Number of physicians in the US: 700,000.

Accidental deaths caused by physicians per year: 120,000.

Accidental deaths per physician.... 0.171

(U.S. Dept. of Health & Human Services)

Makes you wonder - you have a 17.1% chance of getting killed by your doctor.

I think I would feel better as an Iraqi soldier!

Originally posted by fishweewee
Makes you wonder - you have a 17.1% chance of getting killed by your doctor.

You were kidding, right?

Thanks weewee -- now we'll have to hear from the idiot left wing representative here how Amercian doctors have a hidden conspiracy in place to purposefully harm people in an attempt to drive up more office visits in order to raise more money for themselves so someday they can run for political office here in the US and then be able to attack innocent foreign conuntries as a way to line their personal pockets even further.......

Wait, I mis-spoke.

The 17.1% is not a "probability" per se...but a reflection on the gross annual "kill rate" per year.

Docs are a dangerous bunch. :eek:

not that i love doctors, but i bet they save a whole lot more than .17 lives per year.

I'll bet you American soldiers save more lives than they take every year.

how many lives did american soldiers save last year?

they protect yours every day dammit!

us aggression overseas is not necessary to protect my life and freedom

Haven't seen you in a while. Was nice while you were gone.

Please go hang yourself.

us aggression overseas is not necessary to protect my life and freedom

Just goes to show how naive you are.......US isn't the aggressor here.....and our actions ARE protecting and saving your life you jerk.

JohnR - isn't it time we kick this idiot off this site? Really....

I thought we'd use the "ignore & go away method".

If he wants to talk fishing, some may actually still reply. But if you want to keep threads he has going alive by responding, well ... :wall:

Ignore the posts. If they become seriously disrespectfull - I will pull the plug though.

Point-Counterpoint: The War On Iraq
By Me


George W. Bush may think that a war against Iraq is the solution to our problems, but the reality is, it will only serve to create far more.

This war will not put an end to anti-Americanism; it will fan the flames of hatred even higher. It will not end the threat of weapons of mass destruction; it will make possible their further proliferation. And it will not lay the groundwork for the flourishing of democracy throughout the Mideast; it will harden the resolve of Arab states to drive out all Western (i.e. U.S.) influence.

If you thought Osama bin Laden was bad, just wait until the countless children who become orphaned by U.S. bombs in the coming weeks are all grown up. Do you think they will forget what country dropped the bombs that killed their parents? In 10 or 15 years, we will look back fondly on the days when there were only a few thousand Middle Easterners dedicated to destroying the U.S. and willing to die for the fundamentalist cause. From this war, a million bin Ladens will bloom.

And what exactly is our endgame here? Do we really believe that we can install Gen. Tommy Franks as the ruler of Iraq? Is our arrogance and hubris so great that we actually believe that a U.S. provisional military regime will be welcomed with open arms by the Iraqi people? Democracy cannot possibly thrive under coercion. To take over a country and impose one's own system of government without regard for the people of that country is the very antithesis of democracy. And it is doomed to fail.

A war against Iraq is not only morally wrong, it will be an unmitigated disaster.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
RESPONSE
By You


No it won't.

It just won't. None of that will happen.

You're getting worked up over nothing. Everything is going to be fine. So just relax, okay? You're really overreacting.

"This war will not put an end to anti-Americanism; it will fan the flames of hatred even higher"?

It won't.

"It will harden the resolve of Arab states to drive out all Western (i.e. U.S.) influence"?

Not really.

"A war against Iraq is not only morally wrong, it will be an unmitigated disaster"?

Sorry, no, I disagree.

"To take over a country and impose one's own system of government without regard for the people of that country is the very antithesis of democracy"?

You are completely wrong.

Trust me, it's all going to work out perfect. Nothing bad is going to happen. It's all under control.

Why do you keep saying these things? I can tell when there's trouble looming, and I really don't sense that right now. We're in control of this situation, and we know what we're doing. So stop being so pessimistic.

Look, you've been proven wrong, so stop talking. You've had your say already.

Be quiet, okay? Everything's fine.

You're wrong.

Originally posted by fishweewee
Haven't seen you in a while. Was nice while you were gone.

Please go hang yourself.


now that's funny

FC Alive, I'm just totally confused as to why you persist in returning again and again to agitate the balance of this site so? I don't understand. Is it the thrill of eliciting a response? Wasn't the weather nice enough to go protest outside today? What is it? You've been told time and again it's mostly about the fishing here, but the only real interest you've ever shown is responding to threads about the war, from your own perspective, but obviously knowing full well they would bring on waves resentment from the majority who don't necessarily share your feelings. I think single-handedly, you're practically creating the atmosphere here that you're arguing so vehemently against occurring in the Middle East.
I have this site up my entire workday because it's informative, it helps relieves the stress of an often intense work environment, it's full of great people and up until lately it's also been fun. No one would deny that you didn't aptly make your point, but don't you think it's time to find a new site and go be with your own kind? Whatever they are? And let the students and veterans of the brine go back to sharing their fishing insight, knowledge and humor.

Like I said in an earlier post.

I am new (though totally obsessed with) striped bass fishing so I don't have much to lend to the conversation. When the fishing season starts (and hopefully the war is over) I sure that my posts will change.

I am posting in the non-fishing related forum.

Also, I like arguing with you guys.

By the way, I think that most of the protests have been pretty stupid. I feel that I can accomplish much more in discussions with you all.

Originally posted by FCAlive
how many lives did american soldiers save last year?

By disposing of the Taliban and flushing Al Queda into the mountains, by dispruting their ability to plan and execute the sequel to 9/11, and by discovering documents they left behind in their ratholes that led to the cutting off of a lot of their funding?

I'd say at least another 3,000, conservatively. American lives that is---which are the only ones I care about at the moment.

Those were MY friends and neighbors, MY fellow New Yorkers, MY Fire and Police departments, in those buildings, #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&. Those were MY eyes that watched the horror first-hand, up close and personal. Comprende?

Sell your bull#^&#^&#^&#^& where someone's buying. The store's closed for you here.

Wow mike,

You're pretty tough. I wish I could respond.

FC - now you've pissed me off across multiple levels and have preyed on the "usually" good nature of this site so instead of restricting priveleges, I am now pulling them. If you wish to follow up via e-mail you may do so. But your posting priveleges here are now removed.

Thank you and good day...

John,

Since your warning I have been entirely good natured. In fact it is the people who disagree with me who have been swearing. I even wished you good health. What more do you want from me?

I have certainly showed more interest in maintaining the "family-friendly" nature of the site than many others. You only just mentioned keeping most posts fishing related, what was I supposed to do?

I do not recall this happening in Germany or Japan. When we are done removing the chaff from the wheat, then spending my tax dollars rebuilding that #^&#^&#^&#^& hole, the Iraqi's will have their little Democracy, then they will understand were we are comming from.
Although from a personal level I would rather treat Iraq like a free gas pump.

Originally posted by FCAlive2
John,

Since your warning I have been entirely good natured. In fact it is the people who disagree with me who have been swearing. I even wished you good health. What more do you want from me?

I have certainly showed more interest in maintaining the "family-friendly" nature of the site than many others. You only just mentioned keeping most posts fishing related, what was I supposed to do?

I've ignored you untill now FCAliveagain, I thought John removed your posting privledges:smash: :smash:

Chew on this for a bit. Maybe you'll get some kind of clue. Ya see, I have children, and even if I didn't have children I would want the the world to be a better place, so if that has to be by remmoving the threats of mass destruction which S.H. would surely use, then so be it. It's time we as Americans step up to the plate and we need the entire country behind us.


--------------------------------
America WAKE UP!

That's what we think we heard on the 11th of September 2001 and maybe it
was, but I think it should have been "Get Out of Bed!" In fact, I think
the alarm clock has been buzzing since 1979 and we have continued to hit
the snooze button and roll over for a few more minutes of peaceful sleep
since then.

It was a cool fall day in November 1979 in a country going through a
religious and political upheaval when a group of Iranian students attacked
and seized the American Embassy in Tehran. This seizure was an outright
attack on American soil; it was an attack that held the world's most powerful country
hostage and paralyzed a Presidency. The attack on this sovereign US embassy set
the stage for the events to follow for the next 23 years.

America was still reeling from the aftermath of the Viet Nam experience and
had a serious threat from the Soviet Union when then, President Carter, had
to do something. He chose to conduct a clandestine raid in the desert. The
ill-fated mission ended in ruin, but stood as a symbol of America's inability to deal with terrorism.

America's military had been decimated and downsized / right sized since the
end of the Viet Nam war. A poorly trained, poorly equipped and poorly organized military was called on to execute a complex mission that was doomed from the start.

Shortly after the Tehran experience, Americans began to be kidnapped and
killed throughout the Middle East. America could do little to protect her
citizens living and working abroad. The attacks against US soil continued.
In April of 1983 a large vehicle packed with high explosives was driven into the US Embassy compound in Beirut. When it explodes, it kills 63 people.

The alarm went off again and America hit the Snooze Button once more. Then
just six short months later a large truck heavily laden down with over 2500
pounds of TNT smashed through the main gate of the US Marine Corps headquarters in Beirut. 241 US servicemen are killed. America mourns her dead and hit the Snooze Button once more. Two months later in December 1983, another truck loaded with explosives is driven into the US Embassy in
Kuwait, and America continues her slumber. The following year, in September
1984, another van was driven into the gates of the US Embassy in Beirut and America slept.

Soon the terrorism spreads to Europe. In April 1985 a bomb explodes in a
restaurant frequented by US soldiers in Madrid. Then in August a Volkswagen loaded
with explosives is driven into the main gate of the US Air Force Base at
Rhein-Main, 22 are killed and the Snooze Alarm is buzzing louder and louder
as US soil is continually attacked.

Fifty-nine days later a cruise ship, the Achille Lauro is hijacked and we
watched as an American in a wheelchair is singled out of the passenger list and executed.

The terrorists then shift their tactics to bombing civilian airliners when they bomb TWA Flight 840 in April of 1986 that killed 4 and the most tragic bombing, Pan Am Flight 103 over Lockerbie, Scotland in 1988,killing 259.

America wants to treat these terrorist acts as crimes; in fact we are still trying to bring these people to trial. These are acts of war...the Wake Up alarm is louder and louder.

The terrorists decide to bring the fight to America.

In January 1993, two CIA agents are shot and killed as they enter CIA headquarters in Langley, Virginia. The following month, February 1993, a group of terrorists are arrested after a rented van packed with explosives is driven into the underground parking garage of the World Trade Center in
New York City. Six people are killed and over 1000 are injured.

Still this is a crime and not an act of war?

The Snooze alarm is depressed again.

Then in November 1995 a car bomb explodes at a US military complex in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia killing seven service men and women. A few months later in June
of 1996, another truck bomb explodes only 35 yards from the US military compound in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia. It destroys the Khobar Towers, a US Air Force barracks, killing 19 and injuring over 500.

The terrorists are getting braver and smarter as they see that America does
not respond decisively. They move to coordinate their attacks in a
simultaneous attack on two US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania. These
attacks were planned with precision, they kill 224.

America responds with cruise missile attacks and goes back to sleep.

The USS Cole was docked in the port of Aden, Yemen for refueling on 12 October 2000, when a small craft pulled along side the ship and exploded killing 17 US Navy Sailors.

Attacking a US War Ship is an act of war, but we sent the FBI to
investigate the crime and went back to sleep.

And of course you know the events of 11 September 2001. Most Americans think this was the first attack against US soil or in America. How wrong they are. America has been under a constant attack since 1979 and we chose to hit the snooze alarm and roll over and go back to sleep.
In the news lately we have seen lots of finger pointing from every high official in government over what they knew and what they didn't know. But, if you've read the papers and paid a little attention, I think you can see exactly what they knew. You don't have to be in the FBI or CIA or on the National Security Council to see the pattern that has been developing since 1979.

The President is right on when he says we are engaged in a war. I think we have been in a war for the past 23 years and it will continue until we as a people decide enough is enough.

America has to "Get out of Bed" and act decisively now. America has changed forever. We have to be ready to pay the price and make the sacrifice to ensure our way of life continues. We cannot afford to hit the Snooze Button again and roll over and go back to sleep.

We have to make the terrorists know that, in the words of Admiral Yamamoto
after the attack on Pearl Harbor "that all they have done is to awaken a
sleeping giant."

Author "Unknown"


--------------------------

I have to get back to my children now.
Have a little respect for John and don't post anymore.

see Ya Terrorist Dead Or Alive0