Yup, a solution needs to be found.
And its not going to be a bunch of 'necks on the beach with rifles thank god.
I'd guess it'd take a week after that opened for some idiot to shoot a surfer.

I'm trying to figure out whats going on on the West Coast that keeps their seal populations in check since they're protected. (Other than the Southern California Great White population)

I'm pretty sure seals were basically almost wiped out there too at one point.

Well! if you can't kill them perhaps the brok-back dune gang in PT can breed them out.

[QUOTE=likwid;589746]

Your father a biologist?
http://www.seaworld.org/animal-info/...-seal/diet.htm

Adult harbor seals eat 5% to 6% of their body weight per day, about 4.5 to 8.2 kg (10-18 lb.).
QUOTE]

That was a crappy way to answer. Are you a biologist?
regardless, almost 20lb/day x an est. 6,000 seals is still a lot of fish consumed.

Sure but everyone relying on information from the past would tell us we need to kill all the sharks, seals, and anything else that might look funny at what we want.

Also there's no problems with the Cod stock either.

And cigarettes don't give you cancer.
Make sure to use DDT on everything.
Seatbelts don't save lives.
Cocaine is good for you.

Likwid, you seem to have done some research on this. Some people are concerned about the seals eating the bass and blues and decreasing the fish population that way. In reality, the seals are eating the same food as the gamefish. They feed on menhaden, alewives, herring, and mackerel along with other bait fish and squid, clams and crustaceans. The competition for food is what is driving the fish away, mostly offshore. The stripers and blues being picked off of someone's line are only taken because they are easy prey for the seals. And fishermen do spend money on the cape. Stop into a 24 hour Dunkin Donuts or c-store in the middle of the night. Check out the parking lots of motels and look for trucks with trailers. Look at the boats on trailers being filled up at gas stations all over the cape. Now, I know that tourism is always going to be #1 on the cape. But, if fishermen chose to band together and use their combined voice about this and other issues (better discussed in other threads), they would at least raise awareness. As for the west coast, the inshore fishing has gotten worse over the years. Maybe it's because the seals have eaten a lot of the bait. Then, the seals move on because they are looking for food. Seals have a very large range and can travel far. They stop and take up residence where food is plentiful. Until they decimate the bait stocks around here, we will not see them going anywhere.

Which we've (as a WHOLE not just any one group) already done a FANTASTIC job of decimating.

And the cycle continues.

You know, it would work better if people could pull their collective heads out of their as!@#!@# and work together on this than relying on just one group.
These issues don't just affect fishermen.
The growing population of seals (among the other issues) affects pretty much everyone who goes anywhere near a beach.

Likwid, the way you break down people's posts is very passive aggressive. I have a list of questions and statements for you.
1. Are you a biologist?
2. When was the last time you fished from shore on the outter cape?
3. Do you like gay tuna?
4. When was the last time you tried to rake sandeels inshore??
5. I believe the horsehead seals are different then the seals at Sea World
6. Before I made my statements I said don't quote me these were told to me a few years ago and someone could go digging if they wanted to.
7. My dad is an engineer, he is a very logical person, not the type to make things up out of the blue. The data that he told me was quoted from something he had read. Again this was a few years ago so I might not be accurrate.
8. When was the last time you fished from shore on the outter Cape? From your comments I would guess it was a very long time.

Because its the same things over and over without any evidence. It gets old.

1: Nope, but what I quote is from biologists

2: Last fall

3: I loves all the tunas equally. Om nom nom nom.

4: I don't rake, I go by what I see in the water.

5: Grey seals (Halichoerus grypus) a larger seal, are being seen more frequently but harbour seals still outnumber them. The grey seal population in the Bay of Fundy appears to be on the increase. Males reach lengths of 245cm (8') and weigh 450kg (990lb), females 215cm (7') and 270kg (600lb). The head is long and the seal is often called the"horsehead" seal.
Kinda like aussies call bluefish tailors. Same thing.

6: Ok, but too many people run around with facts and figures that came from someone else that said something else that they read in a book that was written in 1902.

7: I can provide links and/or books to prove what I say.

8: Repeat, last fall. Thats not very "long ago". And I'm down there just about every other weekend just for the hell of it. (Including all winter long. Nice place to take the dog for a walk.)

If people (in general) don't educate themselves, they're doomed to failure. Walking into something (say the seal problem) blindly with just speculation and heresay won't solve the issue. It'll just make it worse.

[QUOTE=likwid;589762]Which we've (as a WHOLE not just any one group) already done a FANTASTIC job of decimating.

Since this thread was about seals, I was making my point about what the seals are eating. They eat the same food as the fish we are trying to catch. As the seal population increases, the baitfish stocks will decrease. Then, the seals will move on to other areas where they can find abundant food. That will leave the stripers and blues with a lot less food and they will move on also.

I think everyone on this site is aware of what humans have done to the baitfish stocks in New England. When herring were almost gone, they put a ban on taking herring. They have also put limits on the taking of some gamefish that have become overfished.

So, the government can take action to try to fix problems of overfishing by humans. Unfortunatley, there is no regulation of the seals taking baitfish.

However you want to look at it, or where ever you get your data from, it is visibly obvious that the seals population is in the midst of an explosion. You might see balls of bait "offshore" but ask anyone that has been raking sandeels over the years and you'll get the same response I'm giving you. I haven't seen one skate pulled up on the beach in three years. I would say roughly 50% of the fish I catch now are chased by seals, as opposed to 0% four years ago. You hear it all over the outter Cape that buisnesses are struggling. I just find it odd that someone who is out there as much as you claim you are hasn't noticed any of this. I know seals can't be held 100% responsible for all of this. But I also do know that they are contributing to the problem and to close your eyes to the whole matter confuses me a little bit. Anyway, that's all I have to say on this. You all can flame on now.:deadhorse:

There was a winter long series about the cape and life on NPR.

They detailed a ton of issues with the cape from property prices to lack of real jobs being the cause of the decline (People who live out there year around talking about this, not NPR). Not once did they mention seals.

You'd think if it were a major cause like people are making it out to be that they would have talked about it?

I'd put money on Omega Protein taking more menhaden than the entire MA seal population eats in a year.

One last thing, 5%-6% of a 990lb animal is much closer to 50# then 18#.

Maybe someone can start shooting them.

no likwid, 6000 is probably not an accurate count I agree, I don't think 10000 is right either

count these in this picture and do the math

I bet there are more

Thats actually out of a fantastic book.

On the basis of data that are themselves suspect, the department asserts that horseheads consume 50,000 metric tonnes (1980 figures) of valuable fishes every year, or 10 per cent of the half-a-million tonnes taken by Canadian east-coast fisherman. Analysis of this charge demonstrates that less than 20,000 tonnes of the consumption attributed to horseheads (but by no means proven) is of species of even marginal commercial value. Furthermore, the presumed tonnage represents live weight-the weight of the whole fish-while the figure for the commercial catch is based on processed weight-only that portion of the fish that is packaged for sale. The live weight taken by Canadian commercial fisherman in 1980 was approximately 1.2 million tonnes. The percentage of commercially valuable fish eaton by the seals can therfore be no more than 1.6 per cent.

Someone push Greenpeace's buttons enough about them and they'll run over their nets and ram their ships.
See? Greenpeace CAN do fishermen good. :D

What time of year was that?
What did the other haulout locations look like?

Questions that need answers to make an educated guess on real numbers.

Anyone know if WHOI has done any counting?

Choice words
 

Well it finally happened to me... Fishing in a nice school of cookie cutters, blow ups every cast. Got a nice fish on, took a little drag; and its about 20yrds away in pretty tight to the shore. I see a giant black shape emerge behind my bass and up comes a huge grey seal. He chases my fish around for a second and pretty soon he's got it. Then my line starts peeling big time and soon enough he cuts through the line. Then the bastage comes up with my fish in its mouth, and my lefthook pilgrim, obviously taunting me.... Had a few calm choice words of course. I think it went something like:

"GO F YOURSELF YOU STUPID FING SEAL, I HOPE YOU CHOKE ON THAT DAMN PLUG!"

Luckily the fishing didnt totally shut off, just all the big fish left:fury:

How did the seal fight? Strong steady pull that you had not chance in stopping?

I've had two fish grabbed by something in the last few weeks. It was at night so I never got a look at whatever it was. It was just swam off at a moderate pace with the fish and I had no chance of stopping it. Thinking seal but could be a shark I guess.

I gave up fishing the outer beaches of the cape a while ago. One spot I went to scout at daytime had 60+ seals, easily.

They are very intelligent. They see you with a fishing rod, they will follow you. Kinda like dogs.

Anyhoo, FWIW, the fishing is not bad on the Bay side. Not as many seals.

I haven't seen as many seals in RI as I have on the outer cape this summer.

I beg to differ! I had a seal pup grab my yellow pencil a few weeks ago. Not sure if it was playing or thought it was a fish. Landed the seal but did not get the plug back...

Yeah,
I had three gray seals around my baits just outside of Rockport harbor last year.

People are getting harassed on Stellwagen by them. I never saw even ONE in my whole life in either of those places. I spent the better part of my childhood around those two areas.

They are moving beyond the Cape now. I would say that it will be a regional problem in 5 years or so. Just look at everybody arguing back and forth in 2008. It's a given out there now. Seals chase my lures now, as well, just as spin said.

I really don't care either way...I have a boat and can chose to leave them. There's not a lot of stipers on the OB's like there used to be, and the seals seem to hate blues.

Something will happen. Mark my words, it'll be something weird like feline distemper that crosses the blood-brain barrier and then...kaboom.

yup exactly, but could be either one I suppose.

Nature has a way of correcting imbalances, provided we don't get in the way.

I say leave the sharks alone and give 'em time to fatten up.

http://kron4.com/2015/10/13/new-slow...eying-on-seal/

Seals are not sea lions and Alcatraz is about 3,000 miles from MA and on a different ocean. :hs: