been out everyday last week, fishing 2 hrs. before sunset till dark. The fish are not here yet. After the early start last year this is depressing! Its suppose to warm up today and the tide looks pretty good so will try again. Ive told you guys before that I live on buzzards bay in an area that has very shallow water to about a half mile of shore. I have noticed on my walking patrols along the shore that the minnows and small shiners that are usually around this time of year have been hard to find. Water temps are starting to get close to 45-50 and it should not be long now.(I keep saying that). Any of the old timers remember late starts like this year? I don't fish the holdover spots, just the bay from shore. I've been fishing here for 12 years and can't remember this tough a start. A little off subject but anybody ever use scup as striper bait? Live lining them? Is it legal?

..as long as the scup are of legal size and you don't have more than your limit. There is no law forbidding the use of scup as bait.

...they're very hearty when live-lined.. . .. and yes, they catch fish

Need a BIG bass to take a 9" Scup!!

you'd be surprised what takes it. Trim down his spiny dorsal fin and reduce that tail a bit.... some people also like to cut them but I don't...they are not like a bunker that emit oil. Send them down to the kill zone and I let them vibrate around a bit... bass will inhale them.

Big Bass??...who wants that?? ;)

...no seriously, it's amazing to watch.. if you ever get the chance. The Bass circle the scup waiting for the right moment to slap it. Then BANG@!!, they whack em with their tail....if that isn't enough, they smack em' again...as soon as that scup is the least bit stunned, the Bass will then try to inhale him face first. If the scup recovers, the smacking commences...until it's safe to inhale. I couldn't figure out how a bass could be fast enough to slap a scup. After all, a scup can swim pretty fast, but when I witnessed it for the first time, it all made sense. The scup had gotten chased to the surface...the Bass kept circling him, just below. Then the bass would appear to turn downward, but in reality it would just be turning its body...appearing to head down toward the depths when the tail would suddenly thrash the surface with extreme force....smacking the scup. It happens in a fraction of a second. The whole time the scup thought the bass was departing, but the bass was actually positioning itself to strike. It really is amazing. ...and Macojoe, a keeper size bass can inhale a 9" scup much more easily than you'd think ;)

thanks bloocrab for an excellent reply. I know stripers do strange things to my plugs. Hard to prove but I have had some experience with stripers slapping plugs. Had one last year jump ontop of a popper and drive it down doing a head stand, with his
tail in the air for what seemed like forever, till she turned and ran toward shore with it. Big tail , big fish. Scup are easy to come by where I fish so might give it a try. I will cut off the dorsal fin and try that also.

That was an extremely informative reply. Really! What is the preferred way to hook them so they stay alive? Like a herring, on top but not thru the spine? Or some other way?

In my experiences; :rolleyes:

A. * I find that when you pierce his back just before the dorsal fin begins, (about an inch down - depending on how thick his back is), this has normally allowed the scup to dive down and stay down in his natural habitat. (Until the inevitable happens :D)

Note: You DO NOT want to injure the scup's spine. This will greatly decrease his life span.

B. & D. * Anywhere near the tail, eventually has him swimming for the surface. The weight of the hook and dragging line forces his tail down which inturn faces him a bit upward. He will take dives from time to time, but the combination of weight with the constant tail action, will mostly turn him, until he gets so tired that he lays flat on the bottom. Once he goes sideways, he's on his way out. This method tires him out faster. Also, if you go with D., be careful not to puncture any organs.

C. * The disadvantage I find with this method is increased gut-hooking. Due to the fact that your using a large bait, you must give the bass enough time to inhale the offering...putting the hook down near her throat, as a bass swallows it's prey head first. :(

My favorite? B. Once that scup is halfway in her mouth, I know the hook is just about at jaw level. The bass swallows the scup but takes a small pause as it carefully passes thru into the esophagus. I good 5 count. If the bass stops her run, she may spit it..but don't worry, she may just be repositioning the meal. Let her run again....and this time give a 3 count.

...and like he said above, trimming the tail will slow him down, but I enjoy a chase, I don't normally trim. I have never trimmed the dorsal. I believe that's just for stability not speed.

..as far as life expectancy. D. B. A. C.

D. = being the shortest
C. = being the longest

hope this helps-

Bloo, this post was great. Thanks

Do the same techniques apply to live lining macs? Also, what's the preferred hook for live lining?

Great response!!! I am going to give it a try. Thanks alot bloo

Wow Bloo that was great! - wish I couda watched the bass doing that.

I have watched them slurping herring from above.

The bass coralled the herring into a ball and layed under them quietly. Then one at a time so as not to disturb the herring into a flight the bass rolled up under them on their side and quickly vacuumed one in. Very impressive - calm and smooth. The bass would slide down and the next one and on & on. I cant emphasize it enough the bass seemed to know not to smash the herring they just wolf packed'em and proceeded quietly about their supper.

One thing, why does a bass play her prey like a cat playing it's prey before eating it? That's so sick, but yet fascinating...:cool:

...Notaro,

...to answer your question, think of it like this;

I'm fat and weigh over 300 pounds. Your skinny and weigh about 110 pounds. You decide to call me FATSO. I start to chase you, but you keep dodging me and outrunning me. Eventually I get over-tired and you get away.

..as opposed to:

I'm fat and weigh over 300 pounds. Your skinny and weigh about 110 pounds. You decide to call me FATSO. I make it seem like it doesn't bother me. So you get closer and closer and keep calling me FATSO. I pretend not to see you, or even care that your calling me names. Suddenly, your in my reach. BAMN!!! ...NOW YOUR IN A HEAD-LOCK GETTING PUNCHED IN THE FACE OVER AND OVER.

My logic scares me sometimes. A bass will do whatever it takes to get what it wants. The smarter Bass won't expend extra energy when it doesn't have to. It slowy moves closer to it's prey, until it's close enough to corral it. The 'head-lock' is when the bass is circling the victim, the punch is when he strikes the victim before swallowing it head first. :)

ok, not the greatest scenario...:D but I'm sure you knew the answer before you asked the question.

With macks, you don't have too much room for error. They are much more sensitive when live-lined. Especially if you puncture their body. They also ..are not as durable. You normally only have 1 shot at setting the hook.

As far as hooks, the Daiichi Bleeding Bait hook works pretty good, but with larger sized scup...the Gami Octupus 6/0 works fine. With smaller baits, go with a "Live Bait" hook. The size depends on the size of your bait. A heavy hook will wear down a smaller bait. I do not like cirlce hooks with live bait, (I really don't care for them at all period). You spend too much time handling the baitfish, which will also effect it's life-span. This is from my experiences. I'm sure there are other methods that work just as good, if not better. I read that a lot of S.Shore boaters live-line macks all the time. Maybe one of them can chime in and share their method with us.



...PasNgas...:) I had em' for a solid week holding up in the same *spot*. (2) rods, one for scuppin' the other for Bassin'. No sooner would I catch a scup, transfer him onto the other rod...toss him into the same general area that I caught him, he would dive right down to the bottom...within a couple of minutes I'd have numerous bass chase him to the surface, and the show would start. Toward the end of the week, I talked my brother into coming out with me, (he doesn't fish)...but when I dropped him off...he said, "Bro...that was like living-thru an ESPN moment.." Needless to say, that made my day. :)


Good Luck to all...

this should be thrown in the "how-to" section

livelining scup definitely works well
and its easy

they hold up well to being hooked through the back and last a long time

Scup Slapping?

That sounds pretty mean. Shouldn't there be a law against that? :eek: :smash: :laughs:

ive put a 2/0-4/0 treble in their backs rather than singles, depends on size. i like hitting the fish as soon as it gets the bait in its mouth.