Trump* himself told us that the president is accountable for bad things that happen on his watch.
At a Republican debate on February 13, 2016, Trump* got into an exchange with Jeb Bush in which he argued that President George W. Bush should have been impeached for the Iraq war and was responsible for the 9/11 attacks.

BUSH: And while Donald Trump* was building a reality TV show, my brother was building a security apparatus to keep us safe. And I’m proud of what he did.And he has had the gall to go after my brother.

TRUMP*: The World Trade Center came down during your brother’s reign, remember that.

BUSH: He has had the gall to go after my mother. Hold on. Let me finish. He has had the gall to go after my mother.

TRUMP*: That’s not keeping us safe. . . .

RUBIO: I just want to say, at least on behalf of me and my family, I thank God all the time it was George W. Bush in the White House on 9/11 and not Al Gore.

And you can—I think you can look back in hindsight and say a couple of things, but he kept us safe. And not only did he keep us safe, but no matter what you want to say about weapons of mass destruction, Saddam Hussein was in violation of U.N. resolutions, in open violation, and the world wouldn’t do anything about it, and George W. Bush enforced what the international community refused to do.

And again, he kept us safe, and I am forever grateful to what he did for this country.

TRUMP*: How did he keep us safe when the World Trade Center—the World—excuse me. I lost hundreds of friends. The World Trade Center came down during the reign of George Bush. He kept us safe? That is not safe. That is not safe, Marco. That is not safe.

RUBIO: The World Trade Center came down because Bill Clinton didn’t kill Osama bin Laden when he had the chance to kill him.

TRUMP*: And George Bush—by the way, George Bush had the chance, also, and he didn’t listen to the advice of his CIA.

So those are the rules of engagement, as laid out by Donald Trump* himself.

I’m sure you all received a mailing recently that was titled
Presidenf Trump’s Coronavirus:
Guidelines for America

When the CDC screws up, Trump* has nothing to do with it. Not his fault! When the CDC successfully sends out guidelines, they’ve literally got “President Trump’s” personal brand on them.

He can’t have it both ways, even though he’s trying to write his reality TV script to fit that narrative.

He did this.

He owns it.

Every expert (no that's not Trump) I see interviewed, whether it's on channel 5, fox channel 25, MSNBC, CNN and even Fox, who apparently didn't vet the responses they might expect from the latest expert they invited on, all state emphatically this administration dropped the ball early and often. I don't need to repeat all the messaging from Trump, it's part of the miserable record and when science speaks Trump covers his ears until the noise is deafening. Do I buy into Trump and Jim's arguement that if the limited China travel restrictions weren't taken millions would die, not in the least, but I do acknowledge that was a good first step. Sadly nothing followed but hunches, gut feelings, predictions of warm weather and miracles.

The experts knew what to expect, they knew early on what was needed to ID where this virus was expanding, they knew the importance of extensive and expanding testing and they predicted the shortages all those people on the front line are experiencing today if very early and proactive steps were not taken. The predictions now are even more disturbing as many feel that unless there is more of country wide shut down, this may be with us for months and then we can expect it coming back again in the fall as have most corona viruses.

Do I complain a lot on this issue as of late, you bet your a*ss I do, that's what this forum offers all of us a place to vent; it certainly isn't a forum for civil debate or discourse about politics. I blame this lame a*ss administration for us being in this place, when we could have been in a recovery mode after a peak had already been reached. This realty TV show host aka clown, has cost a lot of Americans their lives who may not have ever been exposed, I hope that doesn't include anyone in your family or your friends families, but that is the reality of this administration of poser's.

I hope and expect the 2020 election turnout will be massive and we can finally kiss this con man goodbye.

90% approval rating amongst his base?

Greatest President of our time!

Not surprising, seems his base here, feel he hasn't handled this badly at all. His base on it's own, isn't going to put him back in for another term.

Got Stripers -

"Do I buy into Trump and Jim's arguement that if the limited China travel restrictions weren't taken millions would die, not in the least"

First, it's a blatant lie to say that is "my" statement. I posted links to experts, including Fauci, who made that claim. It's their statement, not mine. But because that statement supports Trump, and for that reason alone, you have to trivialize it as my statement.

Second, you believe the experts who say we dropped the ball early, and ignore the experts who say the early ban made a big difference. In other words, you believe the experts who bash Trump, and ignore the experts who say he makes good calls.

I have no idea who to believe and who not to believe, there are "experts" who say we are overreacting terribly, there are experts who say we aren't doing enough. I literally have no idea who to believe. I have no basis to believe some over others. You base your decision on whether or not to trust an expert, on whether or not what he's saying is bashing Trump.

Pelosi and Diblasio, as recently as late February, were explicitly telling people to continue to gather in public places. you haven't uttered a syllable about this. It's all Trumps fault.

And Gov Cuomo and Newsom, both very liberal, are complimenting Trump. But MSNBC tells you he is incompetent, and by jiminy that's good enough.

The left and the media went berserk when he ordered the travel ban. If he had simultaneously shut down businesses and schools, what would they have said? And would you have disagreed when MSNBC ad CNN called him a clueless dictator? We will never know, yet we do know. You'd have been leading the charge that he was a lunatic.

Hindsight obviously suggests that we should have done more, earlier. But I didn't hear many people (anyone, in fact?) calling for that, back then. Again, Trump was bashed for doing the one thing he did. But the same people who bashed him for doing anything, are now saying he didn't do enough, and you suck it up like a Hoover Deluxe.

60% of those Gallup polled say he's doing a good job.

Not surprising, seems his base here, feel he hasn't handled this badly at all. His base on it's own, isn't going to put him back in for another term.

When the experts blame Trump because some poor idiot drank fish tank cleaner, do they lose any credibility at all with you? Any at all? A sane person not suffering from TDS, would stop listening to anyone who made that claim, just as a sane person would stop listening to Sean Hannity on Foxnews.

Ma had to fly to China to get masks. think about that.

JIM angain you fail to see Trumps actions and his inaction in totality ... you love to just bringing up the flight restrictions..
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Ma had to fly to China to get masks. think about that.

JIM angain you fail to see Trumps actions and his inaction in totality ... you love to just bringing up the flight restrictions..
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what i’m bringing up, is that last month the left went nuts that he was going too far, and today the same exact people are saying he didn’t do enough.

NO ONE on the left has held Pelosi or Diblasio for the reckless things they were telling their constituents to do. Why not?

once again, you’re trying to have it both ways.

not saying trump handled this well. it’s just funny that the left sees nothing wrong with attacking him for overreacting a few weeks ago, and now attacking him for under reacting. And none of you has sh*t to say about Pelosi or Diblasio. only trump. why is that?
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So much wasted energy, time and talent around here..

Kraft's plane, (one of them, with Patriots logo), was sent to pick up a reported 1.5 million masks... What we don't know is if Kraft paid for crew and fuel, and landing fees? Who paid for masks? Or who is going to distribute this 'order", and whose order is it?

What we do know is that the factory producing said masks is in China... China. Not Maine. Not North Carolina. China. And we know who is working to get Americans a better deal in trade... Maybe, just maybe, after this is all done with the virus, we will see things actually being manufactured here in the USA. The corporate greed of older boomers played its part in America not making anything within our borders anymore... This has to change...

So much wasted energy, time and talent around here..

Kraft's plane, (one of them, with Patriots logo), was sent to pick up a reported 1.5 million masks... What we don't know is if Kraft paid for crew and fuel, and landing fees? Who paid for masks? Or who is going to distribute this 'order", and whose order is it?

What we do know is that the factory producing said masks is in China... China. Not Maine. Not North Carolina. China. And we know who is working to get Americans a better deal in trade... Maybe, just maybe, after this is all done with the virus, we will see things actually being manufactured here in the USA. The corporate greed of older boomers played its part in America not making anything within our borders anymore... This has to change...

I have done all I can to buy American made products and if all Americans did that, vacationed in the US, ate out often and visit local mom and pop stores after this is over, it might send a message that will be heard.

When the experts blame Trump because some poor idiot drank fish tank cleaner, do they lose any credibility at all with you? Any at all? A sane person not suffering from TDS, would stop listening to anyone who made that claim, just as a sane person would stop listening to Sean Hannity on Foxnews.

I doubt any “experts” blame Trump for natural selection taking a dumbbell off the planet. Trumps inaction and messaging have and will continue to cost lives that would not have been lost. Even now with so many suffering, so many dying, so many now unemployed and worried about their future, our president is boasting about his TV ratings during the press conferences. He has demonstrated his entire life and term it’s all about him, the most shameful display in such a time.

Maybe, just maybe, after this is all done with the virus, we will see things actually being manufactured here in the USA. The corporate greed of older boomers played its part in America not making anything within our borders anymore... This has to change...

The My Pillow guy (1) makes everything in the USA, and (2) voluntarily re-tooled 75% of his production to making 50,000 masks a day. But he is to be mocked instead of being called a hero(not by you), because he had the audacity to mention religion.

It's not just huge CEO's who benefitted from making everything in China, we all benefitted from the lower prices. No one was forced to shop at Walmart, we all could have continued to shop at the mom and pops, but we all swarmed to Walmart because of the prices. If we make all that stuff here, prices go way up. I'm not saying I'm opposed to that, but prices will go way up. But so will quality.

I doubt any “experts” blame Trump for natural selection taking a dumbbell off the planet. Trumps inaction and messaging have and will continue to cost lives that would not have been lost. Even now with so many suffering, so many dying, so many now unemployed and worried about their future, our president is boasting about his TV ratings during the press conferences. He has demonstrated his entire life and term it’s all about him, the most shameful display in such a time.

"I doubt any “experts” blame Trump for natural selection taking a dumbbell off the planet"

CNN and MSNBC blamed him day and night. SO if a host can say that with a straight face, what kind of "experts" are they going to put on?

"our president is boasting about his TV ratings during the press conferences"

I agree it's pathetic when he does that, and it's why I have a really hard time watching him speak. He takes self-absorption to new levels, no doubt. But is that all he has done? Or did he also help usher in the largest relief bill in the history of the country as well? Did he also help establish a terrific relationship with the private sector, getting them to help? You left out that small detail. Again, you are hyper-fixated on his flaws (which are many), but you ignore his accomplishments (which are many).

I'd rather have a guy who gets huge private sector companies to help because they se him as an ally, and a guy who off the bat wanted to get cash into people's hands, even if he never stops patting himself on the back...over someone who has a less offensive style but can't get as many good things done.

I care about how my wife and my kids speak to me. When it comes to an executive who is far removed from me (my CEO or my president), I care waaaay more about results than about an abrasive or nauseating style. That's how I see Trump. An insulting and disgusting individual who gets things done that no one else could. I'm going to retire at least a year earlier because of Trump, than I would have if Hilary had won. I am 100% convinced of that.

So if he wants to brag about the size of his hands or his TV ratings, that will make me wince and turn the TV off, but it's not going to make me vote for Hilary. Or Biden.

And again, not a syllable about Pelosi and Diblasio. Zip.

"I doubt any “experts” blame Trump for natural selection taking a dumbbell off the planet"

CNN and MSNBC blamed him day and night. SO if a host can say that with a straight face, what kind of "experts" are they going to put on?

"our president is boasting about his TV ratings during the press conferences"

I agree it's pathetic when he does that, and it's why I have a really hard time watching him speak. He takes self-absorption to new levels, no doubt. But is that all he has done? Or did he also help usher in the largest relief bill in the history of the country as well? Did he also help establish a terrific relationship with the private sector, getting them to help? You left out that small detail. Again, you are hyper-fixated on his flaws (which are many), but you ignore his accomplishments (which are many).

I'd rather have a guy who gets huge private sector companies to help because they se him as an ally, and a guy who off the bat wanted to get cash into people's hands, even if he never stops patting himself on the back...over someone who has a less offensive style but can't get as many good things done.

I care about how my wife and my kids speak to me. When it comes to an executive who is far removed from me (my CEO or my president), I care waaaay more about results than about an abrasive or nauseating style. That's how I see Trump. An insulting and disgusting individual who gets things done that no one else could. I'm going to retire at least a year earlier because of Trump, than I would have if Hilary had won. I am 100% convinced of that.

So if he wants to brag about the size of his hands or his TV ratings, that will make me wince and turn the TV off, but it's not going to make me vote for Hilary. Or Biden.

And again, not a syllable about Pelosi and Diblasio. Zip.

If you consider news anchors on any station experts, it's no wonder you don't know who to believe.

These first two things ought to really scare you, I hope they are not a trend.

On the first day of tracking whether the new coronavirus model Dr. Birx is using is accurate, the data on the ground exceeded the highest end of the model for deaths and new cases by 15%+.

Today a frontline doctor at a major NYC hospital tells he lost his first patient this morning to rationing of care — not enough ventilators to go around. The lack of supplies and testing is real — and costing lives — no matter what the daily reality show tries to sell you.

Now look at just what did the Dems do or not do?
If you look a little bit you will find that the coronavirus danger was pushed publicly quite a bit.
It was pushed far more within the intel and public health community.

Just think what might have happened if there were WH press conferences and hard questions were asked by nasty reporters.

We will find that out eventually, this will be investigated.
Americans will want to know how so many died and what could have been done, it will likely be hundreds of thousands worse than Benghazi.

February 2nd
With fewer than a dozen cases reported, Mr. Trump said
in an appearance with Sean Hannity that the United States
had stopped the virus’s spread by restricting travel. “We
pretty much shut it down coming in from China,” he said.

Chris Murphy
@ChrisMurphyCT
Just left the Administration briefing on Coronavirus. Bottom line: they aren't taking this seriously enough.
Notably, no request for ANY emergency funding, which is a big mistake. Local health systems need supplies, training, screening staff etc. And they need it now.
10:09 AM · Feb 5, 2020

March 7th
With nearly every state reporting at least one case, a reporter
asked Mr. Trump whether he was concerned that the virus was
getting closer to the White House. Mr. Trump replied, “No, I’m
not concerned at all. No, I’m not. No, we’ve done a great job.”

Remember that the same people who had a problem with Hunter Biden’s qualifications are totally cool with the president’s know-nothing son-in-law playing a big role in solving a global pandemic. It’s almost like they’re completely unprincipled scumbags.

Nations around the world bought up the worlds supplies of PPE and ventilators starting in January, including ours. The administration dawdled.

Last week, a Trump administration official working to secure much-needed protective gear for doctors and nurses in the United States had a startling encounter with counterparts in Thailand.

The official asked the Thais for help—only to be informed by the puzzled voices on the other side of the line that a U.S. shipment of the same supplies, the second of two so far, was already on its way to Bangkok.

Now read the playbook and think about what could have been if the administration had listened to the people inside and outside the administration telling them before March.

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/6819268-Pandemic-Playbook.html

If you consider news anchors on any station experts, it's no wonder you don't know who to believe.

I don't consider them experts. But what I said was, the hosts and their producers, decide which "experts" to bring on their show. If you are comfortable trusting the expert selected by a host so demented that they blame Trump for someone drinking fish tank cleaner, that's your right. But obviously those hosts are as politically biased as anyone you will ever see on Fox. So forgive me if I'm skeptical of their experts, especially when other experts are saying the opposite.

You haven't told us why you believe the experts who coincidentally are bashing Trump...but you don't need to, we know why, and your avoidance of the question only makes it that much more obvious. When two groups of "experts" are saying the opposite thing, most people will side with those with whom they already agree.

Monday morning quarterbacking is pretty easy, not always fair. But how any people back in mid January were saying we needed to be in lockdown? 95% of the people I heard back then, said that Trumps travel ban was going too far, that the virus didn't warrant such a nationalist response.

Is there any special reason why you won't comment on Pelosi or Diblasio telling their constituents in late February, to continue to go to crowded public places?

I don't consider them experts. But what I said was, the hosts and their producers, decide which "experts" to bring on their show. If you are comfortable trusting the expert selected by a host so demented that they blame Trump for someone drinking fish tank cleaner, that's your right. But obviously those hosts are as politically biased as anyone you will ever see on Fox. So forgive me if I'm skeptical of their experts, especially when other experts are saying the opposite.

You haven't told us why you believe the experts who coincidentally are bashing Trump...but you don't need to, we know why, and your avoidance of the question only makes it that much more obvious. When two groups of "experts" are saying the opposite thing, most people will side with those with whom they already agree.

Monday morning quarterbacking is pretty easy, not always fair. But how any people back in mid January were saying we needed to be in lockdown? 95% of the people I heard back then, said that Trumps travel ban was going too far, that the virus didn't warrant such a nationalist response.

Is there any special reason why you won't comment on Pelosi or Diblasio telling their constituents in late February, to continue to go to crowded public places?

I’m not listening to news network hosts, the nuts on the view or late night with Maddow, I’m listening to experts in the field who have worked their entire lives in this field. To me and you are entitled to your opinion based on where you get your intel, the efforts to test and gear up happened far to late to get out in front of this. To compound things, the social distancing efforts were also late, but why would anyone feel the need when our president has downplayed this until just recently as it finally dawned on him crap this is bad.

I don’t follow what Nancy or others have or are saying during this, I’ve tried to weed out the noise and focus on listening to people in this field. I’d have to have a timeline and context to comment and guess what they are not the messaging a large part of Americans were listening to, back in February; the messaging from the top was their focus. It was bad then and only in the last two nightly briefings has it become more honest and real, too little to late IMHO.

I have to wonder if all the citizens of the world who are negatively affected by this virus are finding somebody to blame. It takes a very brave person to find a person to blame for this global pandemic. Thanks to Bitchslappedboy and GS and PaulS for standing up to Trump today. You are truly first responders and your sacrifice and heroism is noteworthy.👍🏿
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The My Pillow guy (1) makes everything in the USA, and (2) voluntarily re-tooled 75% of his production to making 50,000 masks a day. But he is to be mocked instead of being called a hero(not by you), because he had the audacity to mention religion.

It's not just huge CEO's who benefitted from making everything in China, we all benefitted from the lower prices. No one was forced to shop at Walmart, we all could have continued to shop at the mom and pops, but we all swarmed to Walmart because of the prices. If we make all that stuff here, prices go way up. I'm not saying I'm opposed to that, but prices will go way up. But so will quality.

Total lie he was commended for making masks. The he went of the rails and blew Trump as gods work please , and that's where was mocked

But Republicans love the owners of Walmart pence was there the other day ,, they. Can but wont even give their employees paid sick time ...

I have to wonder if all the citizens of the world who are negatively affected by this virus are finding somebody to blame. It takes a very brave person to find a person to blame for this global pandemic. Thanks to Bitchslappedboy and GS and PaulS for standing up to Trump today. You are truly first responders and your sacrifice and heroism is noteworthy.👍🏿
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Standing up for people I respect, people I admire, people with strong leadership skills, people who treat people with respect regardless, people who are emphatic for all is easy; Trump isn’t on that list. You opinion is registered and meaningless, but thanks MRI1.

I have done all I can to buy American made products and if all Americans did that, vacationed in the US, ate out often and visit local mom and pop stores after this is over, it might send a message that will be heard.

All those masks are for Massachusetts now Russia just sent more ventilators


TRUMP latest tweet. Let's see who jumps to his defense

Massive amounts of medical supplies, even hospitals and medical centers, are being delivered directly to states and hospitals by the Federal Government. Some have insatiable appetites & are never satisfied (politics?). Remember, we are a backup for them. They should ...have been stocked up and ready long before this crisis hit. Other states are thrilled with the job we have done. Sending many Ventilators today, with thousands being built. 51 large cargo planes coming in with medical supplies. Prefer sending directly to hospitals.

I have done all I can to buy American made products and if all Americans did that, vacationed in the US, ate out often and visit local mom and pop stores after this is over, it might send a message that will be heard.

All great ideas here and I am being serious. I love seeing the manufacturing being brought back also.
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I have to wonder if all the citizens of the world who are negatively affected by this virus are finding somebody to blame. It takes a very brave person to find a person to blame for this global pandemic. Thanks to Bitchslappedboy and GS and PaulS for standing up to Trump today. You are truly first responders and your sacrifice and heroism is noteworthy.👍🏿
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Are you referring to the pandemic you dismissed until recently..

It took an innovative governor and a NE Patriot to circumvent the feds outbidding our state.
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Are you referring to the pandemic you dismissed until recently..

Show me an example of dismissing this Wayne.
Did I say “whoa is me”?
No
Did I blame somebody?
No
You can find plenty of posts where I said it’s gonna get worse.
But that is not dismissive, is it?
Please do a search to back up your claim and then report back.
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I have to wonder if all the citizens of the world who are negatively affected by this virus are finding somebody to blame. It takes a very brave person to find a person to blame for this global pandemic. Thanks to Bitchslappedboy and GS and PaulS for standing up to Trump today. You are truly first responders and your sacrifice and heroism is noteworthy.����
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I posted one time mocking you with your "greatest Pres" quip.

Is it any wonder that I think you are a vile scummy person?

What is your sacrifice?

I posted one time mocking you with your "greatest Pres" quip.

Is it any wonder that I think you are a vile scummy person?

What is your sacrifice?

He didn’t get his new boat in the water, saving gas for those that need it.

Plenty of gas around.
I need to get the bottom painted before she is splashed. Also looking in to having the motors painted white. They will go through the motors in the next few days so they meet expectations. Plugs,cooling system,belt, whatever needs love will get attention.
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I have to wonder if all the citizens of the world who are negatively affected by this virus are finding somebody to blame. It takes a very brave person to find a person to blame for this global pandemic. Thanks to Bitchslappedboy and GS and PaulS for standing up to Trump today. You are truly first responders and your sacrifice and heroism is noteworthy.👍🏿
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Are you so clueless that you think Trump* was not told how dangerous this was in January?
That there was no reason that the other developed nations bought up all the ventilators and PPE starting in January?
We gladly sold them everyone we could and that nobody paid any attention to why the demand increased exponentially.

Remember the guy who said three weeks ago that in America “we will be down to almost zero people infected by Coronavirus within days” but now we’re talking about 200,000 or more Americans dying in the next months. It almost feels like Coronavirus wasn’t the hoax he claimed it to be.

Every one of these press conferences is a rebuke to every person who thought that it would be awesome to have a complete amateur in charge of a superpower.

We're now being briefed on the biggest threat to American life since Vietnam by the membership of Trumps country club.

Here's the takeaway from Jared Kushner's book report: we did not start active response phase of dealing with this crisis until 13 days ago.

13 days!

Coming tomorrow, we will probably have the Barron briefing on using FLOTUS scarfs to prevent infection.

I'm glad you are impressed with yourself, tell me again about Italy.

Here's what you posted March 3rd, complaining that I dared to say we need to do more.

"59 million and burdened with widespread virus
327 million and still isolated cases"

Tomorrow that will be a month ago and the numbers below will be higher.
The numbers now for the US
243,970 infected, up 14% today
6000 dead

You are just plain stupid.

Plenty of gas around.
I need to get the bottom painted before she is splashed. Also looking in to having the motors painted white. They will go through the motors in the next few days so they meet expectations. Plugs,cooling system,belt, whatever needs love will get attention.
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OMG we were all worried, but so thankful your focus is on the important stuff, boy I certainly hope the floats get in soon so you can resume your privileged life.

If you thought this administration could not get any stupider, just wait a minute.

Jared Kushner says some governors don't know how many ventilators they have & coronavirus outbreak is revealing manager skills.

"What a lot of the voters are seeing now is that when you elect somebody...think about who will be a competent manager during the time of crisis."

OK, coming next month states should think about having nuclear weapons, tanks, warcraft and standing armies.
Why would anyone think that the federal government should have any responsibility for national security?
Just caravans and drugs in the Caribbean

It’s every governor and state is on their own, I’m so happy to see ours found a way to get our first responders and health care workers the supplies they need. F*ck Trump and his entire inept administration and family.

How is it remotely acceptable to the country that the president’s unaccountable son-in-law address the nation and serve in a decision-making role in a generational crisis of historic magnitude for which he has no requisite qualifications, preparation or experience?

This will not end well for Jared. Young Damien Thorn's past efforts have resulted in contempt for him. This one, with lives at stake, here in the US, will result in him becoming one of the most reviled public figures in modern memory in this country.

Are you so clueless that you think Trump* was not told how dangerous this was in January?
That there was no reason that the other developed nations bought up all the ventilators and PPE starting in January?
We gladly sold them everyone we could and that nobody paid any attention to why the demand increased exponentially.

Remember the guy who said three weeks ago that in America “we will be down to almost zero people infected by Coronavirus within days” but now we’re talking about 200,000 or more Americans dying in the next months. It almost feels like Coronavirus wasn’t the hoax he claimed it to be.

Every one of these press conferences is a rebuke to every person who thought that it would be awesome to have a complete amateur in charge of a superpower.

We're now being briefed on the biggest threat to American life since Vietnam by the membership of Trumps country club.

Here's the takeaway from Jared Kushner's book report: we did not start active response phase of dealing with this crisis until 13 days ago.

13 days!

Coming tomorrow, we will probably have the Barron briefing on using FLOTUS scarfs to prevent infection.

I'm glad you are impressed with yourself, tell me again about Italy.

Here's what you posted March 3rd, complaining that I dared to say we need to do more.

"59 million and burdened with widespread virus
327 million and still isolated cases"

Tomorrow that will be a month ago and the numbers below will be higher.
The numbers now for the US
243,970 infected, up 14% today
6000 dead

You are just plain stupid.

I know about the numbers Bitchslappedboy. Do you think copy and paste makes you a smart person? When I made that post it was accurate. Is your head on fire or something?
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OMG we were all worried, but so thankful your focus is on the important stuff, boy I certainly hope the floats get in soon so you can resume your privileged life.
I was just responding to your comment. Also,there are no floats at my marina.Please go back to whining so you can be SBs imaginary first responder. ⛑
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How is it remotely acceptable to the country that the president’s unaccountable son-in-law address the nation and serve in a decision-making role in a generational crisis of historic magnitude for which he has no requisite qualifications, preparation or experience?

This will not end well for Jared. Young Damien Thorn's past efforts have resulted in contempt for him. This one, with lives at stake, here in the US, will result in him becoming one of the most reviled public figures in modern memory in this country.
He is clearly the greatest president of our lifetime.
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He is clearly the greatest president of our lifetime.
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MRI1 speaks we are thankful for you contributions and wisdom.:jump:

He is clearly the greatest president of our lifetime.
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Do you smoke meth?
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I know about the numbers Bitchslappedboy. Do you think copy and paste makes you a smart person? When I made that post it was accurate. Is your head on fire or something?
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Dingleberry,
Glad you are proud of your support of the Trump administration, it has often been described as “malevolence tempered by incompetence.”

I think now that we have a crisis not of his own doing, the COVID-19 version of that is “incompetence exacerbated by malevolence.”

We have now reached the final result of blind loyalty and pathetic politicians. I don’t see how either what was formerly the Republican party or their claims of conservatism recovers from what we have seen over the last three years—but especially the last three months.

I think MRI1 likely snorts Adderall, that's the cool thing for Trumplicans.

Pelosi and Diblasio, as recently as late February, were explicitly telling people to continue to gather in public places. you haven't uttered a syllable about this. It's all Trumps fault.


Like other Progressives who were way sooner on top of the pandemic before Trump was:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emyNXZ8v8sY

So now it's but Nancy......but you obfuscate the fact that the NSC, CDC and DHS all report to the administration and he ignored or chose to believe his good friend, the Chinese leader, rather than the information he was given.

Perhaps the political appointees he surrounded himself with did not want to upset him?

Or is it that he was busy with the impeachment, can't multitask and couldn't perform his job like McConnell said.

He's toast, let's try and not let him toast us on the way out.

He is still lying and helping it spread
Today, the president pushed back against the suggestion of suspending domestic plane and rail travel by saying passengers on planes and trains are getting tested twice, before departure and after arrival.

They are not being tested at all.

Do you smoke meth?
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No, but I have a beautiful double grape ready to chop.👍🏿
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Dingleberry,
Glad you are proud of your support of the Trump administration, it has often been described as “malevolence tempered by incompetence.”

I think now that we have a crisis not of his own doing, the COVID-19 version of that is “incompetence exacerbated by malevolence.”

We have now reached the final result of blind loyalty and pathetic politicians. I don’t see how either what was formerly the Republican party or their claims of conservatism recovers from what we have seen over the last three years—but especially the last three months.

You don’t see a lot Bitchslappedboy. But that won’t stop you from voting for your mailman.
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MRI1 speaks we are thankful for you contributions and wisdom.:jump:

⛑👍🏿🐰
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2016: But her emails
2017: But Gorsuch
2018: But the stock market
2019: But socialism
2020: But only 200,000 Americans dead
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Dingleberry
If you quit snorting Adderal, maybe you could sleep.
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So now it's but Nancy......but you obfuscate

It's not but Nancy . . . it IS Nancy (and several others, but you'd have to watch the video to see that). Now Nancy the conniving hypocrite is ginning up yet another "investigation" of Trump about "what did he know and when did he know it." Apparently, she and the other libs in the video "downplaid" the pandemic before Trump did and now accuse him of it. And then you, like a wind-up toy, obfuscate all that by turning on the usual canned anti Trump babble stored in your head . . . blah, blah, blah.

Hobby Lobby Keeps Disobeying State Stay-at-Home Orders

Must be religious rights argument
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It’s every governor and state is on their own, I’m so happy to see ours found a way to get our first responders and health care workers the supplies they need. F*ck Trump and his entire inept administration and family.

(1) if you previously thought that the federal government can ever be all things to 300 million people spread across a continent, I assume you were in a coma during hurricane Katrina.

(2) the feds aren't doing "nothing". The CDC is helping with testing research, the army corps of engineers is building a massive number of hospital beds, two massive navy hospital ships have been deployed, the feds have enacted policy which allows them to direct private companies to help.

3M has been selling masks to foreign countries instead of selling them to states desperate to buy them. I hope we all remember that when this is over.

FACT CHECK: Trump Claims U.S. Testing For Coronavirus Most Per Capita — It's No.

Shocking more lies
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Hobby Lobby Keeps Disobeying State Stay-at-Home Orders

Must be religious rights argument
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I heard something about that, I wonder what the heck they are thinking?

I'm sure you don't know either, but again it's interesting that your instinct is to blame religion, then on the other side of your mouth you say religion isn't being attacked. Trying to have it both ways.

I heard something about that, I wonder what the heck they are thinking?

I'm sure you don't know either, but again it's interesting that your instinct is to blame religion, then on the other side of your mouth you say religion isn't being attacked. Trying to have it both ways.

God spoke to him (the owner). That was the report as to why he stayed open originally.

Looks like they are closing now.
https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/hobby-lobby-closes-coronavirus-orders

(1) if you previously thought that the federal government can ever be all things to 300 million people spread across a continent, I assume you were in a coma during hurricane Katrina.

(2) the feds aren't doing "nothing". The CDC is helping with testing research, the army corps of engineers is building a massive number of hospital beds, two massive navy hospital ships have been deployed, the feds have enacted policy which allows them to direct private companies to help.

3M has been selling masks to foreign countries instead of selling them to states desperate to buy them. I hope we all remember that when this is over.
So no issues with fema outbidding states

But take issue with 3m selling to the highest bidder ..

Why are bids even an allowed, why not have Trump fix the price they can charge
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(1) if you previously thought that the federal government can ever be all things to 300 million people spread across a continent, I assume you were in a coma during hurricane Katrina.

(2) the feds aren't doing "nothing". The CDC is helping with testing research, the army corps of engineers is building a massive number of hospital beds, two massive navy hospital ships have been deployed, the feds have enacted policy which allows them to direct private companies to help.

3M has been selling masks to foreign countries instead of selling them to states desperate to buy them. I hope we all remember that when this is over.

Catch up isn’t what the country needed, this will be harder, longer and more deadly due to this administrations slow response to acknowledge, to properly message and to gear up. It’s NOT in catchup due to what other politicians and governors said early on, most were not privy to intel and they like everyone else take their lead from the top.

2016: But her emails
2017: But Gorsuch
2018: But the stock market
2019: But socialism
2020: But only 200,000 Americans dead
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2021: But I thought my mailman would win
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It's not but Nancy . . . it IS Nancy (and several others, but you'd have to watch the video to see that). Now Nancy the conniving hypocrite is ginning up yet another "investigation" of Trump about "what did he know and when did he know it." Only in America could 200,000 dead be less of a catastrophe than 30,000 emails or 4 dead in Benghazi Apparently, she and the other libs in the video "downplaid" the pandemic before Trump did and now accuse him of it. And then you, like a wind-up toy, obfuscate all that by turning on the usual canned anti Trump babble stored in your head . . . blah, blah, blah.

Not anti-Trump, it's pro USA. The path of destruction that the incompetent Trump has left in his wake is now becoming apparent to anyone willing to look.
He should have been gone, we now suffer the consequences of his incompetence and lack of even a basic understanding of how government actually works.

Trump, the “wartime president” yesterday said, “We’re a backup.”

Remember when Franklin Roosevelt said “We’re a backup” and states have to win WW2.

But we can all rest easy. The boy who read 25 books and brought peace to the Middle East, and conquered the Opioid Crisis is taking on the most deadly virus in our lifetime. I for one am breathing a sigh of relief.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NezEbDx4B9A

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-52145270/how-trump-s-attitude-toward-coronavirus-has-shifted?intlink_from_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.bbc.com %2Fnews%2Fworld%2Fus_and_canada&link_location=live-reporting-map

2021: But I thought my mailman would win
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you only have to wind them up a little and they'll go ALL day long...:rotf2:

Brains of rubber
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I see MRI1+2 are playing dingdong again

This is what government looks like. Today during a crisis both federal and state



And Republicans think less Government is better?

Looking at this crisis I can only see that idea as crazier, than it was before this and it was crazy then

This is what government looks like. Today during a crisis both federal and state



And Republicans think less Government is better?

Looking at this crisis I can only see that idea as crazier, than it was before this and it was crazy then

Non sequitur. The total scope of government is a different concern than the amount of power within constitutionally allowed government.

China, for instance, under CCP rule has unlimited scope of government power. China does not suffer from less government. It's government is in total control of the entire society. Does China, with more government, "look like," as you put it, what you would want today.

This is what government looks like. Today during a crisis both federal and state



And Republicans think less Government is better?

Looking at this crisis I can only see that idea as crazier, than it was before this and it was crazy then

yes, this is why the liberal
places like CT and IL are in such fine shape.

conservatives want less government, in areas where people
can do just fine by themselves. no one is saying we should do away with government altogether? can you make a single post in his forum that’s not ridiculous?
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yes, this is why the liberal
places like CT and IL are in such fine shape.

conservatives want less government, in areas where people
can do just fine by themselves. :bs: no one is saying we should do away with government altogether? can you make a single post in his forum that’s not ridiculous?
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No kidding their not saying no government their saying only the government they like and want

So theses Republican governors who have no restrictions in place, I should assume they can do fine by themselves, and the government shouldn't help them if this goes sideways on them ..

God spoke to him (the owner). That was the report as to why he stayed open originally.

Looks like they are closing now.
https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/hobby-lobby-closes-coronavirus-orders

is that really what he said?
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No kidding their not saying no government their saying only the government they like and want

So theses Republican governors who have no restrictions in place, I should assume they can do fine by themselves, and the government shouldn't help them if this goes sideways on them ..

the republican governors with no restrictions, in my opinion, are being reckless. very reckless.

but conservatives are not opposed to governments at all
levels taking steps to be prepared for these kinds of emergencies. even diehard libertarians don’t oppose this.

you need to learn a bit more about the basics. i don’t have any idea where you get them information you use to form your opinions if conservatives, but you’re being misinformed. instead of letting msnbc tell you what conservatives think, why not ask a conservative? you are comically, very misinformed.
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yes, this is why the liberal
places like CT and IL are in such fine shape.
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I would take Connecticut in the heartbeat over the majority of those red States. After all look at the incompetent President they helped elect.
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Non sequitur. The total scope of government is a different concern than the amount of power within constitutionally allowed government.

China, for instance, under CCP rule has unlimited scope of government power. China does not suffer from less government. It's government is in total control of the entire society. Does China, with more government, "look like," as you put it, what you would want today.

Typical response jumping right to communism..

How would less government improve what we are seeing

Not saying more government is the right answer.

But for Trump to suggest the federal government is just a back up in this situation :bs:

He wants to be a leader only when winning. When things go south no so much


That navy Captain just fired is the example of a True leader , Placing the care and treatment of his men , Above his own self intrest

Trump is unable to do such a thing it's not his nature

I would take Connecticut in the heartbeat over the majority of those red States
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who cares?

CT, one of the most beautiful states in the nation, is one of the few states that’s losing population. CT has so much going for
it, people should be fighting to get here. But they’re fleeing.

one persons opinion doesn’t make that wrong.

Our debt is also tens of thousands of dollars for every single
human being in the state. Did conservative economic
principles generate that massive debt, or liberal economic principles.


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who cares?

CT, one of the most beautiful states in the nation, is one of the few states that’s losing population. CT has so much going for
it, people should be fighting to get here. But they’re fleeing.

one persons opinion doesn’t make that wrong.

Our debt is also tens of thousands of dollars for every single
human being in the state. Did conservative economic
principles generate that massive debt, or liberal economic principles.


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Then leave.

As we have discussed dozens of times it is bc of the superior services provided in this liberal state. there are many facts that indicate people are better off in liberals states but you continue to harp on taxes while ignoring the better education and higher pay you get here.

the republican governors with no restrictions, in my opinion, are being reckless. very reckless.

but conservatives are not opposed to governments at all
levels taking steps to be prepared for these kinds of emergencies. even diehard libertarians don’t oppose this.

you need to learn a bit more about the basics. i don’t have any idea where you get them information you use to form your opinions if conservatives, but you’re being misinformed. instead of letting msnbc tell you what conservatives think, why not ask a conservative? you are comically, very misinformed.
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Jim its happened in real time look at those Governors,,,, what other reason have they given ?.. why they have chosen to what their doing

Alabama Governor Kay Ivey, who just last week rejected any statewide action because “Y’all, we are not California. We’re not New York. We aren’t even Louisiana,


Thought this was spot on with some of these Governors so concerned with not upsetting Trumps base


I’d be happy to stand with the president,” the governor would quip, “if he’d just stand in the same place.”

Another indication how sleazy this admin. is. Read the full article

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/the-trump-administration-just-changed-its-description-of-the-national-stockpile-to-jibe-with-jared-kushners-controversial-claim/ar-BB1288Bx?li=BBnb7Kz

The Trump administration on Friday changed its description of the Strategic National Stockpile on a government website after journalists noted that it contradicted a claim Jared Kushner had made about the program.

Kushner on Thursday evening offered a novel argument about the national stockpile. He said some states still had stockpiles that they hadn’t been employing for the coronavirus outbreak and that localities should go to them first. And then he suggested that the national stockpile wasn’t even meant for them.

“And the notion of the federal stockpile was it’s supposed to be our stockpile,” Kushner said. “It’s not supposed to be states’ stockpiles that they then use.”

As reporters quickly noted, that didn’t match with how the Department of Health and Human Services was describing the program. On its website, it said, “Strategic National Stockpile is the nation’s largest supply of life-saving pharmaceuticals and medical supplies for use in a public health emergency severe enough to cause local supplies to run out.” It continued to say, "When state, local, tribal, and territorial responders request federal assistance to support their response efforts, the stockpile ensures that the right medicines and supplies get to those who need them most during an emergency.”

“The Strategic National Stockpile’s role is to supplement state and local supplies during public health emergencies,” it now says. “Many states have products stockpiled, as well. The supplies, medicines, and devices for life-saving care contained in the stockpile can be used as a short-term stopgap buffer when the immediate supply of adequate amounts of these materials may not be immediately available.”

Jim its happened in real time look at those Governors,,,, what other reason have they given ?.. why they have chosen to what their doing

Alabama Governor Kay Ivey, who just last week rejected any statewide action because “Y’all, we are not California. We’re not New York. We aren’t even Louisiana,


Thought this was spot on with some of these Governors so concerned with not upsetting Trumps base


I’d be happy to stand with the president,” the governor would quip, “if he’d just stand in the same place.”

"
Jim its happened in real time look at those Governors,,,, what other reason have they given ?.. why they have chosen to what their doing"

They've said very clearly why they haven't imposed severe restrictions, and it's not because conservatives want less government. It's because in those states, governors feel the counts aren't high enough to justify crushing the state economy. It's not because they're conservative, it's because they don't feel thigs are that bad yet. I think its a dangerous gamble, but if the counts remain low in those states, the small business owners and employees will be very glad the governors did what they did. There are scientists who feel that the measures taken in most states are going too far. I don't happen to agree with them, but there are scientists who are still saying that. There's a chance that when all is said and done, we'll conclude that we didn't need to shut down the economy. In fact I hope that's what happens, because that would mean the virus wasn't catastrophic. Does that make sense?

"“Y’all, we are not California. We’re not New York. We aren’t even Louisiana"

and he's talking about not having as many sick people. It's math, not politics.

Then leave.

As we have discussed dozens of times it is bc of the superior services provided in this liberal state. there are many facts that indicate people are better off in liberals states but you continue to harp on taxes while ignoring the better education and higher pay you get here.

You don't get it. Rather, you won't admit you get it, because that would dispute your "point"...it doesn't matter if I stay or go, of if you like it here or not. What matters is that a beautiful and convenient state, is one of the nation's leaders in population loss over the last 10 years. There is only 1 explanation for why this is happening in such a beautiful place with so much opportunity. You just can't say it out loud, like most liberals (note I didn't say all) you cannot process even the most obvious empirical data unless it serves your agenda.

When clinging to your beliefs requires you to deny facts that are staring you in the face, maybe ask why you believe what you believe. I was a registered democrat when I graduated from college, because it made a lot of sense to me to eliminate poverty by just taking a tiny bit more from billionaires who wouldn't miss it. Who could oppose something so obvious? but the thing is, it doesn't work. It just doesn't work. It has never worked, not once. So I stopped believing that was the answer.

"bc of the superior services provided in this liberal state.'

What planet do you live on, exactly? Ask just about anyone who works in state social services how their budget has changed in the last 10 years here in CT. Budgets are cut across the board, services offered to our needy neighbors being cut across the board. State funding to universities cut massively across the board.

You can't help anyone, when you're broke.

"there are many facts that indicate people are better off in liberals states "

Then why are successful people leaving (in general) liberal states, and moving to (in general) conservative states? Because they're too stupid to see that CT is better than the suburbs of Charlotte?

You don't get it and constantly ignore the facts that other than taxes (cost of living) things are much better in the liberal states than the conservative states.

The colder states lose pop. when people are retiring and moving south to the warmer climates.

Clearly the greatest president of our generation
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You don't get it and constantly ignore the facts that other than taxes (cost of living) things are much better in the liberal states than the conservative states.

The colder states lose pop. when people are retiring and moving south to the warmer climates.

"facts that other than taxes (cost of living) things are much better in the liberal states than the conservative states"

Sure, drugs, crime, poverty, fatherlessness, suicide, none f those thigs exist in liberal places.

"The colder states lose pop. when people are retiring and moving south to the warmer climates"


If that were it, NH would also be losing population. Yet in the nice suburbs, they cannot build $600,000 houses fast enough. Also doesn't explain the population exodus from CA. What does explain it, is that people are realizing that it's not necessary to overpay for a good quality of life.

Typical response jumping right to communism..

I didn't jump to communism. I pointed out that more government does not equate to better solutions.

How would less government improve what we are seeing

The amount of government is not the answer.

Not saying more government is the right answer.

I don't know what you're saying here.

But for Trump to suggest the federal government is just a back up in this situation :bs:

He has done more than "just" back up. But back up is a big portion of what the federal government is supposed to do in cases of pandemic. See post 6 in the Welcome to seat of the pants government thread.


He wants to be a leader only when winning. When things go south no so much

Yeah, right.

That navy Captain just fired is the example of a True leader , Placing the care and treatment of his men , Above his own self intrest

Trump is unable to do such a thing it's not his nature

Good to know that we have such expert insights as yours on this forum. But I do prefer, personally, that the President's personal interests don't get in the way of executing the duties as prescribed in Article II.

Job #1 is ratings

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
·
Mar 29
“President Trump is a ratings hit. Since reviving the daily White House briefing Mr. Trump and his coronavirus updates have attracted an average audience of 8.5 million on cable news, roughly the viewership of the season finale of ‘The Bachelor.’ Numbers are continuing to rise...

Friend of Murderers

Just spoke to my friend MBS (Crown Prince) of Saudi Arabia, who spoke with President Putin of Russia, & I expect & hope that they will be cutting back approximately 10 Million Barrels, and maybe substantially more which, if it happens, will be GREAT for the oil & gas industry!

Coming soon.............Infrastructure week

from the daily misinformation rally

He could keep himself out of so much trouble if he just read what was put in front of him instead of trying to riff on it and sound smarter or more informed than he is.

"We continue to study the effectiveness of hydroxychloroquine," Trump says, reading, and will keep Americans updated.

Then, ad-libbing, he says, "I don't know, it's looking like it's having some good results."

Trump is clear as mud on cloth masks. CDC recommends all Americans wear cloth masks when they're out. "It's probably good. I'm not going to do it. You can if you want.

Trump continuing to ad-lib vague optimism: "Stay at home. This is ending. This will end. You'll some bad things...and some really good things. It's not going to be too long."

Trump says hospitals and healthcare providers treating uninsured patients with coronavirus will be reimbursed by the federal government through the CARES Act (remember that)

Trump is prohibiting the export of “scare medical supplies” like N95 respirators, surgical masks, gloves and other PPE through the Defense Production Act. (3 months after other countries)

It is so disconcerting watching the president deliver important news, and being surprised by it because he is reading it for the first time as he’s trying to tell us about it.

-Why aren’t you wearing a face mask?

-I just can’t sit behind that beautiful Resolute desk wearing a mask.

That wasn’t actually the recommendation, of course.
Surgeon general now trying to step in and do cleanup.

Hard to imagine another President that would personally reject a CDC guideline.

Maybe Fillmore.

And because we know you love her so much, let me present......
Nancy Pelosi
We’re up to about 90% of Americans being under shelter-in-place orders. It should be 100 percent.

Great work Bitchslappedboy
😷
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Another comment from the MRI1
Karma is a funny thing

Sure, drugs, crime, poverty, fatherlessness, suicide, none f those thigs exist in liberal places.



No one claimed that the liberal states don't have those problems but liberal states have less crime less suicide less poverty and less drugs abuse, less fatherlessness, than conservative States.

I think you need to ask yourself the following:

When clinging to your beliefs requires you to deny facts that are staring you in the face, maybe ask why you believe what you believe
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Another comment from the MRI1
Karma is a funny thing

Not as funny as watching the Bitchslappedboy flail.
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That navy Captain just fired is the example of a True leader , Placing the care and treatment of his men , Above his own self intrest




"Modly said Crozier had cc’ed more than 20 people, including some outside the chain of command, over unsecured and unclassified systems, assuring the memo’s leak.

He also said Crozier did not speak to his direct superior, carrier strike group commander Rear Adm. Stuart Baker, about his concerns before sending the memo, despite Baker being on the carrier and living within feet of Crozier.

Modly said Crozier was not fired for expressing concerns, but the way he chose to do so.

The chain of command doesn’t exist merely to keep order. It also exists to keep information from the public. Crozier commanded one of only ten Nimitz-class nuclear-powered aircraft carriers in the Navy. These ships are considered the backbone of America’s naval fighting force.

By going public with his complaints, Crozier essentially sent a giant banner up into the sky announcing to America’s enemies that one of the primary weapons in America’s arsenal might be out of commission. You can see, therefore, why the Navy took a very dim view of Crozier bypassing the chain of command to announce that he had a problem."

[QUOTE=wdmso;1189993]

That navy Captain just fired is the example of a True leader , Placing the care and treatment of his men , Above his own self intrest

[/QUOTE


"Modly said Crozier had cc’ed more than 20 people, including some outside the chain of command, over unsecured and unclassified systems, assuring the memo’s leak.

He also said Crozier did not speak to his direct superior, carrier strike group commander Rear Adm. Stuart Baker, about his concerns before sending the memo, despite Baker being on the carrier and living within feet of Crozier.

Modly said Crozier was not fired for expressing concerns, but the way he chose to do so.

The chain of command doesn’t exist merely to keep order. It also exists to keep information from the public. Crozier commanded one of only ten Nimitz-class nuclear-powered aircraft carriers in the Navy. These ships are considered the backbone of America’s naval fighting force.

By going public with his complaints, Crozier essentially sent a giant banner up into the sky announcing to America’s enemies that one of the primary weapons in America’s arsenal might be out of commission. You can see, therefore, why the Navy took a very dim view of Crozier bypassing the chain of command to announce that he had a problem."

Like i said.put his men before himself..

I am sure he spoke to his chain of command. And was told to lay down so he went over their heads ..

And his cc to people so it would be leaked..

Please with the giveing info to the. Enemy is bs every family member knew what was going on, and where the ship was .

The Navy's playing damage control
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[QUOTE=wdmso;1189993]

That navy Captain just fired is the example of a True leader , Placing the care and treatment of his men , Above his own self intrest

[/QUOTE


"Modly said Crozier had cc’ed more than 20 people, including some outside the chain of command, over unsecured and unclassified systems, assuring the memo’s leak.

He also said Crozier did not speak to his direct superior, carrier strike group commander Rear Adm. Stuart Baker, about his concerns before sending the memo, despite Baker being on the carrier and living within feet of Crozier.

Modly said Crozier was not fired for expressing concerns, but the way he chose to do so.

The chain of command doesn’t exist merely to keep order. It also exists to keep information from the public. Crozier commanded one of only ten Nimitz-class nuclear-powered aircraft carriers in the Navy. These ships are considered the backbone of America’s naval fighting force.

By going public with his complaints, Crozier essentially sent a giant banner up into the sky announcing to America’s enemies that one of the primary weapons in America’s arsenal might be out of commission. You can see, therefore, why the Navy took a very dim view of Crozier bypassing the chain of command to announce that he had a problem."

Like i said.put his men before himself..

I am sure he spoke to his chain of command. And was told to lay down so he went over their heads ..

And his cc to people so it would be leaked.. please who leaked it if you know who got copies

giveing info to the. Enemy is bs every family member knew what was going on, and where the ship was .

The Navy's playing damage control
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

In an interesting twist of history, the aircraft carrier’s namesake was involved in a similar situation. During the summer of 1898, Colonel Theodore Roosevelt, U.S. Army, was leading the famed “Rough Riders” in Cuba. The Rough Riders were part of the Army’s Fifth Corps garrisoned near Santiago de Cuba. At the time, more than 4,000 of the Fifth Corps’ 4,270 soldiers were sick with malaria and yellow fever. Many were on the verge of dying. The eight divisional commanders, including Roosevelt, were convinced that if they remained in Cuba Fifth Corps would be wiped out.
The divisional commanders met with Major General William R. Shafter, Fifth Corps Commander, and requested that Fifth Corps immediately redeploy to the United States. While it is unclear how Shafter responded to the request, he was certainly aware that President McKinley wanted to maintain a military presence in Cuba until the United States was able to finish peace negotiations with Spain. Whatever his reaction, the divisional commanders left the meeting compelled to put their request in writing.

The writing allegedly fell to Colonel Roosevelt, as he was the lowest ranking officer among them and the only volunteer, which meant he had the least to lose, career-wise, in the event the chain of command was to react negatively to the letter. As documented in Roosevelt’s book The Rough Riders, published in 1899, the letter, known as the Round-Robin letter and signed by all of them, reads as follows:
MAJOR-GENERAL SHAFTER. SIR: In a meeting of the general and medical officers called by you at the Palace this morning we were all, as you know, unanimous in our views of what should be done with the army. To keep us here, in the opinion of every officer commanding a division or a brigade, will simply involve the destruction of thousands. There is no possible reason for not shipping practically the entire command North at once. Yellow-fever cases are very few in the cavalry division, where I command one of the two brigades, and not one true case of yellow fever has occurred in this division, except among the men sent to the hospital at Siboney, where they have, I believe, contracted it. But in this division there have been 1,500 cases of malarial fever. Hardly a man has yet died from it, but the whole command is so weakened and shattered as to be ripe for dying like rotten sheep, when a real yellow-fever epidemic instead of a fake epidemic, like the present one, strikes us, as it is bound to do if we stay here at the height of the sickness season, August and the beginning of September. Quarantine against malarial fever is much like quarantining against the toothache. All of us are certain that as soon as the authorities at Washington fully appreciate the condition of the army, we shall be sent home. If we are kept here it will in all human possibility mean an appalling disaster, for the surgeons here estimate that over half the army, if kept here during the sickly season, will die. This is not only terrible from the stand-point of the individual lives lost, but it means ruin from the stand-point of military efficiency of the flower of the American army, for the great bulk of the regulars are here with you. The sick list, large though it is, exceeding four thousand, affords but a faint index of the debilitation of the army. Not twenty per cent. are fit for active work. Six weeks on the North Maine coast, for instance, or elsewhere where the yellow-fever germ cannot possibly propagate, would make us all as fit as fighting-cocks, as able as we are eager to take a leading part in the great campaign against Havana in the fall, even if we are not allowed to try Porto Rico. We can be moved North, if moved at once, with absolute safety to the country, although, of course, it would have been infinitely better if we had been moved North or to Porto Rico two weeks ago. If there were any object in keeping us here, we would face yellow fever with as much indifference as we faced bullets. But there is no object. The four immune regiments ordered here are sufficient to garrison the city and surrounding towns, and there is absolutely nothing for us to do here, and there has not been since the city surrendered. It is impossible to move into the interior. Every shifting of camp doubles the sick-rate in our present weakened condition, and, anyhow, the interior is rather worse than the coast, as I have found by actual reconnoissance. Our present camps are as healthy as any camps at this end of the island can be. I write only because I cannot see our men, who have fought so bravely and who have endured extreme hardship and danger so uncomplainingly, go to destruction without striving so far as lies in me to avert a doom as fearful as it is unnecessary and undeserved. Yours respectfully,THEODORE ROOSEVELT, Colonel Commanding Second Cavalry Brigade.
Roosevelt delivered the letter to Shafter, but, presumably not convinced the corps commander would act on it in a timely fashion, also allegedly handed a copy of it to the Associated Press correspondent who was covering the Cuba beat. That correspondent quickly cabled the letter to AP headquarters and it published nationwide the same day.

The public outcry was overwhelming and unanimous in accusing the McKinley Administration of not caring about the troops. McKinley summoned his Secretary of War, Russell A. Alger, and vented his fury that the letter was leaked and ordered him to do what he could to make the problem go away.
Alger demurred when asked by the press whether the leak had caused him to react faster than he otherwise would have; however, he was on record as previously having asserted that no ships were available to bring Fifth Corps back from Cuba.
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[QUOTE=scottw;1190056]


I am sure he spoke to


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you don't know anything....

[QUOTE=wdmso;1190059]

you don't know anything....

I know enough that the captain in command of one the most powerful weapon in the US Military

Wouldn't have made these actions as his 1st choice . To address his concerns .

Unless all other choices were allready dead ends...

Why else whould he throw his future in the Navy down the Drain?
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I know enough that the captain in command of one the most powerful weapon in the US Military

Wouldn't have made these actions as his 1st choice . To address his concerns .

Unless all other choices were allready dead ends...

Why else whould he throw his future in the Navy down the Drain?
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This is a reasonable assumption.
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Agreed, but at the same time he knew there would be consequences. It was a sacrifice he could sleep with.
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Agreed, but at the same time he knew there would be consequences. It was a sacrifice he could sleep with.
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I agree 100%

2 words. Movie deal


If there is anyone left alive to go see it ......

One dad’s comment
My USNA grad daughter, former SWO & now a primary care MD just said to me “Crozier knew exactly what he was doing. You don’t get that command w/o knowing the chain of command. He was desperate & knew what he had to do to save his crew.”
Currently 155 test positive
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One dad’s comment
My USNA grad daughter, former SWO & now a primary care MD just said to me “Crozier knew exactly what he was doing. You don’t get that command w/o knowing the chain of command. He was desperate & knew what he had to do to save his crew.”
Currently 155 test positive
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Stfu
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He was desperate & knew what he had to do to save his crew.”
Currently 155 test positive
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News flash, his crew would have survived. Corona is not a death sentence, the crew were all young and healthy.
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Is that your judgement based on your life as a person charged with responsibility for the lives of thousands?
Asking for a friend, 😎
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Is that your judgement based on your life as a person charged with responsibility for the lives of thousands?
Asking for a friend, 😎
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Figured it was your go to for 3+'years it must be a winner
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