Good to admit you're wrong. Obama did oppose the surge for sure, but it's not that he wasn't knowledgeable. I think his position that additional troops alone wouldn't be enough to stop the violence and that it would take pressure off of Iraqi's is quite reasonable. There were a variety of proposals on the table for how to improve conditions in Iraq.

As you know well, the success of the Surge wasn't really just about more troops and a shift in tactics. The timetable of sectarian fighting worked to our advantage...

Well, this is how our government functions. Legislation is based on a set of assumptions that may not be accurate.

If you read what I stated above you'd see that that's not true. I believe if you factor in the real economic drop the projection is still within the margin of error.

And more importantly, why aren't you calling me "Pyle"?

-spence

The well known "conservative" Barney Frank says it too:

"Frank: Obama admin 'dumb' to predict no higher than 8% unemployment
By Michael O'Brien - 08/18/10 06:45 AM ET

It was "dumb" for President Obama and his aides to promise that unemployment would not surpass 8 percent if the stimulus act passed, a top House Democrat said Tuesday."
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefi...8-unemployment



http://otrans.3cdn.net/ee40602f9a7d8172b8_ozm6bt5oi.pdf

if you look at the dems report, at pag.5 you'll see the chart of unemployment with and without the "stimulus".
With the stimulus it STAYS right UNDER 8%.

"As you know well, the success of the Surge wasn't really just about more troops and a shift in tactics. The timetable of sectarian fighting worked to our advantage..."

Spence, unlike Obama,and I suppose unlike you, I was there before and after the surge. Everyone knows that the reduction in violence was a direct result of the increased troop presence in the forward areas. You suggest the reduction in sectarian fighting COINCIDENTALLY matched up with the increased troop presence?

Clueless. I mean, clueless.

"Well, this is how our government functions. Legislation is based on a set of assumptions that may not be accurate. "

Oh, see. So when Obama is as wrong as can be on the economy or on th esurge, it's because these things are, unfortunately, not an exact science. Did you say the same thing about Bush and the start of the Iraq war? That was also a result of incorrect interpretation of data, but you don't seem to be willing to give Bush the same get-out-of-jail-free card that you give Obama.

Bush supported the surge, because vcirtually every single military commander said it would work. Obama, somehow, concluded that he knew better. If Obama thinnks he knows more about these things than the guys with blood on their boots, what does that say about Obama?

The same thing it says about you. You and Obama are both so blinded by ideology that you cannot see facts before your eyes. Obama thinks the best way to address our debt ($60 trillion) is to tweak tax rates on a handful of zillionaires. You agree. Neither of you are swayed by the fact that the math clearly shows that any addiitonal revenue won't even be enough to pay the INTEREST on what we owe. But that strategy is out of the commie playbook, and that's all that matters to you and Obama.

So when conservatives admit the truth, you (and Obama) know you can't respond based on the issues. All you can do is shriek "YUO HATE POOR PEOPLE! VOTE FOR ME, OR THE MEAN REPUBLICAN WILL KICK YOU OUT IN THE STREET!!"

That's literally all you have.

I keep asking you how you'd generate $60 trillion by adding $90 billion of tax revenue, and you keep d#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&g.

If you read your article you'd see that Frank was stating that to discuss the number at all was bad politically, not that he disagreed with the projection.

And he used the word "predict" not "promise".

-spence

I'm not responding to this post in detail until you edit it and replace "spence" with "Pyle".

-spence

Originally Posted by Jim in CT
Spence, he said the stimulus would keep unemployment under 8%, and he was spectacularly wrong.

Originally Posted by spence
Well, we should probably fact check your assertion.
First off, Obama never even said it.

"The administration famously released a chart during the fight over its signature $787 billion American Recovery and Reinvestment Act (ARRA) showing that, if that package were enacted, unemployment would not exceed 8 percent."

promise, predict, project....whatever "p" word you want to use to describe it or how it was delivered to the public or by which member(s) of "OBAMA'S" Administration...it was "wrong"....and dumb...here's a good one for you...prevaricate
did they "predict" that the way we'd get back to 8% unemployment is that millions of American's would simply give up looking for work

I kinda a like "Pile" if you are replacing the name "spence"

yup...and it's worked out about as well as most Obama initiatives....:uhuh:

"The Obama administration's initial foreclosure-prevention programs, launched in early 2009, were intended to help 7 million to 9 million people. So far, they've aided about 2 million, and not all of those are out of foreclosure danger.

Programs begun later have also faltered. One intended to help at least 500,000 has helped just a few hundred a year after its launch. Another initiative to extend $1 billion to help the jobless or underemployed avoid foreclosure ended in September, obligating less than half of its funds. The unused money went back to the U.S. Treasury.

As of Nov. 30, the government had spent just $2.8 billion of the $46 billion war chest it had in 2009 to devote to the housing crisis, the Treasury Department says. More has been committed, but only $13 billion will ultimately be spent, the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office estimated in March."

"Every program has fallen far short of goals. I can't think of one that's been largely successful," says John Dodds, director of the Philadelphia Unemployment Project, a non-profit that's been involved in foreclosure prevention for decades.



What went wrong with foreclosure aid programs? ? USATODAY.com


also

75% of modified home loans will redefault
By Les Christie, staff writerJune 16, 2010: 3:02 PM ET

NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Most borrowers who have had their mortgages modified through a government-sponsored program will redefault within 12 months, according to a report released Wednesday.



http://money.cnn.com/2010/06/16/real...mods/index.htm

and

HuffPo
HAMP: Mortgage Modifications Slow To Trickle Under Obama Anti-Foreclosure Program

08/ 9/11

WASHINGTON -- Since the Home Affordable Modification Program launched in the months following President Obama's inauguration, nearly 870,000 struggling homeowners have been kicked out of the initiative, while just 657,044 remain in permanent modifications.

For eligible borrowers, HAMP lowers monthly payments to 31 percent of their monthly income by reducing interest rates, extending the term of a loan and temporarily forbearing payments. If a borrower successfully makes reduced trial payments for three months, the modification is supposed to become permanent -- but in its early history the program has been notorious for its drawn-out and often hopeless trial mods.

President Obama said in 2009 that the program would help 3 to 4 million households modify their mortgages. The Treasury Department, which administers HAMP, backed away from that goal last year and started measuring the program's success mainly by the number of modifications across the entire mortgage servicing industry.

Spence, what about that $60 trillion in unfunded liabilities. You have no opinion on that? Nothing at all?

Of course not. You don't know what to say about that, because Obama hasn't told you what to say. And like any other mindless parrot, you can't regurgitate the words unless your master trains you first.

$60 trillion. And that IGNORES the $15 trillion in operating debt that we currently have (the number you see in Times Square), so our total debt is more along the lines of $75 trillion, which is $250,000 for each of the 300 million of us.

Obama's plan is to ignore this, and to demonize anyone who bravely suggests that we need to address this problem. Because Obama hasn't chimed in yet, Spence has nothing to say. Nothing. Yet Spence claims he is well informed and intelligent.

no he is NOT ! Clueless
In fact .....he just gave away 8 BILLION dollars (yesterday)
of "our Money" without even asking
so that proves it right there....
there is NO debt .... everything is just fine and DANDY .

Was that for more electricity in Africa so there can be some more pollution from
coal burning?
The Chinese also want to buy our land in Tennessee for coal mining so the rest of the world can pollute, but we are discouraged here with the highest tech in the world to reduce pollution. Like we won't be affected by their air and they will join us in anti-pollution.