agreed Flap... however, my grandparents came in with papers.. as I am sure yours did... and they did not demand that people spoke their langauge, they adapted english, (not perfect, but worked on it as a lifelong chore, no prouder day for them, when the became "U.S. Citizens :) ), and assimilated to this country...

I know several "legal" aliens.. all decent hardworking folk, who work hard to speak english, and live by the book.. they are peer pressured by their community tho, to support the illegals, kind of sad, in a way, that has to happen.. "Illegal's Rights"... :huh: kind of an oxymoron, I'd say....

"Jose, Can you see?"... yeah, leave the anthem alone, Please.

Wow we have a lot of characters on this board and I am one of them. Bigfish I know you were not insulting my grand dad I was just making a point that spainish and indians speaking folks are here for the same reason your and my ancestors came. For a better life. I am sure there are some, a small percentage that play the system as do plenty of Americans, but I am also certain that many come here for a fresh start in a free country. I always try to keep that in mind when I deal with these folks. So have a nice day and keep on spreading the love.:uhuh:

No one cares about "legal" imigrants in this country. We encourage imagration when you do it the "legal" way. What Flaptail and many others like to ignore is the whole Legal vs. Illegal issue. Why are you guys trying to lump "illegal" imigrants in the same breathe as "legals"? There is a big differance guys. You come here the right way like my ancestors did or you dont come here at all. If you dont want to obey the laws of the US get the hell out. Do it right or stay the hell away.

I'm sick of people making excuses for the illegals and accepting thier behavior. These people are a slap in the face to the people who come to this country right way. Why the hell you people dont get that is beyond me. But then again you guys prob want open borders so everyone can flock to this country without the US doing any backround checks on these people or whatnot.

You come here legaly or you dont come here at all!

Bingo! Illegals have ZERO rights! They gave up thier rights when they decided to say F the system and sneek over the order ILLEGALLY. And you and me are paying for this illegal behavior.....:doh: Let them all stay home from work today, lets show them this country can run just fine without the illegals.

Horse hockey.

Aside from the logistical issues of deporting 11 million people, you have to replace their jobs with legal workers who are protected by different state and federal laws.

The impact to our economy would be devistating and impossible to counter...Unless you have a 100 year plan...

-spence

Hey read the paper please, A whole bunch of immigrants just landed at the airport. They are called alot of things , but most of all Dam Yankee's.... Kick them bastages out of town quick!:hidin:
VB

:doh:

I'm not sure what all the flap is over this Spanish version of our National Anthem, aside from zenophobia...

Jimi Hendrix ticked a lot of people off with his version, but guess what? It was simply Jimi expressing his love for America in his own way...it was his version...

If a hispanic person wants to express their feelings for America in Spanish I don't see what the problem is...it doesn't mean it has to be played at baseball games!

-spence

Did you read the post coprrectly? I am not in favor of illegal immigration.

It would not be devestating at all, and I already handed you a place to get these workers, and do not have to be protected by anything, you do know minimum wage is more than 2 bucks a day right? The ACI workers get paid less than illegals already, and there is absolutely no shortage of inmates in the USA. Sure it would be hard to deport 11 million people, but if we do not, then we might as well burn our constitution and bill of rights as they mean nothing. We were able to invade and occupy two countrys in less than 2 years, and they had weapons! You mean to tell me our armed forces could not make a huge dent in the illegal alien problem in our own country? You gravely underestimate the power we wield.

Duke...definitely was not insulting your Grand-Dad......he came the right way and I applaud him for, like you said, his bravery to make such a move.:claps:

Yeah i just re-read your post. I see what your saying. I think we're accually on the same page in many ways.

Especially the Spanish National Anthem. Thats just lame, they won't get any bonus points from Americans on that one. If anything it'll hurt thier cause more.

I love it, your reference for feesability are two military actions where the desired outcome ended up killing tens of thousands of innocent people :uhuh:

And according to the DOJ there are only about 2.1 million inmates, not quite the numbers necessary for your plan. Given you probably don't want the harder criminals out in the fields, the pool is quite a bit smaller than that.

Besides, what would happen if crime rates fell! Would we have to enact tougher laws to ensure the prison population was able to supply the needed people-power to keep the produce flowing :)

-spence

This issue is very easy.

No one is against LEGAL immigration. That is what this country is about.

It is the immigrants who are here ILLEGALLY who want to side step the process that is the problem.

If I were an immigrant going through the process legally I'd be pissed.

Heard an immigrant on the radio this morning going thru the process legally was asked if he'd go to war for the country. He said yes but he wasn't a citizen. I THINK WHAT ALLOT OF PEOPLE DON'T UNDERSTAND IS YOU DO NOT HAVE TO BE A CITIZEN TO BE IN THE ARMY, NAVY, AIR FORCE, MARINES OR COAST GAURD. but you do have to be a legal. That is a great loophole to becoming a citizen is join the military for a number of years, you'll get your citizenship through them.

People died because they were fighting invaders of their country, we will not be fighting on a battle field.

even if we don;t have the 11 million to directly replace the illegalls, atleast we have a starting point to deal with a two front problem. gettting rid of illegals, and helping ease the strain Prisioners put on us. And by the time the crime rate falls, all those illegals should be here legally :D And don't forget, out of those 11 millin illegas, how many are working adn how many are thier childeren? It is safe to say that is we booted 11 million illegals, there will not be 11 million jobs to fill, and if there is, then hey, looks like we will ave a reason to get them here quicker legally, so in the end everyone wins.

Also, atleast I am trying to come up with a solution, not just lying down and giving up. Ths country was built on the notion that anything is possible if you work hard enough.

A son of a legal immigrant
 

Spence,

Where are you getting your numbers for the monies that illegals put into US? All kidding/bitching aside, I truly would like to read this.

One irrefutable fact is that all border states are having huge financial problems due in large part (not 100%) in the drain illegal immigrants put on the local economy. Here is some information from a non-partisan (have not vetted them on this count) group:

QUOTE
The small picture, too, is a concern, said Mark Krikorian, executive director of the Center for Immigration Studies. Although he concedes that definite benefits for some specific sectors of the economy come from the illegal workforce, the overall costs to American citizens outweighs the benefits of illegal immigration.

"There's no question that illegal immigration, that unskilled immigration of all kinds, is a losing proposition," Krikorian said.

Krikorian's group just released a study this week that says illegal immigration is most harming the unskilled sector of the labor force. Krikorian said it shows current U.S. immigration policy isn't looking out for its own citizens.

A study of Census Bureau data revealed that while U.S. unemployment is under 5 percent, unemployment among high school dropouts is 14 percent and among those with only a high school education is about 7 percent, he said.

Krikorian said that shows that despite the claims otherwise, for non-immigrants "there isn't full employment in the low-skilled labor market."

Krikorian said that until immigration policy changes, the problem boils down to a simple point — low-wage citizen workers are being crowded out of low-pay jobs by illegal immigrants.
END QUOTE

tim

The American Indians
 

We are all immigrants.....:rollem:

It's a number I've seen used several times...although I'm sure it's a pro-immigration source...I've also read that the Social Security Administration alone attributes about 7 Billion in taxes to illegal or undocumented people.

I'd completely agree that some communities shoulder much more of the burden than others...

Also, I'm not arguing that illegal immigration is a good thing or that there's parity between give and take...

Rather, that there is a tremendous input into our economy by illegal workers, and they they aren't going anywhere soon. Any feesable long-term solution must take these factors into account.

-spence

Yeah unfortunatly anything short of extremly drastic measures will not help at all. We have let it get too far out of hand.

Drastic measures will just upset the apple cart...there's an economic interest here as well.

The current situation has "evolved" into something quite gray. We need to segment the problems and attack them individually.

For instance, an open border and business desiring the cheap labor are certainly related...but they don't necessarily have the same solution.

-spence

This guy seems to be taking matters in his own hands
http://www.filecabi.net/video/mexicans.html

You and I are LEGAL, our familys came to this country by following the rules and doing it through the legal proccess. Can't say the same thing about the mexicans hopping the fences now can we? This is NOT about LEGAL imigrants!! this is about ILLEGAL imigrants who dont follow the law of the US. Why is this so hard for people to understand??? :hs: Its so simple yet folks make it so freakin complicated. Or they are PC people who are afraid they might offend someone. I think that is the most likely scenerio.

I heard Rush Limbaugh wants to round up all the illegal aliens, and make gasoline additives out of them. :bl:

Skippy, do you speed?

-spence

Quoted for absolute truth. All my ancestors were imigrants as well, my grandparents were not born here, but they did it the right way, and that is all we are asking, do it right so you can fit properly into our structured system

:lurk: :lurk: :lurk: :lurk:

The times i have i've gotten pulled over and ticketed, as i should've becuase i broke the law. But in your world you give the Illegals a pass and dont care if they break law, no punishment no nothing. if you break the law ,no matter how severe or minor, we have penalties for the law breaking. It keeps order in the country. But i guess for some reason ILLEGALS get a free pass on this law right? Please tell me why its ok for them to break and ignore OUR laws and we should reward thier law breaking actions? becuase this is what we are doing, rewarding criminal behavior.

To bad some people fail to understand this simple logic. Do it the right way and America welcomes them with open arms. Do it illiegally and we have no respect for you, becuase they have no respect for America by breaking our laws and cutting in front of the line of people who are going through the LEGAL proccess to come to America.

Well, illegal immigration is considered a "civil" offense...sort of like speeding...

Just wanted to lump you all in the same bucket :cputin: :btu:

-spence

I often wonder how many of our ancestors DID get in here legally? I dont know the answer to that, and I'm calling anyone here out, I just take it for face value that my relatives got here legally, but who knows? The french canadian side of my family dates back to the 1700's? were they legal or did they just show up?

Does everyone KNOW for FACT that their ancestors got here on the up and up?