the intent of bombing dresden wasn't to test a new weapon ..


The bombing and the resulting firestorm destroyed over 1,600 acres (6.5 km2) of the city centre.[2] An estimated 22,700[3] to 25,000[4] people were killed.

Within the first two to four months of the bombings, the acute effects of the atomic bombings killed 90,000–146,000 people in Hiroshima and 39,000–80,000 in Nagasaki; roughly half of the deaths in each city occurred on the first day.

and lets look at all the data that came after the war and how it advanced or knowledge of radiation fall out and effects of the bomb

67 Japanese Cities Firebombed in World War II

http://www.ditext.com/japan/napalm.html
Name of Japanese
city firebombed Percentage of the
city destroyed Equivalent in size to
the following American city

Yokohama 58 Cleveland
Tokyo 51 New York
Toyama 99 Chattanooga
Nagoya 40 Los Angeles
Osaka 35.1 Chicago
Nishinomiya 11.9 Cambridge
Siumonoseki 37.6 San Diego
Kure 41.9 Toledo

no we dropped it to test a new weapon in hind sight you could say it was an evil act I am not suggesting that at all but It wasn't done just to end the war it might have been part of it but not the sole reason

WDMSO, are you under the impression that we decided on our own, to pick on Japan in 1942?

What do you base that on, if I may ask?

He's correct - the primary reason was to encourage the Japanese to end the war (and saving millions of lives, American, Chinese, Indo-China, Korean, and yes, Japanese too).

It was also intended to influence the Soviets, and hedge their thoughts of invasion of Japan, But that is considered an influential but not deciding factor. Remember - Truman did not initially know of the bomb until shortly before

Missing in this discussion is that Germany and Japan both had Atomic weapons programs and had their efforts been more fruitful and advanced, things might have been a lot different.

it's hard to be wrong stating the obvious "not the sole reason"....I think the rub is the suggestion that we did it to "field test" a weapon of mass destruction on folks("inferiors") that we didn't necessarily mind mass destroying(women, children and the like) simply because they didn't look like us or our "european brothers"....

As unpalatable as that may be by todays standard .... I strongly feel thats exactly what we did... most of the propaganda of that time reflects that believe

I have no issues in what was done to japan to include the bomb or germany during war its about winning and i wasn't fighting that war those who were did what they felt best for the country.. i just am not blinded by patriotism or nationalism that 71 years later things should be viewed through the same 1942 lens ... its not revisionist history people had reservations then

http://www.trumanlibrary.org/whistle...b&pagenumber=1

Jesus God Almighty, that was the world then. Japan set out to enslave the world. They were well on their way until we stepped in. Captured American fliers WDERE TORTURED AND EATEN, and back then we didn't give a sh*t about political correctness. We wanted to annihilate them. They were barbaric monsters.

Yes, we had reservations.

But it wasn't an evil act, and for Obama to say it was...he's a village idiot, we elected the village idiot.

Jim, he never said that.

You need help.

"We shall not repeat the evil".

what was he referring to?

another Clinton Presidency...just a guess

:rotfl:
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

that hitler poster is pretty offensive...I can't believe we stooped to that:doh:

just demonstrating the stark deference between the 2 theaters

this is as sinister as the Germans one get

a world War comes to mind

He never said that Jim.

"Let all the souls here rest in peace, for we shall not repeat the evil" is an English translation of an epitaph on the Hiroshima memorial.

You've once again been duped by fake right wing "news."

long and storied history of depicting the enemy in unflattering caricature...nothing new...still to this day

First you denied that he said "evil". Now, you're saying...I don't know what... but you are claiming that by "evil", Obama wasn't referring to our dropping the bomb. His whole speech was about nukes, and the people who died at Hiroshima, and the death fell from above, duh duh duh.

His whole speech was about nukes, and that death fell from above, and about the people who died at Hiroshima. Sorry if the text of his speech proves my point...

it was at hiroshima why wouldn't it be about nukes?? and a world war guess you didnt take the time to read the speech

The world war that reached its brutal end in Hiroshima and Nagasaki was fought among the wealthiest and most powerful of nations. Their civilizations had given the world great cities and magnificent art. Their thinkers had advanced ideas of justice and harmony and truth. And yet the war grew out of the same base instinct for domination or conquest that had caused conflicts among the simplest tribes, an old pattern amplified by new capabilities and without new constraints.
In the span of a few years, some 60 million people would die. Men, women, children, no different than us. Shot, beaten, marched, bombed, jailed, starved, gassed to death. There are many sites around the world that chronicle this war, memorials that tell stories of courage and heroism, graves and empty camps that echo of unspeakable depravity.


Still, every act of aggression between nations, every act of terror and corruption and cruelty and oppression that we see around the world shows our work is never done. We may not be able to eliminate man’s capacity to do evil, so nations and the alliances that we form must possess the means to defend ourselves. But among those nations like my own that hold nuclear stockpiles, we must have the courage to escape the logic of fear and pursue a world without them.
^^^^^^this is the only mention of evil in his whole speech


heres a link to the whole speech http://time.com/4350339/barack-obama...ech-full-text/

that speech sucks :uhuh: just more lecturing from the lecturer-in-chief

Obama skips over important facts like Japan killed an estimated 14 million Chinese citizens in its invasion of China. And during the course of that invasion, its forces acted much like Hitler’s SS, conducting mass-scale rapes, grotesque human experimentation, and enslaving countless men, women, and children.

In the Battle of Okinawa just prior, in slightly less than three months of combat, more than 20,000 Americans died, over 70,000 Japanese troops lost their lives, and up to one-third of Japanese civilians perished. One battle was deadlier than the Hiroshima bombing.

I'd have to check the timeline to be sure but I'm pretty sure we were aware of the the Japanese atrocities, their ferocity and willingness to fight to the last man,woman, child going in....I don't believe we understood the depth of the atrocities of the Germans till we began liberating those camps near the time of surrender.

So the horrors of the Nazis were being uncovered leading up to and after surrender in May of 1945....we had the bloodiest battle of the Pacific in Okinawa ending in June 1945...and "WE DROPPED DEATH" August 6th 1945...and changed the world...presumably for the worse:confused:



"Seventy-one years ago, on a bright cloudless morning, death(from America) fell from the sky and the world was changed. A flash of light and a wall of fire destroyed a city and demonstrated that mankind(America) possessed the means to destroy itself.
Why do we come to this place, to Hiroshima? We come to ponder a terrible force (America) unleashed in a not-so-distant past. We come to mourn the dead (killed by America), including over 100,000 Japanese men, women and children, thousands of Koreans, a dozen Americans held prisoner.
Their souls speak to us. They ask us to look inward, to take stock of who we are and what we might become.

Yet in the image of a mushroom cloud that rose into these skies, we are most starkly reminded of (America's)humanity’s core contradiction. "


I wonder if Obama ever ponders what the world would look like if America had not intervened?

My grandfather never owned a Japanese car. Or a German car. How quickly we forget.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

and how quickly we forgive...we began rebuilding these nations that unleashed historic horrors on the world immediately...

taking "stock of who we are and what we might become."

he makes me vomit

I crack up at a particular area union facility with BMWs, Mercs, Lexus, etc - and me with my lowly F150.

Yes, nation building at considerable cost, of civilized nations, that had been thoroughly defeated. To assist in providing a counterweight to the Soviet Union.

Hard to say how much better it could have worked out ;)

also consider.....how many folks listening to that speech would not be around to hear it, either directly or having never been born if we'd gone ahead with a mainland invasion...the loss of life estimates were astronomic...not to mention all the rubble

Obama skips over important facts.. was he giving a speech or a history lesson??


1 bomb =100,000 Japanese men, women and children, thousands of Koreans, a dozen Americans held prisoner.in an instant [/B]


80 day plus battle for the Island of Okinawa which some have described as the "typhoon of steel"


if you see theses as equal you dont understand how it changed the world and warfare for ever

WOW funny to see people hold a grudge against the Japanese..over a war that was Fought 71 years ago ! do you still hate the British and the french or Germans for past wars and battles and gas chambers and other atrocities

of course not they are European

he was giving one of his obnoxious self-serving lectures