I know I might take a ribbing for this,and maybe some of you may never talk to me again, but I think I am going to buy a Penn Torque.

I have an 7 year old 560 that has never failed me and has alot of sentimental value. This thing has taken an absolute beating the last seven years and this morning a fall on the rocks busted the bail (yes,I fish a bail) and the handle got completely severed from the reel housing/main gear it screws into. I am going to fix it and pass this down to my little bro who just "discovered" surfcasting this year. I could fix it and fish it but want something with a smoother drag,more line capacity...this is a major issue with the 560 when fishing 25 or 30lb hybrid line as Ive been down to the "gold" many times after making a long cast and having a large fish take it at the top of the cast. Having something sealed cant hurt either and will reduce maintenance time, which isnt a big deal but will save me time. I completely broke down the 560 15 times this year at 20 min. a whack. I know some of you will point me too a VS or ZB but I like Penn and have had very good luck fishing the 560 in places that VSs and ZBs are commonly seen. Also I hear this model is made in the USA again which makes me more comfortable buying one....I hate buying sh*t thats made in china. Although I think my TICA 10'er is....which is argument for another time.

Before I do I was wondering if anyone has fished one and what size would be comparable to the 560. I know this Penn was originally designed as a boat jigging reel but redesigned for the surf. Is there separate models for surf and one for jigging? Also, who sells this? I get most of my line,reels and rods from Mike/M+Ds and like to give him business rather than bass-pro or somewhere online.

Thanks in advance.

-Aaron

Aaron - while it irks the crap out of me with VS & ZB made overseas (mine are older US models) they are solid reels for what you want to do. Proven and usually reliable. You can maybe find some new old stock that was made in the US (VS anyway). They also weigh a bit less than the Tourque.

Now, GO BAILLESS :jump1:- it is so NOT an issue once you get used to it you'll wonder why you didn't sooner.

I'll second M&Ds as a great shop :btu: (was going there long before this site or they became a sponsor here)

I'd talk to Mike and listen to his advice.

Aaron,
In all seriousness, dump the Penn dude.
My Dad was, and still is a Penn Guy. Buy USA. I grew up a Penn guy. My father's reasoning, when (not if) it breaks, you can get parts easily pretty much where ever you are and fix it quickly to be back in the game. Growin up fishin on the back side, the reels didn't take much abuse, but my 6500's made in the USA, were always breakin down on me. Got fed up with it and went to Shimano baitrunners (sealed drag, never used baot runner feature, they were just bullet . My Dad would ask what I was gonna do when it broke down like the Penns always were and I said "Dad, it's not a problem, cause they don't break down". Never did.
I use to bash the hell out of Van Staal. I always thought that anyone that would pay $700+ for a reel was an A-hole. Got in a drunken beligerant rant at the first Striper Cup years ago at their booth about how much of a waste of money it was, especially to someone standing on sand.. Then I really started wetsuiting and fishing rocks. the Shimanos just weren't cuttin it. Wife bought me a VS 200 for our wedding 3 years ago. I had to apologize to Craig at VS for my previous tantrum.
The thing has been bullet proof for 3 years now. It looks like it got dragged down the street behind my truck. I doubt there is anyone out there that is harder on their equipement and takes less care of their equipement than I do. I don't even rinse it off. For the life of me, I don't know how I used to fish without it, especially wading out through boulder fields and standing on bars gettin bashed by waves trying to keep my reel up out of the water.
The price of a VS is a big nut to swallow, yes, but the justification of "I could buy 10 Penn's for the cost of a VS and just throw them out when they crap out and I'd still be ahead of the game" just doesn't float, especially on those nites when you walk over a mile to fish, are into a school of supa cows, and that Penn craps out. Trust me, I used to use that justification.
Even though you aren't swimming, and givin the area you are fishin, maybe even the new VS that just came out that isn't completely sealed is an option.
Penns are still just like the reels our Dad's fished with. Antiquated.
Go with a proven winner.
Plus VS has the SWEEEEEETEST sounding drag in the world.

My wife didn't buy me nothing when we got married! What's with THAT?

My wife didn't buy me nothing when we got married! What's with THAT?

It was the least she could do after I put my new truck on her finger.
I think she owes me a few more for the past 3 years of misery...........

I own both Van Staal and Zeebaas both reels are worth the price IMO

The drag on the ZB is unbelievable and so smooth

That new entry level reel that VS has coming out in December is a great reel
and I will be buying one for kayak fishing

The one thing that the Torque has going for it--having seen photos of the guts of the reel--is that it appears to be a very simple design, and about as idiot-proof a reel as there is for servicing yourself.

If you decide to self-service a VS, there's a ticking time bomb that can lock up your reel if you're not careful---making absolutely sure that the grommet on the main gear is seated inside the traverse block. If this slips out as you're reassembling the side plate, the reel totally locks up.

Looking at the schematics of a ZB, Stella or even a Saltiga---it's scary. Especially the Stella.

The Torque isn't any more complicated inside than a Slammer, and almost as simple as an old 700 series Spinfisher. Plus, you can get to the internals without having to partially remove the rotor and main shaft--something that you can't do with any Japanese reel except the Shimano Saragossa.

As far as "surf vs boat" reels--IMO it's nonsense for 95% of fishermen. But the Torque will be out in manual-pickup versions eventually.

I know you said you want feedback on the Penn reel but I don't think you will get much because everyone is too afraid of it.

If you really like fishing a bail I thik you should give serious consideration to the Saltiga 4500z if you're willing to pay what a Tourque costs.

I would buy whatever you are comfortable with,it will make you happy.

I know you said you want feedback on the Penn reel but I don't think you will get much because everyone is too afraid of it.

If you really like fishing a bail I thik you should give serious consideration to the Saltiga 4500z if you're willing to pay what a Tourque costs.

HOLY SH!T!
I didn't realize they were over 500 beans!!!! For a PENN???!!!!
An UNPROVEN reel????!!!!!!

Yeah, like Luds says, if you gonna shell out those many clams, the Staltigas are a pretty dam fine reel too. I forgot about them as an alternative. 2 of my fishin partners have/ like them though........

I'd wait to hear some feedback from people you trust on the Penn before dropping that kind of money. The nice thing about the VS and ZB's is that the companies have worked the bugs out, for the most part. I was always A Shimano and Okuma guy once I got sick of having Penns fixed or replaced. I finally I bit the bullet and got a ZB this year because I found a good deal on a USA made model. No regrets at all. I'm actually wondering why I didn't do it sooner.



That new entry level reel that VS has coming out in December is a great reel
and I will be buying one for kayak fishing

Bob, have you seen the new $400 VS in person? I've only seen it in the OTW article, but am intrigued for the yak and the boat.

Seems like this could be the start of a debate, which is cool because before I shell out $600-1100 I want too be sure I made the right choice.

Mike: I understand your argument and understand VS is a top quality reel and most of Penns older products cant compare to a VS in terms of longevity and quality. Is this reel different? Has Penn stepped up to the plate and finally made something that take a pounding year after year? I found this posting on SOL after doing a google search for reviews on the Penn Torque.

Just finished field testing the final upgraded Production version of the Penn Torque - SurfTalk (http://www.stripersonline.com/surftalk/showthread.php?t=751280&highlight=penn+torque+spinning+test)

It was a good post and made some good points. I understand the author probably works/affiliated with Penn so I dont believe everything I read when it comes to articles like this. I trust opinions from folks that are here on SB, who used the products and have tested them in real life under high stress,long duration fishing situations.

I guess my reason for sticking with Penn (I haven't totally made up my mind yet) is because I have had a very good experience with the 560 (well the exception being this morning, and the fall I took would have smashed/broken any I reel I think) , although maintenance is key, particularly during very rough NE blows when I take wave after wave on a few of the rocks I fish or I fall into the water, both happen more often than not. I have "thrown" this reel many times when I have to use 2 hands to handle,and not hurt, the larger fish... at that point the reel doesn't matter, then fish does, and the reel ends up in 3 feet of water getting smashed against the rocks. I understand I dont wet-suit or skish (I know and have seen what swims in the ocean I fish!!!) but my reel does take a beating and would def. by-pass an entry level reel. I need something completely sealed.

I should ask Mike at MDs for his opinion, last year after breaking a $320 Lami he pointed me towards a TICA and I LOVE this rod...very,very powerful and has a great feel to it.

I guess the question stands: Has any one fished a Torque? Or know someone that has?

John R: Could you explain the benefits of going bailess? I mostly fish rigged and live eels and needle-fish plugs.

Thanks Guys. I truly value all your opinions which is why I created this post in the first place.

-Aaron

When you go Bailless you don't need to manually flip a bail when using braid. Also don't need to worry about the bail flipping prematurely when casting and watching your $35 Sebile rocketing to the vineyard

Bob, have you seen the new $400 VS in person? I've only seen it in the OTW article, but am intrigued for the yak and the boat.

Yes I held it and played with it for some time at Striperfest

Yes I held it and played with it for some time at Striperfest

I did too....and then someone started banging on the port-a-john door..................game over.

I too used the Slammers as my go to reel for years and dunked them. I broke them down to get them dried up, tried all different lubes and had the white metal main gear replace a few times. When I was deep wading I always tried to keep it out of the water. Liked a bail.

I figured that since I enjoy surfcasting so much- I would get a better tool- one that I did not have to worry about being under the water. So I live 5 miles from the ZB location- when they were assembling the reels there . Called up and went over there -met Wendy and Tim ( Robs son) super nice to me- and ended up getting a 2.5 with a bail.

Love the reel and especially the drag. Whole other world than the Slammer.

Manual bails do not flip closed on casts anymore. That is ancient history. I do not know why that still gets brought up. Never will happen on a ZB, a bailed VS or a Saltiga. What could happen is that you destroy the bail on a rock . Yes that could happen. But I like a bail-

If you like a bail- stick with the bail. Rob

i saw a Penn Torque the other day and couldn't believe the price. Wow! for that amount of money I would definitely get either a VS or saltiga....

i saw a Penn Torque the other day and couldn't believe the price. Wow! for that amount of money I would definitely get either a VS or saltiga....

$533.99 at this site

Penn Fishing penn trqs7-b torque spinning 7 blac - www.MidwestHuntersOutlet.com (http://www.midwesthuntersoutlet.com/item.aspx?PID=183159&w=PQ%2BJDyOLrQE%3D)

I found this posting on SOL after doing a google search for reviews on the Penn Torque.

Just finished field testing the final upgraded Production version of the Penn Torque - SurfTalk (http://www.stripersonline.com/surftalk/showthread.php?t=751280&highlight=penn+torque+spinning+test)

It was a good post and made some good points. I understand the author probably works/affiliated with Penn so I dont believe everything I read when it comes to articles like this. I trust opinions from folks that are here on SB, who used the products and have tested them in real life under high stress,long duration fishing situations.




Awesome John is far from the most objective person when it comes to this reel. He considers it to be "his baby", even though he has no formal ties to Penn..

I would wait until either Alan Hawk or Alan Tani posts a review of it before accepting any third party's judgment. Or wait for first hand user feedback.

But--speaking as objectively as I can without ever having fished one--it's a pretty simple reel. One thing that many people have commented on so far is that there's no secondary anti-reverse if the IAR bearing slips or fails outright, as there is in a Stella SW or Saltiga (and even the $200 or so Daiwa Saltist has one). People have commented that the bearing looks on the small side. I think the switch on the bottom of the rotor that allows for a choice of manual or automatic bail closing is a dumb idea and likely to have sand issues. Other than that, there isn't much inside the reel that looks like it can go wrong. From the pictures that I've seen, the main gear and the pinion gear look like they're machined stainless steel, and the crosswind gear looks like it's some kind of bronze alloy. Some of the $700+ reels mentioned here have white metal crosswind gears, although failures haven't been reported. And it should be an easy reel to fix yourself if the need arises. Penn parts are generally available.

I did too....and then someone started banging on the port-a-john door..................game over.

lol:biglaugh:

Ok, if I where to buy a VS or ZB what model would best suite me? I like to keep it around the same size as a 560 in terms of weight,etc. Mike: you mentioned you had a VS 200? What about a ZB?..25?

either one of those would work, I would get the ZB because it's new technology and I love mine

If you're going to hang it off a 10' rod, and fish mono or hybrid line, I'd go with the VS 200.

The only ZB that I've ever made a few casts with is John R's fancy deluxe first generation 22. :biglaugh:

I have an older VS 200 and 250, with the unsealed Penn style drag on both. Both US, made in Stratford. They've pretty much sat unused over the last 4 years. But neither ever gave me a lick of trouble over the 8 years that I used them. It's just that the Saltiga serves my present needs better.

i saw a Penn Torque the other day and couldn't believe the price. Wow! for that amount of money I would definitely get either a VS or saltiga....

Bart, how do you know the Penn reel is not just as good a reel as the VS or Saltiga?

I'd be interested in how the Torque holds up. I have always been a big fan of Penn reels....The 4500,5500,6500ss have been my work horses for years...Maybe not the smoothest thing out there, but they last and they are super easy to take care of. That being said I did switch over to a VS on my big surf rod....and love it.

My VS's have cushioned my falls at the ditch, served as wading staffs in the surf, had the dog snot beat out of them for years. I don't service them, just a quick splash with the hose. Not as shiny as they used to be, but still feel out of the box smooth. I use a few slammers on the boat, drags are good , they could never deal with the shore abuse the VS's get however.
You will never miss the bail, takes about 3 cast for your index finger to automatically know the line pickup program.

I have had the torque in my hands and it just didn't feel right.

I will be at the canal this weekend. PM me if you would like to kick the tires on the 250 or 275.

Bart, how do you know the Penn reel is not just as good a reel as the VS or Saltiga?

He probably doesn't but I'd bet he doesn't want to spend $600 to try it out. :)

Ok, if I where to buy a VS or ZB what model would best suite me? I like to keep it around the same size as a 560 in terms of weight,etc. Mike: you mentioned you had a VS 200? What about a ZB?..25?

I switched from a 704z that ive used since i was like 12 that was my dad's to a vs200 two years ago and have never looked back. Its been the meat in a couple johnny/ditchrock sandwiches and has never broken or performance been hampered in any way. never had a break off due to the bailless. Im actually furious with myself that i hadnt switched sooner to a bailless system and its stupid easy to use. Having said that my ONLY gripe with the thing is casting distance due to the 200's smaller spool. i wish i got a 250 :smash:

My VS's have cushioned my falls at the ditch, served as wading staffs in the surf, had the dog snot beat out of them for years. I don't service them, just a quick splash with the hose. Not as shiny as they used to be, but still feel out of the box smooth. I use a few slammers on the boat, drags are good , they could never deal with the shore abuse the VS's get however.
You will never miss the bail, takes about 3 cast for your index finger to automatically know the line pickup program.

I have had the torque in my hands and it just didn't feel right.

I will be at the canal this weekend. PM me if you would like to kick the tires on the 250 or 275.


Might take you up in that offer...have this weekend off. Ill let you know.

I am taking a few hours off this afternoon and going "window shopping" for a reel...I know where I can feel/test a VS but where can I look/feel a ZB?

Bad Fish Outfitters, North Falmouth, MA 02556 Tel. 508-563-3474

Powderhorn Outfitters, Hyannis, MA 02601 Tel. 508-775-8975

Red Top Sporting Goods, Inc., Buzzards Bay, MA 02532 Tel. 508-759-3371

Surfland Bait & Tackle, Newbury, MA 01951 Tel. 978-462-4202

This is off the ZeeBaas site I would call first

If you want to try out a Saltiga z4500, I will let you try mine out. I love this reel! Swapped from a Penn to this one, I hesitated buying it but this thing kicks arse. I'm local to you.

Call Surfland 1st....they may be shutdown this weekend for the Funeral and Memorial.

Bart, how do you know the Penn reel is not just as good a reel as the VS or Saltiga?

I don't know how it compares, but the VS and saltiga are proven warriors. If it was a 704 or 706 i'd say jump all over it. I have a few of them and love them. But from what ppl have been saying about Penn for the last five years or so I wouldn't buy one. Although I have yet to put a lot of hrs into my VS, I know it was a worthwhile investment just on reputation alone...

It's funny how so many people wanted Penn to build a dunkable reel (that doesn't have to be packed and re-packed w/grease) and when they finally do everyone bitches about the price which is still less than a VS or ZB... If shimano ever decides to get with the dunk-program they'll be even more $$ than a stella or ZB. I bet the owners or the new torque will be satisfied with their purchase..Only time will tell.. and FWIW..I've been a Shimano guy all my life :buds:

It's funny how so many people wanted Penn to build a dunkable reel (that doesn't have to be packed and re-packed w/grease) and when they finally do everyone bitches about the price which is still less than a VS or ZB... If shimano ever decides to get with the dunk-program they'll be even more $$ than a stella or ZB. I bet the owners or the new torque will be satisfied with their purchase..Only time will tell.. and FWIW..I've been a Shimano guy all my life :buds:

Everyone wanted Penn to make a sealed 704z or a 706z, I'm pretty sure no one wanted the Torque

Everyone wanted Penn to make a sealed 704z or a 706z, I'm pretty sure no one wanted the Torque

and I'd like a new one for free to test... but there is about the same probability in the 2 happening :)

Just as a FYI--Red Top has no ZB reels in stock currently.

and I'd like a new one for free to test... but there is about the same probability in the 2 happening :)

and I think that's the problem, no one has tested the reel to give a full review

$700 reel with a fit & finish sub par to a $299 reel.

No thanks.

After going it over in my mind several thousand times and doing as much research I as I possibly and reading some of the replys here, I have decided to just buy the Torque, fish it and see for myself. Its a new model so not many folks have bought and fished in heavy and alot of what I hear are assumptions. Im sure there will be some opinionated fisherman next year after being on the market a little longer. If its a piece of sh*t then oh well I buy a VS and learn my lesson the hard way, if its a gem all the better. Too bad its this late in the season but probably will get fished a few times this February fishing cod from long beach here in Plymouth. Time will tell.

After going it over in my mind several thousand times and doing as much research I as I possibly and reading some of the replys here, I have decided to just buy the Torque, fish it and see for myself. Its a new model so not many folks have bought and fished in heavy and alot of what I hear are assumptions. Im sure there will be some opinionated fisherman next year after being on the market a little longer. If its a piece of sh*t then oh well I buy a VS and learn my lesson the hard way, if its a gem all the better. Too bad its this late in the season but probably will get fished a few times this February fishing cod from long beach here in Plymouth. Time will tell.

So what's the word so far?
Did you pull the trigger?
What line did you end up puttin on it?
I always had major issues with braid and Penns. Any so far?
Even more important, any fish on it yet?

Eager to see the reults of this test as it progresses. keep us informed Aaron. You are the guinea pig for us all here with this reel.

HOLY SH!T!
I didn't realize they were over 500 beans!!!! For a PENN???!!!!
An UNPROVEN reel????!!!!!!

Not that many beans in the can.......

and I think that's the problem, no one has tested the reel to give a full review

There's been a few, but for the most part you are right. I work for a company that sells them and we are having a hard time getting the ones we have promised for customers. I can only hope Pure get's their act together. I might pick one up this winter but only if we get some in stock and they are in front of my face everyday :buds:

So what's the word so far?
Did you pull the trigger?
What line did you end up puttin on it?
I always had major issues with braid and Penns. Any so far?
Even more important, any fish on it yet?

Eager to see the reults of this test as it progresses. keep us informed Aaron. You are the guinea pig for us all here with this reel.

Hi Mike,

Havent pulled the trigger on the reel yet. Not because I didnt want too....My fishing season is done for the most part. I wore myself out this year but it was my best year for fish over 40lbs so the time/energy and lack of sleep made it a very worth while fall season for me. Also I have been managing a few controlled burns on Marthas Vineyard in the State Forest which is pretty time consuming to say the least. My wife made it a point that I save some vaca. time for our annual trip to GA to visit the inlaws around Christmas or else. I will be buying the reel soon and during my trip to GA might try my luck at in-laws vaca.house on Lake Hartwell,GA for some land-lock stripers and of course my surf caught cod trips here in Plymouth in late Jan/early Feb. if the weather warm enough to do so. Once I get the reel and fish it for awhile I will be sure to post a review of the findings -likes/dislikes. Might be awhile though.

I dont use braid as I have had bad luck with wind knots and break offs in the rocks. I use Yo-Zuri Hybrid 25lb with 50lb 4' leader with 6/0 Mustad and have had excellent luck with this set-up the last 5 years. You fish braid? If so what kind?

You done for the year or you still fishing?

Take care bro.

-Aaron