what about the educational aspects ?

should we pass on learning from people and their contributions ?

maybe it is just me. trying to make progress everyday.

The sharpies new better than anyone that it was perseverence and dedication that delivered the goods.

IMO many posts are personal raves attempting to define a statement or are good, light hearted fun.

statements need to be backed up with fact or corrections.

they work together.

some of the topics are incredibly boring on any of tese sites wit a lot of mudslinging involved.

A forum such as this (like my interest ina 4wd forum) create substantive topics and information to discuss

:)

I have to agree with Satheart and Sandman. I think naming it Hall of Fame is a bad idea. Any Hall of Fame you go to for any sport is strongly based on performance. In fishing you cannot judge performance like any other sport and there arises the problem. In striper fishing there is no batting average, homerun total or number of championships won. The entry requirements then become subjective to peoples opinions. Questions become Who are the "mentors"? , Who made "contributions"?, Who did you look up to? Who is a "great" fisherman? whose your buddy? etc... There is no way to judge the answers to these questions and to evaluate them fairly since everyone will have different opinions.

I would be more in favor of a historical memorial page. Writing about past history is something completely different and is worthy of documentation. It's also much more palatable than saying that someone is deserving of "fame and recognition".

Ed

so then let's just rename it ?

what's the big deal ?

What Ed suggests is what i think will work. A memorial section if you will where anyone can post a thread and info about anyone they want to remember and share memories about.

If you want to memorialize Gibbs for a big contribution to the sport , fine. if you want to memorialize your Uncle who took you fishing as a boy eben though he didn't fish himself , that's fine too. Like the 10X10 section only for anyone who has someone who wants to post about them.

now you are on the right track

this wouldn't be cooperstown it would S-B memorial page.

No big deal to get in but hopefully not a lot of BS either

:)

Point well made, Ed. The tall, quiet stranger steps outta the shadows with yet another cogent comment. :btu:

That's pretty much what I meant about stories or anecdotes in regards to those who were listed, done in the tradition of an oral history. But honestly, I gotta tell ya that I didn't think that John just proposing an HOF would lead to a provincial pi$$ing contest over who was in or out right off the bat. I think all of us agree that we can probably do without that here, that sort of crap is what keeps me away from the other sites of late. Ya know, I mean, WTF.

Yup, Ed, you're right, sort of the cyber version of the Fisherman's Memorial at Brenton Point. It would be a great project for all of us, whether we contributed to the collection or just simply spent time going through the archives on cold winter nights.

Ed B is right.

But what kind of memorial…… page, forum, or both?
A page would be more permanent, and still be there years down the line, and not get archived or buried under a ton of other submissions.
A forum would allow submissions of great articles and build a collection.
Or both, a page on Mr. Stan Gibbs, and start a memorial forum for every one else.

Or have we opened up a Pandora’s box, and maybe just forget it.

Tough call for the webmaster.

Is this a dead issue or still under consideration?:confused:

dead, hmm.

probably. maybe I had something to do with it. no scrub gonna influence a new page on this site :)

Still under consideration. A few people brought it to my attention and wanted me to float it for people's coments, questions, and discussion.

Personally, I'm uncomfortable with "selecting" or helping to select the who's who and deserving of a HOF. Sure some people are easy to chose and there would be little disagreement but others still deserving might not make it for whatever reason.

Also, while S-B can certainly contribute and prod "it" along, it must be something more than what S-B thinks to lend it some kind of legitimacy. Sure, we can add a "memorial page", no problem at all. But I feel it should be something beyond just S-B. Thoughts? Comments?

have a poll. start with the (in)famous.
Maybe explain that it would be done in segments.

I can see how you fear this but some of you folks have the experience to be prudent.

personally I don't think a living person should be on it. decreases the numbers you have to consider.

but i am a scrub you see :) :laughs: :laughs: :)

Plenty of people have opinions about those who are or who are not in some of the "other" Halls of Fame, baseball and so on. You are always going to have controversey and opinion one way or the other. I have stated it before in prior posts, more than anything it should be informative and educational to all those who visit the site. I for one would very much like to know about all of the great fisherman who came before me and "blazed the trail". Stan Gibbs is a person who I very much would like to know more about.....just a "regular joe" just like you and me, who loved to fish and made a few contributions (whether they be large or small). That is all these people are....just regular everyday people who put their pants on one leg at a time who shared the same passion that we all have....."fishing"! Can't anybody see that???!!!! These folks do not need to be "glorified" by this site! They simply should be remembered.....remembered for the notoriety they achieved through their passion to fish. What some would call "fame" for these people is simply regional. These people, many of them, are not known outside of the Striper Coast really.....they are treasures of our own way of life, people who worked hard and fished hard. To them fishing was important, just as it is to us, so shouldn't this just be a way to pay tribute in some way, be it a small way but a tribute just the same? My .02 cents.....I think I have already chipped in about .16 cents worth, but I truely believe in this so lets give it a go folks.:wave:

I am with BigFish and beach walker;
informative and educational,
remembered,
not glorified,
oh yah, and in the big fishing hole in the sky.

Select a baker’s dozen or so of non-scrub senior members for a panel.
Come up with criteria.
Then create an avenue for submissions.

By the way, what’s a scrub? (Not insulted, just curios.):pop:

I believe it is another word for a jacka$$ (Not talking about you Beachwalker) am I right?:huh:

rookie member

Ron @ the sm den used 2 call me the rookie;)
now I'm a rookie here 2 beach:laughs: :laughs: :laughs:

Okey dokey......well, here goes nuttin'...:D:

Since we can probably at least agree on who should be on a nominating committee, let me be the first to stick my head outta the foxhole and start a list of who might be considered for considering who might be in a HOF perhaps here or somewhere else.

I'll leave it to you to figure out why I really chose who I did and my personal choices on the nominating committee are listed in no particular order. They are friends in some cases and in others, people I know only by virtue of online discusions at S-B.com. In all cases they're people who haven't yet set off my BS Detector and whose opinions I value. Being that we all hang out here, my only criterion was that they are S-B members. Most all are senior officers, as I see it.

JohnR, in my opinion, should be left to his usual position of moderator/referee/bouncer. Marquis of Queensbury rules, gentlemen, no hitting below the belt, no rabbit punching in the clinches and make a clean break when so instructed by the ref.

:smash: :fishslap: :smash: :fishslap: :smash:

DISCLAIMER: I just woke up from a pasta induced power nap after dinner and I'm still a little fuzzy, so gimme a break. Please address all references to my half-assed ideas, my personal habits or the manliness of my performance in the surf or elsewhere to my PM box (as well as any comments you may have on the marital status of my forbears or the depth of the gene pool I came from) so as not to impede the progress of the nominating process.
All correspondance will be answered on a first-come-first-serve basis.

So, howzabouts:

DZ
Ed B
Flaptail
Al Goldberg
Mike P
Crazy Alberto
striprman
Capesams
vineyardblues
Slipknot
Fish_Eye
Habs
Joe

I can add a few more and probably will after my coffee is done brewing.

Just thought it might be a way to get the ball rolling on the HOF nominating committee and initiate a spirited discussion to while away the winter doldrums.

:hidin:

Anyone else have a personal list?

Outstanding. :claps:

I know DZ. Have not had the pleasure of meeting the rest. But if they are all of the same caliber thats one heck of a panel.

I think Crafty's post shows exactly why this whole thing is a bad idea.

His list of ten of S-B's "senior officers" includes 5 guys who don't even have 100 posts under their belt here. 4 are less than 50 and 3 don't even have 30 posts.

Give me a break! :smash:

Its exactly this type of potential selection and more importantly exclusion to both the HOF and the now proposed "Selection Committee" that will lead to the trouble I'm calling Pandoras Box and exactly what we don't need here at S-B.

Can all the HOFamers have bobblehead dolls made in their likeness too. Just because guys have their pictures in magazines and write articles or happen to get a big fish or two does'nt make them better than you or me. I personally know a handful of guys from Newport to Narragansett that are otstanding fisherman that maybe a few of the people on this board might know and the others would say , who? Putting people in a HOF is a popularity contest. The only things that should be in a fishing HOF are the monsters that get caught.

See - as for a HOF, I think it would be unwise for S-B to take any kind of a lead. S-B could participate and maybe even create some of the framework of the site but any real HOF would need to be above and beyond the site.

I think, at this time, perhaps having S-B create/participate in a memorial for those legends that have passed might be a bit more realistic

I'm in full agreement with Saltheart.

Maybe this is a project for the MSBA

You people reading anything I said??? Just curious, because it is actually yourselves who are damning this project up! Your first mistake is by calling it a "Hall of Fame"...therein lies your biggest problem. People read too much into anything called a "Hall of Fame"....they get offended when the people who are included are not what THEY call "the best" in this sport, and that is not what this should be about. That is why I proposed what I stated earlier. A forum that contains these people in photos and bios that are informative and educational, so that people can know them and understand who they were and the contributions that they made to Saltwater Fishing as a sport, a passion, and a pastime. Not that these people, any of them were the best fisherman, or the best rod-maker, or the best plug builder or who caught the biggest fish or the most fish.....just that they simply were! That they existed, and this is who they were or are, and these are their contributions and also some of the great "personal" achievements that they had as a fisherman....plain and simple without having a brighter spotlight on some and not so bright a spotlight on others. That is not what this should be about.

Example: Stan Gibbs was born in Easton, Massachusetts in the year 1915. Stan began his passion for fishing at an early age catching sunfish and pickeral in his native Easton. Relocating his family to Sagamore in 1945, Stan was able to concentrate on his passion for fishing by honing his skills fishing the fast moving current of the Cape Cod Canal etc. etc. Stan began turning plugs from broom handles in the basement of his Sagamore home etc. etc. People having seen the success that Stan was having with his home made plugs began asking him if they could purchase a few and the cottage industry of Gibbs Plugs was born etc. etc.

Fill in the many voids left by me with facts of any time in the service Stan did, his many occupations which put food on the table for his growing family, his hunting and trapping expertise, and personal accounts of some people who knew him in regards to the type of person he was and the places he used to haunt. You see, these people are no different than any of us....they worked, fed their family and indulged a passion in fishing just as we do. They don't hit game winning homeruns, or score Superbowl winning touchdowns.....they were and are people just like us. As soon as the rest of you boil it all down to the simple thing that it needs to be to make it work and benefit eneryone, then it will come together and be a beautiful way to simply honor these many people. As far as treating it like a "Hall of Fame" by convening a panel and voting people in periodically, that is the mistake. Make a long list of people who could be included and maybe add one to the "Forum" periodically, whether it be one a week or every other week or whenever someone has time to do the work to put the information up, it really is just about remembering them and letting other people know who they were and what they did as a fisherman or woman. I am done on this thread, I have spoken my mind and it is up to the rest of you to take the ball and run with it or argue it to death, ultimately it is up to the big guy JohnR. Later folks.

John & Saltheart,

You men will do what is correct but I have tonstate what I believe Bigfish is saying.

Try not to make it a big deal and A Hall of Fame.

This concept took root in my mind when Stan Gibbs passed away.

My vote is for a memorial page with bios and stories of the fisherman so enshrined.

Past people. I believe it equates to less politics and still serves the prupose that the original impetus fostered

:)

Again, Saltheart is right.. Take my word for it, it will not be a that prestigious a thing to be nominated to be on this (or any) HOF web site no mater what your intent. In fact, it may be embarrassing for the person (dead or alive) that is nominated. Most of these guys lead a low-profile life/fishing style and do not seek the glory of some web based “top 10 list” .

Begin Story:
One night on BI under the bluffs, I ran into a local fellow I seemed to cross paths with most nights. IMO he's probably one of the better surfcasters I've ever met always scoring with big fish when many went fishless. When I saw what was in the back of his truck my eyes popped. The bass were running but so were the weakfish. There were some big weaks taken along with the bass. It wasn't uncommon to see fish the low teens but he had one that went 23.5# . That is a big weakfish, at that time the IGFA world record fish (maybe still is?). I saw it weighed myself on a legit scale. And I watched as he cleaned it. I mentioned that was potentially a record fish and he should submit an app and take a photo, line, ect... and he went on a 5-minute rant and wanted nothing to do with notoriety or records.
End Story

Do you think a fellow like this would want his name on a website telling the world how great he is/was? IMO, many of these HOF'ers don't want your recognition...maybe secretly they do in your hearts, but not publicly, and surely not on a web site. I know you are trying to provide knowledge and help to others but please don't insult or embarrass your HOF’er in the process.
I think you are opening a "can-of-worms" here. My vote is pass.

That is why if they are past fisherman it isn't a big deal.

WE (maybe just I) am looking for knowledge and history (stories) about past characters and their contributions.

Am I too far away to be heard ?

Are there any out there with a similar interest ?

Guys - I agree that S-B should not be a driving force behind a Hall of Fame. I don't think that "S-B" (or any website for that matter) has the credentials, even though some of its members may. My points regarding a H.O.F. is that S-B might provide some of the underpinnings of a potential site but shouldn't be the driving force and sure as hell isn't an authority on running it.

YES, I'm all for a historical memorial, and a general Fisherman's Memorial only has one requirement to be "nominated", your line is tight in the neverending surfline. It could be a way that we can appreciate some of the legends and some of the die hard "regular" people such as ourselves (with the primary difference being that we are still alive).

BUT, what if someone like the guy Sandman talks about wouldn't want any part of it?

Chipwood - agree. Welcome to the site BTW....

There's gonna be some guys dieing to get on there:hee:

John,

am I talking about something you guys aren't ? the dude would be gone. Curtains down, out of eels, etc.

Are you thinking we need a note from the family ?

:)

I think this HOF page would be a bad idea, but i do like some of the suggestions being thrown out there. In my opinion, something like a recognition page, where ANYONE can write something else about ANYONE ELSE, who might have been a mentor, or inspiration, or perhaps just a good friend. Something on the lines of one person recognizing some else, for something they have done, with perhaps just little write up of what that might have been, much like what bigfish, and others have mentioned. I think to have some sort of " vote " or panel, would be a bad idea, as there would be too many outside factors involved. Simply put, we all have our heros, and hall of fame type of people in our lives that have made a difference for one reason or another, so they are very dear to us, but maybee not to someone else, but because of that, that dosent mean they should be excluded from a HOF. anyways, didnt mean to ramble on.......

Well said sandman, my vote is no HOF.
Keep the secrecy sacred.

JohnR,
We need your gavel.
This thread is going around in circles. I thought the idea of not having an HOF but instead, having a memorial page and/or forum was straightened out on the bottom half of page 3.

It seems a decision needs to be made on this so we can move on to next point.
:wall:

Carl Johanson ,, Angler #1 You have no Idea how many people Carl taught to fish ..Thru State program that he designed,,Mass Angler Educ Program ,,Isak Walton. definately a giver and my mentor... Hows about this one ..." Ted Williams" Remember him at the old Sportsman show with the flyrod..

Jesus, Mary and Joseph......

So I guess this what is meant by a "hot button topic"?

From the posts I've read (and reread, including my own) calling a memorial page a 'HOF' would be a misnomer and brings up other issues that no one - especially me but most importantly John - would want to see here.

None of the points I made were exactly mine to begin with and the 'nominating committee' I posted was simply a list of fellow surfcasters whose opinions I respect a great deal, some of whom are friends, all reasonable even-handed men with a passion for the sport and a helluva lot of time spent in the surf. Number of posts never entered into it. As for the rest of it, most of the time my writing style is - and always will be - at times tongue-in-cheek and occasionally a little on the smart-assed side as well. That's a function of where I came from, way too late to change it now and if it puts anybody's shorts in a knot, my apologies.

I've been around this sort of thing before - I was involved in the Fisherman's Memorial at Brenton Point. The bronze plaque on the monument was created from my photograph of a friend of mine holding his 52# bass from the '80's and his loss while fishing at Brenton Reef was the impetus for the memorial site overlooking the reef.

The purpose of that site was - and is - to memorialize those whose lives were lost at sea and there are inscribed pavers lining the area available to those who wish to remember their loved ones. Those memorial pavers also include the names of many who were not lost at sea but have passed on and serve as markers at a beautiful spot where people come to reflect and remember. If any of you haven't been to the Fisherman's Memorial, you should if you find yourself in the area - it's pretty moving. A memorial page or forum would have the same effect, I would think, minus the surf.

BigFish, Beachwalker, Ed B and others all made excellent points and I couldn't agree with them more. Ultimately, while it's apparent that everybody here has deep feelings on how best to approach it - if at all - it's John's call on S-B's level of involvement in such a historical site. He's worked pretty damned hard to create what exists here at this site and he's paid for it out of his own pocket.

IMHO, a memorial is certainly a great idea, whether it actually comes to pass or not. Personally, I get to reflect on the lives of those who either touched or influenced my life when I'm firmly planted on a set of rocks somewhere in the deep of night. Then the only memorial site I really need is between my ears.

Peace.

Well said CA,

Spent three years living in Newport and know the Memorial well. A beautiful place.

We'll see here what happens. I agree with you on the space between the ears. I think a memorial area would be fun for us and would also benefit the nubies who need a reminder on what it takes to produce the way these folks did.

This site is a great one indeed and I am sure John and Co. will make the correct decision

:)

No HOF without Robert O. Greene and Charlie Soares