Trawling giant shuts down, blames bureaucrats

Trawling giant shuts down, blames bureaucrats | SouthCoastToday.com (http://www.southcoasttoday.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20110406/NEWS/104060330&cid=sitesearch)

Interesting.

Not sure how good it is. Or bad for the matter.

I have an internal battle between what's good for fisheries and business. As they two rarely seem to find an equitable middle ground. The politicians? They sway with the breeze that blows harder.

What if bycatch could be kept and charged at a higher cost against allocations? Or some other way that bycatch could go against the quotas without being discard?? Will they figure it out before no fish are commercially exploitable?

What if bycatch could be kept and charged at a higher cost against allocations? Or some other way that bycatch could go against the quotas without being discard?? Will they figure it out before no fish are commercially exploitable?

JR: you are relying on "common sense"??? Any fish in the net is caught, i.e. there is only catch not bycatch?

more baitfish for the stripers will keep them in local waters longer which should be good for in shore fisherman

more baitfish for the stripers will keep them in local waters longer which should be good for in shore fisherman

Absolutely agree!!!!

And if the herring species don't get mixed up pair-trawled there may be more herring that return to spawn.

News Release 11142002 (http://www.norpel.com/news/11142002.htm)


In 10 years of operation they took a significant amt of baitfish and "other fish" with their trawling nets... I have never been a fan of trawling operations... stationary nets are fine but dragging the ocean bottom is very destructive IMHO

Sad day when some people can applaud the loss of 140 jobs, just because it make thing a little better for their hobby. :(

Sad day when some people can applaud the loss of 140 jobs, just because it make thing a little better for their hobby. :(


Very saddened by the loss of jobs.

Isn't reduction in herring pair trawls better for the fish? Regardless of the hobby?

Disappointed with fisheries management in general, and politicians in particular.

I guarantee that they open right back up in month, coincidentally when the season begins.

I bet this is purely a political move.

Yes no one is pleased to see the loss of 140 local jobs but the BIG PICTURE is more important...

Trawling is akin to strip mining of the ocean.. take a read thru some of these links and see what the true cost of trawling has on the marine ecosystem.

The fishery will be much improved for all types of fishing with the elimination of trawling... I think it was a mistake to allow any type of trawling in the FIRST place

---------------------------------------------------

Devastation of Trawling Visible from Space | LiveScience (http://www.livescience.com/4827-devastation-trawling-visible-space.html)

Impacts of Bottom Trawling — Alaska Marine Conservation Council (http://www.akmarine.org/our-work/conserve-fisheries-marine-life/impacts-of-bottom-trawling)
JSTOR: An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie (http://www.jstor.org/pss/3069270)

Effects of trawling on seafloor habitat and associated invertebrate taxa in the Gulf of Alaska (http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=1886068)
EarthTrends: Feature - The Impact of Global Trawling: Mapping our Footprint on the Seafloor (http://earthtrends.wri.org/features/view_feature.php?theme=1&fid=10)

This is a better link that details pelagic pair trawling which is what the New Bedford operation does for mackeral...

Bottom trawling - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bottom_trawling)

Yes no one is pleased to see the loss of 140 local jobs but the BIG PICTURE is more important...

Trawling is akin to strip mining of the ocean.. take a read thru some of these links and see what the true cost of trawling has on the marine ecosystem.

The fishery will be much improved for all types of fishing with the elimination of trawling... I think it was a mistake to allow any type of trawling in the FIRST place

---------------------------------------------------

Devastation of Trawling Visible from Space | LiveScience (http://www.livescience.com/4827-devastation-trawling-visible-space.html)

Impacts of Bottom Trawling — Alaska Marine Conservation Council (http://www.akmarine.org/our-work/conserve-fisheries-marine-life/impacts-of-bottom-trawling)
JSTOR: An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie (http://www.jstor.org/pss/3069270)

Effects of trawling on seafloor habitat and associated invertebrate taxa in the Gulf of Alaska (http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=1886068)
EarthTrends: Feature - The Impact of Global Trawling: Mapping our Footprint on the Seafloor (http://earthtrends.wri.org/features/view_feature.php?theme=1&fid=10)

Even if I believed all that drivel, these boats weren't bottom trawling, they were midwater trawling, like the squid boats.

URI has done some whey interesting studies on the impact of bottom trawling on the marine bottom, but you won't hear about it on the tree-hugger websites because the news isn't sensational.

The "big picture" is only important when its not your job they are eliminating.

unfortunately almost all information on these types of subjects come frpm polarized sources. All bad or all good depending on the point they want to make. In this the "Information Age" its a shame so much information is sifted to show only one side of the story. Never has it been more true to "believe nothing of what you hear and only half of what you see".

Very saddened by the loss of jobs.

Isn't reduction in herring pair trawls better for the fish? Regardless of the hobby?

Disappointed with fisheries management in general, and politicians in particular.

Maybe, the problem with the herring trawlers was twofold, or maybe threefold.
1) They caught too many fish (really the managers fault, but they got blamed)
2) They were also catching blueback herring, not only the Atlantic herring they were allowed to catch. And
3) They were also catching Juvenal Haddock, and there is no room to give them more of a haddock allocation. That is (was) a great example of a "choke species" that closes a fishery down well before it can catch it alloted quota.

I wouldn't be surprised if they did open back up again, on a more limited basis once the season opens. They might fish for a couple of week until they fill their haddock quota and then ship the boats out.

Sad day when some people can applaud the loss of 140 jobs, just because it make thing a little better for their hobby. :(


Really? How sad is it that commercial interests have decimated near shore species? How sad is it that I can only IMAGINE what fishing was like 40-50 years ago? How sad is it my IT job went over to India? Still crying there not making fabrics on your local river?
economies change. It's life. no one is guaranteed a job just because their heritage was in the trade.

Really? How sad is it that commercial interests have decimated near shore species? How sad is it that I can only IMAGINE what fishing was like 40-50 years ago? How sad is it my IT job went over to India? Still crying there not making fabrics on your local river?
economies change. It's life. no one is guaranteed a job just because their heritage was in the trade.

First of all these guys weren't fishing anywhere "near Shore." they were fishing in federal waters and most the time faaaar out in federal waters.

Secondly, near shore species decimated? I know what it was like 40 years ago, and for almost all "inshore species" fishing has NEVER been better. Tautog is one exception, but that fishery is 90% RECREATIONAL Same goes for stripers, better now than 40 years ago and even if you disagree the fishery is 80% RECREATIONAL If you want to blame someone for poor fishing on "inshore species" you had better take a look in the mirror.

If we were talking 20 years ago I might have agreed you, at least with respect to some species, but today, with the rebuilt populations of almost every "inshore species" no way.

Yep... Strip mining is way too harsh... Draggers work established fishing grounds, they just don't go anywhere they please. Unknown grounds = hangups, which can result in loss of expensive gear and at worst a vessel capsizing. Most of these grounds have been fished heavily for over fifty years- not like they're doing additional damage (although one can argue that the damage was reprehensible in the first place).

And some studies have shown that fish activity is increased in areas that are dragged... much akin to rototilling a field to seed, the actions of the trawlers stir up benthic invertebrates, and many fish move into the area to feed.

I'm not saying it's zero-impact: Far from it, that's for sure. But it's far from the 'strip mining' and 'destroying coral reefs' that Kurlansky and much of the media would have you believe.

But like MM said, these are pelagic trawlers, so it's apples to oranges... On NORPEL, sad to see the loss of so many jobs to hard working people, but glad to see the baitfish get a break.

Pair trawling - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pair_trawling)


The Brits have outlawed paired trawling for bass in specific areas for good reasons as detailled in this Wiki link..


One thing that most of us have learned in our lives is that change is gonna happen no matter what.

Jobs will be lost.... jobs will be created ...

Some of these fisherman can choose to help re-build New Bedford, others may chose to become get involved in other jobs in the growing sportfishing area esp if the quality of coastal fishing improves, other may follow the boats to their next home port..

Pair trawling - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pair_trawling)


The Brits have outlawed paired trawling for bass in specific areas for good reasons as detailled in this Wiki link..


One thing that most of us have learned in our lives is that change is gonna happen no matter what.

Jobs will be lost.... jobs will be created ...

Some of these fisherman can choose to help re-build New Bedford, others may chose to become get involved in other jobs in the growing sportfishing area esp if the quality of coastal fishing improves, other may follow the boats to their next home port..

Do you even read what you post? That article confirmed that pair trawling can take place mid-water, as we have been telling you these boats did. The Brits outlawed them because of marine mammal concerns, which has not been an issue in the herring fishery.

Easy to say "jobs will be lost...jobs will be created" when its not your job. Plus there doesn't seem to be much "creation" going on anywhere lately.

As I said in another forum .I work in the seafood business. Seeing companies shut down because of bereaucrats drives me up a wall. How long before my company is next.

As a recreational/wannabe commercial fisherman it's nothing but good news.

So I'm conflicted.

said this elsewhere, but I dont see them staying closed, nor do I cry for a company that relies heavily on illegal immigrants as its employee pool.

First of all these guys weren't fishing anywhere "near Shore." they were fishing in federal waters and most the time faaaar out in federal waters.

Secondly, near shore species decimated? I know what it was like 40 years ago, and for almost all "inshore species" fishing has NEVER been better. Tautog is one exception, but that fishery is 90% RECREATIONAL Same goes for stripers, better now than 40 years ago and even if you disagree the fishery is 80% RECREATIONAL If you want to blame someone for poor fishing on "inshore species" you had better take a look in the mirror.

If we were talking 20 years ago I might have agreed you, at least with respect to some species, but today, with the rebuilt populations of almost every "inshore species" no way.


I don't know enough about this issue to comment, but this statement about the inshore fishery being better than 40 years ago is really in stark contrast to what we hear about on this and other sites day and day out. I know fisherman like to tell stories, but are they all just full of it? I know everybody has different experiences and your experience back then could be drastically different, but us younger fisherman just have this impression that it was just a LOT better back then. I'm not saying you're lying, it would just be nice to get the truth on this issue at some point! this is kind of a hijack though, so I apologize.

Yep... Strip mining is way too harsh... Draggers work established fishing grounds, they just don't go anywhere they please. Unknown grounds = hangups, which can result in loss of expensive gear and at worst a vessel capsizing. Most of these grounds have been fished heavily for over fifty years- not like they're doing additional damage (although one can argue that the damage was reprehensible in the first place).

And some studies have shown that fish activity is increased in areas that are dragged... much akin to rototilling a field to seed, the actions of the trawlers stir up benthic invertebrates, and many fish move into the area to feed.

I'm not saying it's zero-impact: Far from it, that's for sure. But it's far from the 'strip mining' and 'destroying coral reefs' that Kurlansky and much of the media would have you believe.

But like MM said, these are pelagic trawlers, so it's apples to oranges... On NORPEL, sad to see the loss of so many jobs to hard working people, but glad to see the baitfish get a break.

Not sure, but I think "Globally " bottom draggers are like bulldozing the forest to catch the squirrels. Effective but perverse. :confused:

anyone that says fishing is better now than it was 40 yrs. ago, wasn't fishing 40 yrs. ago.
comm. or rec. i don't care. it's worse now and getting more so.

First of all these guys weren't fishing anywhere "near Shore." they were fishing in federal waters and most the time faaaar out in federal waters.

Go down to Scarborough in the early winter. Nebe's got the photos.... they were all around the blackfish grounds a couple of seasons ago.

Kevin:
On mud and sand, probably true about minimal impact, although I wouldn't say 'retilling', sandy surfaces in particular are often resurfaced either by wave or tidal currents, but the effect draggers have is pretty sever on Cobble bottoms...

You guys just don't know what you're talking about when you talk about fishing 40 years ago. I was fishing , both commercially and recreationaly 40 and even 50 years ago and fishing is much better now for most inshore species than it was then. Yes some fish are now and were then cyclical, bluefish and weakfish in particular, they would get scarce for some time and then come back strong. As I said before the only species I can think of offhand where fishing was better back then is tautog and winter flounder. We catch just as many fluke, sea bass, scup, triggers, today as we did back then, but today the fish are TWICE the size of the ones we caught back then.

When did you start fishing Slow Eddie? I started around 1951.

Go down to Scarborough in the early winter. Nebe's got the photos.... they were all around the blackfish grounds a couple of seasons ago.


You sure about hat Bryan? If its true I would be very surprised that DEM wasn't all over then as they probably don't have RI principal effort licenses. Also I doubt they were herring fishing, or pair trawling for that matter that close to shore. Pair trawlers need a lot of room to work setting and retrieving the net.

I'm not saying they weren't there, I'm questioning what they were doing there. I have a picture of the Hanna Bowden leaving the harbor of refuge, but that doesn't mean she was swordfishing in RI. :)

You sure about hat Bryan? If its true I would be very surprised that DEM wasn't all over then as they probably don't have RI principal effort licenses. Also I doubt they were herring fishing, or pair trawling for that matter that close to shore. Pair trawlers need a lot of room to work setting and retrieving the net.

I'm not saying they weren't there, I'm questioning what they were doing there. I have a picture of the Hanna Bowden leaving the harbor of refuge, but that doesn't mean she was swordfishing in RI. :)

Mike I know when I see two boats pair trawling on east to west runs < 1 mile south of Washington ledge. they were there.

I saw paired trawlers working within 3 miles of MA shore several times last fall

Bryan I believe, I doubt if blondterror could tell the difference between two boats pair trawling and two boats just working near each other. Bryan, were they the two boats from Norpel?

I suspect the haddock and cod fishery is many times more important than the midwater herring fishery.

Strip mining anything has short term economic benefit. That does not make it an economically sound decision.

Improving the groundfish stocks very likely has national economic benefit several hundred times greater than anything vacuuming up their young and forage produces.

So I read the article and I have a question.

If they only caught 86 tons of the allotted haddock then how is it that Dave's market (a small chain in RI with great fish) has had it on sales for the last month?

Where is it coming from? It is not flash frozen as I asked the fish monger behind the counter and he said "no, it's fresh caught locally".

Seems like the facts don't add iup.

So I read the article and I have a question.

If they only caught 86 tons of the allotted haddock then how is it that Dave's market (a small chain in RI with great fish) has had it on sales for the last month?

Where is it coming from? It is not flash frozen as I asked the fish monger behind the counter and he said "no, it's fresh caught locally".

Seems like the facts don't add iup.

Almost different fish. The haddock that the herring boats were catching are little fish with zero market value. The haddock you see in Dave's is caught by groundfish boats and they have been doing very well on the haddock. The issue for the herring boats is that they are catching too many of the little buggers, and they are only allowed to catch a little.

Almost different fish. The haddock that the herring boats were catching are little fish with zero market value. The haddock you see in Dave's is caught by groundfish boats and they have been doing very well on the haddock. The issue for the herring boats is that they are catching too many of the little buggers, and they are only allowed to catch a little.

Thanks Mike. Now I understand.

Go down to Scarborough in the early winter. Nebe's got the photos.... they were all around the blackfish grounds a couple of seasons ago.

Kevin:
On mud and sand, probably true about minimal impact, although I wouldn't say 'retilling', sandy surfaces in particular are often resurfaced either by wave or tidal currents, but the effect draggers have is pretty sever on Cobble bottoms...
The mid water trawlers were right off Nauset also last fall catching herring and dumping bass as usual.

Did they shut down the fishery? I read that 2 boats that fish MWT are leaving but all that means is a bigger piece of the quota for the rest of the fleet from other east coast ports.

Hopefully I misread the article and the fishery is closed.

Any trawler activity pretty much defines the term "rape and pillage".

Bryan I believe, I doubt if blondterror could tell the difference between two boats pair trawling and two boats just working near each other. Bryan, were they the two boats from Norpel?

yes.
If memory serves, it was their big navy/yellow paired up.

yes.
If memory serves, it was their big navy/yellow paired up.

I remember the picture it was the two Norpel boats.

So I read the article and I have a question.

If they only caught 86 tons of the allotted haddock then how is it that Dave's market (a small chain in RI with great fish) has had it on sales for the last month?

Where is it coming from? It is not flash frozen as I asked the fish monger behind the counter and he said "no, it's fresh caught locally".

Seems like the facts don't add iup.


Icelandic day boat. Caught in the morning. On icelandic auction the next day. One a plane to boston that night.


Ask me how I know :D

Mike:
I dug up Eben's thread from December, although I think Nebe was wrong on the port, as these are the not Maine boats....

http://www.striped-bass.com/Stripertalk/stripertalk/67821-maine-herring-boats-off-narragansett.html

This picture in particular is no doubt paired-up close to shore.