Never heard that. I believe HFC's are about ten times weaker than CFC's in regards to global warming, and 50 times weaker in regards to ozone depletion.

Hey wasn't the ozone hole a big scam as well???
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Worester's high of 58 today tied the all time record set in 1892.z

No other records than Salty's ranting about Barry's vacation costs were tied or broken today.

No Poll, just random reading over a period of time on the controversy.

I agree one day, month, year, or even a decade don't prove it either way.
I am saying to think that a massive Green Jobs Program to save the world
and produce a new economy is pie in the sky thinking.

No matter what we do China and the emerging third world countries who are
doing most of the manufacturing polution are not going to adhere to
strict standards or go to the expense.

2010 was the warmest year on record for BOS with a daily avg temp of 53.8 beating the 53.6 set in 1949 and 1953.

NWS has been recording temps in BOS since 1872

From Wikipedia...
The interim replacements for CFCs are hydrochlorofluorocarbons (HCFCs), which deplete stratospheric ozone, but to a much lesser extent than CFCs.[10] Ultimately, hydrofluorocarbons (HFCs) will replace HCFCs with essentially no ozone destruction (although all three groups of halocarbons are powerful greenhouse gases).

I don't know if it was a scam but do you know it was not?

I don't know what you mean by a 'scam'?
Ozone was a real issue, and globally it was a significant achievement to reduce the depletion of Ozone in the atmosphere by eliminating CFC's

Note; I don't have time to dig out a text and look it up, but from memory, with the caveat that I'm not an atmospheric chemist:

HFC's are a greenhouse gas. Not as effective at trapping solar radiation as CFC's, so besides the ozone benefit of banning cfc's there is a reduction in greenhouse gas, albeit a slight one. We are essentially swapping one GHG with another, with the added benefit of not destroying the Ozone layer.

the amount of HFC's in the atmosphere vs CO2 is orders of magnitude smaller, although ideally, a non-greenhouse gas would be used as a propellant or coolant. the net benefit of HFC's over CFC's to the ozone layer is significant, even if there was no significant reduction in greenhouse gas. Think of it as the lesser of two evils.

Ok now that was friggin funny :love:

There is no such thing as global warming. It's all been dreamed up.

It's really Obama's fault.

Our climate is changing. There is no doubt. While we can argue forever about the warming part, our climate is capable of rapid ups and downs. 60 degrees one day and 20 degrees the next. Flash flooding is more common as storms are more intense. Anyone who gets caught up in the debate about the term " warming" is a fool.
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Was a joke. People said the same thing about the ozone hole years ago, environmentalists just trying to wreck the economy, but you don't hear that today.
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Todays crisis is tomorrows old news.

Then why not lobby to roll back to CFC's? They're a lot easier to make.

-spence

Yup, since day one it has beeen in flux, ice age etc.

It's great if you love weather.

I don't really care either way. I'm more concerned about my water bottles. :biglaugh:

Who in here was it that said the there are many scientists that don't believe climate change is man-made?

Report: 97 percent of scientists say man-made climate change is real - Science Fair: Science and Space News - USATODAY.com

Well, I guess 41 out of 1,372 could be considered "many".

So now you believe in polls???

They're all in the scam to ruin the American dream.
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Coldest Jan. in 20 years predicted. Just sayin.

Sounds like the climate is changing. Thanks for validating this important issue.
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Records change...the climate changes... wow...a revalation!

friggan ice core samples show that....

"global climate disruption" ...scary stuff :rotf2: Can we get a percentage of these "scientist" to at least agree on a name for this apocalyptic occurence

There's a difference between predicted or measured.

You seem to still be stuck thinking climate change means global warming. :rotf2:

Show what? That we've had interglacial and glacial cycles for the last 2.54 Million years (OK, not all of that is from Ice), and that the last nine have been ~100,000 years apart or so (The last 8 or so captured by ice cores)?

Yup.

Do they also show that the rate of warming in the last couple of centuries is higher than any in the ice cores? And that it has been correlated with a host of other proxies back 10's of thousands of years? Yup.

Read two-mile time machine (Alley) Raven and the Longest Thaw (Archer), I think you'd enjoy it (sincere response, can be tough to convey I'm not being a wiseass). or anyone else for that matter. Also check out the skeptical environmentalist for a view of the other side.....

RRH, as I've posted before being a 747 taking off gives off the same pollution
as 10,000 cars starting their engines. That's a lot of pollution in itself.
Then with the sun certainly feeling hotter on the skin, common sense tells me something is happening, and maybe man may have something to do with it.

But what % of the change do the scientists think should be attributed to man vs natural changes?

Interesting read. I just put the first paragraph, rest is at the link below.

FWIW, it's about to snow. uh-oh, no more global warming.

Cold winter in a world of warming?

From: RealClimate: Cold winter in a world of warming?

Last June, during the International Polar Year conference, James Overland suggested that there are more cold and snowy winters to come. He argued that the exceptionally cold snowy 2009-2010 winter in Europe had a connection with the loss of sea-ice in the Arctic. The cold winters were associated with a persistent ‘blocking event’, bringing in cold air over Europe from the north and the east.

We all see how accurate scientist predictions are JD.:rotf2:

too bleepin' funny, nothing goes well for the climate scammers does it? why didn't I think of capturing the excess Global Warming CO2 and pumping it underground????

The Canadian Press – ONLINE EDITION
Carbon injected underground now leaking, Saskatchewan farmer’s study says

By: Bob Weber, The Canadian Press

A Saskatchewan farm couple whose land lies over the world’s largest carbon capture and storage project says greenhouse gases that were supposed to have been injected permanently underground are leaking out, killing animals and sending groundwater foaming to the surface like shaken-up soda pop.

Cameron and Jane Kerr, who own nine quarter-sections of land above the Weyburn oilfield in eastern Saskatchewan, released a consultant’s report Tuesday that claims to link high concentrations of carbon dioxide in their soil to the 8,000 tonnes of the gas injected underground every day by energy giant Cenovus in its attempt to enhance oil recovery and fight climate change.

“We knew, obviously, there was something wrong,” said Jane Kerr.
Cameron Kerr, 64, said he has farmed in the area all his life and never had any problems until 2003, when he agreed to dig a gravel quarry.

That gravel was for a road to a plant owned by EnCana — now Cenovus — which had begun three years earlier to inject massive amounts of carbon dioxide underground to force more oil out of the aging field.

Cenovus has injected more than 13 million tonnes of the gas underground. The project has become a global hotspot for research into carbon capture and storage, a technology that many consider one of the best hopes for keeping greenhouse gases out of the atmosphere.

By 2005, Cameron Kerr had begun noticing problems in a pair of ponds which had formed at the bottom of the quarry. They developed algae blooms, clots of foam and several colours of scum — red, yellow and silver-blue. Sometimes, the ponds bubbled. Small animals — cats, rabbits, goats — were regularly found dead a few metres away.

Then there were the explosions.

“At night we could hear this sort of bang like a cannon going off,” said Jane Kerr, 58. “We’d go out and check the gravel pit and, in the walls, it (had) blown a hole in the side and there would be all this foaming coming out of this hole.”

:rotf2::rotf2:GOOD GRIEF!!!:rotf2::rotf2:

From the Australian:

THE term “climate change” could be replaced by “climate challenges” if a federal commissioned marketing study is taken onboard.

they can settle the science but they can't settle on a name :rotf2::rotf2:



OOPS...

January 11, 2011

The BBC serves Freedom of Information request (FOIA) on UK Government over weather forecast failures secrecy in worst winter for 100 years.

In an almighty battle to salvage credibility three British government institutions are embroiled in a new global warming scandal with the BBC mounting a legal challenge to force ministers to admit the truth. Sceptics ask: Is the UK government’s climate propaganda machine finally falling apart?

Last week the weather service caused a sensation by making the startling claim that it was gagged by government ministers from issuing a cold winter forecast. Instead, a milder than average prediction was made that has been resoundingly ridiculed in one of the worst winters in a century.

With the BBC appearing to take the side of the Met Office by seeking to force the government to give honest answers, untold harm will likely befall Prime Minister Cameron’s global warming policies on energy, taxation and the environment.

HERE'S YOUR FRIGGIN GLOBAL WARMING

-4 in Uxbridge this morning.

My diesel made noises I never hear in the morning.

global waRMING :smash:

muther#^&#^&#^&#^&ing invented hocus #^&#^&#^&#^&in pocus mamby pamby bull#^&#^&#^&#^&.

Your bull#^&#^&#^&#^& theories don't fill my propane tanks or oil tank. They need to change the stupid laws about not being able to run a pellet stove in a commercial building.