So I'll ask again....Why are we here and what's the end game? Same questions I heard over and over about Bush. What are we trying to accomplish? The same thing Bush was accomplishing in Iraq? Nation building?

Yes, and I'll repeat my first post too:

"I would like to know that too. The silence is deafening."

I thought the war was the reason he won the election. I guess thereal agenda here was socialism. I'll have to hand it to him, he really knows how to play on a persons emotions. At least the people that make decisions based on them.

The reason he won the election is because people were scared of McCain continuing the Bush agenda, everything about Palin, and the Republicans buried themselves deep in the muck. Now the Democrats are doing the same thing.

Didn't you guys read the thread? I think this dude outlined the high-level strategy pretty well.

-spence

:rotf2: You also said he was following along with the Bush plan. Is it Bush's high-level strategy?

????

Some overlap, but Obama certainly wants to shift focus from Iraq and more importantly treat Afghanistan and Pakistan as a joint problem. This is different from Bush who simply wanted NATO to carry the water so he could focus on Iraq.

-spence

Are you saying that Bush was forever going to focus on Iraq and that he was never going to turn defence over to the Iraqi military, and that he would not return his focus to Afghanistan?

He said on Letterman last night that he won't commit anymore troops until he comes up with a plan. If I'm not mistaken, I thought he had a plan and already had more troops over there. WTF

When you head to the tuna grounds, and there isn't a sniff of life for miles, do you continue on with your plan because you "had a plan" already?

Situations change, and as such, so does the response. I'm sure the Generals of WWII had plans that needed re-adjusting after they got in the rough of it.

Sounds like the same thing you would say about Bush:rotf2::wall:

The Generals have recommended a change and a plan. It's been sitting on his desk. While real men are losing there lives. He's too busy hitting the road selling Shamwow Health Care. Where is that outrage from the left???????

Johnny, he's right.

I don't think this is accurate. To my knowledge there's been no formal proposal made to the President, rather an unclassified status report which says we need more troops was publish that caught the media's attention.

This doesn't mean the plan is sitting on Obama's desk and American's are dying because of it.

-spence

Remember the last time you called me out for not telling the truth:uhuh:

Yes, and you were wrong then as well.

-spence

??? I was? Hmmm. I don't think so.

Bloodiest year already for our troops in 8 years. What's the change?... not for better thats for sure.

I think you just crossed the line.

-spence

A shift in focus from Bush's war in Iraq, where we never should have been to Afghanistan, where the real problem has always existed.

In one post, you complain that Obama doesn't heed the advice of the Generals in Afghanistan (the increase of troops, temporary outposts, moving into rural areas and establishing a longer-term presence all contradict your comment though), then, you complain that nothing has changed.

We all understand that you will seize even the slightest opportunity to make vague criticisms about any topic referring to Obama - you'd probably even criticize the way he takes a sh!t - but at least be consistent.

The fact is we are now engaged further in Afganastan with no clear objective from our leader. I saw him stumble and bumble through this same question at the G20. It's a shame. I'm disappointed with the left. They assured us Obama had all the answers. At least his knew direction of dialog would make everyone love us again.
Here's a fact, in Iraq, Afganastan, Iran, North Korea and even here on our own soil we are less safe today then 1yr. ago. It's amature hour at the Whitehouse.

If it's a "fact" then you should have no problem producing some statistics to back up your claim.

Have at it.

-spence

Regardless of our differences, the fact is that more of our armed services are dying in Afghanistan now, then anywhere else during this action.
iCasualties | Operation Enduring Freedom | Afghanistan

The Afghanistan people have been at war for centuries. How can we change the fundamental way of life. When the Taliban pay men to fight, kill those who are found or suspected to be against them, how, can anyone from outside change the way of life.

To many American men are dying for a war we will never win.

"Obama's War."

Afghanistan is America's War.

Iraq (where more troops have died and has cost twice as much as Afghanistan) is Bush's War.

As a fact, I am anxious to see evidence that backs it up.

I agree, they are a tribal people and not prone to want to answer to a National government let alone a Western style government.
There has to be a desire on their part to want it and defend it. That doesn't seem to be the case.
Sending more troops will not change that, no way, no how.

Meantime they are waiting for the post election results with a NATO mandate to support the legitimate government of Afghanistan.
So if they are illegitimate what does that mean for the NATO mission??? Politicians don't seem to want to speculate on that.

What did you stop reading the news? Open your eyes. You and Spence are friggen joking right?

For the last week? Yes.

Even still, aside from the terrorists that have been arrested over the last week, there have been no events to articulate any change in how safe we are compared to a year ago.

I was no more nervous flying home from California on Thursday with the substantially increased airport security (due to the elevated number of FBI advisories) than I was last year.

Go through TSA in Dulles, I feel like I am in a third world country.

Please be more specific.

-spence

Even Muammar has grown a set of what I would refer to as "Obama balls". Reality is, the animals that want to hurt us and kill your kids, won one for their team when you guys put Obama in office.

plenty of time for Letterman...but...


By Amanda Carpenter on Sept. 28, 2009

The military general credited for capturing Saddam Hussein and killing the leader of al-Qaeda in Iraq says he has only spoken to President Obama once since taking command of Afghanistan.

“I’ve talked to the president, since I’ve been here, once on a VTC [video teleconferece],” General Stanley McChrystal told CBS reporter David Martin in a television interview that aired Sunday.

“You’ve talked to him once in 70 days?” Mr. Martin followed up.

“That is correct,” the general replied.

This revelation comes amid the explosive publication of an classified report written by the general that said the war in Afghanistan “will likely result in failure” of more troops are not added next year. Yet, the debate over health care reform continues to dominate Washington’s political discussions.

they'll probably try to destroy him now like General "Betray-Us" right?

Nice, so the free and fair democratic process is a win for terrorists?

How patriotic of you.

Acording to Obama's National Security Advisor - a retired US Marine General no less - we're actually killing more terrorists these days.

-spence

The Israelis all but said they we're going to destroy Iran's capacity to produce nukes last week in front of the U.N. General Assembly.
The Israelis don't bluff - they are not going to sit around and wait to be rubbed off the map.

I think striking Iran would be a lot harder than Iraq or Syria. Iran actually has the ability to retaliate via Hezbollah.

That's not to say they wouldn't do it if they really felt threatened. Israel does have a reputation to maintain.

-spence

I'm surprised they've had as much restraint as they have shown.
I would have thought they would have done it a year ago before the US elections, not knowing how a new US administration would react.

US and World opinion or not, I have a feeling they are very close to the end of their restraint.

Just went through SFO in California on Thursday. Multiple checkpoints and random searches of people waiting at their gate - at least 1/3 people were having their bags checked after going through the scanners and seemed like at least 50% of people were being patted down. Security was pretty tight.

Dulles has everyone domestic and international go through the same security checkpoints, so many many languages being spoken.
Also alot of the people working TSA there are immigrants, women with face shrouds, men with turbans. I feel really weird going through security there.

It's been a while since I've been through. If I'm going to DC, the Acella trains are for me. When I have connections, Dulles is a last resort. That airport is a mess.