Greetings,

I am planning to wrap up a Patriot 1209 blank for jigging and heavy plugging and was wondering about using the Fuji alconite guides. I would love to hear all opinions on the alconites as I do not know much about them other than advertised literature.

Also, some opinions on guide spacing would be welcome. I plan on putting a Daiwa Emblem ZA 5500 on it using 65lb Tufline XP. The reel will be mounted 22 inches (reel stem) from the butt of the rod.

Best regards,

Mark

Put the first guide 36 inches from the seat front. Put the first guide 7 inches from the tip. Space out the rest accordingly. I think I would use 6 guides total. can't help you with the alconite as i use fuji-- Hardloy guides and Sic tips.

I've got this rod and love it. It took some getting used to, but now it is my go to rod!

If you're still looking for the spacing let me know. I'll check mine out and let you know.

I've got hardaloy guides with an sic top and it is rigged conventional.

For me the sweet spot seems to be five oz.

Greetings,

Thanks for the replies.

I have this rod as well and it has also turned out to be the rod that I reach for. For the way I fish it seems to be a great all purpose rod. I had one wrapped for me about 5-6 weeks ago and I instantly fell in love with it. It can do pretty much everything I want and has the backbone to make the fish do pretty much what I want. I like the way I can bring in small fish and not have to worry about them being played out. Also 25lb bass in a good current can be managed quite nicely.

That is why I am thinking of wrapping another one over the winter with possibly the alconite guides.

Saltheart, thanks for the suggestions.

Stroth, thanks for the offer of your guide spacing but I am pretty much a spinning guy only.

Best regards,

Mark

I am in the process of building the exact same rod in spinning trim.


Going with the following guides in hardloy 50, 40, 30, 20, 16, 12
with a 12 ring SIC tip

Spacing is as follows but still needs slight tweaking!

50-57.5"
40-43"
30-32.5"
20-23"
16-14.5"
12-7"

My seat is fixed at 25.5" to center of seat.

Hope this helps!!

I tried to set the guides up with a 25 between the 30 and the 20 and then go to a 16 without using the 12 but I like it better without the 25 and adding the 12.



Russ

Alternative guide spacing - completely contradicts everything posted here.

Since you want to use Alconite guides, go with the MN frames (BMNAG). The guides are fairly cheap, order the "normal" guides as requested as above, lay out the guides on teh rod, test cast it. Record all info regarding how far wach guide is from each other - then take them all off.

Take a MN 20, place it no less than 44 inches from the center of the reel. Next MN 16, space it based on a static deflection test. Decide which size ring tip-top you are going to use, 12 or 10. The rest of the guides on the rod can be either 10 or 12's. Place all these guides based on a stress test.

Now go test cast, making sure the line shoots right through the stripper, and notice how the line does not look like it is moving through any of the remaining guides. Also notice, there is no noticeable loss or gain in distance. Also notice how light the rod is compared to when it had the standard guides on it.

Basically, this is the Fuji Low Rider guide layout, using regular MN guides. Although it was designed for longer 12'6 rods, it will make a noticeable diffrence in weight, while offering the same casting distance in a shorter rod such as the one you are looking to build.

I'm not telling you this is the way you should do it, give it a shot, if you like it, go for it, if not, go with teh standard set up. Best part of wrapping your own is it's YOUR rod and you build it as you see fit. All I'm doing is offering an alternative.

I've wrapped an Arra 1204 (which had an 18" extension and broke), then I wrapped an Arra 1321 both with the Low Riders. The rods are (were) light as can be, and they both casted really well.

Another advantage of teh rod being so light, is that you can add another guide near the tip section. This will transfer teh load of fighting a fish down to the beefier part of the blank, thus making it feel "stronger". This is much easier to show if we were in person, but when a rod has a normal set up with 5 or 6 guides, when the blank is loaded, it feels kind of springy. With tha addition of an extra guide i teh right place (and thus re-positioning all guides except the stripper), will result in teh rod having a more solid feel when loaded. THere will be no loss of casting distance with this additional guide, because the line is gathered at the stripper guide, and goes STRAIGHT through all teh remaining guides out through the tip. So you could probably add 5 more guides and not lose much distance due to friction (I'm assuming on this point)

Billy,
With that 20 at 44" from the reel wont you get line slap on the blank? Not familiar with the lowriders so I really dont know how larger the guide is or how close to the blank it sits?

After reading your comments again, were you thinking conventional setup? It just puzzled me when you said to use 12 or 10's the rest of the way?

Now ya got me confused!!!!:smash:


Russ

Billy,
Thanks for that info... Looking at something a different way is never a bad thing... Besides.... got a long winter ahead to play with those ideas...

Russ - that's a spinning set-up. ONLY for Braid, if I left that out, I shouldn't have. Mono will NOT work like this. With Braid, tehre will be NO line slap at all.

I test casted an Arra 1204 with a VS250 and 65# Whiplash, and teh line went right through the stripper with no slap. The NAutil 7500 (I think) and 65# Whip on an Arra 1321 had no slap, and went through the guide even smoother.

All I can say is don't believe what I posted, try it for yourself on your next rod. All it will cost you is a few extra bucks in guides, and maybe an hour or 2 of your time.

The whole purpose of using all 10's or 12's is that the line is "tamed"/under control after the stripper guide, so there is no reason to use larger guides, unless you want to make the rod heavier than it is. Again, assume I'm lying, and try it out and see for yourself how the line looks when going through these running guides.

The worst thing that can happen if you try this out is you don't like it, think I'm crazy, and make the rod teh way you normally do.

HMMMMM very interesting Billy 40, i can see youre point, mono has memory and coils out, while braid has no memory it goes out straight so big guides are not needed. except for the stripper.
something to think about on the next rod.

SJ - this is not anything I've come up with, it's basically my interpretation of Fuji's Low Rider Concept for Tournament distance casting with Spinning rods. I substituted the BMNAG guides for the LCSG guides for cost savings, since I know a lot of guys like myself cannot or will not afford SIC guides. I also added my personal likes to lighten a rod.

If you try using Mono with this setup (size 20 stripper), please do not come back here and post telling my I'm a butthead who doesn't know what I'm talking about, it will not work with Mono. lol.

Now I get it!!!

Billy, PM sent!!!!!!

Good stuff Billy!

One question , I assume a 1209 is being used for casting fairly heavy stuff (unlike an Arra 1204) which means a heavy leader material. How well does the leader knot go through all the #10 guides?

Decide which size ring tip-top you are going to use, 12 or 10. The rest of the guides on the rod can be either 10 or 12's.

Or 16's. Anything is lighter then the 40-30-25-20-16 standard set-ups. 20 -16-16-16-16, or 20-16-12-12-12 or 20-12-12-12-12 or 20-12-10-10-10 or 20-16-10-10-10 - try them all, see if it feels lighter and casts teh same, and then make a decision. IT can't hurt to test cast all these various set-ups one boring weekend afternoon to figure it out.

At least my weekends are boring - lol.