repairs for each leg. The odds are stacked way against you.

I'm in the camp of letting my children find their limits. I did it. I was foolish and lucky more times than I can count. I want to help my children find their limits in a safer method than I did.

Whether it be a youth go kart racing league instead of street racing at 1am, or joining an extreme ski school instead of the nonsense back country chances I took.

Kids will make dangerous choices no matter how hard you try and stop them. It's our job as parents to mitigate the danger. My choice will be through education not prohibition.

Let's see, I did 2 combat tours in Iraq with the USMC as the CO of a weapons company. I've been in for-real combat, and I lost 2 kids under my command.
.

Give it up. Likwid's mother is a hotshot sailor and likwid himself fished WH in the dark! Why would you think he could learn anything about responsibility for other's lives from someone as inexperienced as you?

Apparently along side this girl's attempt (and MIGHT or MIGHT NOT have had ANYTHING to do with HER decision to make the attempt) was the father trying to make a buck off this.

Thats directly from the SoCal sailing scene, please be sure to note the stuff in parentheses. I know, its difficult to not just revert to thinking this is politics, but read it all with a grain of salt please.

But most non-coddled 16yo's would tell a parent to go f*** themselves if they weren't prepared to do something.

But most non-coddled 16yo's would tell a parent to go f*** themselves if they weren't prepared to do something.

In which case a responsible parent would take away their $500,000 sailboat for a month.

I like turtles
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I like clams

Darcy clams
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mmmmmmmmm

rescued

French Fishing Boat Rescues Teen Sailor - Boston News Story - WCVB Boston (http://www.thebostonchannel.com/news/23878751/detail.html)

from the dad's point of view

Her parents have come under criticism from some observers for allowing the high-risk adventure.
Veteran sailors questioned the wisdom of sending a teenager off alone in a small boat, knowing it would be tossed about for 30 or more hours at a time by the giant waves that rake the Southern Hemisphere's oceans this time of year.
Her father defended the voyage.
"I never questioned my decision in letting her go," he told reporters Friday. "In this day and age we get overprotective with our children. If you want to look at statistics, look at how many teenagers die in cars every year. Should we let teenagers drive cars? I think it'd be silly if we didn't."

My .02 is that the parents should have in the least had a safety and support ship trailing her. Not to help her navigate, but for an instance like this. They could have been a slave to her lead, and rescued her in an instant.

I am glad she is safe

So the Australian taxpayers paid to charter the Airbus?
So the fishing boat captain ended up in the water risking his life?
So the fishing boat crew's families will go without their catch shares?
All so a wealthy Calif teenager can play in the Southern Indian Ocean?
Clearly it was worth it from her father's point of view.
Brilliant.

Not even close to the truth. She openly says she doesn't care about records, etc. Plus the record wasn't even going to be broken because she stopped at Cape Town for repairs. She could have ended the quest there if it was all about the recognition and records. She's doing it for your passion of the sea and accomplishing and testing her inner strength. It's got nothing to do with recognition from the sailing community IMO. In regards to the bill....that's why we have rescue services for this. Does the Coast Guard charge for their rescues around here?

From the rescue article:

Sunderland set out from Los Angeles County's Marina del Rey on Jan. 23, trying to become the youngest person to circumnavigate the globe solo and nonstop.
Soon after starting her trip, Sunderland ran into equipment problems and had to stop for repairs. She gave up the goal of setting the record in April, but continued, hoping to complete the journey.
Zac Sunderland, her brother, held the record for a little more than a month last year until Briton Mike Perham completed his own journey. The record changed hands again last month, when 16-year-old Australian Jessica Watson completed her own around-the-world voyage.

I just can't resist.

According to Eben, the father defended his decision to encourage her to go by saying "in this day and age, we overprotect our children".

No one will ever accuse this horse's ass of overprotecting his children. Low and behold, turns out he was trying to make a profit. Never would have seen that coming...risking your kid's life for money. I remember a video that circulated a few years ago, a guy who operated an alligator sanctuary was dangling his toddler over the open mouth of a gator. The dad was crucified for what he did. To me, that's very similar to what this Dad did. I guess likwid would say that sincde the toddler wasn't screaming "stop", that I can't judge the guy for holding a 2 year old over the mouth of a carnivorous dinosaur.

Telling a 16 year old "you can't sail solo across the world" does not amount to suffocating your children.

I can't help but be impressed by her skill (i'm assuming it takes some skill to get as far as she did in that boat). And I wish her well in life. With her parents, she has 2 strikes sgainst her

OMG.. 64 kids with parents that should be lined up and shot
Canadian ship sinks off of Brazil coast; all 64 aboard rescued - Worldnews.com (http://article.wn.com/view/2010/02/19/Canadian_ship_sinks_off_of_Brazil_coast_all_64_abo ard_rescue/)

Have you booked your plane ticket to go yell at her yet Jim? She intends on trying again.

:rotf2:

I hope they give her a more managable boat.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I hope they give her a more managable boat.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1CDZ7Ya8Ni0/RsYPeCpV54I/AAAAAAAAA9g/uX4l1kvkR0c/s400/0Generali.jpg

:hihi:

Lol
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Daddy......HELP!

http://i438.photobucket.com/albums/qq108/Quissett/sinking.jpg

now that she is safe i can say it - just another spoiled rich kid.

She wants to try again. She is 16. What about school, boys, sports?

My youngest daughter is 16 and thinks she is stupid. Do I need to say more?

now that she is safe i can say it - just another spoiled rich kid.

She wants to try again. She is 16. What about school, boys, sports?

My youngest daughter is 16 and thinks she is stupid. Do I need to say more?


Please don't.

Have you booked your plane ticket to go yell at her yet Jim? She intends on trying again.

:rotf2:

likwid, if I thought it would get through to her Dad, I would do it. But as he, and you, have proven, you can't cure "stupid".

By the way, my 15 year-old wants to fly for the Air Force (we're a military family). I agreed to let her take some flying lessons, but I insisted that she fly with the most experienced, highly regarded, expert around. She only flies on perfect days, and even though her instructor says she could fly solo, it will not happen on my watch, not for a few years.

I don't keep my kids in a bubble. Nor do I give them a whiskey bottle and keys to the car. There is a wide range of activities that allow kids to live life to the fullest, yet aren't certifiably crazy. This one's not even on the fence.

If you'd agree to thist, what could your 16 year old ask permission for, which you would ever say "no" to?

Give it up. Likwid's mother is a hotshot sailor and likwid himself fished WH in the dark! Why would you think he could learn anything about responsibility for other's lives from someone as inexperienced as you?

LMAO numbskull, hope I can buy you a beer one day...

her new boat has been chosen. http://yachtpals.com/files/userimages/hydroptere2.jpg

I've sat back watching this thread from the start. I can appreciate both sides of the arguement. I do lean more towards Numby and Jims side though.

My question; Are her parents going to pay for a rescue if needed on another attempt ? Through her families own admission rescue crews were dispatched from 3 continents..... Wonder what the combined cost was ? 10 million ?

likwid, if I thought it would get through to her Dad, I would do it. But as he, and you, have proven, you can't cure "stupid".

By the way, my 15 year-old wants to fly for the Air Force (we're a military family). I agreed to let her take some flying lessons, but I insisted that she fly with the most experienced, highly regarded, expert around. She only flies on perfect days, and even though her instructor says she could fly solo, it will not happen on my watch, not for a few years.

I don't keep my kids in a bubble. Nor do I give them a whiskey bottle and keys to the car. There is a wide range of activities that allow kids to live life to the fullest, yet aren't certifiably crazy. This one's not even on the fence.

If you'd agree to thist, what could your 16 year old ask permission for, which you would ever say "no" to?

no one has said your a bad parent my friend. :)

I've sat back watching this thread from the start. I can appreciate both sides of the arguement. I do lean more towards Numby and Jims side though.

My question; Are her parents going to pay for a rescue if needed on another attempt ? Through her families own admission rescue crews were dispatched from 3 continents..... Wonder what the combined cost was ? 10 million ?

Couple hundred grand covered by insurance.

Back to my original response;

Solo offshore voyage goes against any premise of good seamanship in my book. Nevermind a circumnavigation.... and that goes for the whole lot of them, from Joshua Slocum, to Chichester, and Dodge Morgan too.....

I, too, was doing a lot of offshore stuff at 16, some of which my parents could never have known what the real deal was. (Likwid has found out about my younger wild days of running race boats...) But, no way I would have considered, nor been allowed to do a solo beyond a day trip. Despite the sailing resumes on display here, I haven't seen anyone put down any extended solo experiences. Going offshore is no joke, for anyone of any age. Even if I had a kid that had the complete toolset, the experience, the mental toughness as well as the mental health that it would demand..... I'm not letting him/her go and do it. I love my kids too much. They have the rest of their lives to pursue adventures. They can pursue that one when they're truly mature and can also contribute to the necessary banking it would require.

Please don't.

Ok I'll bite. Kids aren't always as stupid as we think. They recognize spoiled rich kids, especilly those who play X games for real like Abby.

Is her daddy going to pay big $$$ for another boat? Why are we supposed to respect this stupid stunt?

I see postings for and against. I am always a non supporter of this Kennedy kind of behavior.

Couple hundred grand covered by insurance.

Maybe so, but the response just sounds so cavalier.....I mean, just when have you gotten an Airbus fueled up and told them "don't worry, I have insurance...." Insurance companies are exactly known as the fastest paying outfits around. It's not like they have a regulated "settlement" timeframe like the securities industry does for their transactions. And let's not forget the men and or women who went out there or altered course and missions to assist.


(Damn.... I was doing so well at not getting baited back into this thread, too.....)

History does not remember those who sat on the couch.

DDDDDAAAAAaaaaaaaddddd...........y....yyy......... .......

http://i438.photobucket.com/albums/qq108/Quissett/drowning.jpg

What's funny is that if she'd made it and that was the first we had heard...

Everyone would be remarking at what an incredible young woman she was and how proud her parents must be.

-spence

DDDDDAAAAAaaaaaaaddddd...........y....yyy......... .......

http://i438.photobucket.com/albums/qq108/Quissett/drowning.jpg

I'm wondering if we should remember posts like this if you're found wader boots up...

BTW, there's bass at MTK. :rotf2:

History does not remember those who sat on the couch.

How do we remember Eric Tabarly? As France's record setting solo sailor, who ultimately was lost at sea........while sailing solo. Got to know him in 1982 in Newport.
http://www.sailing.org/halloffame/21218.php

How do we remember Eric Tabarly? As France's record setting solo sailor, who ultimately was lost at sea........while sailing solo. Got to know him in 1982 in Newport.
ISAF Hall of Fame : Eric Tabarly (http://www.sailing.org/halloffame/21218.php)

Nobody gives a damn about sailing in the US. You know that.

Most have no clue who Joshua Slocum or Nathanael Herreshoff were.
Nor Dodge Morgan, or Mike Plant.

Terry Hutchinson will never be a household name like John Bertrand once was overseas.

Nor will they ever care.

Nobody gives a damn about sailing in the US. You know that.

Most have no clue who Joshua Slocum or Nathanael Herreshoff were.
Nor Dodge Morgan, or Mike Plant.

Terry Hutchinson will never be a household name like John Bertrand once was overseas.

Nor will they ever care.

For good reason. It is no longer anything special. Technology and safety gear has cheapened it to the point that even a child can do it.

Joshua Slocum did it, and did it the hard way. It has been done, it can be done, doing it again and again whether younger, faster, or with less stops is gilding the lilly.

Nathaniel Hereshoff's accomplishments are in the realm of engineering and art......they have nothing to do 16 yo's setting records.

The truth of this stunt is that it was conceived to make the girl and her parents seem special........both to themselves and to the public. Hence the publicity surrounding it. If it was about the girl herself it would have been done privately.

The fact is that it is very, very likely there is absolutely nothing special about this girl at all. If there was she would not need a stunt to show it. More likely she is probably just another fairly smart, fairly mature 16 yo doing what she has been raised to think she needs to do to gain her parent's approval as she separates from them during adolescence. It is her parent's decision on how they want to raise their children, and surely that is their right and choice, though I would suggest that teaching your kids to think they are special (which is a whole different thing than teaching them to strive to be their best) rarely ends happily. The world will define special as what they do for others, not they do for themselves. Expensive sailboats included.

I'm wondering if we should remember posts like this if you're found wader boots up...


Please do, likwid. Unlike the 16 yo, I'm past the point of my life where dying would have any great consequence, and if it helps you maintain your delusion of being special it would not bother me.

My dad brought up an interesting point. He actullay has sailed the Southern Oceans and most of all had to buy insurance for the boat. He thinks that the insurance company will not pay any claim becuase there was no one on watch when the wave hit. Her mother stated that Abbey was below deck on the sat phone with her when the wave stuck, thus no one on watch. There was a clause in his policy that stated there must be a crewman on wacth at all times, while at sea. Interesting point.

My dad brought up an interesting point. He actullay has sailed the Southern Oceans and most of all had to buy insurance for the boat. He thinks that the insurance company will not pay any claim becuase there was no one on watch when the wave hit. Her mother stated that Abbey was below deck on the sat phone with her when the wave stuck, thus no one on watch. There was a clause in his policy that stated there must be a crewman on wacth at all times, while at sea. Interesting point.

On watch means "in command of the vessel" not "on deck".
All of the Open class boats are driven by autopilot a vast majority of the time and full access to those controls are both down below and on deck.

Thats one for the lawyers to decide.

Also, there was no single wave that did it, the boat was knocked down multiple times.

Surprise, surprise. A teenage girl is talking on the phone while a machine drives a boat bought by her father to make her famous through a storm and something bad happens. What was she talking about, movie rights?

Surprise, surprise. A teenage girl is talking on the phone while a machine drives a boat bought by her father to make her famous through a storm and something bad happens. What was she talking about, movie rights?

Breaking News: Stupid comment made by stupid troll. News at 11. :rotf2:

Gee, I thought we were discussing how ocean sailing makes people special :rollem:. My bad.

what were the motives again...
or is it just capitalizing on the fame of the kids....

Abby Sunderland's dad had TV deal as girl risked life at sea - NYPOST.com (http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/sail_kid_parents_set_cour_for_tv_crGRuKCVBcBCM5v3s 23ULK)


glad she is safe

I think most people would agree that we're at the point where even a small dose of fame has tremendous short-term value. In an open society, where such blatant opportunity exists to capitalize on fame - it's unrealistic to expect that people will not engage in risky or outrageous activities that could net them marketable notoriety.

Everyone read rirockhound's most recent post. It came out over the weekend (at least that's when I first caught it) that her dad was trying to put together a reality TV show for her.

Knowingly endangering the life of your 16 year-old for a little bit of money (and I assume they are not a poor family if their hobby is offshore sailing) and 15 minutes of fame.

It's putrid, vile stuff.

I kept my mouth shut on this in case she was ultimately lost but now that she is safe , I got to say this type of thing done by children , boys or girls, is absolutely irresponsible on the part of the parents. Either the parents value whatever alterior thing was motivating them more than they value their kids lives or they are just totally stupid and ignorant as to just how dangerous an adventure like that could be.
The law should make hanging onto those kids one grueling nightmare for those parents. I wouldn't want to see them taken away but a good grilling to hang onto them and the scare of losing them might be just what the parents need to appreciate having them safe at home with them.

Anyway , stupidity can be found under many titles , in this case its under the mom and dad category!

what were the motives again...
or is it just capitalizing on the fame of the kids....

Abby Sunderland's dad had TV deal as girl risked life at sea - NYPOST.com (http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/sail_kid_parents_set_cour_for_tv_crGRuKCVBcBCM5v3s 23ULK)


glad she is safe


Guess she is not really a spoiled rich kid, just slave labor
:rotf2:

Reminds me of the kid who flew away in the weather Balloon a few months ago.

So what folks are saying it all of this is just stunt like that idiot who said his child floated away in a weather ballon when the whole time the kid was hiding in the attic ?!#@

Every one wants their 15 minutes of fame! Yup, they want the glory, but don't want to put in the sweat!

Kids now a days think they can put a video online and be a discovered sensation overnight?! Yeah, right - don't quit your day job and remember to ask if the customer if they want fries with that, OR if they want to supersize it, LOL.

The worlds in a lot of trouble IMHO. There is no short cut to things. There is no free lunch. Get in line for your enemas now. ;) I hope we survive these bozos the sheeple elected into office.

I'm glad the girl is alive.

LOL, Sandman - you type faster than I do. ;)

this girl will amount to more than any couch potato kid wielding a nintendo joystick. ;)

what were the motives again...
or is it just capitalizing on the fame of the kids....

Abby Sunderland's dad had TV deal as girl risked life at sea - NYPOST.com (http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/sail_kid_parents_set_cour_for_tv_crGRuKCVBcBCM5v3s 23ULK)


glad she is safe

apparently numbskull is a tv producer too!

Sunderland said the individual who approached him about the project, Ted Caloroso, has "a personal vendetta against me." He said Caloroso was going to take the show in an unethical direction, depicting him as a bad father and predicated on Abby dying in the venture.

Abby Sunderland's Father Denies Plans for Reality TV Show (http://www.seattlepi.com/tvguide/421771_tvgif14.html)

Dad is a wacko, I wouldn't trust a single thing good or bad that comes out of his mouth.

this girl will amount to more than any couch potato kid wielding a nintendo joystick. ;)

Maybe she'll become an "engineer" like Nat. :rotf2:

this girl will amount to more than any couch potato kid wielding a nintendo joystick. ;)

And probably far less than a kid who has to overcome real life challenges to achieve their goals. Those kids don't have the benefits of EPRIB's, rich daddys, and TV deals.

But I don't see this as about the girl. She is just 16 and decades away from establishing her quality as a person. It is about her parents, and this fiasco says little for their qualities.