Can you guys stay on topic? What the heck does that have to do with it?

I wonder how much food, shelter and other neccesities our troops in Afghanistan and Iraq have brought to the people there?

Lincoln's second innuaural address, another wacko like FDR that got us in a war! Look how many times he mentions God! Like freeing the slaves was God's work! Somehow history forgot this guy was republican.......and VERY religious

One-eighth of the whole population were colored slaves, not distributed generally over the Union, but localized in the southern part of it. These slaves constituted a peculiar and powerful interest. All knew that this interest was somehow the cause of the war. To strengthen, perpetuate, and extend this interest was the object for which the insurgents would rend the Union even by war, while the Government claimed no right to do more than to restrict the territorial enlargement of it. Neither party expected for the war the magnitude or the duration which it has already attained. Neither anticipated that the cause of the conflict might cease with or even before the conflict itself should cease. Each looked for an easier triumph, and a result less fundamental and astounding. Both read the same Bible and pray to the same God, and each invokes His aid against the other. It may seem strange that any men should dare to ask a just God's assistance in wringing their bread from the sweat of other men's faces, but let us judge not, that we be not judged. The prayers of both could not be answered. That of neither has been answered fully. The Almighty has His own purposes.

"Woe unto the world because of offenses; for it must needs be that offenses come, but woe to that man by whom the offense cometh." If we shall suppose that American slavery is one of those offenses which, in the providence of God, must needs come, but which, having continued through His appointed time, He now wills to remove, and that He gives to both North and South this terrible war as the woe due to those by whom the offense came, shall we discern therein any departure from those divine attributes which the believers in a living God always ascribe to Him?

Fondly do we hope, fervently do we pray, that this mighty scourge of war may speedily pass away. Yet, if God wills that it continue until all the wealth piled by the bondsman's two hundred and fifty years of unrequited toil shall be sunk, and until every drop of blood drawn with the lash shall be paid by another drawn with the sword, as was said three thousand years ago, so still it must be said "the judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether."

With malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in, to bind up the nation's wounds, to care for him who shall have borne the battle and for his widow and his orphan, to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace among ourselves and with all nations.

The food and shelter part of the game has all been privatized, even with respect to housing troops. Not to mention, I don't think the US Military should be the red cross either or for that matter providing social services and humanitarian assistance. Rather they are ensuring the security of the place so that these services can be provided by other organizations.

Bill Clinton - another religious wacko!
So in this pulpit, on this day, let me ask all of you in your heart to say: We will honor the life and the work of Martin Luther King. We will honor the meaning of our church. We will, somehow, by God's grace, we will turn this around. We will give these children a future. We will take away their guns and give them books. We will take away their despair and give them hope. We will rebuild the families and the neighborhoods and the communities. We won't make all the work that has gone on here benefit just a few. We will do it together by the grace of God.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYvcY1E7SvA

Now compare this to what you've posted. After all, like minded individuals pray alike....


"I think God's will has to be done in unifying people and companies to get the gas line built, so pray for that."
-Sarah Palin

Nothing like a little help from the man upstairs...

my "anger" with the religious angle was sarcasm. I was proving to you that some of the most famous, and liberal, politicians have used God and prayer in the speeches, Clinton, Lincoln and FDR speak of his (or her?) will.
However Palin si some crazy religious sealot that believes the war is a task of god to destroy muslims.....

RIJIMMY, you're completely missing the point and mixing references to god.

A big difference between doing right by God, and believing you're doing God's will. Sure reads to me like she was thinking the later, and every government official who's said anything similar has taken it hard for their words. She's speaking to a lot of influential minds in that video.

There are a lot of influential evangelicals (and non evangelicals) who do believe this is a Christian vs Muslim issue.

-spence

My point being, that if Gods task was to bring peace to the region why did the guy running the show declare that task was achieved when it was obvious that the worse was yet to come. he was more than happy just going there and making things go Boom.....he wasn't thinking about peace in the area....just a piece of the area.

so let me get this straight too...its OK for us to go over there and give "hand-outs" to the people in Afghanistan and Iraq...hmmm thats so Liberal of you.

I think Jim is close to snapping... :hihi:

For what its worth, Bush stated that we are in war under gods will as well.. he said it a few years ago and my head almost exploded..

Under god's will is a heck of a lot diferent than saying 'let god guide us' gods will means some whack job thinks he has a special Tom Tom that can comunicate with the man upstairs.. sorry... But.. all of the christian radicals who read the bible word for word are having orgasms over all of this talk... :yak:

religion should stay at home and in the church... not in the whitehouse. Same thing goes for oral sex and cigars..

In religious homes.

What about road head?
Is that allowed?

only on straight roads.


not homo roads... :hihi:

:lama:

Remember, just don't inhale, or swallow.

European or African swallow?

You freaking new ager!
With your crocs

AND SOCKS :eek5:

damn straight. I dont give a crap what people think of what I look like... those crocs and my smart wool socks are the footwear of the future.

http://www.conservapedia.com/Socialism

This is the extreme. But right up about where Obama wants US. I feel he is a believer in the "people of the world crap". And wants US to fall into step with the UN on everything. But to do so would have to gut some of the things in our Constitution.

Smart wool has been around for like 20 years.

You're committing a party foul dude.

the main issue is that her speech was not about one issue concerning this country...only attacks, slogans and spin...how about the economy? how about how we are actually going to 'win' the war in iraq since 'victory is in sight', or about energy policy since there is no greater friend to the saudis and the oil industry than the republican party, how about regaining our standing in the world which has been so bungled these past 8 years...great speech? maybe well delivered but absolutely void of anything important...scary that this country could be swayed by that...

I think your post should be in the other thread about the speech, but amen to that! and what the hell is she talking about "Obama wants to make sure we read them their rights"
yeah and he's also for increasing troops in Afghanistan to actually go after Al-Queda, something this adminstration has pretty much put on the back burner

Afghani-who?
C'mon man, the right can only keep track of one war at a time.
You're confusing the poor old man and the school mom.

The problem we are having in Afghanastan, and I may be wrong is that the areas we secure are fine. But the areas that are being secured by other nations are a problem. Pakastan is also the problem because we can't go in there. I'm not sure it's as simple as just sending over a few thousand more troops and problem solved. Jeez, this Obama sounds like he's a war munger.

Mac, your right. The Obama administration would have to gut the constitution. However, the constitution cannot be gutted, at least that is not how it was intended under the compromises of our founding fathers. Unfortunately, the application of the constitutional principle of due process has been bled a bit. Hopefully, this will be reconciled, but if not, then we should indeed worry about the powers of the government for we will all be hemophiliacs, cut off from the blood transfusions of disent. A powerful all knowing- no holds barred centralized authority is a prerequisite of socialism on one end of the spectrum and royalism on the other.

Now all that aside (about the constitutional bloodletting of the current administration) I would not worry to much about the socialism predictions underscoring the mantra of Obama opponents. Federalism, as mandated by constitution, places exceptional limitations on any sweeping changes in the direction of socialism/communism in America. Socialism has always been fringe ideology on the political spectrum and even FDR faced considerable opposition to his New Deal Policies which at the time were viewed not as economic jumpstarters but rank socialist expansionism by some on the Supreme Court. With 80,000 governments of varying size and scope in this country coupled with a majority stacked textualist supreme court bench, the likelihood of socialism in it extremes acquiring any serious foothold is next to nothing.

I do think social programs and incentives for reinvigorating math, science and the engineering disciplines are on the horizon, as well as curbing some of this free trade undercutting american made products. This type of government expansion, aimed at strengthening education and the economy are not all that distasteful in my opinion, but again this all in theory.

For reality far more complicated, unpredicatable and variable than what the books & experts say...

He could just change the face of the supreme court and undercut the Constitution and the will of the people that way.

The problem we're having in Afghanistan is that it's a tribal country where everybody is out for their own interest. Take a few hundred thou from the CIA then laugh while you sell opium and let the Taliban run through your back yard.

We can't be everywhere at once, it's why they call Karzi the Mayor of Kabul!

-spence

and w ran against the idea of 'nation building'...now we have 2 of these such projects going on...

I think he specifically said that US troops would never be used for nation building.

Hence another reason why I don't trust a think Palin says.

It looks like McCain's first pick for VP was Joe Liberman, which set the far right into a tizzy. Instead he went 180 degrees and chose a social conservative...simple to please the BASE.

This indicates her presence is to get votes rather than add substance to the Administration. Why should she practice anything she preaches?

Bush sure as heck sold us a bill of goods, then flipped on most of it.

-spence

Judges are nominated by the president, which has to be affirmed by Senate. So "He" can't change the face of Court by sheer will. There records are intensively scrutinized as we saw with Alito. Judges can also be impeached.

The issue with Afghanistan was we DIDN'T do this and left them in shambles and allowed the Taliban to run buck wild through the country.