Some of the stuff I read there and searched really opened up my eyes.Its apparent why some are exluded from "the ledge" So on this one I agree with eben.Something like that should be used for the moderators only. There was a post there from august named "#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& back to posting, good thing or bad" Now I dont care about that so much but, what I read in that post has really shocked me especially from who wrote it...wow..........At anyrate, was it bassmaster who said "the internet sucks" I now have to agree.......Unreal.

That's not cool:yak6:

No its not at all, call me an ahole all you want, I have never done that, everyone either hates me or whatever but they at least know where I stand. I want to know from the start why "certain" people were invited in that forum? I have been a member since the site came alive? I was never even told about it. Want to know why?? Heres why, I bet it was thought that I could not be "trusted " in a forum like that, that I would abuse it in some way well, trust me its been abused by the very people who are supposed to be trusted?? It should not exist in my opinion, want to talk about someone on this site, do it in the public forum so the poor dude at least has some way of defending himself????? doesnt that make sense??? They can try and pull it all now but, I have the proof, I printed it all out because it upset me so much...I have a good mind to scan it in and show all.........But I have better things to do.But its here.

I also think it's a great idea to have a "hidden" forum where all you ball less bastards can badmouth everyone you want without them having the ability to defend themselves.
I now know who my friends are and those who say one thing to my face and another behind my back. :nailem: :nailem:

Thats shady!! Takes no sack to talk BS in private

If anybody has been thrashing my cooking behind my back they're toast :gf:

-spence

Some folks have said this but any useful links to weather, tides, etc. Adding too many forums waters down their affect in my opinion. I like having the one forum for striper talk vs regional forums.


As to the latest posts above, always too bad when the direction of the thread goes elsewhere based on the original poster's question(s).
Don't you guys think your comments should be done either via a separate thread or via PMs. Right or wrong, this thread isn't the place to post this stuff.

I like pictures............:angel:

There's already enough personal negative criticism on the open forum - now there's "secret" stuff too? :hs: :hs:

PMs?? give me a break, how about an "honest" site?? Look what has already been done in private.....

To get back to the original thought;
I like a site that is easy to navigate, has what I want and has a lot of good stuff in one place. CNN is agreat layout; Intellicast is a great layout. NOAA (if you get past the first page to the site map has an exceptional layout) I agree that weather links would be cool, or tide links etc..

As far as the hidden forum; do I like it? No, but I think the Mods need a place to discuss, i.e. That Rockhound is causing trouble again, or Spence is jabbering Politics again etc..
When it comes to more personal attacks, well, I have no idea what was/is said on the 'hidden forum' and frankly I dont care. I'm hear to fish and talk fishing, and along the way I have met several people I consider my good friends. the rest of the crap that goes on is just BS anyways

Pain
 

#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& & Piemma, I feel your pain!

Sighting in the site...
 

JR I don't pay much attention to anyone else web site so I can't say for sure this is the best out there, but I if it isn't it sure as hell has to be one of the top two. I have to go with Clammer and Tattoo, leave it alone...........:uhuh:

agree with all , however, its not for "mods" only there are plenty of members in that forum.I said the mods should have one but this thing is totally different..............

I agree; email sent

I would like a map of the east coast on here, with everyone having a gps chip. Then at a glance you could see where everyone was fishing. That would work...oh yeah and tide charts :hee:

Regarding the private area issue, there was a time when this site had some troublemakers, and spies from other sites. That was one way things could deffinately be discussed in private with out the whole world knowing. The other reason it was created is that with the growth of the site came some posts that were hogging space, and it was a pain to read thru a million posts by the same persons about the same stuff day after day. That being said I know that such area was being deemed as useless and there was talk of discontinuing it.

I think we need fewer forums so more ends up on the main page. I tend not to read as many threads if I have to go from forum to forum to find them. If they were on the main page , you could scan them all at once.


As far as the controversy over the semi private forum , I do think people have a legitimate gripe.

We went through about 2 most excellent years here. Having been involved with many sites at the time , IMO there was no contest that John had succeeded in creating the site everyone wanted. Then as word got out about how outstanding a site it was , people started joining in blocks. the MSBA block , the CT Surfcasters block , the Newport block , the RISSA block , etc. Suddenly the number of members exploded and they came in as parts of "Clichs" . In an effort to preserve the best of the original group , the Ledge was created as a core group to help decide the direction the site would go in. It was a "good thought" but unfortunately it started going haywire almost immediately. First was the bashing of other sites which we tried to discourage , second came the people bashing which we also tried to discourage.
I also can honestly say that the intentions in creating the semi private forum were for the betterment of the site. Sometimes things don't work out as planned.

John asked what we would like to make the site better and I answered. :hs:

its very apparent that the private forum did indeed become a bash space for the few "select" cronies. What I have read from it recently anyway is that there is no attempt to stop it.I am sure its buzzing today.What was done there should not have been done...But of course no one will step up and take blame, it will be turned around and twisted into something else, just like everything else does on this board.I saw many, many knifes in peoples backs there and, in some ways You even admit that saltheart...........Not good.....

If you "do think people have a ledgitimat gripe" then do something about it , you guys are the moderators......

I don't think you did....



"Hey i got a great idea. Why dont you set up a hidden forum where a select group of members can bad mouth everyone else while pretending to be your friends.

no wait that already exists. "

Moses, I agree with you, I don't think he answered either.

Nebe, what do you suggest we do about your gripe? answer here or PM JohnR.

#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&, what do you suggest we do?

To answer John's question, I think the site is fine just like Clammer said.
I'm gonna go back and hide in the plug forum now.

You should see if you can intgrate Google Map into it....that would be kind of cool.

Tide charts would be good also. Articles, maybe a Guilt free Photo gallery where people can post pics of there catches.

while i didnt answer johns question, i feel that i brought a very neagative feature of the board to a public forum.

If my suggestions matter, then i suggest that the ledge be done with or just allow moderators to use it. I know my name has been mentioned in there a couple of times, but i could care less what people think of me ..I fish when i can, i catch what i can and thats all that matters to me. If someone wants to sit behind a keyboard and criticize who i am, who i am not and, wehre i fish and what i am up to, by all means go ahead, but i have a good memory and i know who said what about me. my gripe is that the forum exists and that there are board members who are not moderators who are allowed to view it. Why should i dontate cash, my artwork or the plugs i make to a site that i do not have full access to??

well said eben, while I have not donated anything (monitarily anyway) to this site anyway exept the one time to bassmaster, I think eben brings up a good point, why should he or anyone else donate, support and contribute to a site that doesnt give him full access. You may say that it is for mods, however it clearly is not, why are the select few allowed and it is clearly 15 to 20 people that are certainly not mods?? and why should anyone support something that has a private room where others can chit chat about them however they please?? the whole things smells bad.......

You have Tlap in there jenn,clammer,fishwee,goose,daves,bassmaster..etc the list goes on...Are these guys mods????????

There are a lot of people here and there are almost as many opinions as to what's the best things to do. You can't please everyone all the time.

We continually try to make things better

Its not as easy as it looks.

Ahh, yes, the super secret member forum. So secret I get asked about it all the time - really, I do.

We created a forum a couple years ago so we could discuss site issues amung a group of people that had been on the site for a few years and people that I and the moderators thought could give us the straight poop and help us steer this site through the crap - which was getting REAL miserable at the time with people PUI (posting under the influence), the teenagers SSX/SSN, and a half dozen other people making the site miserable at the time. . About six eiught months into it, I decided it was not doing as well as what I wanted it too so I capped the members, removed a few that were were really not helping out in there, and have not added anyone since. We have about every "group" of the site in there, the hardcore surf guy, the boat guys, Clammer, guys from MSBA, RI clubs, NJ clubs, NY clubs, we have people from CT, RI, Ma, The Cape (really a seperate entity), NY, NJ, plug people, regular fishers, business owners, and all. We have a few people of just about every "click" on this board. That also allows us to fix problems before they get out of whack too...

And it is not that secret, funny you should ask but a bunch of people, including some voicing about no secret forums, have asked to get access. And it has not been a problem when some people have asked to have their own forum.

That forum has been debated back and forth on whether or not it should even stay open and for us to close it. But it still has some uses. Recently it was used to discuss a problem that if had been made public initially instead of researched, some wrong conclusions could have been made. Not often enough did it do what I wanted it to do - a so called steering commitee for the site, but it has been used that way successfully a lot too. That forum, like some of the other aspects of this site are under review as well.

Spots don't get bragged about and no super secret spot X fishing done there. Again, the intention was to help steer the site.

Bill - that forum started long after you left, and when you came back, nobody else has been put in. It's not supposed to be a social club. There are a lot of people I would put in there, you included, if I felt that the forum was being used as good as it should be. A lot of people have asked to have access in there over time, Canalman, F18, Eben, Swimmer, Ahours, and others, people that could, in my opinion, assist in a "steering" with the site and there are other I would ask. But the forum does not always work as intended so it has not been expanded in well over 18 months and it has been deliberated on a few occasions whether or not to shut it down alltogether.

One of the greatest things about that forum? I - AND THE OTHER MODERATORS, can vent and blow off steam in private, or look into stuff too before opening our big fat traps on the main board...

And don't think this is the only site that has a forum for a few people. Almost all do. As will all larger entities, you have (or certainly should) some people that help manage things and a place to do it - THAT was what it was for. Even though it occasionally gets carried away. Oh, and we do let people swear in there :eek5:

Oh - one more thing, it really is not a super secret - a lot of people have asked me about it and I have never denied it, whether or exists or what goes on there (and certainly its intention).


Now I would like this to get back on topic to make this place better. That is what I want us to do.... If you have any issues with this, or about that forum, address them to me or to the moderators...


Thanks,


John

Fewer forums is a good idea. This site for the most part is great, but remember it is internet hosted, thus you can't take or interpret everything you read on the internet as a personal attack. I don't. Half the time I read stuff here and can't determine if guys are serious or not. If I bust balls or god forbid, someone busts mine, big f)(*^&%%n deal. Get over it. It should be all in fun, no private back rooms with gold keys needed to enter unless it is business. Also, #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& and Piemma make this site rock! Some of the posts are too funny! You can't tear the guys up in private for what has been posted here on the site. I have never read anything that was too far out of bounds to be called fun. BTW, is there anything about me in there I should know about?

Aside from the pictures of you with the mule and bottle of Jack? No, nothing...

:wiggle:

-spence

Your suggestions do matter and although I don't feel this is thread for it - be sure to read my response above. Unfortunately, doing this at lunchtime (late lunch) and the first time I can get down to the machine. As for who is in there, a lot of people and all that were year long before you came on board. If things were different, you would be in there too. As for having access to everything on the site? Nobody does except the mods. If this site were a like a private business, a few people would have ultimate reign on everything, but it is not. If it were not something "owned" it would probably have an ewlected e-board - it does not, instead, it has twenty something people that have been here 4 years and as many as 6 years, that I can ask and run things by...

So, I agree with what Nebe stated in his last post. For those of you who think we are off base I ask the question. How would you feel if you know that you and your name was being run through the mud on a private forum? You probably would be as PO'ed as I am.

I don't care if people want to drag me down but do it to my face, not behind my back. These are guys that I have fished with who are supposedly friends. I will not forget the names of my "friends".

I have seen the posts and know everyone who is responsible.

4 the last time let's get this post back on track, we are not discussing private forums on this post any longer, if some of you would take the time to read each and every post instead of skimming, alot of crap on the boards would go away. If you had read everything you would have seen John put the kabosh on it in this post. ff If you want to talk about the private forum, pm John or start a new thread in the grumpy section.

John I think this place is fine, and would like to say thank you for all of your time.

John it might be time tp restrict peoples editing again...

Honestly, aside from some sort of tide/weather chart thing, This site is top notch, I couldn't ask for more...:cool:

Thanks alot John for all you do to keep the lights on...you da man :claps:

I like the site. Be nice to link straight to weather/tides from here but most of us probably have a site bookmarked anyway. I bet some of you feel the pull of the moon in your blood.

I would like to be able to access a list of all sponsors with their links from the message board.

John, Thanks for your time.

Maybe update a photo gallery of sorts, Maybe have saltheart or mike cc do up a how to basic rod building? Put Bm's articles in a how to?

I still like your idea of a S-B surfcaster Ninja outfit:uhuh:

very interesting !!!

Chris, didnt you mention an SB dating service? :lasso: :humpty:

#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& and I have talked about this. I said some crap in the heat of the moment I should have worded a lot better and he took some stuff out of context and we're cool.

If anyone has a problem, PM me please... THanks,

When I get home in a few hours, I'm going to split this thread into the part about making the site better and the part about the "secret" forum that most knew about anyway...

John...