Great piece...

"congressional Republicans over the past few years have decided that they cannot leave Medicare to collapse and take the government’s finances (and the nation’s economic future) with it, and so they must address the problem despite the standing threat from the left to demonize anyone who tries."

Try making that wrong...although not enough Congressional Republicans are talking about this...they should all be talking about it, and talking about the fact that the Dems refuse to address it in the least.

Anyone know if Ryan is resigning from Congress? People in his position usually do not, but I haven't heard anything...

Interesting article. Thank you. It actually seems unbiased...

I heard yesterday he was continuing his campaign for reelection. This was on cnn btw.

About the only part that wasn't biased was when the author admits the Ryan plan might be a total failure...TWICE :faga:

-spence

Ryan's plan might indeed be a failure, Spence. But unlike the president, at least Ryan proposed a possible solution.

Spence, the other unbiased part was when the article said that we can no longer afford to ignore the problem. Yet, that's precisely what Obama has done. To be fair, Bush also ignored the problem of Medicare finances (in fact, made it worse). But Obama promised something along the lines of "change" and "a different way of doing things", or some such nonsense.

Not doing anything, is a disaster for all of us. And that is basically what Obama has done with Medicare - nothing.

Spence, I keep asking you what Obama's vision is to save Medicare. I get nothing. Nada. Zip. Zilch. Bupkus.

Let's stop attacking Ryan for trying to solve the problem, and come up with a better solution. Insulting Ryan is not a viable alternative solution.

R&R have my vote, but it's sad that this is the best ticket the repubs have to offer, I think this election will be a layup for o.b. :wall:

every plan may fail spence. thats why it takes people with testicles to implement.
Simpson-Bowles was a good plan, sponsored by Obama. Where is that plan now? ??? No balls to implement.
The time to talk is over, the time to act is now.

I thought Simpson-Bowles was certainly a step in the right direction. It's a shame the GOP led House voted it down. Yes, Obama wasn't a strong supporter but he never even had a bill to sign or reject.

-spence

I can't find where Spence said it sucks. I saw a post where he pointed out things in the plan that he thought were bad ideas, but that isn't what you are talking about. I think my tin hat must be messing with me. Now wait... that was the post you quoted. Did he edit the insulting part where he said it sucks?

"Which brings us to Simpson-Bowles (see how I did that?). On Wednesday, Reps. Jim Cooper and Steve LaTourette managed to put Simpson-Bowles to a vote before the House of Representatives. It didn't just fail. It got crushed. The final tally was 382-38. Twenty-two of the supporters were Democrats, while 16 were Republicans. But overall, the rejection was overwhelming, and overwhelmingly bipartisan."

Wonkbook: House reaches bipartisan deal to reject Simpson-Bowles - The Washington Post

Greenspan: Obama’s ‘Worst Mistake’ Was Rejecting Simpson-Bowles Deficit-Reduction Plan
http://www.moneynews.com/FinanceNews...5/02/id/437734

Geithner explains why Obama never embraced Bowles-Simpson
http://thehill.com/blogs/on-the-mone...bowles-simpson

Zimmy, are you feeling well today?

I said many times I don't know if Ryan's proposal is a good proposal. But at least he had the honesty and courage to say "this is going broke, here's my idea to overhaul it".

Zimmy, what's Obama's idea to overhaul Medicare? Nothing. Except to say that Ryan wants t'o "end Medicare as we know it". Earth to liberals...it isn't Paul Ryan that will end Medicare as we know it. The Baby Boomers will end Medicare as we know it.

Spence, you're saying the GOP rejected Simpson-Bowles? So Obama wanted to implement most of the recommendations, did he? I guess I missed that.

Was anything I said not factual? Please be specific, I'm trying to build cred with my foxhole buddy Jim.

-spence

just adding context to your biased version

"It's a shame the GOP led House voted it down" vs. the rejection was overwhelming, and overwhelmingly bipartisan

"Obama wasn't a strong supporter" vs. Obama’s ‘Worst Mistake’ Was Rejecting Simpson-Bowles and Geithner explains why Obama never embraced Bowles-Simpson


specific enough?:) and this from Ezra Klein types.....for context and cred


glad you said "foxhole" :biglaugh:

Honest question here...what, specifically, did the GOP-led house shoot down?

It's now practice to denote respect by indicating if you'd share a foxhole with the quotee. It's part of the political forum reform plans.

I'm not sure I'd share a foxhole with you to be honest. While you were busy digging up out of context quotes to snidely parse the enemies battle cry, Jim would probably have already shot them.

This is really about my safety after all.

-spence

what...no specifics? what did I quote that was not factual?.... snidely?

So the hate-fest begins in earnest.

(1) At Ryan's kickoff speech, 2 female left-wing haters were heckling him, and tried to storm the stage. On MSNBC, Rachael Maddow used that as evidence that Ryan isn't a good pick. Maddow said something to the effect of "see, at his first speech, he gets that kind of a response from the crowd (2 people out of 10,000 heckled him). Therefore, Ryan is not a good pick.


(2) Enter Andrea Mitchell of NBC News, who said Ryan's selection "is not a pick for suburban moms, is not a pick for women". So we have established that Ryan is anti-women. Check.

(3) Enter Senator Bernie Sanders from Vermont. The esteemed senator Sanders said on MSNBC last night "unlike Paul Ryan, I believe America needs a strong middle class to thrive". OK. So now we also know that Paul Ryan doesn not want America to have a middle class. Check.

(4) Every single guest/host on MSNBC, every single one of them, said the following..."Paul Ryan wants to end Medicare as we know it."

Earth to Ryan-bashers...Paul Ryan doesn't want to end Medicare as we know it. The economic impact of the Baby Boomers (millions of people getting old, who will live in old age for decades, needing tons of expensive care) are going to end Medicare as we know it. Medicare as we know it will not exist for anyone younger than Baby Boomers. Paul Ryan doesn't want that. He simply admits it. Finally, his plan (as it turns out) only ends Medicare for people who opt out into a voucher system. People can still choose to stay in a Medicare-type plan if they want. Or, if they prefer, they can opt out into a system where every married couple gets $11,000 a year to find their own health plan. Maybe this is a good idea, and maybe it's not. But it's better than the liberal plan, which is to stick our fingers in our ears, close our eyes, and hope that the problen somehow goes away.

Sp Spence said in this thread that the Simpson-Bowles commission made some good suggestions about the economy. Here is what one of the chairs of that committee, Erksine Bowles, has to say about Paul Ryan. Mr Bowles was Bill Clinton's chief of staff, and remember the Clinton administration did an amazing job turning the economy around...


Erskine Bowles praises Paul Ryan, budget plan (VIDEO) | The Ticket - Yahoo! News

""I'm telling you, this guy (Ryan) is amazing. I always thought I was OK with arithmetic. This guy can run circles around me," Bowles tells a class of students at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.

"He is honest, he is straightforward, he is sincere. And the budget he came forward with is just like Paul Ryan. It is a sensible, straightforward, honest, serious budget and it cut the budget deficit just like we did by four trillion dollars."

But I thought Ryan wanted poor people to die, so he could sell their organs on ebay and give that money to Wall Street fatcats? At least, that's what they're saying on MSNBC...

First big laugh of the day :rotf2:

It was more than 2 hecklers but still not surprising by Maddow. Wench.


Mitchell is incapable of hiding her bias.

I know longer watch MSNBC because of the inherent bias. CNN is actually more fair these days. I have not found a news channel that is unbiased - sadly

To be clear, that wasn't all he said - Bowles did have some negatives he brought up on Ryan - but it was mostly positive.

"To be clear, that wasn't all he said - Bowles did have some negatives he brought up on Ryan - but it was mostly positive"

John, I'm not saying Ryan walks on water. But he is not anywhere near what the left is making him out to be, either. We need (in a real hurry) to get past the point of saying "you should fear Paul Ryan because he wants to end Medicare". We need to be able to say "here are the good things about his proposal, and here are the things we can improve upon". No one on the Democratic ticket is saying that.

John, I believe our kids are about the same age (mine are 5, 2, 1). Unless something drastic is done, they will each be hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt when they graduate college. That is not hysteria or exaggeration on my part, it is mathematical fact.

Agree %100, and unless something is done now with Medicare it will
be dead in the water in 12 years. Soc Sec won't be far behind.
In the end ALL of us will have to give up something and sacrafice in order
to get this country back on the right track.

In the real world, there is no Santa Claus.

Oh, you just hate old people.

Last night on MSNBC, they repeatedly referred to a recent national poll where 80% of the respondents said they didn't want significant changes to Medicare. Therefore, according to Rachael Maddow and 'Red' Schultz (2 swell guys), we should leave Medicare alone. Never they mind that 'leaving it alone' isn't a long term option.

That's what we're up against, and here in CT, we lose to these people every single year. Soon, I'm going to contact the payroll department where I work and ask them to stop paying me in dollars. Instead, I want to get paid in kerosine and canned food, so I can start stocking up.

Oh - I agree and I agree. We are at $50K for every American just to pay off we we are now - TODAY - not including continuing debt obligations.

We have a tremendous gash in the hull of the Fiscal Ship of State and we are discussing what is on the menu from brunch and what deck chairs clash with other deck chairs - we are not even rearranging yet.

The one thing that might get Grannies more upset than their medicare might be to tell them that their grandkids will be indentured slaves at current course.

I only watch Morning Joe, the nightly programming just isn't very interesting.

-spence

CNN already has an opinion bash-piece about Ryan's plan to try and let people invest a portion of their SS taxes into a private investment vehicle.

It is currently *the* front page featured article from their CNN Money sections. They never feature articles from the Money section of their website.
Ryan's controversial Social Security plan he doesn't discuss - Aug. 14, 2012
http://imgur.com/mzOlj.jpg

I didn't take that article as a bash piece.....

CNN headline -

Is Ryan for or against Ayn Rand.

so silly

Maybe CNN can help the opposition come up with the perfect plan,
or any plan at all.?????? Pussy footers afraid of their own shadow. :hihi:

Read it, it's actually pretty interesting.

-spence