TRUMP NEWS AT IT AGAIN [Archive] - Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating

Jim in CT

04-16-2020, 10:56 AM

The WHO doesn't possess a crystal ball.
They never sat on or with held information to not upset China.. thats a Fox news spin

They give guidance and direction based on what they Know . Not what they think they know.. Countries around the world do not solely depend on The WHOs direction, this includes the US. And they never have.

The WHO
has no authority over any territory...

But this is the latest defense form Trump his supporters. Seeing his video only worked on his supporters
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

'The WHO doesn't possess a crystal ball.'

Who said they did? The WHO said early on, that it could only be transmitted animal-to-human. Obviously we know that's not true. The WHO was catastrophically wrong.

You are desperately bending over backwards to make sure that no blame goes anywhere other than Trumps shoulders. I think it's very fair to ask Trump why he didn't do more early. It's also fair to ask the WHO when they knew it could be transmitted human-to-human.

I can happily follow the facts wherever they go. You stop in your tracks, the second the facts shift blame away from Trump. In your mind, no one else could have done anything wrong. Only Trump's errors are worth discussing.

"They never sat on or with held information to not upset China"

Prove that, please.

Dr Birx is saying that either China or the WHO had to know that it was transmitting human-to-human. On what basis do you conclude that is spin? She gets her cues from Foxnews? Can you prove that?

I agree with you that we shouldn't be making false accusations against the WHO. Here is where we disagree - if the WHO screwed up (and I don't know if they did), we should investigate that too. You don't want to talk about any screw ups that aren't Trumps.

I'd love to hear you dispute that.

"The WHO
has no authority over any territory... "

I never said they did. I said they offer advice, guidance, and conclusions, which the world relies on (in part) to make public health decisions. They were horribly wrong in this case. Can you please tell me what I said in this paragraph, which is incorrect?

Pete F.

04-16-2020, 01:17 PM

Any of this sound familar?

I see some pretty scary parallels to the current US administration in Zhou's actions.

A crucial turning point in the pandemic came on Jan. 20, after China’s central government sent the country’s most famous epidemiologist, Zhong Nanshan, to Wuhan to investigate the new coronavirus racing through that city of 11 million people. Dr. Zhong delivered a startling message on national television: Local officials had covered up the seriousness of the outbreak, the contagion spread quickly between people, doctors were dying and everyone should avoid the city.

Dr. Zhong, an eccentric 83-year-old who led the fight against the SARS outbreak of 2002 and 2003, was one of few people in China with enough standing to effectively call Wuhan’s mayor, Zhou Xianwang, a rising official in the Communist Party, a liar.

Mr. Zhou, eager to see no disruption in his plans for a local party congress from Jan. 11 to 17 and a potluck dinner for 40,000 families on Jan. 18, appears to have had his police and local health officials close the seafood market, threaten doctors and assure the public that there was little or no transmission.

Mr Trump* eager to see no disruption in his plans for campaign rallies and the economy that he felt his reelection was dependent on, appears to have ignored public health officials, threatened whistleblowers and assured the public that there was little or no transmission.

Less than three days after Dr. Zhong’s warning was broadcast, China locked down the city, preventing anyone from entering or leaving and imposing strict rules on movement within it — conditions it would later extend far behind Wuhan, encompassing tens of millions of people.

That was January 20th
On Jan. 22, two days after Chinese officials first publicized the serious threat posed by the new virus ravaging the city of Wuhan, the chief of the World Health Organization held the first of what would be months of almost daily media briefings, sounding the alarm, telling the world to take the outbreak seriously.

Meanwhile back in the USA,

Trump consistently downplayed the threat until it became apparent that people were dying and it would not soon, as he claimed "BE DOWN TO ZERO"

March 17, 2020: Pandemic
Trump:I’ve always known this is a real, this is a pandemic,” Trump said. “I’ve felt it was a pandemic long before it was called a pandemic.

wdmso

04-16-2020, 01:53 PM

'The WHO doesn't possess a crystal ball.'

Who said they did? The WHO said early on, that it could only be transmitted animal-to-human. Obviously we know that's not true. The WHO was catastrophically wrong.( you just did )

You are desperately bending over backwards to make sure that no blame goes anywhere other than Trumps shoulders. I think it's very fair to ask Trump why he didn't do more early. It's also fair to ask the WHO when they knew it could be transmitted human-to-human.

they knew January 20th It is clear that at least some human to human transmission exists from the evidence we have, but we don’t have clear evidence that shows the virus has the capacity to transmit among humans easily,” said Takeshi Kasai, the World Health Organization’s regional director for the Western Pacific, in an interview with Bloomberg.3 He added, “For us to analyse the full extent of human to human transmission, we need some more informationI can happily follow the facts wherever they go. You stop in your tracks, the second the facts shift blame away from Trump. In your mind, no one else could have done anything wrong. Only Trump's errors are worth discussing. Trumps errors are Trump errors and his and his Administration's Alone thats not even debatable

"They never sat on or with held information to not upset China"

Prove that, please.

Dr Birx is saying that either China or the WHO had to know that it was transmitting human-to-human. On what basis do you conclude that is spin? She gets her cues from Foxnews? Can you prove that?

I agree with you that we shouldn't be making false accusations against the WHO. Here is where we disagree - if the WHO screwed up (and I don't know if they did), we should investigate that too. You don't want to talk about any screw ups that aren't Trumps.

I'd love to hear you dispute that.

"The WHO
has no authority over any territory... "

I never said they did. I said they offer advice, guidance, and conclusions, which the world relies on (in part) to make public health decisions. They were horribly wrong in this case. Can you please tell me what I said in this paragraph, which is incorrect?

jim your confusing what you said, with what Trump and his friends over at fox are spreading ..

I will be more specific when referring to things in a general and be specific if it relates to something you said . to avoid any confusion

"The virus was identified on January the 7th. The [genetic] sequence was shared on the 12th with the world."

When WHO issued its first guidance to countries, it was extremely clear that respiratory precautions should be taken in dealing with patients with this disease,"

In early January, the disease was known only through a cluster of atypical pneumonia cases — pneumonia with an unknown origin.All of that was out on the 10th and the 11th of January,"
Jan. 14. In that session, she discussed the questions that researchers were trying to answer about the virus, from the modes of transmission to the extent of infection in patients.

Jan 14
"All of our guidance that was out before we did that press conference was about limiting exposure to people and to prevent transmission, particularly in health care settings," Van Kerkhove said.

Preliminary investigations conducted by the Chinese authorities have found no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission of the novel #coronavirus (2019-nCoV)

What happened in February Trump tweeted almost 900 times in February but mentioned the coronavirus just 20 times

Donald J. Trump
✔
@realDonaldTrump
The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA. We are in contact with everyone and all relevant countries. CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart. Stock Market starting to look very good to me!

:kewl::kewl::kewl::kewl:

Jim in CT

04-16-2020, 01:57 PM

jim your confusing what you said, with what Trump and his friends over at fox are spreading ..

I will be more specific when referring to things in a general and be specific if it relates to something you said . to avoid any confusion

"The virus was identified on January the 7th. The [genetic] sequence was shared on the 12th with the world."

When WHO issued its first guidance to countries, it was extremely clear that respiratory precautions should be taken in dealing with patients with this disease,"

In early January, the disease was known only through a cluster of atypical pneumonia cases — pneumonia with an unknown origin.All of that was out on the 10th and the 11th of January,"
Jan. 14. In that session, she discussed the questions that researchers were trying to answer about the virus, from the modes of transmission to the extent of infection in patients.

Jan 14
"All of our guidance that was out before we did that press conference was about limiting exposure to people and to prevent transmission, particularly in health care settings," Van Kerkhove said.

Preliminary investigations conducted by the Chinese authorities have found no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission of the novel #coronavirus (2019-nCoV)

What happened in February Trump tweeted almost 900 times in February but mentioned the coronavirus just 20 times

Donald J. Trump
✔
@realDonaldTrump
The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA. We are in contact with everyone and all relevant countries. CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart. Stock Market starting to look very good to me!

:kewl::kewl::kewl::kewl:

i am aware of what the WHO said in january ( not easily transmitted between humans). There are those who say they knew more, back then. i don’t k is if that’s true or not. if i was only guided by politics, i’d say it’s true. that’s not wht i’m saying. if Dr Birx says they had to know it was easily transmitted from person to person, i have no reason to conclude she’s wrong.

You’re the one jumping to conclusions to benefit your politics.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

04-16-2020, 02:05 PM

they knew January 20th..." It is clear that at least some human to human transmission exists from the evidence we have, but we don’t have clear evidence that shows the virus has the capacity to transmit among humans easily,” said Takeshi Kasai, the World Health Organization’s regional director for the Western Pacific"

Follow along here...

If the WHO said on January 20th that there was no evidence that it transmitted easily from human to human, then on what basis are you libs shrieking that Trump should have done much more.

You can't have it both ways.

If Trump instituted a lockdown on January, you all would have gone berserk that he was going against the WHO.

You say his Chinese travel restrictions went too far, but at the same time say he didn't do nearly enough. Yet you also say the WHO wasn't negligent in January when they said it wasn't easily transmitted from human to human. So according to you, the WHO had no reason to say it transmitted easily from human to human in late January, yet at the same time you say Trump didn't do enough in January. Which is it? He was supposed to know better than the WHO? About what was happening in Wuhan?

Additionally, Libs don't like Trump saying he has "total control" over forcing states to do what he wants, yet you only blame him and not the governors, who you say have that control. So you say Trump can't tell states what to do, but at the same time all this is Trumps fault, not the fault of the governors who you say are the only ones with authority to do anything. Again, which is it? You can't have both.

There is zero logic there. The only consistency, naturally, is that every syllable is an attack on Trump. You cannot do anything else.

scottw

04-16-2020, 02:57 PM

You can't have it both ways.

they always want it both ways...they are bi-factual

spence

04-16-2020, 03:32 PM

If the WHO said on January 20th that there was no evidence that it transmitted easily from human to human, then on what basis are you libs shrieking that Trump should have done much more.
But they didn't say that.

Pete F.

04-16-2020, 03:44 PM

Some people just plain lie

It only works one way, not both ways and there is no way to gaslight it unless you ignore the facts.
Perhaps you think that the WHO should react every time someone sneezes.
They provided reliable information when they had it, that's their mission.
It's not perfect, few organizations are but if you think it should improve and you are a major funder you should at least send a representative to the executive board.
Consider where we would be in past pandemics if they did not exist.

This administration denied and ignored the proferred advice, did not start the pandemic plan which would have prepared the Strategic National Stockpile, notified the Governors, prepared the medical community, etc. and it's incompetence magnified the effect of Covid-19 in the USA.

All the documents are public and the video of Trump* denying and downplaying it are in the public domain.

Don't ignore the fact that the US has a very good handle on movements on the ground all over the world and large scale reductions in traffic are easily identifiable thru satellite imagery.

31 Dec 2019

China reported a cluster of cases of pneumonia in Wuhan, Hubei Province. A novel coronavirus was eventually identified.

1 January 2020

WHO had set up the IMST (Incident Management Support Team) across the three levels of the organization: headquarters, regional headquarters and country level, putting the organization on an emergency footing for dealing with the outbreak.

4 January 2020

WHO reported on social media that there was a cluster of pneumonia cases – with no deaths – in Wuhan, Hubei province.

5 January 2020

WHO published our first Disease Outbreak News on the new virus. This is a flagship technical publication to the scientific and public health community as well as global media. It contained a risk assessment and advice, and reported on what China had told the organization about the status of patients and the public health response on the cluster of pneumonia cases in Wuhan.

10 January 2020

WHO issued a comprehensive package of technical guidance online with advice to all countries on how to detect, test and manage potential cases, based on what was known about the virus at the time. This guidance was shared with WHO's regional emergency directors to share with WHO representatives in countries.

Based on experience with SARS and MERS and known modes of transmission of respiratory viruses, infection and prevention control guidance were published to protect health workers recommending droplet and contact precautions when caring for patients, and airborne precautions for aerosol generating procedures conducted by health workers.

12 January 2020

China publicly shared the genetic sequence of COVID-19.

13 January 2020

Officials confirm a case of COVID-19 in Thailand, the first recorded case outside of China.

14 January 2020

WHO's technical lead for the response noted in a press briefing there may have been limited human-to-human transmission of the coronavirus (in the 41 confirmed cases), mainly through family members, and that there was a risk of a possible wider outbreak. The lead also said that human-to-human transmission would not be surprising given our experience with SARS, MERS and other respiratory pathogens.

20-21 January 2020

WHO experts from its China and Western Pacific regional offices conducted a brief field visit to Wuhan.

22 January 2020

WHO mission to China issued a statement saying that there was evidence of human-to-human transmission in Wuhan but more investigation was needed to understand the full extent of transmission.

22- 23 January 2020

The WHO Director- General convened an Emergency Committee (EC) under the International Health Regulations (IHR 2005) to assess whether the outbreak constituted a public health emergency of international concern. The independent members from around the world could not reach a consensus based on the evidence available at the time. They asked to be reconvened within 10 days after receiving more information.

28 January 2020

A senior WHO delegation led by the Director-General travelled to Beijing to meet China’s leadership, learn more about China’s response, and to offer any technical assistance.

While in Beijing, Dr. Tedros agreed with Chinese government leaders that an international team of leading scientists would travel to China on a mission to better understand the context, the overall response, and exchange information and experience.

30 January 2020

The WHO Director-General reconvened the Emergency Committee (EC). This was earlier than the 10-day period and only two days after the first reports of limited human-to-human transmission were reported outside China. This time, the EC reached consensus and advised the Director-General that the outbreak constituted a Public Health Emergency of International Concern (PHEIC). The Director-General accepted the recommendation and declared the novel coronavirus outbreak (2019-nCoV) a PHEIC. This is the 6th time WHO has declared a PHEIC since the International Health Regulations (IHR) came into force in 2005.

Jim in CT

04-16-2020, 03:49 PM

But they didn't say that.

wdmso just posted that they said that. it’s in his post.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

04-16-2020, 03:51 PM

But they didn't say that.

From WDSMO's post...

"they knew January 20th It is clear that at least some human to human transmission exists from the evidence we have, but we don’t have clear evidence that shows the virus has the capacity to transmit among humans easily,” said Takeshi Kasai, the World Health Organization’s regional director for the Western Pacific"

spence

04-16-2020, 03:56 PM

From WDSMO's post...

"they knew January 20th It is clear that at least some human to human transmission exists from the evidence we have, but we don’t have clear evidence that shows the virus has the capacity to transmit among humans easily,” said Takeshi Kasai, the World Health Organization’s regional director for the Western Pacific"
That's not what you said.

Pete F.

04-16-2020, 03:57 PM

14 January 2020

WHO's technical lead for the response noted in a press briefing there may have been limited human-to-human transmission of the coronavirus (in the 41 confirmed cases), mainly through family members, and that there was a risk of a possible wider outbreak. The lead also said that human-to-human transmission would not be surprising given our experience with SARS, MERS and other respiratory pathogens.

Sea Dangles

04-16-2020, 04:07 PM

You it’s certainly an association worth revisiting.
It could be time to drain that swamp also
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

wdmso

04-16-2020, 04:07 PM

Follow along here...

If the WHO said on January 20th that there was no evidence that it transmitted easily from human to human, then on what basis are you libs shrieking that Trump should have done much more.

You can't have it both ways.

If Trump instituted a lockdown on January, you all would have gone berserk that he was going against the WHO.

You say his Chinese travel restrictions went too far, but at the same time say he didn't do nearly enough. Yet you also say the WHO wasn't negligent in January when they said it wasn't easily transmitted from human to human. So according to you, the WHO had no reason to say it transmitted easily from human to human in late January, yet at the same time you say Trump didn't do enough in January. Which is it? He was supposed to know better than the WHO? About what was happening in Wuhan?

Additionally, Libs don't like Trump saying he has "total control" over forcing states to do what he wants, yet you only blame him and not the governors, who you say have that control. So you say Trump can't tell states what to do, but at the same time all this is Trumps fault, not the fault of the governors who you say are the only ones with authority to do anything. Again, which is it? You can't have both.

There is zero logic there. The only consistency, naturally, is that every syllable is an attack on Trump. You cannot do anything else.
Clearly you want it both ways blame china and the WHO. For what Trump failed to do.. its that obvious..

White House defends Ivanka Trump's personal travel amid lockdown

Shocking
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

04-16-2020, 04:19 PM

Let's recap.

When Trump restricted travel from China, liberals said he went way too far. Yet at the same time, he didn't go far enough.

When Trump said he had "total control" of what states do, liberals said that was crazy, that the governors have that authority, not Trump. But at the same time, they are saying that all of this is on Trump's shoulders, it's all his fault, not the fault of the governors.

Trump (and others) are now saying the WHO blew it, by not sounding the alarm when China obviously had a catastrophe on its hands. Not so, say the liberals who can't accept even a remote possibility of anyone looking bad who isn't Trump. WDMSO says the WHO was OK when they said in late January that it didn't spread easily from human to human.

Yet somehow, Trump was supposed to know better than the WHO and enact lockdowns, even though (1) the travel restrictions were too much for liberals, and (2) liberals concede he can't tell states what to do.

When you simultaneously say he did too much and yet didn't do nearly enough...and when you simultaneously say its all his fault yet he can't tell states what to do...it's time to ask some questions.

And he's also wrong for saying we don't need the WHO, even though they said in late January that it couldn't be spread easily from human to human.

TDS, in all its glory.

Jim in CT

04-16-2020, 04:20 PM

But they didn't say that.

This gets really, really old...

I said that the WHO claimed on January 20th, that t wasn't spread easily from human to human. I re-posted a quote from WDMSO, where the WHO said there was no evidence of easy transmission from human to human.

wdmso

04-16-2020, 05:38 PM

Now it came from a chinese lab foxes show The 5 pushing it as truth

U.S. intel community examining whether coronavirus emerged accidentally from a Chinese lab

US military chief: ‘Weight of evidence’ that Covid-19 did not originate in a lab

WOW. you cant make this Stuff up , whats next or who is next ... ? everything out of this administration is some one elses fault... they're the boy who cried wolf .
and the day the wolf is legit none will believe it
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

wdmso

04-16-2020, 05:45 PM

Jim in CT

04-16-2020, 05:50 PM

you fit right in his cult its eveyones elses fault
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Not even close to what I said. I said it's fair to criticize him for the things he did wrong.

But you can't criticize anyone who isn't him. You just can't. Nothing bad that happens, can be anyone else's fault.

How long can you go, without lying about my stance? You can't admit the truth (I blame Trump when he deserves it,, I give him credit when he deserves it), because you cannot accept anything other than Trump=bad. I give him criticism and praise, because like everyone else on the planet, sometimes he deserves praise, sometimes he deserves criticism.

You're so enslaved by this, you can't even criticize someone else. In your mind, you equate criticizing someone else, with letting Trump off the hook. For some reason, the thought that both Trump AND someone else messed up, is beyond your grasp.

Try making that wrong. Read your posts, and tell me I'm wrong.

As to the labs...how many labs are there that study coronaviruses? Not many. But there's one in Wuhan, very close to where China says this originated. That's a coincidence? Maybe.

spence

04-16-2020, 07:37 PM

This gets really, really old...

I said that the WHO claimed on January 20th, that t wasn't spread easily from human to human. I re-posted a quote from WDMSO, where the WHO said there was no evidence of easy transmission from human to human.
You’re playing around with your adjectives. Be consistent with the WHO’s actual statements. There is typically scientific process behind them.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Pete F.

04-16-2020, 07:49 PM

The WHO never said there’s no evidence
They said they would expect that there is
Only an illiterate person could gleam that it was not transmissible human to human from their briefings
That person is Trump*
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

04-16-2020, 07:58 PM

You’re playing around with your adjectives. Be consistent with the WHO’s actual statements. There is typically scientific process behind them.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Based on whet WDMSO posted, there's no way of knowing if science was behind what they said. What's clear, is that they said there was no reason to believe that it spread easily from human to human.

But Trump was supposed to know better and order a lockdown, even though (1) your side said the travel restrictions were going too far, and (2) the WHO said it wasn't spread easily from human to human, and (3) your side is saying he lacks authority to order states to do anything.

So I'll ask you the obvious question...which is it? Back then, in January, what should he have done? And who was telling him to do so? Not his experts, not the WHO, not the media, sure as hell not Bill Diblasio or Nancy Pelosi who were saying until late February that it was safe to go out in crowded public places.

Pete F.

04-17-2020, 12:55 AM

His administration should have simply followed the playbook.
All the steps are there.
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/6819268/Pandemic-Playbook.pdf
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw

04-17-2020, 03:59 AM

Only an illiterate person could gleam that

Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

never disappointing

gleaming literacy:hihi:

scottw

04-17-2020, 04:54 AM

this is classic.....

New Jersey governor Phil Murphy said he “wasn’t thinking of the Bill of Rights” while implementing social-distancing measures — writing off any constitutional considerations as being “above his pay grade.”

Murphy made the comments during a Fox News interview with Tucker Carlson on Wednesday night, in response to Carlson questioning the constitutionality of his executive order. “That’s above my pay grade, Tucker,” Murphy responded. “I wasn’t thinking of the Bill of Rights when we did this. . . . We went to the scientists who said people have to stay away from each other.”

and

A group of sheriffs announced they will not enforce some of Democratic Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer's executive orders on the same day thousands rallied against state-mandated shelter-in-place orders outside the state Capitol in Lansing.

Sheriffs Mike Borkovich, Ted Schendel, Ken Falk, and Kim Cole of Michigan's 101st District released a press statement Wednesday afternoon detailing what they said was their decision to place their oath to the Constitution above Whitmer's wishes.

I heard she's on the list for biden veeps

Pete F.

04-17-2020, 06:58 AM

never disappointing

gleaming literacy:hihi:

Glad to see you’re following your playbook

Perhaps you could help Trump* with his spelling and grammar

Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw

04-17-2020, 07:25 AM

Glad to see you’re following your playbook

Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

page 1 of the playbook....

"if you are going to attack someone as illiterate...try not to look like an illiterate fool"

:tm:

Sea Dangles

04-17-2020, 07:30 AM

He may as well call somebody unintelligent next.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

wdmso

04-17-2020, 07:34 AM

Not even close to what I said. I said it's fair to criticize him for the things he did wrong.

But you can't criticize anyone who isn't him. You just can't. Nothing bad that happens, can be anyone else's fault.

How long can you go, without lying about my stance? You can't admit the truth (I blame Trump when he deserves it,, I give him credit when he deserves it), because you cannot accept anything other than Trump=bad. I give him criticism and praise, because like everyone else on the planet, sometimes he deserves praise, sometimes he deserves criticism.

You're so enslaved by this, you can't even criticize someone else. In your mind, you equate criticizing someone else, with letting Trump off the hook. For some reason, the thought that both Trump AND someone else messed up, is beyond your grasp.

Try making that wrong. Read your posts, and tell me I'm wrong.

As to the labs...how many labs are there that study coronaviruses? Not many. But there's one in Wuhan, very close to where China says this originated. That's a coincidence? Maybe.

China is not my President the WHO is not my CDC , lack of direct criticism of them( which has merit that most can separate what they didn't do and what we the USA didn't do)

Yet the only relevant criticisms you want to hear is about china and WHO , anything attempting to ease the case against Trump ( that's how I read your posts and responses )

I Criticize my President when he act in a manner that deserves criticism.... which I'll say it again it's not imaginary..and a direct response to his words and actions

You don't deserve praise for doing what your suppose to do... but Trump demands praise and accolades. 1st before he does his job that's a poor leader that a poor trait for anyone

I dont envy Trump but he thought being POTUS was easy ,, just un do anything With Obamas name on it , get praised go to a rally get cheered , play golf or spend more time in Fla than DC ... ( That's changed ) . Now it's real and his leadership is front and center.. and people are taking note ..

Pete F.

04-17-2020, 07:34 AM

Sad

O great and wondrous One, master of the written and spoken word.
Perhaps you can explain this

Yesterday
Trump says he's angry he wasn't told there was an epidemic: "And I was angry, because this should have been told to us. It should have been told to us early. It should have been told to us a lot sooner. People knew it was happening and people didn't want to talk about it."

“I've always known this is a real, this is a pandemic. I've felt it was a pandemic long before it was called a pandemic.”
—@realDonaldTrump,
March 17, 2020
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

wdmso

04-17-2020, 07:45 AM

Jim in CT

04-17-2020, 08:01 AM

China is not my President the WHO is not my CDC , lack of direct criticism of them( which has merit that most can separate what they didn't do and what we the USA didn't do)

Yet the only relevant criticisms you want to hear is about china and WHO , anything attempting to ease the case against Trump ( that's how I read your posts and responses )

I Criticize my President when he act in a manner that deserves criticism.... which I'll say it again it's not imaginary..and a direct response to his words and actions

You don't deserve praise for doing what your suppose to do... but Trump demands praise and accolades. 1st before he does his job that's a poor leader that a poor trait for anyone

I dont envy Trump but he thought being POTUS was easy ,, just un do anything With Obamas name on it , get praised go to a rally get cheered , play golf or spend more time in Fla than DC ... ( That's changed ) . Now it's real and his leadership is front and center.. and people are taking note ..

"the WHO is not my CDC '

So if you don't think we're supposed to be giving consideration to recommendations from the WHO, why do they exist? Why should we give them money, if you're saying they have zero influence in our public health decisions?

"Yet the only relevant criticisms you want to hear is about china and WHO '

Every single time you characterize my positions, you lie. Every single time. I have criticized Trumps handling of this many, many times. He doesn't let the experts talk, he's attacking the press which does zero good, and he was obviously wrong when he downplayed things early on.

Where you and I disagree, is on this point - it's also fair to say that many others, including those whose opinions we rely on, were similarly wrong. I can admit that. You cannot. You are physically incapable of saying anyone else was wrong, and for damned sure you would never say that Trump was wrong because he listened to "experts" who were wrong.

Fauci said early on it was no big deal, as did the WHO. SO Trump is supposed to ignore them, because he's supposed to have a crystal ball?

Bill Diblasio said in late February that it was safe to live normally. And if he was the nominee, you'd refuse to criticize that statement. You can only criticize Trump.

You constantly lie about my positions, because you can't debate me honestly, because I have facts and common sense on my side. There's no other to mischaracterize my positions every single time. You don't know how to respond to accuracy, honesty, and fairness, because in the era of Trump, it doesn't exist on your side.

So you act like I said something that I never came close to saying.

scottw

04-17-2020, 08:04 AM

when spelling mistakes. Are a bigger issue than the facts presented in the same sentence...:its just
:faga:faga:

nope...just amusing...particularly in the context of arrogantly lecturing others and questioning their intelligence...it's practically an art form here

PaulS

04-17-2020, 08:15 AM

He may as well call somebody unintelligent next.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

but sometimes people are, and uneducated - as they demonstrate every day.

Sea Dangles

04-17-2020, 08:18 AM

Some people simply go out of their way to get laughed at. If you can’t get your point across in an intelligent manner, please enjoy the banter. And don’t take it personally!
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Sea Dangles

04-17-2020, 08:19 AM

but sometimes people are, and uneducated - as they demonstrate every day.

More irony
🤡
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

PaulS

04-17-2020, 08:26 AM

More irony
��
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

we see that every day here (and unintelligence).

Sea Dangles

04-17-2020, 08:35 AM

It gets vial sometimes
🤡
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Pete F.

04-17-2020, 08:39 AM

Of course, the Chinese Communist Party & WHO should have been providing us with better information more quickly about Covid-19. I also wonder what our Intelligence Community was reporting. Since when did we start relying on communists to tell us the truth to defend our security?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

PaulS

04-17-2020, 08:42 AM

It gets vial sometimes
��
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Sometimes and sometimes people use it to try to determine what nepotism means bc they aren't intelligent enough to know what the word means. They must have skipped that day in HS.

PaulS

04-17-2020, 08:43 AM

Sea Dangles

04-17-2020, 09:02 AM

Sometimes and sometimes people use it to try to determine what nepotism means bc they aren't intelligent enough to know what the word means. They must have skipped that day in HS.

It must be a magical miracle.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

PaulS

04-17-2020, 09:04 AM

It must be a magical miracle.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Just hope he isn't as petty as some of the dotards I know.

Amazing our Pres. thought it would just disappear that easily. But I guess some people are so stupid, they would believe anything.

wdmso

04-17-2020, 09:18 AM

"the WHO is not my CDC '

So if you don't think we're supposed to be giving consideration to recommendations from the WHO, why do they exist? Why should we give them money, if you're saying they have zero influence in our public health decisions?

"Yet the only relevant criticisms you want to hear is about china and WHO '

Every single time you characterize my positions, you lie. Every single time. I have criticized Trumps handling of this many, many times. He doesn't let the experts talk, he's attacking the press which does zero good, and he was obviously wrong when he downplayed things early on.

Where you and I disagree, is on this point - it's also fair to say that many others, including those whose opinions we rely on, were similarly wrong. I can admit that. You cannot. You are physically incapable of saying anyone else was wrong, and for damned sure you would never say that Trump was wrong because he listened to "experts" who were wrong.

Fauci said early on it was no big deal, as did the WHO. SO Trump is supposed to ignore them, because he's supposed to have a crystal ball?

Bill Diblasio said in late February that it was safe to live normally. And if he was the nominee, you'd refuse to criticize that statement. You can only criticize Trump.

You constantly lie about my positions, because you can't debate me honestly, because I have facts and common sense on my side. There's no other to mischaracterize my positions every single time. You don't know how to respond to accuracy, honesty, and fairness, because in the era of Trump, it doesn't exist on your side.

So you act like I said something that I never came close to saying.

assuming people were wrong when presenting facts as they.knew them . And they changed their positions based on new information.. again dosnt get him off the hook..Trump avoided it until he couldn't avoid it ..

Thats wasnt caused by wrong info. That was his choice

And fairness TRUMP doesn't have any room for you to demand fairness. Do you think he is operating based on fairness .

Jim your facts are fashioned to 99% blame everyone else but Trump sprinkled with 1% criticism, to say see iam not a Fan

I have 100% disdain for him and see him as a dark stain on the History of the united states ..

TRUMPS saying at his library A Center For Children Who Can't Read Good And Wanna Learn To Do Other Stuff Good Too, we teach you that there's more to life than being really, really ridiculously good-looking. Words can only hurt you if you try to read them.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

wdmso

04-17-2020, 09:27 AM

Funny Ronald Reagan Trust, but verify QUOTE

That idea must have lost its meaning . In Trumps republican party

The new quote
Justify and Blame

Quite the comparison
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT

04-17-2020, 09:33 AM

assuming people were wrong when presenting facts as they.knew them . And they changed their positions based on new information.. again dosnt get him off the hook..Trump avoided it until he couldn't avoid it ..

Thats wasnt caused by wrong info. That was his choice

And fairness TRUMP doesn't have any room for you to demand fairness. Do you think he is operating based on fairness .

Jim your facts are fashioned to 99% blame everyone else but Trump sprinkled with 1% criticism, to say see iam not a Fan

I have 100% disdain for him and see him as a dark stain on the History of the united states ..

TRUMPS saying at his library A Center For Children Who Can't Read Good And Wanna Learn To Do Other Stuff Good Too, we teach you that there's more to life than being really, really ridiculously good-looking. Words can only hurt you if you try to read them.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

You're wandering all over the place, you don't have any command of what you're saying, except that everything bad that has ever happened or will ever happen, is Trumps fault, and his fault alone.

"And fairness TRUMP doesn't have any room for you to demand fairness. Do you think he is operating based on fairness "

Yet you're more than fair to the politicians you happen to like. Is Hilary so morally superior to Trump? I sure don't think so. Both scumbags. Doesn't mean I can't evaluate them fairly.

"Jim your facts are fashioned to 99% blame everyone else but Trump sprinkled with 1% criticism"

Not even close. You're making stuff up. Your posts are at least 99% negative, even when things were peaceful and prosperous. Because you simply cannot be far, because you have TDS.

"I have 100% disdain for him "

Thanks for the revelation, we didn't already know that.

As a human being, I also have great disdain for him. But the fact is, as a president, he did some things which made many of us better off. I can admit that. You can't. You just can't. Because you are enslaved by your ideology. I go where the facts and empirical results take me. You can't do that.

Pete F.

04-17-2020, 10:05 AM

By the time he's done Trump* will eventually have taken every possible inconsistent position about the virus. That will let him test which polls best, and his supporters can then pick that one as the position he took all along.

Trump*s new plan with the-buck-stops-with-the-states posture is largely designed to shield himself from blame should there be new outbreaks after states reopen or for other problems.

The Trump* "plan" to re-open the economy is similar to the Trump* "plan" to have drive-thru testing in every Wal Mart parking lot. It's...not a plan. It's another lie announced by this administration that purports to be a plan.

So over the next few weeks it’s going to become painfully obvious that governments in many other developed economies have handled this better than the United States.

detbuch

04-17-2020, 10:27 AM

Of course, the Chinese Communist Party & WHO should have been providing us with better information more quickly about Covid-19.

"Better" information!??!? They were out and out lying. China intentionally withheld the truth and spread destructive falsehood. And their puppet head of WHO regurgitated the lie for the rest of the world to react accordingly. And yes, we're supposed to follow WHO advice. It is its purpose to inform and advise us. We pay them enough for that. We should demand a refund. And we should tell China that we will cancel our debt on the loans from them as a payment in full to balance the debt we have incurred because of their malfeasance.

China immediately stopped travel from Wuhan to the rest of China when it knew what the virus was doing. But it allowed travelers from Wuhan to the rest of the World. The CCP knew it was spreading the virus world wide while trying to contain it in China.

The CCP deliberately attempted to weaken us. They should pay for that.

I also wonder what our Intelligence Community was reporting.

How far back in history do you want to wonder about that? How often have we been misinformed by our intelligence? How often have we deliberately been misled by it in order produce legislation and policy that favored what it wanted to do? Even during this administration, it has misled and lied to us about Trump's conspiring with Russia in order to remove him from office.

Do tell us that it knew exactly what China was doing. What the virus really was. How it really started. What and when we should be doing. And how about the highly touted British intelligence, or other European intelligence--what were they saying and what was done about that? Was this a worldwide failure of "intelligence"?

Since when did we start relying on communists to tell us the truth to defend our security?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I think we seriously started to rely on them to tell us the truth during the FDR administration. And they have been faking us out ever since. The only thing that ever stopped them was direct adversary confrontation.

wdmso

04-17-2020, 10:47 AM

You're wandering all over the place, you don't have any command of what you're saying, except that everything bad that has ever happened or will ever happen, is Trumps fault, and his fault alone.

"And fairness TRUMP doesn't have any room for you to demand fairness. Do you think he is operating based on fairness "

Yet you're more than fair to the politicians you happen to like. Is Hilary so morally superior to Trump? I sure don't think so. Both scumbags. Doesn't mean I can't evaluate them fairly.

"Jim your facts are fashioned to 99% blame everyone else but Trump sprinkled with 1% criticism"

Not even close. You're making stuff up. Your posts are at least 99% negative, even when things were peaceful and prosperous. Because you simply cannot be far, because you have TDS.

"I have 100% disdain for him "

Thanks for the revelation, we didn't already know that.

As a human being, I also have great disdain for him. But the fact is, as a president, he did some things which made many of us better off. I can admit that. You can't. You just can't. Because you are enslaved by your ideology. I go where the facts and empirical results take me. You can't do that.

Trump has done zero to make us better off , as a nation he has done plenty to make certain demographics better , that's certain.. but past accomplishments real or not are irrelevant.. the boards been wiped clean and were starting from scratch

Let's see what he does with his new opportunity

scottw

04-17-2020, 10:53 AM

Jim in CT

04-17-2020, 11:45 AM

Trump has done zero to make us better off , as a nation he has done plenty to make certain demographics better , that's certain.. but past accomplishments real or not are irrelevant.. the boards been wiped clean and were starting from scratch

Let's see what he does with his new opportunity

'Trump has done zero to make us better #^&#^&#^&#^&

He kept us safe, he got unemployment to the lowest it's been in 50 years, and the lowest ever for minorities. How is that not making anyone better off? Again, you cannot accept or process, that which doesn't fit your agenda.

"but past accomplishments real or not are irrelevant"

So because a pandemic hit that no one saw coming, his past accomplishments are wiped clean? And since when did you ever acknowledge any of his past accomplishments?

Gibberish.

Let's see where the economy is in 6 months.

Did you rip up your stimulus check? Does that check make you better off than before you cashed it? Yes or no?

Jim in CT

04-17-2020, 11:46 AM

this is hilarious

Wayne...

Wayne has done zero to make sense , as a poster he has done plenty to make certain topics funnier , that's certain.. but past posts real or not are irrelevant.. the boards been wiped clean and were starting from scratch

Let's see what he does with his new opportunity

the dictatorial leanings of the leftists are on display

It's an incredible waste to try and have a conversation, it really is.

scottw

04-17-2020, 12:07 PM

Did you rip up your stimulus check?

probably saving it for when the toilet paper runs out :jester:

Pete F.

04-17-2020, 12:22 PM

I think we seriously started to rely on them to tell us the truth during the FDR administration. And they have been faking us out ever since. The only thing that ever stopped them was direct adversary confrontation.

Do you think the IC told him that he should not think for a moment that President Xi is his friend or that it is a good idea?
That the NSC said a pandemic was not a national security threat?

Trump had a very consistent message that China was great and dealing with it as was he in January, February and most of March until he said I knew it was a pandemic all along and declared an Emergency.

On January 24, President Trump thanked President Xi Jinping for “transparency” and complimented the Chinese on their efforts to contain the coronavirus. For the next 50 days Trump proceeded to publicly praise Xi for his work on containing the coronavirus over a dozen times while privately insisting to his national security team that drastic actions were not needed to contain the virus because he trusted the information out of China.

On January 30, in an interview with Fox’s Peter Doocy, Trump said: “And we are in great shape. China is not in great shape right now, unfortunately. But they’re working very hard. We’ll see what happens. But we’re working very closely with China and other countries.”

On January 31, President Trump barred foreign visitors who had visited China in the preceding days from entering the United States, an early decision that he keeps demanding credit for, even though every subsequent action has undermined this initial move. (Like, that the restriction was only on certain types of passengers, not necessarily flights.)

On February 7, Chinese scientist and whistleblower Li Wenliang died. That same day, President Trump praised Xi’s handling of COVID-19, saying:

He is strong, sharp and powerfully focused on leading the counterattack on the coronavirus. He feels they are doing very well, even building hospitals in a matter of only days. Nothing is easy, but he will be successful, especially as the weather starts to warm & the virus hopefully becomes weaker, and then gone. Great discipline is taking place in China, as President Xi strongly leads what will be a very successful operation. We are working closely with China to help!

(It’s worth noting here that on March 19 the Trump campaign issued a press release accusing the Biden campaign of “siding with the Chinese” for noting the number of hospitals they had built, something that—as you see here—Trump lavishly praised Xi for.)

That wasn’t the only praise Trump offered Xi on February 7: He also told North Carolinians Xi “has handled it really well.” Adding that “we’re helping wherever we can. But we have a great relationship. It’s incredible. They respect us again. They didn’t even respect us. What they were doing to us—they didn’t even respect us. They respect us again and we respect them.”

On February 10, China’s death toll had crested 800 making it worse than SARS in the early 2000s. Trump went on now-benched Fox Business host Trish Regan’s nighttime show, where he said this:

Well, I think China is very, you know, professionally run, in the sense that they have everything under control. I really believe they are going to have it under control fairly soon.

On February 14, Trump told the National Border Patrol Council’s members:

I spoke with President Xi of China, and he’s working very hard on this. It’s a tremendous problem. But they’re very capable and they’ll—they’ll get to it. There’s a theory that, in April, when it gets warm—historically, that has been able to kill the virus. So we don’t know yet; we’re not sure yet. But that’s around the corner, so that’ll be a great thing in China and other places.

It’s unclear here whether Trump was referring to the week-old conversation with Xi, or whether the conversation he was describing was more recent.

On February 18, as he was departing for a west coast jaunt, Trump told reporters at Andrews Air Force Base:

I think President Xi is working very hard. As you know, I spoke with him recently. He’s working really hard. It’s a tough problem. I think he’s going to do—look, I’ve seen them build hospitals in a short period of time. I really believe he wants to get that done, and he wants to get it done fast. Yes, I think he’s doing it very professionally. We’re also working with him and helping him, as of the last few days, as you know.

“I’m confident that they’re trying very hard,” Trump told a Phoenix radio station on Feb. 19. “I know President Xi. I get along with him very well. We just made a great trade deal, which is going to be a lot of business for Arizona and every other place. But they are trying very, very hard, and I think the numbers are going to get progressively better as we go along.”

On February 23, President Trump was asked at a Marine One departure before a trip to India whether he thought “President Xi should be doing something different.” Trump replied:

No, I think President Xi is working very, very hard. I spoke to him. He’s working very hard. I think he’s doing a very good job. It’s a big problem. But President Xi loves his country. He’s working very hard to solve the problem and he will solve the problem. Okay?

On February 25, Trump was in India, where he told business leaders that Xi was “working very hard” and that it looked “like they’re getting it under control more and more.” Back in the U.S. on February 26, he reiterated he thought Xi was “working very hard.” This was just as Italy’s outbreak had begun:

I spoke with President Xi. We had a great talk. He’s working very hard, I have to say. He’s working very, very hard. And if you can count on the reports coming out of China, that spread has gone down quite a bit. The infection seems to have gone down over the last two days. As opposed to getting larger, it’s actually gotten smaller. In one instance where we think we can be—it’s somewhat reliable, it seems to have gotten quite a bit smaller.

In that same press conference, Trump told reporters that Xi Jinping was:

. . . working very hard. It would be very easy for me to say, you know—it doesn’t matter what I say, really. I can tell you, he is working—I had a long talk with him the other night. He is working really, really hard. He wants it to go away from China and go away fast, and he wants to get back to business as usual.

It remains unclear from any of these statements when “the other night” was or how many times Trump spoke with Xi in the previous few weeks.

On March 3, Trump visited the National Institutes of Health, where he spent the day with Dr. Anthony Fauci. At a press conference there, Trump was asked about the possibility of further travel restrictions. Here, too, he tossed out some random praise of China:

Well, we’re looking at different areas, and we’ll make that decision with these professionals. We made an early decision based on a little bit of luck, I suspect, but that was the original decision on China itself. And China, in all fairness to them, they never blamed us. It was, you know, a tough decision for them, but they fully understood. They were very reasonable about it.

On March 4, Trump phoned in to Sean Hannity’s show on Fox where he told listeners: “We’re dealing with China. President Xi, who I speak with, President Xi is working very, very hard in China. They have a big problem. But their numbers have gotten much better with respect to the coronavirus, very much better.”

On March 6, President Trump visited the Centers for Disease Control in Atlanta, where he once again praised China on their progress:

And I’ve heard the numbers are getting much better in China, but I hear the numbers are getting much better in Italy, et cetera, et cetera. But what I hear—so we have 240 cases, 11 deaths. Everything is too much and it’s true. I don’t want 11 deaths. I don’t want any deaths, right? But over the last long period of time, when people have the flu, you have an average of 36,000 people dying. I’ve never heard those numbers. I would—I would’ve been shocked. I would’ve said, “Does anybody die from the flu?” I didn’t know people died from the flu—36,000 people died.

On March 11, the World Health Organization declared COVID-19 a pandemic. In response, Trump restricted travel between the E.U. and the United States. He met with banking executives and while China was not a big topic of discussion Trump did say that he thought they were “healing” and floated the possibility that “we could start to think about getting back involved in that part of the world.”

That night, he also addressed the country from the Oval Office and in this brief talk only mentioned China in the context of praising his earlier decision on travel restrictions. Instead he sought to blame the E.U.’s somewhat looser travel restrictions—rather than the Chinese regime—for the virus’s growth in the United States,.

On March 13, President Trump declared a national emergency.

Reported US coronavirus deaths:

Feb. 16: 0 deaths
Mar. 16: 86 deaths
Apr. 16: 33,268 deaths

detbuch

04-17-2020, 02:12 PM

[B]Do you think the IC told him that he should not think for a moment that President Xi is his friend or that it is a good idea?
That the NSC said a pandemic was not a national security threat?

I don't know what the IC told him. I don't know what the IC of the rest of the world told their governments.

China loosed this pandemic on the rest of the world and there is no way that the CCP didn't know that is exactly what they were doing.

You can go on and on with your notion that it's Trump's fault that it was not stopped at our doorstep, or not stopped soon enough, and posting your selected timelines, but that is all, as usual, a compilation of factoids meant to inspire your preferred conjecture, opinion and accusation.

I don't know if it's also supposed to be Trump's fault that so much of the rest of the world was also not able to do what you think Trump was supposed to do, or if they all were also in your eyes just as negligent.

I don't have confidence that Trump can convince the CCP to play fair trade with us. I think he is right to try much of what he is doing in that respect. But I doubt China will voluntarily give up its one way advantage and become a fair trading partner with the rest of the world. If that were to happen, it would be the beginning of the end of the CCP. And I don't think the party members are willing to commit that suicide--possibly literally as well as figuratively. Same goes for North Korea.

But if there is any hope of such a change, it won't be enhanced by berating China for its malfeasance re this virus. Trump is trapping himself on that tightwire he has to walk while simultaneously negotiating and blaming. I don't expect you to accede to nor understand that.

But, if anything is effective in changing our economic relation with China, the tariffs would be so. It is about the only way, other than outright war, to reverse what China economically has done to the U.S.

And if anything is effective in stopping China from doing what it has done with this virus, it would be the world "community" putting the blame for the spread of it on the country that most effectively could have stopped it at its doorstep.

wdmso

04-17-2020, 02:15 PM

'Trump has done zero to make us better #^&#^&#^&#^&

He kept us safe, thats his Job he got unemployment to the lowest it's been in 50 years, Had nothing to do with anything he did but please feel free to fill in the blanks and the lowest ever for minorities. How is that not making anyone better off? Again, you cannot accept or process, that which doesn't fit your agenda.

"but past accomplishments real or not are irrelevant"

So because a pandemic hit that no one saw coming, his past accomplishments are wiped clean? And since when did you ever acknowledge any of his past accomplishments? like i said actual or perceived accomplishments

Gibberish.

Let's see where the economy is in 6 months. Lets and lets hope its bounces back

Did you rip up your stimulus check? Does that check make you better off than before you cashed it? Yes or no?

Nope still waiting on my check not that 1200 is going to change my life it will go right back at Tax time to the Government .. for the huge tax break i ve been told we all got...

Just because Trump keeps telling you all these things are because of him . you might try actually looking into it :kewl:

wdmso

04-17-2020, 02:18 PM

President Donald Trump has appeared to endorse protests against stringent lockdown measures in several states.

In a series of tweets, he said: "LIBERATE MINNESOTA", "LIBERATE MICHIGAN" and then "LIBERATE VIRGINIA".

again lets start hearing the excuses......of what americans he cares about

scottw

04-17-2020, 02:23 PM

President Donald Trump has appeared to ....

.

:fishslap:

wdmso

04-17-2020, 02:27 PM

:fishslap:

tweets aren't good enough:lama:

scottw

04-17-2020, 02:39 PM

tweets aren't good enough:lama:

I hope trump says at the presser today, when questioned about the WHO..

"If the director is not fired, they're not getting the money" :kewl:

wdmso

04-17-2020, 03:26 PM

The states Mr Trump referenced in Friday's tweets are all led by Democrats. Ohio and Utah, which he did not mention, have Republican governors.

Who also have some kind of stay at home orders ... what a surprise Trump doing what he does best creating 2 Americas us and Them its disgusting

Jim in CT

04-17-2020, 04:53 PM

Nope still waiting on my check not that 1200 is going to change my life it will go right back at Tax time to the Government .. for the huge tax break i ve been told we all got...

Just because Trump keeps telling you all these things are because of him . you might try actually looking into it :kewl:

"He kept us safe, thats his Job '

Let's recap...

WDMSO: Trump didn't do anything to make us better off.

Jim: He kept us safe.

WDMSO: that's his job.

Earth to Wayne, yes that is an important part of his job. And he did that one part well. There are things that he stinks at, but he did that well. You just can't bring yourself to say it. Everything he does, is "doing his job".

"he got unemployment to the lowest it's been in 50 years, Had nothing to do with anything he did"

He lowered the corporate tax rate from 35% to 21%. What that means is, investments in growth that might not have been feasible at a corporate tax rate of 35%, suddenly are a great investment at 21%. Income tax is the "cost" of income. And as I'd assume you already know given your knowledge of macroeconomics, when the cost of something goes down, the demand for that something - no matter what it is - goes up. In this case, the demand for income went up, and one way to achieve more income is to grow and expand, and that requires labor. Which means more jobs. Which lowers unemployment.

He also eliminated regulations, which makes incentivizes growth. He also incentivized businesses to return, I think, about $2 trillion in profits that had been stored offshore.

All of that helped lead to record stock market performance. Which despite what you likely think, helps everyone, especially public sector workers whose pensions need to grow tremendously to have any chance of funding promised benefits.

Go ahead and tell me where that was wrong.

"actual or perceived accomplishments"

SO when unemployment went down and the stock market went up under Obama, were you this reluctant to give him credit? I give Obama good marks for getting us out of the recession.

I'd be very interested to hear you explain why you give Obama credit for helping the economy, but not Trump. I'm all ears.

Pete F.

04-17-2020, 05:20 PM

wdmso

04-17-2020, 05:21 PM

"He kept us safe, thats his Job '

Let's recap...

WDMSO: Trump didn't do anything to make us better off.

Jim: He kept us safe.

WDMSO: that's his job.

Earth to Wayne, yes that is an important part of his job. And he did that one part well. There are things that he stinks at, but he did that well. You just can't bring yourself to say it. Everything he does, is "doing his job".

"he got unemployment to the lowest it's been in 50 years, Had nothing to do with anything he did"

He lowered the corporate tax rate from 35% to 21%. What that means is, investments in growth that might not have been feasible at a corporate tax rate of 35%, suddenly are a great investment at 21%. Income tax is the "cost" of income. And as I'd assume you already know given your knowledge of macroeconomics, when the cost of something goes down, the demand for that something - no matter what it is - goes up. In this case, the demand for income went up, and one way to achieve more income is to grow and expand, and that requires labor. Which means more jobs. Which lowers unemployment.

He also eliminated regulations, which makes incentivizes growth. He also incentivized businesses to return, I think, about $2 trillion in profits that had been stored offshore.

All of that helped lead to record stock market performance. Which despite what you likely think, helps everyone, especially public sector workers whose pensions need to grow tremendously to have any chance of funding promised benefits.

Go ahead and tell me where that was wrong.

"actual or perceived accomplishments"

SO when unemployment went down and the stock market went up under Obama, were you this reluctant to give him credit? I give Obama good marks for getting us out of the recession.

I'd be very interested to hear you explain why you give Obama credit for helping the economy, but not Trump. I'm all ears.

So if you jump on a car that's already doing 50mph and you hit 90 mph. How to you take credit for getting the car to do 90. ,,, I can see taking credit for the extra 40.

Jim in CT

04-17-2020, 06:34 PM

So if you jump on a car that's already doing 50mph and you hit 90 mph. How to you take credit for getting the car to do 90. ,,, I can see taking credit for the extra 40.

He didn't just jump on the Obama bandwagon, he did some very bold, very different things. Cutting the corporate tax rate to 21% had no impact on growth, that's what you're saying? The income tax cuts that 60% of Americans received, that didn't stimulate anything?

Again, Obama and Trump each helped the economy, but took very different approaches. You can't bring yourself to say it. Maybe stick to your day job, economics isn't your cup of tea.

Jim in CT

04-17-2020, 06:36 PM

WDMSO, if Trump said "the sky is blue", you would say "the hell it is!" That's how deranged you are.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2019/jul/9/robert-johnson-bet-founder-praises-trumps-economy-/

spence

04-17-2020, 06:49 PM

Sea Dangles

04-17-2020, 06:56 PM

Ask the Palestinian people.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Pete F.

04-17-2020, 07:33 PM

I don't know what the IC told him. I don't know what the IC of the rest of the world told their governments.
We have the most comprehensive and complete IC community in the world, the WHO has none. We also failed to appoint our representative to the WHO and now Trump* wants to blame them for failing to tell us what they did tell us when they knew and when they knew even though they did.

China loosed this pandemic on the rest of the world and there is no way that the CCP didn't know that is exactly what they were doing.
That is conjecture on your part, just because Pompeo and Trump are pushing that theory doesn't make it true.

You can go on and on with your notion that it's Trump's fault that it was not stopped at our doorstep, or not stopped soon enough, and posting your selected timelines, but that is all, as usual, a compilation of factoids meant to inspire your preferred conjecture, opinion and accusation.

All you need to do is look at Trump*s public statements and the warnings put forth both within and from outside his administration and you can see what he failed to do.

National Security is his F'n Job and if you want to claim it is not then just what rationale do you use for his declaration of an emergency to build a wall.

What is Trump*s fault is delaying action, downplaying the danger, and not following the procedure that previous presidents both R and D for multiple administrations had set up to make sure that the responsibilities in case of a pandemic had already been assigned and we would have the best chance to control it.
"Nobody knew" is Bull.... all the records and documents exist.

I don't know if it's also supposed to be Trump's fault that so much of the rest of the world was also not able to do what you think Trump was supposed to do, or if they all were also in your eyes just as negligent.

Pretty obvious if you look at transaction records that governments of developed governments throughout the world were buying up PPE starting in January. What was the Trump* maladministration doing? Rallies and Golf

I don't have confidence that Trump can convince the CCP to play fair trade with us. I think he is right to try much of what he is doing in that respect. But I doubt China will voluntarily give up its one way advantage and become a fair trading partner with the rest of the world. If that were to happen, it would be the beginning of the end of the CCP. And I don't think the party members are willing to commit that suicide--possibly literally as well as figuratively. Same goes for North Korea.

But if there is any hope of such a change, it won't be enhanced by berating China for its malfeasance re this virus. Trump is trapping himself on that tightwire he has to walk while simultaneously negotiating and blaming. I don't expect you to accede to nor understand that.

But, if anything is effective in changing our economic relation with China, the tariffs would be so. It is about the only way, other than outright war, to reverse what China economically has done to the U.S.

And if anything is effective in stopping China from doing what it has done with this virus, it would be the world "community" putting the blame for the spread of it on the country that most effectively could have stopped it at its doorstep.

What Trump* has done for foreign relations is at a minimum hurt our alliances, let China, Russia and other totalitarian governments gain ground with countries around the world and failed to control anything that he claims to have wanted to.
There are reasons our enemies and allies laugh at him and call him out as the whining baby that he is.
You really think that the countries who have had their administrations bullied and denigrated by Trump and received help from China are going to join him in attacking China?
He may have recognized that there are things that should change in our relationship with the rest of the world but is clueless on how to accomplish that within the framework of the Constitution. If he had put together a competent team he may have had a chance, but all he has ever allowed is people who praise him, take blame for his failures or leave.
His administration is comprised of the largest compilation of incompetent buttkissers ever assembled in the WH.
We are not in a Reality TV series.

In the past month Trump has gone from "anyone who wants a test can have one" to "The States have to step up their TESTING!"
What a Leader, perhaps the Governors should also just pick up their toys and say it's the Mayor's problem, I'm not going to play anymore.
He's done his typical bankruptcy game, that he has done many times before but this time instead of creditors and contractors he has left the American people holding the bag for his failure as a leader.
Now he has a cute Powerpoint by Jared with no defined plan on how the economy is going to come back to life. No testing, it's not his problem. No tracking or control, it's not his problem. Good luck Governors, I'm done.
He'll go back to building his wall for $5000+ a linear foot because those Central Americans will bankrupt us.

detbuch

04-17-2020, 10:18 PM

We have the most comprehensive and complete IC community in the world, the WHO has none. We also failed to appoint our representative to the WHO and now Trump* wants to blame them for failing to tell us what they did tell us when they knew and when they knew even though they did.

What did IC tell Trump? Has there been any of those famous selective leaks that we should know about? Are you denying that WHO did not downplay the virus early on and that China had no influence on that downplaying?

(China loosed this pandemic on the rest of the world and there is no way that the CCP didn't know that is exactly what they were doing.)
That is conjecture on your part, just because Pompeo and Trump are pushing that theory doesn't make it true.

Are you saying that the CCP did not immediately on confirming the danger of the virus shut down travel within China from or to Wuhon? And are you denying that, at the same time, it allowed travel from out of Wuhon to the rest of the world?

All you need to do is look at Trump*s public statements and the warnings put forth both within and from outside his administration and you can see what he failed to do.

Fauci said that Trump agreed to the medical team's requests every time they asked.

What is Trump*s fault is delaying action, downplaying the danger,

He parroted the downplaying that was mouthed by his medical expert team, as well as the media and Democrat pols at the time.

and not following the procedure that previous presidents both R and D for multiple administrations had set up to make sure that the responsibilities in case of a pandemic had already been assigned and we would have the best chance to control it.

What procedures did he not follow?

Pretty obvious if you look at transaction records that governments of developed governments throughout the world were buying up PPE starting in January. What was the Trump* maladministration doing? Rallies and Golf

Really"? Just rallies and golf?

What Trump* has done for foreign relations is at a minimum hurt our alliances, let China, Russia and other totalitarian governments gain ground with countries around the world and failed to control anything that he claims to have wanted to.
There are reasons our enemies and allies laugh at him and call him out as the whining baby that he is.
You really think that the countries who have had their administrations bullied and denigrated by Trump and received help from China are going to join him in attacking China?
He may have recognized that there are things that should change in our relationship with the rest of the world but is clueless on how to accomplish that within the framework of the Constitution. If he had put together a competent team he may have had a chance, but all he has ever allowed is people who praise him, take blame for his failures or leave.
His administration is comprised of the largest compilation of incompetent buttkissers ever assembled in the WH.
We are not in a Reality TV series.

Quite a rant. Up to your usual standards.

In the past month Trump has gone from "anyone who wants a test can have one" to "The States have to step up their TESTING!"
What a Leader, perhaps the Governors should also just pick up their toys and say it's the Mayor's problem, I'm not going to play anymore.
He's done his typical bankruptcy game, that he has done many times before but this time instead of creditors and contractors he has left the American people holding the bag for his failure as a leader.
Now he has a cute Powerpoint by Jared with no defined plan on how the economy is going to come back to life. No testing, it's not his problem. No tracking or control, it's not his problem. Good luck Governors, I'm done.
He'll go back to building his wall for $5000+ a linear foot because those Central Americans will bankrupt us.

More of the same.

Sea Dangles

04-17-2020, 11:28 PM

Clearly the greatest president of our lifetime
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Nebe

04-18-2020, 06:33 AM

Clearly the greatest president of our lifetime
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Right. Clear as day. Keep up the good work
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

wdmso

04-18-2020, 07:50 AM

wdmso

04-18-2020, 08:05 AM

He didn't just jump on the Obama bandwagon, he did some very bold, very different things. Cutting the corporate tax rate to 21% had no impact on growth, that's what you're saying? The income tax cuts that 60% of Americans received, that didn't stimulate anything?

Again, Obama and Trump each helped the economy, but took very different approaches. You can't bring yourself to say it. Maybe stick to your day job, economics isn't your cup of tea.

Yes jim he gave a huge tax break and they used it for stock buy backs

You 60% tax cut did nothing for avg Americans but you insist it has happen based on omg. anecdotal evidence. Deregulation

a new report from Goldman Sachs splashes some cold water on the deregulatory impulse,
Overall, our results suggest that non-financial deregulation has had a limited impact on the economy .. no really

Trump was handed a car running on all cylinders yes he put some better gas in the tank ,,, he keeps paying shut up money to farmers just gave them another 19 billion..

Not sure why the Trump faithful believe him 100% a 100% of the time

It’s Easier to Fool People Than to Convince Them That They Have Been Fooled’?

What a truthful statement

detbuch

04-18-2020, 08:08 AM

Wow a rich black guy is your metric of Trumps genius

Wow if Trump made a comment like that it would be considered racist.

wdmso

04-18-2020, 08:18 AM

Isn’t this illegal?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Don't know ,, 1 min he supported these actions , when he thinks the worst is behind him he tweets that nonsense

I find it funny that they were protesting the lock down that allowed them to drive they showed up armed to shoot covid 19 if it appeared. Most wore no masks ...

I WAGER NONE were doctors nurses police or fire other health care workers , fastfood workers or groceries workers,, just the fringe opportunist ,,, and Trump once again gave them legitimacy , over the millions of Americans who are willing to suffer some short term pain for a long term gain

Sea Dangles

04-18-2020, 08:20 AM

America 1st
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Pete F.

04-18-2020, 08:23 AM

More of the same.

Absolutely more US coronavirus deaths:

7 weeks ago: 0 deaths
6 weeks ago: 17 deaths
5 weeks ago: 49 deaths
4 weeks ago: 249 deaths
3 weeks ago: 1,588 deaths
2 weeks ago: 7,152 deaths
1 week ago: 18,758 deaths

As of yesterday: 36,997 deaths

A key task for analysts during disease outbreaks is to determine whether foreign officials are trying to minimize the effects of an outbreak or take steps to hide a public health crisis, according to current and former officials familiar with the process.

At the State Department, personnel had been nervously tracking early reports about the virus. One official noted that it was discussed at a meeting in the third week of January, around the time that cable traffic showed that U.S. diplomats in Wuhan were being brought home on chartered planes — a sign that the public health risk was significant. A colleague at the White House mentioned how concerned he was about the transmissibility of the virus.

“In January, there was obviously a lot of chatter,” the official said.

The State Department announced Feb. 7 that it had “facilitated the transportation of nearly 17.8 tons of donated medical supplies to the Chinese people” to fight against Covid-19.

The same day, the WHO director general said, “There is limited stock of (personal protective equipment) and we need to make sure we get it to the people who need it most in the places that need it most,” citing health care workers and caretakers.

The rest of the world started buying PPE, Ventilators, etc.

What procedures did he not follow
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/pandemic-resources/pdf/pandemic-influenza-implementation.pdf

After SARS, MERS, AIDS and Ebola it became obvious that flu was not the only pandemic danger.

The NSC in response developed this document, the Trump* administration eliminated the portion of the NSC that administered it. Just another layer of unnecessary bureaucracy that was removed.

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/6819268/Pandemic-Playbook.pdf

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q28z4mkEY5Y

wdmso

04-18-2020, 08:39 AM

Wow if Trump made a comment like that it would be considered racist.

Of course because he would have attached it to not getting convicted of a crime or him being black was his only reason for his success!

Sea Dangles

04-18-2020, 08:48 AM

Stay at home people.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

hq2

04-18-2020, 09:16 AM

Sea Dangles

04-18-2020, 09:32 AM

Response to Pete. F.

The GOP and Trump voters were fools. They elected an unqualified buffoon to be their leader. But what they’re finding out now is that being fools has consequences.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
I look back on the days when we would get boarded by Iranian soldiers in the gulf and just fall to our knees and clasp our hands over our heads looking for mercy. Yup, those were the good ole days. The glory days. We have to bring that back.
Then, we can give them money to make them like us. You know, like they used to.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

detbuch

04-18-2020, 09:44 AM

Of course because he would have attached it to not getting convicted of a crime or him being black was his only reason for his success!

Of course because, as you are demonstrating here, people like you would "interpret" it that way.

detbuch

04-18-2020, 10:00 AM

What procedures did he not follow
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/pandemic-resources/pdf/pandemic-influenza-implementation.pdf

But he did follow those procedures as outlined in chapter 3 Federal Government response. And the "communities" response guidelines in the plan had not been fully followed by the state and local communities which were caught short handed and unprepared. Trump actually used federal resources to make up for that. And the previous administration had not replenished the federal stockpile so Trump had to do that as well as provide to the communities that which they didn't. And the federal regulatory agencies such as the CDC were slow to create a testing regime which it decided to create anew rather than use the existing WHO model, and it flubbed that a few times before getting it partially right (still not 100% verifiable) and accepting contributions from others--all costing that valuable preliminary time that would have saved more lives.

Pete F.

04-18-2020, 10:38 AM

But he did follow those procedures as outlined in chapter 3 Federal Government response. Too late And the "communities" response guidelines in the plan had not been fully followed by the state and local communities which were caught short handed and unprepared. His administration failed to take the leadership role, if the battle was against a foreign army would you expect the states to have the information and take the lead? Trump actually used federal resources to make up for that. And the previous administration had not replenished the federal stockpile so Trump had to do that as well as provide to the communities that which they didn't. He has been in office for three years, and his party controlled Congress for the first two of those years. Perhaps they could have funded the restocking that they blocked under the previous administration. And the federal regulatory agencies such as the CDC were slow to create a testing regime which it decided to create anew rather than use the existing WHO model, and it flubbed that a few times before getting it partially right (still not 100% verifiable) and accepting contributions from others--all costing that valuable preliminary time that would have saved more lives.

His JOB is to administer the federal government and the various parts thereof.
They do need to be led or do you claim that the office is unimportant, ceremonial and titular only? Like the Queen or King of the UK?

He tweeted yesterday about Obama/Biden, how does anyone rationalize that statement with his current claim that this is the Governors fault?

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
Biden/Obama were a disaster in handling the H1N1 Swine Flu. Polling at the time showed disastrous approval numbers. 17,000 people died unnecessarily and through incompetence!

Trump will have really big numbers, much bigger than anyone else and he will figure out a way to brag, cast aspersions and blame.

spence

04-18-2020, 10:52 AM

I look back on the days when we would get boarded by Iranian soldiers in the gulf and just fall to our knees and clasp our hands over our heads looking for mercy. Yup, those were the good ole days. The glory days. We have to bring that back.
Then, we can give them money to make them like us. You know, like they used to.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
You mean that time when we accidentally strayed into Iranian territory, the Sec State made a phone call and our sailors were released with all their equipment...you mean that time?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Sea Dangles

04-18-2020, 01:50 PM

You mean that time when we accidentally strayed into Iranian territory, the Sec State made a phone call and our sailors were released with all their equipment...you mean that time?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
That was an accident Jeff? Of course, USN gets lost all the time. Wow, you are wicked smart. You must read a lot.
Perhaps you should focus more on illegally liberating states.🤡
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

detbuch

04-18-2020, 02:56 PM

(But he did follow those procedures as outlined in chapter 3 Federal Government response.)

Too late

So now you go from him not following procedures to he followed them too late. So the fact is he did, your opinion is too late.

The consensus early on is that the risk in the US was low and that Trump's travel ban on China was excessive and racist. In late February, Pelosi and the Dems, various media, were saying it was safe to continue as normal and made fun of Trump trying to scare us.

(And the "communities" response guidelines in the plan had not been fully followed by the state and local communities which were caught short handed and unprepared.)

His administration failed to take the leadership role, if the battle was against a foreign army would you expect the states to have the information and take the lead?

But the established procedure you said he didn't follow, or he followed too late, clearly stated that the state and local communities were responsible to keep adequate supplies and to be prepared through practice and readiness procedures to quickly respond to a pandemic.

(Trump actually used federal resources to make up for that. And the previous administration had not replenished the federal stockpile so Trump had to do that as well as provide to the communities that which they themselves, as required by the established "plan," had not.)

He has been in office for three years, and his party controlled Congress for the first two of those years. Perhaps they could have funded the restocking that they blocked under the previous administration.

"Perhaps" they were not aware of the shortage. It was the duty of the CDC and FDA to always remain stocked. Shortages had to be reported to the administration, otherwise it would be unaware of the situation.

The media has reported that regulatory agencies informed the Obama administration of the need to re-supply. It didn't in the seven years that it knew of the shortage.

I don't know if the Trump administration was made aware. And I would think that the anti-Trump media cartel would have pointed out that Trump denied a request. Maybe they have. I am not aware of it. And even if Trump did deny a request, "perhaps" he did it for the same reason Obama did. Or "perhaps" he may have thought it wasn't that important if Obama didn't either.

And Trump did, when the shortage was discovered, order it to be corrected and he did so even beyond the federal shortage but aided in filling the State's shortage as well.

As for him being too slow to get testing started, our highly touted
(federal regulatory agencies such as the CDC were slow to create a testing regime which it decided to create anew rather than use the existing WHO model, and it flubbed that a few times before getting it partially right (still not 100% verifiable) and accepting contributions from other sources--all costing that valuable preliminary time that would have saved more lives.) https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/contamination-at-cdc-lab-delayed-rollout-of-coronavirus-tests/ar-BB12Q90W?ocid=spartandhp

His JOB is to administer the federal government and the various parts thereof.
They do need to be led or do you claim that the office is unimportant, ceremonial and titular only? Like the Queen or King of the UK?

He is doing a good job of leading, your opinion notwithstanding.

He tweeted yesterday about Obama/Biden, how does anyone rationalize that statement with his current claim that this is the Governors fault?

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
Biden/Obama were a disaster in handling the H1N1 Swine Flu. Polling at the time showed disastrous approval numbers. 17,000 people died unnecessarily and through incompetence!

Trump will have really big numbers, much bigger than anyone else and he will figure out a way to brag, cast aspersions and blame.

Good to know. Thanks for the heads up.