Attorney General Eric Holder is a staunch opponent of laws requiring voters to show photo ID at the polls to improve ballot security. He calls them “unnecessary” and has blocked their implementation in Texas and South Carolina, citing the fear they would discriminate against minorities.

I wonder what Holder will think when he learns just how easy it was for someone to be offered his ballot just by mentioning his name in a Washington, D.C., polling place in Tuesday’s primaries.

In Washington, it was child’s play for O’Keefe to beat the system. O’Keefe’s assistant used a hidden camera to document his encounter with the election worker at Holder’s polling place:

Man: “Do you have an Eric Holder, 50th Street?

Poll worker: “Let me see here.”

Man: Xxxx 50th Street.

Poll Worker: Let’s see, Holder, Hol-t-e-r, or Hold-d-e-r?

Man: H-o-l-d-e-r.

Poll Worker: D-e-r. Okay.

Man: That’s the name.

Poll Worker: I do. Xxxx 50th Street NW. Okay. [Puts check next to name, indicating someone has shown up to vote.] Will you sign there . . .

Man: I actually forgot my ID.

Poll Worker: You don’t need it; it’s all right.

Man: I left it in the car.

Poll Worker: As long as you’re in here, and you’re on our list and that’s who you say you are, we’re okay.

Man: I would feel more comfortable if I go get my ID, is it all right if I go get it?

Poll Worker: Sure, go ahead.

Man: I’ll be back faster than you can say furious!

Poll Worker: We’re not going anywhere.

Note that O’Keefe’s assistant never identified himself as Eric Holder, so he was not illegally impersonating him.

....a new study by the Pew Research Center found at least 1.8 million dead people are still registered to vote. They aren’t likely to complain if someone votes in their place.

Why We Need Voter-ID Laws Now - John Fund - National Review Online (http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/295431/why-we-need-voter-id-laws-now-john-fund)

Except for the politicians not wanting it to milk it for votes, I could never understand the big deal in registering to vote and being able to prove your idenity.

You do it once, proves you are a citizen over the age of 18 and not a felon. Your official signature is sighned in the poll books and each time you go to vote you sighn your name under the original signature proving who you are and eligble.If your eligble there should be no problem in having
a photo ID either.

What's the big deal, no violation of rights here, just showing you are eligible.

I'm with justplugit. What i sthe harm in verifying someone's identity at the voting booth? Isn't ensuring identity, for the purposes of election integrity, a good thing? Why are liberals opposed to this? Why would it discriminate against minorities? Is it better for those minorities if someone uses their identity to vote illegitimately?

I see no earthly reason to oppose this, but liberals, as a group, vehemently oppose it.

So, O'Keefe lied and he is praised?

You conservatives have no morals.

So, O'Keefe lied and he is praised?

You conservatives have no morals.

Paul, there you go again, saying mean, nasty things. When I do it, you tell me I'm mean and nasty. When you do it, it's OK, I guess?

I see nothing immoral about exposing the issue of voter fraud. If the person actually voted as Eric Holder, that would be immoral.

When someone called Gov Scott Walker (in Wisconsin) and pretended to be one of the Koch brothers, did you call that out as immoral? Because most liberals jumped to the conclusion that the Koch brothers have Walker in their back pocket...

Paul, there you go again, saying mean, nasty things. When I do it, you tell me I'm mean and nasty. When you do it, it's OK, I guess?I figure what is good for the goose is good for the gander - the decorum in this forum has good way down over the last year or so. I figure since your constantly railing against "liberals", that I'll start calling sleazy sleazy

I see nothing immoral about exposing the issue of voter fraud. If the person actually voted as Eric Holder, that would be immoral. If the sleazy conservative didn't vote, how is it voter fraud. :confused:Your missing the point - O'Keefe is lying to someone - he is conservative and sleazy. Therefore, using the logic you use daily, and no conservatives have called him out, therefore they are all sleazy.

When someone called Gov Scott Walker (in Wisconsin) and pretended to be one of the Koch brothers, did you call that out as immoral? Because most liberals jumped to the conclusion that the Koch brothers have Walker in their back pocket...

As w/me, the person who did it saw how sleazy cons. are and figured he would do the same.

Last week I saw that some sleazy conserv. tried the same thing (even setting up a website!) and got caught. I'm sure others have been contacting him and tell him where he went wrong.

You conservatives have no morals.

Maybe I missed something,please show me where I have posted something that was imoral.

Maybe I missed something,please show me where I have posted something that was imoral.

something about "goose decorum"...which I think is similar to "pink slime" ....sleazy sleazy :rotf2:

the guy didn't lie about anything, and he didn't try to cast a vote....just demonstrated how easy it is to vote for a dead guy..or apparently for a live guy too... a live guy (Holder)who doesn't see a problem with people voting for dead guys..

and it wasn't O'Keefe..it was his assistant

Maybe I missed something,please show me where I have posted something that was imoral.

that your so willing to lie and that it comes so easy.

:

the guy didn't lie about anything, He implied that he was Holder - you can tell he was implying he was Holder, right?and he didn't try to cast a vote....just demonstrated how easy it is to vote for a dead guy..How did he demonstrate that if he didn't actually vote?

that your so willing to lie and that it comes so easy.

Please show me a post where I have lied.

You seem to be very judgemental and self righteous.

Please show me a post where I have lied.

O'Keefe (or his assistant) lied by implying he was Holder. O'Keefe is a conservative. There are either cons. or liberals (no in between) here. Your a conserv., therefore your a liar. That is how this forum now operates.

You seem to be very judgemental me:rotf2:do you read any other posts in this forum? I've been pointing out how judgemental this forum has become for about a year now.and self righteous:uhuh:.:)

Nope, but that is what this forum has turned into.

Lets take our foot off the gas pedal and relax.

and ease up on the name calling......just because people do it doesn't mean its right

Lets take our foot off the gas pedal and relax.

and ease up on the name calling......just because people do it doesn't mean its right

Agree, and let's refrain from painting with broad brushes.
The only thing I posted on this thread was my opinion on voting registration.
Neither imoral or a lie.

Can we get back to the point of the original post? Why do Obama and most liberals oppose identity verification? Whose civil rights get violated, and how do they get violated, if we ask folks to prove their identity at the voting booth?

I just don't see a valid argument against this, but liberals tend to paint it as discriminatory...

I just don't see a valid argument against this, but liberals tend to paint it as discriminatory...

Because once you bring discrimmination into the argument, it tends to quiet the opposition. No one wants to be labeled as discriminatory.

Because once you bring discrimmination into the argument, it tends to quiet the opposition. No one wants to be labeled as discriminatory.

Good point FB.

Can we get back to the point of the original post? Why do Obama and most liberals oppose identity verification? Whose civil rights get violated, and how do they get violated, if we ask folks to prove their identity at the voting booth?

I just don't see a valid argument against this, but liberals tend to paint it as discriminatory...

Frankly, a free ID card (if you don't have a license/passport/military ID, etc.) wouldn't bother me all.

Frankly, a free ID card (if you don't have a license/passport/military ID, etc.) wouldn't bother me all.

Don't people need ID to get welfare or other social services? I would think an ID wouldn't be too difficult to get if someone really wanted one.

Don't people need ID to get welfare or other social services? I would think an ID wouldn't be too difficult to get if someone really wanted one.

If I'm not mistaken its actually required to register to vote.....just not required to actually vote at the polls.

just can't see why its such an issue to have one on you when you vote.....you needed it to register

Originally Posted by fishbones
Don't people need ID to get welfare or other social services? I would think an ID wouldn't be too difficult to get if someone really wanted one.



If I'm not mistaken its actually required to register to vote.....just not required to actually vote at the polls.



not so sure about that :)

October 14, 2008

Just this week, a federal judge ordered [1] Ohio’s top elections official to verify the identity of newly registered voters by matching them with other government documents. The very next day a 6th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals set aside the federal judge’s order [2] on verifying registrations.

Further igniting the voter fraud/voter registration debate was the news that a national community organizing group is being investigated in at least 14 states and several swing states for massive irregularities. This news would make headlines anyway, but what made it worse was that Barack Obama was a key player in this organization, the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now .

The Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now [3] (ACORN) is a community-based organization that advocates for low and moderate income families founded in 1970 by Wade Rathke and Gary Delgado. Rathke [8], one of the most powerful hard-Left activists in America, is a former member of a radical 1960s group, the Students for a Democratic Society [9] (SDS). The Weathermen terrorist group split off from the SDS in 1969. ACORN [10] says its priorities include better housing and wages for the poor, more community development investment from banks and governments, and better public schools.

ACORN is also known for its voter registration efforts.
This year alone ACORN has registered 1,315,037 voters.(it's unclear whether Acorn was checking ID's)

Although the organization prides itself for its registration efforts, it also has a long history of scandal. In the state of Missouri in 1986, 12 ACORN members [12] were convicted of voter fraud. But that case was not an isolated incident in the state. In December 2004, in St. Louis, six volunteers pleaded guilty of dozens of election law violations for filling out registration cards with names of dead people and other bogus information. Authorities launched an earlier investigation after noticing that among the new voters was longtime St. Louis alderman Albert “Red” Villa, who died in 1990. The volunteers worked for “Operation Big Vote” — a branch of ACORN — in St. Louis.

On February 10, 2005, Nonaresa Montgomery, a paid worker who ran Operation Big Vote during the run-up to the 2001 mayoral primary, was found guilty of vote fraud. Montgomery hired about 30 workers to do fraudulent voter-registration canvassing. Instead of knocking on doors, the volunteers sat at a St. Louis fast food restaurant and wrote out names and information from an outdated voter list. About 1,500 fraudulent voter registration cards were turned in.

In October 2006, St. Louis election officials discovered at least 1,492 [13] “potentially fraudulent” voter registration cards. They were all turned in by ACORN volunteers.

In November 2006 [14], 20,000 to 35,000 [14] questionable voter registration forms were turned in by ACORN officials [15] in Missouri. Most all of these were from St. Louis and Kansas City areas, where ACORN purportedly sought to help empower the “disenfranchised” minorities living there. But the ACORN workers weren’t just told to register new voters. The workers admitted on camera [16] that they were coached to tell registrants to vote for Democrat Claire McCaskill.

In 2007, in Kansas City, Missouri, four ACORN employees were indicted [17] for fraud. In April of this year eight ACORN employees [18] in St. Louis city and county pleaded guilty to federal election fraud for submitting bogus voter registrations.

And, that was just Missouri.

This year there have been several accusations of fraud against ACORN. Over a dozen states are investigating the organization already. Here is a complete list of the ongoing investigations:

North Carolina — State Board of Elections officials have found [19] at least 100 voter registration forms with the same names over and over again. The forms were turned in by ACORN. Officials sent about 30 applications to the state Board of Elections for possible fraud investigation.

Ohio — The New York Post [20] reported that a Cleveland man said he was given cash and cigarettes by aggressive ACORN activists in exchange for registering an astonishing 72 times. The complaints have sparked an investigation by election officials into the organization, whose political wing has supported Barack Obama. Witnesses have already been subpoenaed [21] to testify against the organization.

Nevada — Authorities raided [22] the headquarters of the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now on Tuesday October 7, 2008, after a month-long investigation. The fraudulent voter registrations included the Dallas Cowboys starting line-up.

Indiana — More than 2,000 voter registration forms [23] filed in northern Indiana’s Lake County filled out by ACORN employees turned out to be bogus. Officials also stopped processing a stack of about 5,000 applications delivered just before the October 6 registration deadline after the first 2,100 turned out to be phony.

Connecticut — Officials are looking into a complaint [24] alleging ACORN submitted fraudulent voter registration cards in Bridgeport. In one instance, an official said a card was filled out for a 7-year-old girl [25], whose age was listed as 27. 8,000 cards were submitted in Bridgeport.

Missouri — The Kansas City election board is reporting 100 duplicate applications and 280 with fake information. Acorn officials agreed [26] that at least 4% of their registrations were bogus. Governor Matt Blunt condemned [27]the attempts by ACORN to commit voter fraud.

Pennsylvania — Officials are investigating [28]suspicious or incomplete registration forms submitted [29] by ACORN. 252,595 voter registrations were submitted in Philadelphia. Remarkably, 57,435 were rejected — most of them submitted by ACORN.

Wisconsin — In Milwaukee ACORN improperly used felons [7] as registration workers. Additionally, its workers are among 49 cases of bad registrations sent to authorities for possible charges, as first reported by the Journal Sentinel.

Florida — The Pinellas County Elections supervisor says his office has received [30] around 35 voter registrations that appear to be bogus. There is also a question of 30,000 felons [31]who are registered illegally to vote. Their connections with ACORN are not yet clear.

Texas — Of the 30,000 registration cards ACORN turned in, Harris County tax assessor Paul Bettencourt says just more than 20,000 are valid. And just look at some of the places ACORN was finding those voters. A church just next door is the address for around 150 people. More than 250 people claim a homeless outreach center as their home address. Some listed a county mental health facility as their home and one person even wrote down the Harris County jail at the sheriff’s office [32].

Michigan — ACORN in Detroit is being investigated [33] after several municipal clerks reported fraudulent and duplicate voter registration applications coming through. The clerk interviewed said the fraud appears to be widespread.

New Mexico – The Bernalillo County clerk has notified prosecutors that some 1,100 fraudulent voter registration cards were turned in [34] by ACORN.
these are just the ones that were caught when the microscope was finally on, they've been at this for years

you can tell he was implying he was Holder, right?..

How did he demonstrate that if he didn't actually vote?


what he specifically asked the poll worker was..

“Do you have an Eric Holder, 50th Street?"

yes, that could imply to the poll worker that he was Eric Holder and was there to vote, but anyone could walk in and ask if they have anyone on their list at a particular address, I don't think it's illegal or lying.....does show just how pathetically easy it is to make a mess of the system...imagine if some organization(oh, say ACORN) was dedicated to making a mess of the system?


he demonstrated that it was very easy to walk into a polling place, ask if they had a name and an address and get a ballot by simply signing on the line, now in this case, if he had taken the ballot and voted(that woud be illegal), and if Holder had shown up at a later date there would be a contested ballot...if the name he asked for was a dead guy, there wouldn't be anyone to walk in later and try to vote under the same name and create a contested ballot...is this really that difficult to grasp?

the obvious irony is that he went to ask for Holder, the top law official in the land who adamantly opposes voter id.....outstanding:)

not so sure about that :)



I said it was required....didn't say it was actually followed. :hee:

I know HAVA requires all absentee registrations to include a copy of ID when submiiting them.

Again, requiring it and actually enforcing it are 2 different things.....

I also think having a 3rd party doing Voter Registrations is a stupid concept and helps lead to issues like these.

I said it was required....didn't say it was actually followed. :hee:

I know HAVA requires all absentee registrations to include a copy of ID when submiiting them.

Again, requiring it and actually enforcing it are 2 different things.....

I also think having a 3rd party doing Voter Registrations is a stupid concept and helps lead to issues like these.

HAVA was signed in 2002 and look at the concerted attempt to undermine the voting process that took place in 2008. Cloward-Piven Strategy applied to voter registration I imagine.

also: HAVA- The specifics of implementation have been left up to each state, which allows for varying interpretations of the Federal law. (some states simply require a signed affadavit in lieu of a picture id)

ACORN is still in business operating under a different name and despite the obvious organized attempt to undermine the process you still have many fighting voter id requirements...this will be a record year for voter fraud and all sorts of claims of voting irregularities, particularly if you know who is ousted :)

bottom line is, like you stated... the solution is very simple:uhuh:

the obvious irony is that he went to ask for Holder, the top law official in the land who adamantly opposes voter id.....outstanding:)

But he wasn't able to vote - which is the whole point (the same w/the Acorn examples).

W/Acorn, they were paying people by the # of folks they got to register. There is no indication any of them actually voted. There has never been any indication of wide spread voter fraud - never (Although I don't know how that hasn't happened in New Orleans or Chicago).

But he wasn't able to vote - which is the whole point (the same w/the Acorn examples).



the poll worker clearly "implies"(your word) that he very well could have :uhuh:

the only thing that stopped him was his honesty?:rotf2:

W/Acorn, they were paying people by the # of folks they got to register. nice, paying to undermine America


There is no indication any of them actually voted. how would you know? There has never been any indication of wide spread voter fraud - never (Although I don't know how that hasn't happened in New Orleans or Chicago).

huh???

Acorn? Oh Jesus....

The simple question is what's more likely, voter fraud or voter disenfranchisement?

O'keef's vid is nothing more than another stunt to feed the crack heads.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Acorn? Oh Jesus....

The simple question is what's more likely, voter fraud or voter disenfranchisement?

O'keef's vid is nothing more than another stunt to feed the crack heads.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Spence, are you saying that verifying identity at the voting booth will cause "disenfranchisement"? Can you please explain?

I have to show id at the doctors office, at my kids' school, when I buy prescriptions aty the pharmacy, when I get on a plane. WHAT IS THE BIG DEAL? When asked to verify id, my rights (specifically my right to vote) is being protected, my rights aren't being violated.

It never occurred to me to feel disenfranchised, whatever the hell that is...

huh???

nice, paying to undermine America How if someone lies on a registration form is that undermining America if they didn't vote? Weren't some of the names obviously fake?


how would you know? - Well, how would you know that they voted? We've heard many stories about Acorn and voter fraud. I would have thought you could pull up many articles about how numerous folks got arrested for voter fraud related to the Acorn registrations?

Clean it up, it's simple. Require an ID to vote. Common sense...........

nice, paying to undermine America How if someone lies on a registration form is that undermining America if they didn't vote? Weren't some of the names obviously fake?


how would you know? - Well, how would you know that they voted? We've heard many stories about Acorn and voter fraud. I would have thought you could pull up many articles about how numerous folks got arrested for voter fraud related to the Acorn registrations?

Paul, you said earlier you would not have an issue with being required to show an id to vote. All O'Keefe is doing is showing how easy it is to commit voter fraud, and thus highlight the need for some common sense protocals. He's not doing anything wrong.

Common sense suggests that you can't just identify yourself verbally and vote as whomever you say you are. The 2000 presidential election was decisded by a cat's whisker, that clearly shows how vital it is that elections are conducted fairly.

I've asked a few times what the big deal is. Not one liberal has addressed that. Spence says identity verification causes disenfranchisement, which is as hard to type as antidisestablishmentarianism. I'm not suere what it means (I'm not sure what either word means), but I am sure that it's supposed to make id verification look "mean".

I just cannot see how any rational person can feel slighted when asked to show an id to vote. It's about protecting one's rights, not violating one's rights...

Paul, you said earlier you would not have an issue with being required to show an id to vote. All O'Keefe is doing is showing how easy it is to commit voter fraud, and thus highlight the need for some common sense protocals. He's not doing anything wrong.



Yes, in my opinion a free Id is not a big deal. But I'm also confused why it is such a big issue if there is no wide spread fraud. O'Keefe isn't showing voter fraud, he is showing registration fraud. I don't know what happens to a registration card that has an obviously fake name.

Did OKeefe dress up like Huggy Bear this time?

I'm 50 years old and I need to show an ID to buy spray paint!!!! This is nuts!!

Spence, are you saying that verifying identity at the voting booth will cause "disenfranchisement"? Can you please explain?

I have to show id at the doctors office, at my kids' school, when I buy prescriptions aty the pharmacy, when I get on a plane. WHAT IS THE BIG DEAL? When asked to verify id, my rights (specifically my right to vote) is being protected, my rights aren't being violated.

It never occurred to me to feel disenfranchised, whatever the hell that is...

makes you wonder what all the potentially disenfranchised do the other 364 days a year with no form of identification ....doesn't it?

Yes O'Keefe isn't showing voter fraud, he is showing registration fraud. I don't know what happens to a registration card that has an obviously fake name.

he went to Holder's primary polling location and demonstrated how easy it would have been to get a ballot and vote...even using the name of a very high level official, the only reason he didn't get a ballot is because he insisted on getting his ID first, the poll worker never asked for an ID and told him that he didn't need it, simply said "sign here"....if it were a dead guy he'd asked for or if Holder decided to not vote in the primary and he'd signed and taken the ballot he could have voted without any issue and no way of anyone knowing that he'd done so...I think that would be voter fraud

how is he showing "registration fraud"? was Holder fraudulently registered?:confused:

the fact that this doesn't disturb you beyond venom for O'Keefe & Co. is a little disturbing:)

he went to Holder's primary polling location and demonstrated how easy it would have been to get a ballot and vote...so your saying he voted? B/c otherwise we can only speculate if he could have voted. I know the lemmings have been told to constantly bring up voter fraud but where is the wide spread voter fraud?


the fact that this doesn't disturb you beyond venom for O'Keefe & Co. is a little disturbing:)

I think what he does his sleazy - the way he constantly lies to people. So I guess people lying doesn't disturb you

If I had venom I would constantly start threads about the minor things that I read about every day. - Like Cantor donating $ to help defeat fellow Repubs. or some racist hacking into roads signs saying T. Martin is N***** or Santorium dropping out b/f the primary in his home state in which he was behind:rotf2:

I think what he does his sleazy - the way he constantly lies to people. So I guess people lying doesn't disturb you


There's a line between what he does and journalism. What O'Keefe does is a stunt to get himself publicity.

Like with the Acorn videos, he should have mentioned that a number of locations called the police about his actions.

The irony is that the crack head response is to snort more rather than look at the situation objectively. It's the exact same accusation Sowell makes of the Left.

-spence

so your saying he voted? B/c otherwise we can only speculate if he could have voted.



Poll Worker: I do. Xxxx 50th Street NW. Okay. [Puts check next to name, indicating someone has shown up to vote.] Will you sign there . . .

Man: I actually forgot my ID.

Poll Worker: You don’t need it; it’s all right.

Poll Worker: As long as you’re in here, and you’re on our list and that’s who you say you are, we’re okay.


he clearly could have... which is the point that can't seem to grasp:)

There's a line between what he does and journalism. What O'Keefe does is a stunt to get himself publicity.

Like with the Acorn videos, he should have mentioned that a number of locations called the police about his actions.

The irony is that the crack head response is to snort more rather than look at the situation objectively. It's the exact same accusation Sowell makes of the Left.

-spence

DJIA 12805.39 ...you need to work a little harder and stop with the crack obsession:)

This is one of those issues, even though some on here label me a 'radical' I can see both sides.

Is it a major impediment to getting or showing a picture ID. No. Does it impact some people? Probably

Do I think voter fraud is that rampant? No. Otherwise we'd see numbers (like records of all these dead people voting for a democrat...)

IMHO not a major panty-wadding issue.... both sides treat it that way though

Do I think voter fraud is that rampant? No. Otherwise we'd see numbers (like records of all these dead people voting for a democrat...) the dead people would have to speak up in order for you to ever know:)



probably never happens much and has no real impact if it does :)

April 9, 2012

The latest fraud case in Indiana shows how foolish the claim is that no election fraud exists or that it is “inconsequential.”

Four Democratic party officials, including the St. Joseph County chairman Butch Morgan, have been charged with conspiracy, forgery, and official misconduct in the 2008 presidential primary election. Morgan allegedly ordered three county officials to duplicate signatures from a 2008 petition for Democratic gubernatorial candidate Jim Schellinger onto petitions for then-presidential candidates Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama. The Republican member of the Board of Voter Registration’s signature, which is required for final authorization of all petitions, was apparently then rubber stamped without her knowledge. In Indiana, a candidate must secure 500 signatures from each of the state’s nine congressional districts in order to appear on the ballot. Then-senator Barack Obama barely qualified for the ballot with 534 signatures.

The South Bend Tribune collaborated with an independent political newsletter, Howey Politics Indiana, to conduct an investigation of the allegedly fake signatures. Erich Speckin, an expert forensic document analyst, told the paper that up to 270 of the ballot signatures for candidate Obama were fraudulent. “It’s obvious. It’s just terribly obvious” that the signatures on the various pages were made by the same hand, Speckin said after reviewing the documents. Previous investigations have already found no fewer than 150 fraudulent signatures on the petitions.

The fraud came to an end after a source from inside the county Democratic party who had participated personally in the scheme approached local investigators. Lucas Burkett attended meetings at the local Democratic party headquarters where Morgan ordered the forgeries. Investigators then compared the signatures on Obama and Clinton petitions to the signatures on file for registered voters, and contacted the voters whose names appeared on the forms, in order to confirm the signatures were forgeries.

Many common citizens were shocked and dismayed to see their own name and personal information on a petition they had supposedly signed four years earlier. “It’s scary. A lot of people have already lost faith in politics . . . and that solidifies our worries and concerns,” Mishawaka resident Charity Rorie.

There is no telling what other deceitful and illegal measures these local party officials were willing to take (or have taken in the past without detection) to steal an election. That is why we need to take steps throughout the voter registration, voting, and election process to secure the integrity of our elections. Voter ID is just one of the precautions necessary for a fair and honest vote.

Hans A. von Spakovsky is a senior legal fellow at the Heritage Foundation, a former FEC Commissioner, and the former counsel to the assistant attorney general for civil rights at the Justice Department.

Google's fun.

Does it happen, yes. On both sides, apparently
Is it rampant? I still say no.
BBCW: Voter Fraud Declared at Christian County, Missouri Republican Caucus: Rick Santorum Wins Fraudulent Caucus (http://bungalowbillscw.blogspot.com/2012/03/voter-fraud-declared-at-christian.html)
Political Animal - Another GOP official commits election fraud (http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/political-animal/2011_12/another_gop_official_caught_co034290.php)

Google's fun.

Does it happen, yes. On both sides, apparently
Is it rampant? I still say no.
BBCW: Voter Fraud Declared at Christian County, Missouri Republican Caucus: Rick Santorum Wins Fraudulent Caucus (http://bungalowbillscw.blogspot.com/2012/03/voter-fraud-declared-at-christian.html)
Political Animal - Another GOP official commits election fraud (http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/political-animal/2011_12/another_gop_official_caught_co034290.php)

I guess..."Bungalow Bills"??? that's a good one :)

how many examples till we get to "rampant"?

Bry, did you actually read either of those?

I guess..."Bungalow Bills"??? that's a good one :)

how many examples till we get to "rampant"?

Bry, did you actually read either of those?

Yes. One was a Caucus, the other was mostly making reference to voter suppression (albeit a creative approach) in Maryland.

So you see this is a major issue?
I'd much rather they tackle some campaign finance laws first. I think that's the more pressing issue.

I still want to know if Oqueef was dressed like a Pimp when he played Holder....

DJIA 12805.39 ...you need to work a little harder and stop with the crack obsession:)
What, that the market has had perhaps one of it's best quarters ever?

-spence

[QUOTE=RIROCKHOUND;932803]Yes. One was a Caucus, the other was mostly making reference to voter suppression (albeit a creative approach) in Maryland.

So you see this is a major issue?
QUOTE]

we're talking about voter fraud and id's

and you post one story from an unusual website involving the Missouri caucus another about a republican whose voter registration showed his ex-wife's address(can't see how that could happen) and then a campaign manager that approved some robo calls which**, while annoying, if you actually believe a strange unnamed voice that calls your house at night and tells you not to bother voting...maybe you shouldn't be voting in the first place:uhuh:

and that's your evidence that there is either no evidence or that everyone does it so it's no big deal?

I thought we did tackle campaign finance laws?

**WashPo
Ex-Ehrlich campaign manager Schurick convicted in robocall case - The Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/ex-ehrlich-campaign-manager-schurick-convicted-in-robocall-case/2011/12/06/gIQA6rNsaO_story.html)

The jury convicted Schurick — who got his start in politics working for Democrats — of trying to influence votes through fraud,guess we know where he learned how:rotf2: failing to identify the source of the call as required by law and two counts of conspiracy to commit those crimes.

What, that the market has had perhaps one of it's best quarters ever?

-spence

you are supposed to be keeping it over 13,000...get back to work:)

you are supposed to be keeping it over 13,000...get back to work:)
I had a kick a$$ meeting today with a huge global producer of hydrogen, oxygen and other industrial chemicals. Went really well...

Market still had a great quarter...suck it up.

-spence

Poll Worker: I do. Xxxx 50th Street NW. Okay. [Puts check next to name, indicating someone has shown up to vote.] Will you sign there . . .

Man: I actually forgot my ID.

Poll Worker: You don’t need it; it’s all right.

Poll Worker: As long as you’re in here, and you’re on our list and that’s who you say you are, we’re okay.


he clearly could have... which is the point that can't seem to grasp:)

But he didn't vote. Maybe she was setting him up to see if he voted and then was going to call the cops. So, he didn't vote and there is no voter fraud in this situation.:uhuh:

Is there a requirement in the constitution to have an id to vote:)

Interesting............................."The Constitution never explicitly ensures the right to vote, as it does the right to speech, for example. It does require that Representatives be chosen and Senators be elected by "the People," and who comprises "the People" has been expanded by the aforementioned amendments several times. Aside from these requirements, though, the qualifications for voters are left to the states. And as long as the qualifications do not conflict with anything in the Constitution, that right can be withheld. For example, in Texas, persons declared mentally incompetent and felons currently in prison or on probation are denied the right to vote. It is interesting to note that though the 26th Amendment requires that 18-year-olds must be able to vote, states can allow persons younger than 18 to vote, if they chose to."

But he didn't vote. Maybe she was setting him up to see if he voted and then was going to call the cops. :

yeah, that's probably what was going on....

Paul, if you have to work this hard making so little sense it should tell you something:)

I had a kick a$$ meeting today with a huge global producer of hydrogen, oxygen and other industrial chemicals. Went really well...


-spence

you go girl...:claps:

I had a kick a$$ meeting today with a huge global producer of hydrogen, oxygen and other industrial chemicals. Went really well...

Market still had a great quarter...suck it up.

-spence

I had a meeting last night just after dinner with a large producer of methane and it wasn't pretty :devil2:

yeah, that's probably what was going on....

Paul, if you have to work this hard making so little sense it should tell you something:)

Ok, you win. It was voter fraud even though no fraud occurred:rotf2:

you are supposed to be keeping it over 13,000...get back to work:)

Ya Spence, I figured you musta been on vacation. :)

Ok, you win. It was voter fraud even though no fraud occurred:rotf2:

you are the only one that claimed that he did anything wrong, noone said he committed voter fraud...just demonstrated that he could have...quite easily


Paul, if someone walked into your house, threw your dog a steak to preoccupy him and went to the jewellery in your bedroom and was about to take it but heard a noise outside and left...

I guess you'd claim that while he may have committed a crime(or lied in the voter case) by entering your house, he never actually took anything so there's no proof that he "could have" taken something if he'd wanted to and therefore any discussion of whether or not he could have taken your jewellery or the relative ease with which he could have taken it or the fact that he just walked into your house and so easily got by your guard dog has absolutely no bearing on the theftproofness/vunerability of your home....

and you might even claim that your dog was in fact "setting the burgular up" and while he appeared to be distracted and thoroughly enjoying the steak, he actually had on eye on the burgular and was planning to dial 911 as soon as he touched the goods ?

and finally..

"Ok, you win. It was theft even though no theft occurred:rotf2:"

which isn't really funny because noone claimed that a theft(voter fraud) occurred, we were just pointing out that it would be, based on the evidence, really easy to steal your jewellery, but you can't seem to grasp that.:)

and then imagine that rather than your home, we were talking about the home of the top home security consultant in America who had been for years claiming that home invasions in his neighborood and elsewhere were overstated:)

Ok, you win. It was voter fraud even though no fraud occurred:rotf2:

I told you Scott, you win. It was voter fraud. We need to change everything b/c there is wide spread voter fraud and b/c O'Keefe (I guess?) committed voter fraud. It says it in the constitution that everyone needs an ID and we need to get it done. - Is that good enough?

Make everyone show an ID.

As good old Benjamin Franklin once said “An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.”

Hell, back then only land owners could vote. Looking back its not a bad idea :)

I told you Scott, you win. It was voter fraud. We need to change everything b/c there is wide spread voter fraud and b/c O'Keefe (I guess?) committed voter fraud. It says it in the constitution that everyone needs an ID and we need to get it done. - Is that good enough?


“Unfortunately, the United States has a long history of voter fraud that has been documented by historians and journalists,” Supreme Court Justice John Paul Stevens wrote in 2008, upholding a strict Indiana voter-ID law designed to combat fraud. Justice Stevens, who personally encountered voter fraud while serving on various reform commissions in his native Chicago, spoke for a six-member majority. In a decision two years earlier clearing the way for an Arizona ID law, the Court had declared in a unanimous opinion that “confidence in the integrity of our electoral processes is essential to the functioning of our participatory democracy. Voter fraud drives honest citizens out of the democratic process and breeds distrust of our government. Voters who fear their legitimate votes will be outweighed by fraudulent ones will feel disenfranchised.”

Indeed, a brand-new Rasmussen Reports poll finds that 64 percent of Americans believe voter fraud is a serious problem, with whites registering 63 percent agreement and African-Americans 64 percent. A Fox News poll taken last month found that 70 percent of Americans support requiring voters to show “state or federally issued photo identification” to prove their identity and citizenship before casting a ballot. Majorities of all demographic groups agreed on the need for photo ID, including 58 percent of non-white voters, 52 percent of liberals, and 52 percent of Democrats.





Artur Davis, who was a Democratic congressman from Alabama until last year. Davis has been an up-and-coming black Democratic leader, having been selected to second the nomination of Barack Obama at the 2008 Democratic convention in Denver.

But in 2009 he decided to vote against Obamacare because he viewed it as unworkable and too expensive. When he ran the next year in the Democratic primary for governor in Alabama, he was attacked as disloyal and defeated by a coalition of liberals, teachers’ unions, and old-style black political machines.

He told me that the voter suppression he most observed in his 68 percent African-American district was rampant fraud in counties with powerful political machines. To keep themselves in power, these machines would frequently steal the votes of members of minority groups. “I know it exists, I’ve had the chance to steal votes in my favor offered to me, and the people it hurts the most are the poor and those without power,” he said.

Davis made it clear in his speech to True the Vote that much of the opposition to voter-ID and ballot-integrity laws is a sad attempt to inject racism into the discussion and intimidate supporters of anti-fraud laws. “This is not a billy club, this is not a fire hose,” he told his audience while holding up his driver’s license. “Where is this notion that if I have a right [to vote], that I don’t have to be bothered with responsibility?” He concluded with an appeal for all sides to eschew racial appeals: “We have to be one country, but the way you become one country is you stop acting like a country that’s divided into different buckets and bases of people.”

Slow day at the B&T?

Artur Davis, who was [B]a Democratic congressman from Alabama until last year. Davis has been an up-and-coming black Democratic leader, having been selected to second the nomination of Barack Obama at the 2008 Democratic convention in Denver.

But in 2009 he decided to vote against Obamacare because he viewed it as unworkable and too expensive. When he ran the next year in the Democratic primary for governor in Alabama, he was attacked as disloyal and defeated by a coalition of liberals, teachers’ unions, and old-style black political machines.

He told me that the voter suppression he most observed in his 68 percent African-American district was rampant fraud in counties with powerful political machines. To keep themselves in power, these machines would frequently steal the votes of members of minority groups. “I know it exists, I’ve had the chance to steal votes in my favor offered to me, and the people it hurts the most are the poor and those without power,” he said.

Davis made it clear in his speech to True the Vote that much of the opposition to voter-ID and ballot-integrity laws is a sad attempt to inject racism into the discussion and intimidate supporters of anti-fraud laws. “This is not a billy club, this is not a fire hose,” he told his audience while holding up his driver’s license. “Where is this notion that if I have a right [to vote], that I don’t have to be bothered with responsibility?” He concluded with an appeal for all sides to eschew racial appeals: “We have to be one country, but the way you become one country is you stop acting like a country that’s divided into different buckets and bases of people.”

Ah, a man with common sense. I'd vote for him in a second.
Too bad he wasn't running against Obama in the 08 primary, oh that's right
he couldn't win, he's not a mind reader.