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detbuch 10-23-2018 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 1153701)
Because as a society we've evolved...Trump looks like he wants to reverse that. It's sad.

He wants to keep evolving it. It's sad that you think evolution only continues when leftists affect society.

The leftist's version of societal evolution is the Hegelian dialectic--thesis, antithesis, synthesis. Every evolutionary societal advance is a combination of or argument between opposing views such as: thesis (Obama administration) vs. antithesis (Trump administration) which evolves into the new, evolved, social order--synthesis.

spence 10-23-2018 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT (Post 1153703)
That's one way of saying it. Another way, is saying that we (and I'm proud to not be included in that particular 'we') are getting too stupid and amoral to survive.

Funny, I think giving transgender people the respect to live their lives in as normal way a possible is a pretty intelligent and moral thing to do.

The Dad Fisherman 10-23-2018 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 1153708)
Funny, I think giving transgender people the respect to live their lives in as normal way a possible is a pretty intelligent and moral thing to do.

Respect is earned, not Legislated.

I, personally, don't care what barthroom they use.

spence 10-23-2018 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman (Post 1153709)
Respect is earned, not Legislated.

I, personally, don't care what barthroom they use.

I think the years of being ostracized, repressed, humiliated and otherwise diminished as humans has earned plenty of respect.

Don't care what bathroom they use either.

detbuch 10-23-2018 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 1153708)
Funny, I think giving transgender people the respect to live their lives in as normal way a possible is a pretty intelligent and moral thing to do.

The underlying implication in what you say is that transgenders are not normal. Which poses the question--is normalizing something an attempt to make normal something that is not normal? And does that transformation, that new "thesis" in your evolution of society, eliminate any distinctions in or between genders? And would that be the end of the evolutionary dialect, or would there be the eventual antithesis to your thesis? And that antithesis can, and would, come from the left and right. From the left, the tendency to evolve would be the erasure of the normal/abnormal paradigm toward eliminating old distinctions until, sexually, there eventually would be no differences.

Actually, the left's notion of "diversity" is a contradiction. It keeps evolving into sameness in order to secure its version of social justice.

Jim in CT 10-23-2018 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 1153708)
Funny, I think giving transgender people the respect to live their lives in as normal way a possible is a pretty intelligent and moral thing to do.

and the rights of a little girl to go to a public restroom and not be scared? she doesn’t have those rights? because they are bigoted?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw 10-23-2018 12:58 PM

since "plumbing" no longer has anything do do with whether one is "men" or "women"...shouldn't we "evolve" and just have one bathroom of everyone? it would make everything much easier:kewl:

Sea Dangles 10-23-2018 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 1153710)
I think the years of being ostracized, repressed, humiliated and otherwise diminished as humans has earned plenty of respect.

Don't care what bathroom they use either.

Blacks,Jews,Muslims,who are you talking about?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT 10-23-2018 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 1153710)
Don't care what bathroom they use either.

Good for you. What about a 9 year-old girl who does care? Why don't her concerns, matter to liberals?

detbuch 10-23-2018 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 1153710)
I think the years of being ostracized, repressed, humiliated and otherwise diminished as humans has earned plenty of respect.

Don't care what bathroom they use either.

Other than bathrooms, did transgenders not have the same civil rights as normal genders?

Got Stripers 10-23-2018 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT (Post 1153728)
Good for you. What about a 9 year-old girl who does care? Why don't her concerns, matter to liberals?

Well if your 9 year old girl is going into any public rest room without a parent in tow, then I’d question their right to even bitch.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw 10-23-2018 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by detbuch (Post 1153730)
Other than bathrooms, did transgenders not have the same civil rights as normal genders?

I knew a transgender guy/gal way back in the mid-80's who had credit cards for both genders...he/she was very successful and seemed pretty unoppressed.... and it was always fun to see which one would show up

fishbones 10-23-2018 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Got Stripers (Post 1153732)
Well if your 9 year old girl is going into any public rest room without a parent in tow, then I’d question their right to even bitch.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Would you take a 9 year old little girl into a public restroom?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT 10-23-2018 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Got Stripers (Post 1153732)
Well if your 9 year old girl is going into any public rest room without a parent in tow, then I’d question their right to even bitch.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

when my wife has
my 3 boys and they need to go, after the age of 7 or 8, they went into their bathroom and my wife waited. she doesn’t go in there with them.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Pete F. 10-23-2018 07:35 PM

To be quite honest, women have bigger concerns about straight men almost any place, then the relatively few transgender individuals in a bathroom.
In Vermont all single user restrooms are supposed to be gender neutral.
Just don’t push the button labeled ATR if you’re a male.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Got Stripers 10-23-2018 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishbones (Post 1153750)
Would you take a 9 year old little girl into a public restroom?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Had three boys and I never allowed them into a public rest room at that age without me.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT 10-23-2018 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Got Stripers (Post 1153768)
Had three boys and I never allowed them into a public rest room at that age without me.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

when your boys were 9, they were never with their mom and had to use a public restroom? not ever? my wife takes
my three boys all kinds of places when i’m at work, and she no longer takes them into the ladies room with her, that stopped at about age 4-5. the reason why she stopped taking them
into the ladies room, is that to many people, it’s normal to share a restroom with people who share your genetalia, especially if you’re a female.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw 10-23-2018 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete F. (Post 1153759)

In Vermont all single user restrooms are supposed to be gender neutral.

Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

??

fishbones 10-24-2018 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Got Stripers (Post 1153768)
Had three boys and I never allowed them into a public rest room at that age without me.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

That doesn’t answer my question.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT 10-24-2018 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishbones (Post 1153750)
Would you take a 9 year old little girl into a public restroom?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I have baby-sat my nieces a zillion times, and I can't tell you how many times, when they were around 9 years old, I walked them to the entrance of a public women's room and waited. It never occurred to me that I'm narrow-minded for not being comfortable with a grown man walking in there with my nieces. It never occurred to be that if Willie Horton said "I'm a woman", that courtesy suggests that I hold the door open for him/her so he could follow my nieces in there.

In a perfect world, all public restrooms would be single toilet and gender neutral. But they weren't built that way originally (because the people who built them never fathomed we'd go this far over the edge), and we can't retroactively modify all of them to make it so.

So someone is going to have to sacrifice personal comfort for the comfort of others. I don't especially like the idea of asking little girls to make the sacrifice so that adult males can go into the ladies room. I don't want to see those people harassed in the mens room either, but I'm of the opinion that adults make sacrifices for children, not the other way around.

Pete F. 10-24-2018 11:15 AM

If you look at some of the designs for new gender neutral bathrooms it will make more sense.
Instead of having a room with sinks and somewhat of an enclosure around toilet/urinals, they have a common washing room and private toilet rooms with no gaps to look thru (either way).
Pretty scary apparently

Jim in CT 10-24-2018 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete F. (Post 1153795)
If you look at some of the designs for new gender neutral bathrooms it will make more sense.
Instead of having a room with sinks and somewhat of an enclosure around toilet/urinals, they have a common washing room and private toilet rooms with no gaps to look thru (either way).
Pretty scary apparently

You're missing the point. Lots of women don't want to be in the room with a man, doesn't matter if the toilet stalls go to the ground. I can't say I'd be comfortable with a woman sharing a rest room with me, but at least I know I don't need to fear of getting attacked. Women don't have that luxury.

If you had the ability to put yourself in someone else's shoes for just a moment, you'd see it. But liberals struggle to accept that some people disagree with them, and some who disagree, are actually normal, rational, nice people. We aren't all sub-human. But in this case, you are mocking the notion that any woman could ever have a legitimate reason to not want to share a restroom with a man. Nit everyone is exactly like you, not everyone feels exactly the same way. Solipsism (the belief that everyone is just like me), is rabid among liberals.

fishbones 10-24-2018 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT (Post 1153794)
I have baby-sat my nieces a zillion times, and I can't tell you how many times, when they were around 9 years old, I walked them to the entrance of a public women's room and waited. It never occurred to me that I'm narrow-minded for not being comfortable with a grown man walking in there with my nieces. It never occurred to be that if Willie Horton said "I'm a woman", that courtesy suggests that I hold the door open for him/her so he could follow my nieces in there.

In a perfect world, all public restrooms would be single toilet and gender neutral. But they weren't built that way originally (because the people who built them never fathomed we'd go this far over the edge), and we can't retroactively modify all of them to make it so.

So someone is going to have to sacrifice personal comfort for the comfort of others. I don't especially like the idea of asking little girls to make the sacrifice so that adult males can go into the ladies room. I don't want to see those people harassed in the mens room either, but I'm of the opinion that adults make sacrifices for children, not the other way around.

My thoughts exactly.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Pete F. 10-24-2018 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT (Post 1153799)
You're missing the point. Lots of women don't want to be in the room with a man, doesn't matter if the toilet stalls go to the ground. I can't say I'd be comfortable with a woman sharing a rest room with me, but at least I know I don't need to fear of getting attacked. Women don't have that luxury.

If you had the ability to put yourself in someone else's shoes for just a moment, you'd see it. But liberals struggle to accept that some people disagree with them, and some who disagree, are actually normal, rational, nice people. We aren't all sub-human. But in this case, you are mocking the notion that any woman could ever have a legitimate reason to not want to share a restroom with a man. Nit everyone is exactly like you, not everyone feels exactly the same way. Solipsism (the belief that everyone is just like me), is rabid among liberals.

It’s a bunch of single stall baths off a hallway with a common sink area
They have locked doors
If each one had a sink inside so it met your idea of a bathroom it would it be acceptable wouldn’t it
Open up a little bit, you’re getting a bit rabid

I suppose the touchless restrooms with no door bothers you also
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

spence 10-24-2018 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT (Post 1153799)
You're missing the point. Lots of women don't want to be in the room with a man, doesn't matter if the toilet stalls go to the ground. I can't say I'd be comfortable with a woman sharing a rest room with me, but at least I know I don't need to fear of getting attacked. Women don't have that luxury.

Have you ever heard of a transgender woman attacking another woman?

Jim in CT 10-24-2018 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 1153806)
Have you ever heard of a transgender woman attacking another woman?

i’ve heard of men claiming to identify as a woman, attack and harass women in the ladies room. if you can’t foresee that this could happen, you are the most naive person who ever lived.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Pete F. 10-24-2018 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT (Post 1153807)
i’ve heard of men claiming to identify as a woman, attack and harass women in the ladies room. if you can’t foresee that this could happen, you are the most naive person who ever lived.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I’ve heard of straight men going into women’s restrooms and attacking them
I’d bet it’s far more common than cross dressing rapists
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

scottw 10-24-2018 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 1153806)
Have you ever heard of a transgender woman attacking another woman?

is a "transgender woman" a guy that thinks he's a girl or a girl that thinks she's a guy?...I get these confused...or does it just work either way?

Pete F. 10-24-2018 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottw (Post 1153809)
is a "transgender woman" a guy that thinks he's a girl or a girl that thinks she's a guy?...I get these confused...or does it just work either way?

Confusion is typical for you, isn’t it?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

spence 10-24-2018 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT (Post 1153807)
i’ve heard of men claiming to identify as a woman, attack and harass women in the ladies room. if you can’t foresee that this could happen, you are the most naive person who ever lived.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Never heard of it happening. Rarely a man goes into the woman's bathroom but there's nothing stopping them from doing this already.

The Dad Fisherman 10-24-2018 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 1153806)
Have you ever heard of a transgender woman attacking another woman?

Its not about being attacked, its about the fact that it just makes some women feel uncomfortable. And the fact that they aren't comfortable with it is being completely ignored because they are worried about the comfort of a smaller group of people.

Basically the fact that a Trans-gendered woman not feeling comfortable using a restroom with Cis-gendered Males is more important than Cis-gendered women not feeling comfortable using a restroom with a Trans-gendered woman.

Some women don't like male doctors, they just don't feel comfortable with them.

scottw 10-24-2018 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete F. (Post 1153810)
Confusion is typical for you, isn’t it?
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I'm usually confused and amused by the nonsense you post..care to provide an answer?

scottw 10-24-2018 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman (Post 1153812)

Some women don't like male doctors, they just don't feel comfortable with them.

what is wrong with these women???

scottw 10-24-2018 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 1153811)
Never heard of it happening. Rarely a man goes into the woman's bathroom

so you are what?...studying this?

Pete F. 10-24-2018 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottw (Post 1153813)
I'm usually confused and amused by the nonsense you post..care to provide an answer?

Look for yourself if you’re that interested
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Jim in CT 10-24-2018 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete F. (Post 1153808)
I’ve heard of straight men going into women’s restrooms and attacking them
I’d bet it’s far more common than cross dressing rapists
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

That's what I mean, straight men. And you would make it much easier for them to get access to ladies rooms, all they need to do is say "I identify as a woman", and you'd hold the door for them to stroll right in. It's the heterosexual predators that women need to worry about. It never occurs to you that one of them would lie about identifying as a woman, just to get access to the ladies room? Seriously?

Jim in CT 10-24-2018 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman (Post 1153812)
Its not about being attacked, its about the fact that it just makes some women feel uncomfortable. And the fact that they aren't comfortable with it is being completely ignored because they are worried about the comfort of a smaller group of people.

Basically the fact that a Trans-gendered woman not feeling comfortable using a restroom with Cis-gendered Males is more important than Cis-gendered women not feeling comfortable using a restroom with a Trans-gendered woman.

Some women don't like male doctors, they just don't feel comfortable with them.

"And the fact that they aren't comfortable with it is being completely ignored because they are worried about the comfort of a smaller group of people."

A small group, anointed by liberal with victim status. And I don't deny these people have a really tough time fitting in.

"Basically the fact that a Trans-gendered woman not feeling comfortable using a restroom with Cis-gendered Males is more important than Cis-gendered women not feeling comfortable using a restroom with a Trans-gendered woman."

Blech.

Jim in CT 10-24-2018 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman (Post 1153812)
.

Some women don't like male doctors, they just don't feel comfortable with them.

Exactly. Exactly, exactly.

The Dad Fisherman 10-24-2018 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT (Post 1153817)
It never occurs to you that one of them would lie about identifying as a woman, just to get access to the ladies room? Seriously?

I've decided to become Gender-Fluid, I figure I can claim I'm female when it's convenient so I can get into all the different Ladies Nights and get $3 draughts. :hee:

Pete F. 10-24-2018 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in CT (Post 1153817)
That's what I mean, straight men. And you would make it much easier for them to get access to ladies rooms, all they need to do is say "I identify as a woman", and you'd hold the door for them to stroll right in. It's the heterosexual predators that women need to worry about. It never occurs to you that one of them would lie about identifying as a woman, just to get access to the ladies room? Seriously?

Ever seen a drag queen?
You’d hold the door and never know
Probably stare at their ass also
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device


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