Still thinking about this one since Saturday.

Helped out on a shark charter Saturday. Good day, charter had fun, ended up with 12 blue sharks. Saw the biggest sea turtle ever, huge.

Steaming back to Scituate heading west a couple miles from the harbor a 45' cabin cruiser steaming North to Boston never yielded to me. I had to slow down and go around him.

This happens a couple times a year. I think people just don't know the rules of the road rather than are jerks.

Leaves me dumbfounded.

I'd say the opposite, jerks
The stuff I see,

Most don't have a clue. They can write a check, they can have a boat..... No idea of the wake they throw. And then they have attitude when you confront them. And I did go after one this weekend who was bearing down on me at 15K in a no wake 5mph zone. "It's our first time here" was their excuse......

I was on the drift Sunday off NPT. Some sailing F'er in a cat was headed straight for me. 100 ft away i laid on the horn. Guy quickly turned boat and looked at me like I was an ahole... people suck. Second time I've had a close call with a rag bagger. They ASSUME they ALWAYS have ROW. A$$h@t$

I think that a lot of the time those big power boats are on autopilot, without a lookout.

The fast ferry refused to yield to me about two weeks ago. I refused to give way and he was forced to slow to avoid getting closer while blasting the horn at me.
I showed him what number I thought he was, and then proceeded to give him quite an earful on ch-13. Saying how he must be texting behind the helm, not paying attention, and endangering his entire ship and that I was sure he can find a copy of Chapman's piloting where he picks up his paycheck!

Mike, do you mean the Salem ferry? I have been tempted to test all my expired flares across his bow........

NO, One of it's sister ships. they are all owned by BHC. It must be the training they receive.:sleeps:

I was taught the first rule of the road is "tonnage wins".
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Had a similar expirience last Thursday. I had my parents out fluke fishing. We were drifting and a fleet of big expensive sail boat proceeded to come with in 50 feet of us. They had Plenty of time and room to turn not another boat around me. I just threw my hands up at them and told them that they could see me from a mile away why is it nesasary to buzz me. All put there noses up at me like I was a peasent. One guy yelled back that smaller vessel gives way. Am I wrong? Or are they?
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Had a similar expirience last Thursday. I had my parents out fluke fishing. We were drifting and a fleet of big expensive sail boat proceeded to come with in 50 feet of us. They had Plenty of time and room to turn not another boat around me. I just threw my hands up at them and told them that they could see me from a mile away why is it nesasary to buzz me. All put there noses up at me like I was a peasent. One guy yelled back that smaller vessel gives way. Am I wrong? Or are they?
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If you are drifting and not under power, and they are under sail while not constrained by draft, I believe they have to give way to you.

I recall boats actively fishing have the right of way over sailboats.
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I recall boats actively fishing have the right of way over sailboats.
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Well, not exactly.......

A dragger working an area actively fishing yes you have to yield, he is restricted in mobility. A small cc actively fishing with no restriction, engine running, you need to give way to a sail boat.

But common sense should prevail where the sailboat could have made a move way prior to that.....

But common sense should prevail where the sailboat could have made a move way prior to that.....

agreed, but I never assume someone has common sense

Autopilot ON!

I was taught the first rule of the road is "tonnage wins".
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"Might has right"
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I think I remember back from class that a sailboat (while using its sail) has right of way regardless??

Other than that.....the person paying the most attention should be the one moving....:huh:,,,sux, but that's the way it is.

friend of mind got hit on his kayak last year while albie fishing - decent swells and the boat operator was paying attention to the fish and not looking at the water. My friend is lucky to be alive, he was uninjured!

Anyway, I generally stay the hell away from any boat traffic while I'm out in the yak and always assume boats don't see me!

I was out in pea-soup fog a couple of weeks ago...
I was going slow myself as it was that thick that although you could hear other boats, you couldn't see them unless they were seriously close.

I was well off the shoreline when suddenly I could make out a kayak-er in the very near distance...this guy had to be totally nutz. I almost got swiped by some idiot roaring by who didn't see me until the last second and I was laying on the horn in hopes he'd hear me (of course with his motor roaring, he never heard chit).....I mentioned to the kayak-er that he should move much closer to shore to avoid injury but he said/did nothing.

I give him a B+ for determination, but an A+ for stupidity.
Most people obey the rules the first season out.........after being exposed to everyone else who doesn't follow them....they follow suit. We're probably all guilty of it to some degree?

"Might has right"
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You can also be dead right
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I think I remember back from class that a sailboat (while using its sail) has right of way regardless??

Other than that.....the person paying the most attention should be the one moving....:huh:,,,sux, but that's the way it is.


A sail boat is at the lower end of the pecking order, just above power boats but most sailboat people think they are at the top of the order.
My opinion they are at the top of the stupidity order just below a Kayaker.
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A sailboat has right of way unless you are underway. It's that simple. If you are not under power and they think you have to yield, they can go f themselves.
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I don't know most of the rules but the majority fall under the banner of common sense. In my opinion, if you are out in fog without radar then there is a lack of just that,kayak or power. Sailboats fall under the banner of anal pores generally speaking,some real entitled jerks who beg for the one finger salute. Kayaks, I have stories....
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Lest we forget paddleboarders
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I was on the drift Sunday off NPT. Some sailing F'er in a cat was headed straight for me. 100 ft away i laid on the horn. Guy quickly turned boat and looked at me like I was an ahole... people suck. Second time I've had a close call with a rag bagger. They ASSUME they ALWAYS have ROW. A$$h@t$

Same thing happened to me Sunday near Beavertail. Asshats for sure.

Joe, we should coordinate better. I'm betting we were within 3 miles of each other. I went right at the Reef, you probably went left onto the reef. Bite was slow in any event.

Well, not exactly.......

A dragger working an area actively fishing yes you have to yield, he is restricted in mobility. A small cc actively fishing with no restriction, engine running, you need to give way to a sail boat.

But common sense should prevail where the sailboat could have made a move way prior to that.....

Sailboat under SAIL. If they are under power then the boat on the right has the right of way. BTW, I hate the sailboat folks. Bunch of self absorbed, elitist, ass&^%les.
As for draggers, WTF those guys are working. Of course I yield to them.

Sailboat under SAIL. If they are under power then the boat on the right has the right of way. BTW, I hate the sailboat folks. Bunch of self absorbed, elitist, ass&^%les.
As for draggers, WTF those guys are working. Of course I yield to them.

A sailboat has right of way unless you are underway. It's that simple. If you are not under power and they think you have to yield, they can go f themselves.
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No it is not that simple. If a vessel like a dragger is fishing and /or a vessel restricted in mobility then even a sailboat under sail has to stay out of the way, coming from the right has nothing to do with it..........yeah there are lots of rules.......

No it is not that simple. If a vessel like a dragger is fishing and /or a vessel restricted in mobility then even a sailboat under sail has to stay out of the way, coming from the right has nothing to do with it..........yeah there are lots of rules.......

Sorry . I didn't think I was talking to any dragger captains. :rotfl:
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No it is not that simple. If a vessel like a dragger is fishing and /or a vessel restricted in mobility then even a sailboat under sail has to stay out of the way, coming from the right has nothing to do with it..........yeah there are lots of rules.......

You misunderstood what I was saying. Take the dragger out of the discussion. Two boats under power, the one on the right beam of the other has the right of way. Below from Navigation Rules:

"There is a "pecking order" that can be used as a simplified memory aid to determine right of way for vessels
of different types. Get very familiar with this list, as it is important to understand it thoroughly. The lower most
vessel on the list is the give way vessel, and must stay out of the way of vessels that are higher on the list:

Overtaken vessel (top priority)

Vessels not under command
Vessels restricted in their ability to maneuver
Vessels constrained by draft
Fishing vessels engaged in fishing, with gear deployed
Sailing vessels
Power driven vessels"

exactly! There you go........ My point was that some of the guys think sailboats under sail 'always' have the ROW, which is not true.

Agreed!

exactly! There you go........ My point was that some of the guys think sailboats under sail 'always' have the ROW, which is not true.

Most Blow Boaters also think they have the ROW when they got their 2cyl 50hp diesel or kicker motor propelling the pos
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exactly! There you go........ My point was that some of the guys think sailboats under sail 'always' have the ROW, which is not true.

Most Blow Boaters also think they have the ROW when they got their 2cyl 50hp diesel or kicker motor propelling the pos
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Most Blow Boaters also think they have the ROW when they got their 2cyl 50hp diesel or kicker motor propelling the pos
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See it all the time Ron!!!

The small sailboats of the inner harbor intentionally alter coarse to force you to yield, like its some sort of power trip for them. They learn the hard way IDGAF if they hit me. Yuppie kids learning to sail I swear the very first thing they learn is "you have the right of way, now go out there and exercise your right"

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y250/thefishingfreak/Mobile%20Uploads/Screenshot_2016-08-03-10-32-17_zpsteao6dfa.png (http://s6.photobucket.com/user/thefishingfreak/media/Mobile%20Uploads/Screenshot_2016-08-03-10-32-17_zpsteao6dfa.png.html)
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Most Blow Boaters also think they have the ROW when they got their 2cyl 50hp diesel or kicker motor propelling the pos
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TRUTH

I look at boating like I drive defensive driving I keep my distance and head on a swivel its hard to argue with someone when you swimming

I think most blow boaters assume they have the ROW, once they put the rags up. Even if they have the motor running and the sails are hanging limp.

most kayakers have no idea of the risk of what they are doing, its pretty amazing actually. They just think they can go tooling around out there with no PFD and just have a laugh. I usually stay very close to shore and stay out of channels as much as possible (sometimes have to cross them of course).

The real yahoos out there on the north shore are the rowers (their backs face forward - like crew rowing) and they are way out there in the boat traffic its unreal. I've seen them in the fog too, paddleboarders too!

No qualms about it...kayakers, paddleboarders, skishindudes...they have every right to be out there, way out there too....but best they use their heads instead of lose them, one way or another.

Although I understand, .......it can get quite chaotic at RP when you have 1/2dz kayakers zig-zagging thru the parking lot on the point. Boats don't have brakes :huh:

Rules aren't always easy to decipher, with the correct word-twisting, they can be made to mean something different or at least lead one to believe...just like some of the rules of the road.

Clearly none of you guys have sailed based on what I'm reading and it appears many think it's as simple as hard about and changing tacks to get out of the way. Having raced sailboats in my youth, then running two sailboat lesson centers for Scituate and Hingham during college summer breaks and working crew on two delivers out of Ft. Lauderdale after college; I have decades of sailing experience.

In my youth on my International 110 and with a 10-15 mph breeze, I could quickly come about and change tacks, but even then it takes time to get back up to any kind of headway speed. Lighten the air and it's a slow process. Make the boat bigger and heavier with that same light air and you could have coffee and a donut in the time it takes to tack and change course. If this has to happen in a harbor with traffic, current and boats on moorings, it's best to hold course and maintain headway steam and let the guys under power yield. Now if this is outside and there is an ocean full of room, again why should a guy under sail power only yield to a guy under power? I've altered course dozens of times in a season in Vineyard sound in my boats and see no big deal in yielding to the guys under sail power only and am happy to do so.

Then there is the experience factor and who's on board, tacking a mid-large sailboat, a finicky hobiecat, or anything without too much experience isn't as simple as turning the wheel, or pushing the tiller hard over. Put up a spinnaker and it's getting a lot more challenging. I think you guys need some good aged cheese to go along with your wine, wah, wah, wah. Rules of the road have been the same since I was a kid and they are there for a reason, safety on the water for ALL.

Inside or out and a guy in a 30 foot sailboat is under power, as far as I'm concerned he's just another powerboat.

Typical blowboater hot air :bs: you're telling me those little inner harbor blowboats racing each other zigzagging all over the harbor feet from each other and rounding the marker buoys within inches making hairpin turns are difficult to mannuver. Doubtful.
They intentionally cross your bow for the same reasons the douche bag cyclists down Mass Ave ride 6 inches outside the bike lane. Because theiy're arseholes. Respectful sailboaters get treated with respect. Douche bag- blow boat- power trippin right-of-way nazis get shown the rubrail
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I grew up sailing, did allot of racing. fun, but fishing took over.

There is no need for a bigger sailboat with motor to be sailing into a harbor in the channel and threw the mooring area.

Hate that. Drop / hoist the sails outside the little harbor

Typical blowboater hot air :bs: you're telling me those little inner harbor blowboats racing each other zigzagging all over the harbor feet from each other and rounding the marker buoys within inches making hairpin turns are difficult to mannuver. Doubtful.
They intentionally cross your bow for the same reasons the douche bag cyclists down Mass Ave ride 6 inches outside the bike lane. Because theiy're arseholes. Respectful sailboaters get treated with respect. Douche bag- blow boat- power trippin right-of-way nazis get shown the rubrail
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They try to cross your bow because your boat throws a huge wake ;)
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I have many more thousands of miles under my belt on sailboat vs power. But times have changed.... In my youth, I couldn't wait for the old members of a club to die off, thinking things around there would be better.... How wrong I was. Now that club, from which I resigned from in 1996, is full of entitled sobs, known locally to the LEOs as heavy drinkers, and think they poop ice cream. Just because they can write the check doesn't mean they know anything. Even the ones who grew up with old timers' tutelage have attitude, be it power or sail. Did I mention that my brother and his tribe are members there? Apple doesn't fall far from the tree....(actually, one of his five kids get it...)
That said, having grown up in that very congested harbor, with any decent wind, I could put a small to medium (40') sailboat pretty much anywhere I want to, under sail! But most people these days don't pay attention in their daily lives! They want to make a left turn in their car and they don't even position the car so that traffic behind them can still pass.... Either they are on the phone, not paying attention, or just DON'T CARE... About anyone else. It is all about them, first and always. No rule followers being developed in this society of ours.
So we reap what we sow. Sail or power. Blow boat or stinkpot. Doesn't matter anymore than it does on the roadways. So I keep my eyes open, anticipating, expecting the other guy to do the worst. but if the opportunity does present itself, I will gladly sacrifice my beloved 20' CC if I think the arshole that fouls me can be my ticket to upgrade to a sweet ride like that of Mr Sea Dangles......

I agree no sailboat with the ability to power into the harbor in today's harbors should be coming in under sail, sails should come down at the outside channel markers, but many (any boat I raced) had no power and therefore should be given right of way. Nebe as one who raced smaller boats in the inner harbors in my teens, id agree with ample wind some can be quick and nimble and if not in a race could give way. Knowing how I was in my teens and still am today, my competitive spirit wouldn't allow me to give up on a race, unless some A-hole with too much power and the will to use it is about to run me downtown . You mean to tell me avoiding an occasional sailboat is that big a deal? I've personally had far more trouble and conflicts with pleasure boaters running over my lines, lobsterman threatening to do you harm because you are setting up a drift too close to their gear, or getting an earful from some captain Bly who thinks because he has paying clients on board I have no right fishing his reef. The 30 minutes in 20 years I might have lost by giving way to dozens of guys under sail is nothing.

I would absolutely love to own some of the POS as some like to call them, love the ocean but under sail without the noise of the outboards is something special.
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They try to cross your bow because your boat throws a huge wake ;)
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Valid point
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.....There is no need for a bigger sailboat with motor to be sailing into a harbor in the channel and threw the mooring area....

I heard from a respected Capt that once a sailboat enters a marked channel whether under sail or power is required to obey ALL the rules as if under power.

Y or N?

Sailboat vs. Powerboat

Remember that a sailboat running an engine, even if sails are up, is legally categorized as a powerboat. In a congested area it is best not to run the engine with sails still up, because captains of other boats may not be aware of your engine running and may assume you are operating under sailing rules.

The Rules are simple when a sailboat and a small recreational powerboat meet:

In most situations the sailing boat is the stand-on vessel and the powerboat must give way.
If the sailboat is overtaking a powerboat, the powerboat is the stand-on vessel and the sailboat must give way.
Any boat with more maneuverability must give way to any boat with less maneuverability (see below).
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Many years ago in Pleasant bay while heading out ducken in a 12' low freeboard boat powered with a mighty 3hp motor I had a cabin cruiser up on plain coming across my bow with big wakes.
One 12 gage shot across the bow was all the signal needed.
Still had to pick up deeks that went overboard but stayed afloat and wet

The long and short is IF you hold any USCG license no matter the size and you have a incident you will be the one under the microscope. You have something to take and the unlicensed operator does not.

That being said it does not alleviate the other mariner from prudent navigation as well as yourself. As much as right of way and who has it and when is concerned - know the rules and take a breath because everyone wants to come home at the end of the day

Oh and if you think the sail boaters are a pain in the ass just try towing a 440' oil barge 200' astern out of Castle Hill on a Sunday, Then you will hear some colorful language.

sol...

[QUOTE=Got Stripers;1105904]Clearly none of you guys have sailed based on what I'm reading

Not true! I crewed on a 39' Southern Cross (made by C. W. Ryder in Bristol) for years. I know how to sail and what it takes to tack. That's not the point. The point is when a Sailboat is under power they are required to obey the rules that apply to power boats because , "They are a power boat when they are running on aux power other than under sail. End of story....I think.

I heard from a respected Capt that once a sailboat enters a marked channel whether under sail or power is required to obey ALL the rules as if under power.

Y or N?

nope

[QUOTE=Got Stripers;1105904]Clearly none of you guys have sailed based on what I'm reading

Not true! I crewed on a 39' Southern Cross (made by C. W. Ryder in Bristol) for years. I know how to sail and what it takes to tack. That's not the point. The point is when a Sailboat is under power they are required to obey the rules that apply to power boats because , "They are a power boat when they are running on aux power other than under sail. End of story....I think.

Really never saw anyone make that point, but I'd agree as you saw by my post above, they should be under power entering a congested harbor and then they need to abide by the rules of the road like anyone else.

I know a lot of sailboat owners, my parents saved for years to buy a 39 foot Corbin hull and spent every free moment building what turned out to be a beautiful boat; they were so far removed from your description of "Blow Boaters" its not funny. Most of their friends in the Scituate Boat Club were the same hard working class people, who all just loved to sail and didn't want to hear an engine after clearing the breakwater.

I'd bet a lot of the high end fishing boats are a lot more money to buy and run then some of the sailboats I've admired every time I make my way out of Westport Harbor. I worked for a guy who would fit your description and his boat has brand new 300 HP four strokes on the back end and no sail bags in is slip locker. I really think the "most" is so far from the truth, I know far more hard working, truly nice genuine sailboaters than what you describe.

I guess it depends on who you have had experience with in life, I know more powerboat owners that fit that description then sailors. I guess now that I've downsized to a Kayak I will fit into someones generalized catagory of A-holes who shouldn't be forcing them to alter course or slow down so they don't capsize someone. That's all right, I will be happy to pass on a single finger salute as someone hell bent on getting to his fishing hole powers buy throwing a 2 foot wake my way.

I truly enjoy the sailboat on sailboat crime. Nothing like a couple blowboat capts yelling at each other.