John R, I couldn't agree more... But u notice how Audabon immediately points at people using the beach...because they want us off so they can manage it as a monopoly. They want the concession of the guided tours for their own ends. Who knows what else is out on Nauset, feral cats kill alot of birds. How many get dumped after the summer and go wild... Besides, what is the historical number of plovers? Gull numbers are way out of whack, historically speaking; and they eat plover chicks too...

Just picked up a few of these bumber stickers on Ebay. Perhaps I will slap them on an unsuspecting patrol vehicle.:hee:
No, honestly there a LOT of predators and the guys watching the nests KNOW for a fact that it is not vehicles causing the probems. The frigging crows sit on the cage and wait until the little guy makes it out. If the crows don't get them the skunks hawks coons and others will. The issue with the trucks is that the little chicks like to hang out in the tracks of the trucks and they have good camo. It is easy to run over the little buggers. My point has been to MOVE THE BIRDS TO MONOMOY OR NOMANS OR MUSKEGET OR some other bird reserve island that does not have many of these predators. I think in the long run this is their only shot. Shutting down the entire beach for a bird is absurd IMO.

a guy at a local tackle shop explained it to me this way : we are at the northern most point of the birds' travels, yet we suffer the extreme consequences. the long island area is/was a hot bed for the bird, but now they are all but extinct there. so up here, we get clobbered on these regs.

i say, this is just the way they(the environmentalist wackos)want it. they don't want us on the beach:plain and simple. and they will stop at nothing to get us off.

plovers taste like turkey

Sorry, but they are nowhere near extinct on LI. I know of 3 beaches presently closed--two entirely, one with the most productive bar inacessible to vehicles--for plovers. At least at the last one, you can walk in and in many ways, I used to prefer it--kept the lazy slobs and the headlight-happy guys out of your way ;)

OK for all that are pissed off about Nauset and race point, think about this beach for a moment. Plum Island is a awsome area to fish and does allow off road vehicles for beach use. Beach use is defined as FISHING -- you must be actively fishing, or off ya go. PI is open only from mid August til Labor Day. That is only about a month of use folks, and that is if you are lucky.

Now for those who think the MBBA is a bunch of drunks out there for a good time think again. The MBBA does more than any other organization to protect the beaches and maintain high standards of use. Karl is correct that the MBBA is widespread and is governed by a small group who are in charge of more than access. Those who are not familiar with the organization should at least visit the website of the MBBA and look at the scheduled events that take place each year. I am a member (as you can easily figure) and I do attend the events, but not all meetings due to travel distance. The great majority of members are surf casting fishermen, not boat owners and do try and protect their rights to access to the beaches.

Please, this closure is another tool to limit our access to the fishing grounds we all love. Lets not sling mud between groups, but unify and help maintain beach access for ALL! :lossinit:

Don very well put, Just a simple correction about PLum Island,
they changed the rules last year Labor day to 10/31 and you don't have to be actively fishing until dusk to dawn. no sleeping. unless your in a SCV

They taste like a cross between white rhino and bald eagle :nopain: :bgi: :bgi:

Everyone bring your drivers down to your nearest beach and some t's... problem solved :hidin: :devil: :devil: :devil:

Are you talking about the closure at Plum Island or the G-men using the Plovers to stick it to us rtather than they being in a can't win situation cause if they don't close the beach the Dept. of Interior and US F&W will be up thier ass and if they do close them we are up thier asses?

I do not think the plover is being "used" to stick it to the surf and beach crowd. One thing I have noticed and maybe I should keep my mouth shut is that the rangers on the Seashore beaches, except for crowd control tactics at sticker sales time are virtually absent when the fisherman descend on the beaches at night at RP to Truro. 15 years ago they would acost you if you sitting in your vehicle or God forbid, taking a snooze. Now they hardly botheer with you.

Like anything, once the feds get thier hands on a "species restoration" project as the USFWS has with the plovers and the mountains of burocracy to get the plan implemented, running and then to have their field people, who are scared to death of lawsuits from Enviro groups, release the species from the endangered list, it will be a span of 15 to 20 years. And might I add, are plovers are doing alright, better than the current minimum levels to be taken off the list but coast wide, especially along Long Island beaches, thier numbers are in the toilet, so being that it is a national program, until the NY, NJ populations respond we ain't going to see any difference in the closure scene in Massachusetts. We pay for thier shortcomings at restoration of populations.:uhuh:

Lets hope Nature eats the probems quickly!

my 2 cents
 

Many good points made by people here. And some of you may already know my point of view on this from previous threads on the subject. I believe that vehicular traffic is a minor endangerment to birds compared to predation by foxes, coyotes, skunks, racoons, gulls, crows, and feral animals (cats and dogs). It is will known that many predatory animals have, over the years, learned that the exclosures (designed to protect the plover chicks) actually attract predators who have learned to associate those structures with an easy meal. However, no one wants to deal with the "real" threats (which might include population control of these predators) and it is an easy and politcally correct solution to ban human access. It is a simple and minimally effective form of "managment" (a term I use loosely here).

Regrettably, we live in a world where a certain political segment of the population want to blame humans for all the environmental challenges we face. While humans have created much of the problem, the limited breeding territory available to these birds is NOT solely due to the use of the Cape Cod National Seashore by vehicles. One must look at development and destruction of habitat from a wide range of more permanent sources.

The "Catch 22" that we'll all be facing soon is that if the Piping Plover population does recover in larger numbers, that will mean more nests, more chicks, and more beach closures. I predict that over the next few years, the success of programs designed to improve plover breeding success will highten (not lesson) restrictions.

I have to agree with flaptail the rangers were more aggressive fifteen years ago.

I agree with this 100%. Once the population's back up (if that happens) you can kiss access to the backside goodbye forever just to keep it up.

i did not see the signs at scusset for the plovers roped off area and i cut thorugh and had a f-ing bitchy autobon with bonculars lady come up to be and start bitching me out and OH that wasnt enough see had to call the park ranger and tell me that he would give me a warning( OH im real scared) if i cut though again.it wasnt like i hung around in there or was taking pot shots at plover chicks.

the plover lady must have not liked fisherman because i saw two other people cut through that same area and nothing happend and i was not rude to her at all when she spoke to me. i explaned that coyotes and foxs were mostley to blame because of the over popualtion and peta puffers of MA banning trapping for them.

people need to look at the whole picture not just the beach buggy corner that seems to get all the blame and i swear to ***** that the plovers have more rights in MA than humans do.

We try not to be very heavy-handed in moderating, but there are people here who would be offended by that.

NEWS FLASH
 

If they CAN'T COUNT PANDA BEARS ,gee how many plovers are really out their ????

wtf


VB


NEW YORK (Reuters) -- Giant pandas may not be in as much danger of extinction as feared with a new British-Chinese study finding there could be twice as many living in the wild as previously thought, scientists said on Monday.

It is a know fact that the chicks that pick a congested spot to hatch do best! The ones that are near the public beach where cars are driving past regularly and there is a path to the beach always seem to survive better then the ones in a remote locations. IMO the vehicle and people activity tend to keep the predators away and the chicks stand a better shot.

To further prove that vehicles are not the blame in cases where the beaches are closed completely to vehicles the chicks die anyway! They didn't die from vehicles! IMO the birds would be better off with vehicle traffic out there.

I am still of the opinion that if you really care that much about the bird, move him to his own friggin island, Lord knows we have enough of them dedicated to the cause. The amount of people-energy that is expended protecting and watcing over this bird is absurd and IT STILL DOES NOT HELP. Just move them to a safe spot and let them be.

If the critters don't get them the weather does. One good Noreaster and they are toast here. All the eggs get washed away...wouldn't it have been better to move them to a safe spot on their own island? They would thank you if they could.

http://www.capecodonline.com/cctimes/capenews22.htm

:fishslap: :crying: :gu: :(

we use to snooze duing the day and Nusuck they use to bust nuts also.
our counter was how come no bag them for hard tires :call:
Im a Filthy Town Work'r Now LOL............

ya got yer dream job, good fer U
U is a born town worker :p ;), union man too.. nice, now ya can buy a boat :D
don't get splinters leanin' on that shovel, :p.. besides now ya gonna get paid ta sleep in a truck :hihi:

dude ya woke me up:lasso:

Hey, who left the door open? BM gets a job, now he has time to post!:rotf2: :rotf2: Just kidding Dave. Good to see you in here and hear things are better on the job front.:)

Hey dave welcomeback-- glad to hear that you got that yob. Now we can fish YOUR spots whilst you are sleeping? Good luck Dave.:D