Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating - Shoud illegal immigrants be eligible for Social Security benefits?

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Ok, after a good nights sleep I came to the realization you're just a flaming hypocrite and just don't know it :)

The illegal immigration from Mexico doesn't come from all over Mexico, it's really more from specific areas that are really economically depressed. The people of Mexico tend to be more socialist than in the USA ...where we put the emphasis on personal responsibility (i.e. pull yourself up by your own bootstraps).

Those crossing the border, and most other Mexicans see the illegal immigrants as victims of a system that's not protecting them by providing economic security.

Your complaint seems to either be directed as those doing what they have to to make a living and provide for their families, or a government who isn't enforcing the law.

Regardless, you're applying the same victim mentality on your own people that you can't protect.

You sound very much like the Mexican's I've spoken with about the subject.

Think about it.

-spence

the best way to curb illegal immigration is to build a thriving middle class in the countries of origin. like mexico. not necessarily in our hands, and it will take time.

in the meantime, with the housing slump we are in right now, wouldn't be surprised if a lot of guys are going back home ... because of layoffs. there are only so many guys who can mow lawns and prune trees, etc.

don't forget that illegals have to buy stuff. they pay sales/consumption tax like the rest of us do. not sure that is embedded in a lot of cost-benefit assumptions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 489066)

Your complaint seems to either be directed as those doing what they have to to make a living and provide for their families, or a government who isn't enforcing the law.

-spence

My complaint is directed at those who choose to break laws to make a living and the government that chooses not to enforce those laws, yep you got that right. In the world I come from making a living and providing for your family is not an excuse to break the law. The fact that they come from a more socialist society does not nullify the laws of our country.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stripersnipr (Post 489139)

So you have a Mexican government not providing for some of it's people, and US corporations who are breaking the law by employing (hence attracting) these people.

And your anger is directed toward those trying to make a living?

Sounds like it's misplaced.

Oh, wait...I forgot.

This is the largest economic threat to our country! :rotflmao:

-spence

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence (Post 489144)

And your anger is directed toward those trying to make a living?

Sounds like it's misplaced.

Oh, wait...I forgot.

-spence

Oh yeah, I forgot you people aren't into blaming criminals. Why dont you just accept total responsibility, it'll make you feel all warm and fuzzy. :love:

Quote:

Originally Posted by stripersnipr (Post 489285)

Oh yeah, I forgot you people aren't into blaming criminals. Why dont you just accept total responsibility, it'll make you feel all warm and fuzzy. :love:

Not at all...

I'm simply doing a root cause analysis. You cite illegal immigration as, what was it?

Quote:

Originally Posted by stripersnipr (Post 488362)

As much as some people will fight and argue against the notion, illegal immigration is in my opinion, the single greatest economic threat this country faces.

When illegal immigration is not the real problem. The issue has to do with the Mexican government's inability to provide for its people and our consumer driven economy looking for the best bang for the buck.

This has more to do with physics than politics, it's a matter of ENTROPY :happy:

-spence

An observation-
Stripersniper proposed that illegal imigration is the greatest threat to our economy.

Spence said it wasnt.

Now stripersniper is accusing spence of SUPPORTING illegal imigration.

I doubt spence supports it.

carry on

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bassturbed (Post 488971)

*sigh*

i don't know about you guys, but most of the illegal aliens i see around me work their gazoongas off to send money back to their families. most of these are mexicans, etc.

they take jobs nobody wants. they do unsafe and dirty work nobody does. compared to the rest of us they are willing to work for peanuts. they do it without benefits (well, except in cali). they crib in groups and eat instant noodles 24/7 to save money. their work ethic put some of us to shame.

i can't help but have a sincere admiration for these people living on hardscrabble, regardless of how they got here.

did i mention many are serving in our armed forces, fighting and dying for the rest of us? and they're not citizens.

your perspective might depend on where you live. people who live in Cali and the southern border states (Texas for example) might be up their eyeballs in illegal-related crime. here on the east coast, i don't see it that much. maybe i am out of touch.

the reality is that they are here and more than a few of us find that for the most part they are wanted/needed.

we really should have some kind of guest worker program, to legitimize their presence here (take a headcount and collect tax revenue!).

i'm not saying we have to offer citizenship or even certain benefits (is it fair for them to take benefits once they start paying taxes?), but there ought to be a way to track 'em - allow the law-abiding productive ones to come and go and keep the bad apples out.

i feel bad for immigrants in a post-9/11 world. it really sucks for them now. i have a lot of co-workers here who are here on a work-visa. if they get laid off by their employer, they have no choice but to hunt for another sponsor (not easy!) or be deported. i don't know if i could live with that kind of nerve-wracking uncertainty.

Well said Ben

Quote:

Originally Posted by stripersnipr (Post 486995)

Coming from the party that worships the parlayer of this truth: "I did not have sexual relations with that woman"......your opinion on truth is moot.

:beat:

When near to totally wrong point out something a Democrat did wrong :fishslap:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nebe (Post 489306)

Now stripersniper is accusing spence of SUPPORTING illegal imigration.

I doubt spence supports it.

carry on

Nope, I dont think he does. We just disagree on the severity of the problem.