between Obama funding terrorism and the Clinton's fleecing the poorest among us...I'm really starting to be concerned about the direction of the democrat party

you've never listened to a Clinton speech??

Trump is more likable.....and has better hair...and dresses better...and has a better looking spouse and daughter(sorry Paul)...and I don't think his spouse is a sexual predator....etc...

What part of the 2nd amendment is so hard to understand ? " The right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed "

So spence, you support infringing on those rights?
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That entire sentence is a an old and successful meme. As far as it being true, that's a far different matter. Between the two, there are comparisons and differences. So, WTF are you talking about?

He does what I do? That's insulting.
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You didn't define arms.
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Comparing you to Trump might be insulting to Trump. Nonetheless, there is a comparison when it comes to hurling insults.

That's intellectually dishonest and you know better. I guess in the alt right world this is all justified. Conservatism is dead.
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Neither does the Constitution. If the Framers had intended to specify only specific weapons, they would have done so. Obviously, they meant "arms" in the general meaning of military or other weapons.

So I guess nukes are in scope then. Those are pretty general in the meaning of military or other weapons.
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I stated what I consider to be true. Trump is far more accomplished than you are. At least as far as I know. And just because you think that the characterizations with which you freely and continuously define those with whom you politically disagree are not insulting doesn't mean that they aren't. And, certainly, your saying them does not make them true.

And if conservatism is dead, it is because conservatives abandoned it. They may have killed it more surely than any insults you or your Progressive idol's could ever have done. Or, perhaps I should be more generous and say that "conservatives" have stopped fully and forcefully being conservative. And they have become fearful of the phony insults and "memes" cast their way by Mainstream Media and by fellow travelers like you.

And maybe they have stopped being conservative because the word doesn't explain what they are supposed to be conservative about. The Alt Right is not afraid. It might seem over the top to you, but it is a more effective antidote to authoritarianism than is the meager, mealy-mouthed, fearful accommodation that establishment Republicans give to the left's encroachment on our liberties. The Alt Right, in its cultural libertarianism, is far more faithful to our Constitution's principals than many of those that are referred to as "conservative."

Some on this forum think you're just trolling when you say outrageous stuff. I think you are sincere. I think you actually believe what you say. I don't think you have the slightest notion of how outrageous you often are. And you certainly are blind to how similar your outrageousness is to Trump's, or the Alt Right's.

So I guess you're an extremist in spite of your pretension that you aren't. Who is it that can afford to buy an arsenal of nukes? And where do they buy them? At your local gun shop or at Walmart? Can they even find a legitimate nuke manufacturer that would fill their order?

I suppose if Trump or Soros could afford diminishing their fortunes merely to buy a bunch of nukes, and found a legitimate manufacturer who would sell them, they would have a right to do so. On the other hand, there seem to be worldwide treaties banning the ownership of nukes by those who don't already have them. And it seems that the vast majority of people support that. And I suppose that if a majority of American citizens by vote in three fourth of the States supported an amendment to the Constitution that limited or abolished the second amendment and the Supreme Court held that as constitutional, that would be the end of it.

And why do you not believe that is the Progressive end game?

Trump is more juvenile.

Her deplorables comment was at least as offensive, and inappropriate, as anything he has said. The impact on the polling since she said it, would seem to indicate I am right.

Spence, you are literally the only person I know, besides her, who doesn't think she lied about the sniper thing. Your radar is off.

Of course he does. That's what liberalism is. He also supports infringing upon the right to freedom of religion. That's just as explicit in the Constitution as the right to keep and bear arms.

"Conservatism is dead"

THAT'S not intellectually dishonest?

As I type this, the Republicans control both houses of the US Congress, they hold a big majority of governorships and state legislatures, and the biggest horse's ass we could ever nominate, is neck and neck with the head of the largest liberal political machine on the planet?

That's "dead" to you?

Put down the Kool Aid and calm down.

The left wing doesn't have a problem with nuts? Harry Reid, when he was the majority leader in the Senate, lied, and said that Mitt Romney didn't pay any taxes. When he was proven wrong, a reporter asked Reid if he admitted lying. Reid said no, because Romney lost?

That was the majority leader in the US Senate. You support that tactic?

I don't think Trumps wife tells him what to say
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Because it's not. The vast majority of Americans believe in legal, responsible gun ownership with some limitations...not repealing the Second Amendment. Only the *extreme* fringe left wishes to abolish.

The NRA is the enemy
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Nebe - you really voting for Trump? Really? Truly? Were you drinking?

Agree. Having seen many single parent kids (and having been one for a while), 2 healthy parent environment is worlds ahead of a broken family or worse. Though I don't know where to go on the tranny comment :tm:(I know some same sex couples that a great parents - the tranny thing might be a bridge too far - would need to see what the numbers and studies say - not the hugatherapy types)

And many do not.

Hillary outright lies, makes stuff up, and has the media covering for her. Though she does not suffer to as high a degree of mental touretts that Trump does.

There is the legitimate way of repealing the Second Amendment--the amendment process itself. Repeal the legitimate way is not possible as long as the "vast majority of Americans" are against it. And persuading the vast majority with the ongoing propaganda war against private gun ownership can take too long to win.

Repeal in the illegitimate way, placing "some limitations," and then some more, and then some more, through bogus "interpretations" until the Second Amendment is meaningless is a faster, surer way to do it.

What was once the *extreme* fringe left has now become the mainstream left--the Progressive left. And Progressives are not merely about repealing this or that Amendment. They want to reinterpret the entire Constitution, and in such a way that limitations on government are removed. The Second Amendment is just another tidbit (albeit a rather large tidbit) among the interpretive destructions that have already been accomplished.

[QUOTE=JohnR;1108573]Nebe - you really voting for Trump? Really? Truly? Were you drinking?

Many of us are voting for Trump, not because of who he personally is, but because he is on the ticket for the party that has any realistic chance of reversing the Progressive takeover of the American political process and reshaping it into their own authoritarian image.

Trump got the nomination. For good or ill, that's the big elephant fact in the room. If he wins, he won't be around forever. Probably only one term, if he lasts that long. And we still haven't been transformed to the point that the President is a total dictator. We're inching toward that, at least toward the point where he is the visible figurehead of an all-powerful central government.

So he will be held in check not only by Progressives, but by those in his party who oppose that kind of transformation. Because so many in his party oppose him, his use of the bully pulpit will only go as far as his majority in Congress will allow him--if he has a majority. That would, as well, at least temporarily, hold in check our trajectory into authoritarianism. So the only real concern, as far as the future direction of the country goes, would be whom he nominates for the Court. And, like anything else he will do, he will be advised. And, I am guessing, his advisers won't be Progressive.

[QUOTE=detbuch;1108577]For starters - I understand why people vote for Trump - good and bad. I am shocked that Nebe is there so I suspect a high :smokin: degree of mischief in the post ;)

I can't vote for Trump. I just can't. We have the candidate that has done wrong in ForPol and we have the candidate that will do wrong in ForPol. I don't see a high degree of difference between the two (though shockingly HC is not as bad as DT). Hillary will digest things to a fault before making a bad decision, The Donald will ready and fire no aiming.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/sizing-u...ief-1474064606

Under Obama, one of these *extreme* fringe leftists you speak about gun ownership and gun rights have gone up. Is he just really bad at it?

[QUOTE=JohnR;1108579]Hillary has been digesting things all her political life, and she still comes up with bad decisions. I don't think it's so much the digesting as it is about eating bad politics in the first place which leads to her decisions. That won't change no matter how much she digests the poisoned meat.

As for Trump, according to pundits including Spence, his every move is calculated. It would have taken a lot of calculating in his business ventures. Some good, some bad. And he won't be making decisions on his own whim. He surrounds himself with "good" advisers. And his party will, no doubt, be advising the hell out of him. It's their Arse, not just his. The image I get of him is that he likes to take the credit for other people's good work.

Anyway, if we have already arrived at the point where the President can, without the approval of Congress, do whatever he wants, then it is too late. If we are at that point, then the system, along with the country, is in for a huge collapse.

That is so hilarious. Are you imputing the rise of gun ownership and whatever rights have been solidified (not gone up) in the Courts to the efforts of Obama? Is that what you call intellectual honesty?

You're deeper in the tank than I thought.

Quite the contrary, I've repeatedly said he's very erratic. I do think his offensive remarks are a combination of calculation and just revealing who he really is.


And lie about his numerous failures and scandals. Must have been nice to start a career with millions of dollars and the system in your father's pocket. When that cashflow dried up there's always Wall Street to fleece, and the taxpayers. Good thing he's possibly got Russian oligarchs propping his business up. One thing Trump is good at is profiting off of other's losses.

I think we're a long way from that.

That's not what I said...

Boy howdy, are you selective in requiring honesty in your candidates. Hilary passes your honesty test...that must be some curve you grade on...Kate Upton couldn't hope for such curves.

the latter
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c6.../DT-Orange.png

Really? You're going to throw that statement out there like that and not quantify it? How about stating why gun ownership has gone up?

I hope your right, except that "a long way from" still implies that it will happen. You progressives are very persistent.

But if that is so (that we have not already arrived at the point where the President can, without the approval of Congress, do whatever he wants), then why are you guys so afraid of Trump? Perhaps, you should all be more afraid of our corrupted, authoritarian government. And maybe Trump can be the guy who blows it up.

exactly right debutch

I'd pay money to see a debate between you and spence rather than watch a presidential debate

Hmmm...your candidate, as an attorney, defended a man who raped a child. That's not profiting from someone else's loss?

Do you have ANY principles? I mean, actual principles? Other than conservative=bad, and liberal=good?

Hillary mentioned bomb yesterday....socialist news media edits it out and attacks Trump for the word bomb.....:)