it’s not all equal, but even non-trump corruption is worth looking at, at least to most people.

WDMSO, they were chanting “impeach the morherf*cker” from day one. i’m not saying he’s innocent, but i’m saying they are never going to stop digging, whether there’s reasonable cause or not.
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We no longer have co-equal branches of government? Corruption in opposition to POTUS is less important than corruption of POTUS? Corruption is not important if it is "not as"?

Are you the judge of what is not as important?

Corruption in our political leaders, whether they are Presidents, Senators, Vice Presidents, judges, bureaucrats, is important to root out and eliminate. President is a temporary office. Career politicians and bureaucrats and judges are here far longer and have a far greater cumulative effect in terms of corruption or otherwise.

Plenty of it, and it is not hard to find.

All you have to do is look at what Trump whines/projects about and there it is in his administration.

Libertarians, constitutional conservatives, and classical liberals believe in protecting whistleblowers to expose government corruption. Trump Republicans believe in exposing whistleblowers to protect government corruption.

right. potential corruption behind efforts to un-do a fair presidential election, nothing to see there.
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As I said, "Ironic like the only corruption your concerned with is Trump."

Impeachment is not undoing an election.

What would the result be if the election was "undone"?

What will the result be when Trump is impeached and tried and convicted in the Senate?

"Impeachment is not undoing an election"

It might be, when the losing side has decided on impeachment before the inauguration. It might be, if (big "if") they used the DOJ to improperly violate the rights of a US citizen, for the purposes of hurting the Trump campaign. If Durham and the IG conclude there was noting fishy there, I'm fine with that and can let it go.

"What would the result be if the election was "undone"?"
That the man they hate with irrational intensity (a subject with which we all believe you are familiar), won't be POTUS anymore. But we elected him.

"What will the result be when Trump is impeached and tried and convicted in the Senate?"

Based on what we know at this time? How much would you like to bet that the senate does not convict, not unless another bombshell is revealed? No sane person thinks that will happen.

While I am glad to see that you admit that the memo of the phone call was a bombshell, why would you think that no sane person thinks that another bombshell could not be lurking?

Impeachment is not the undoing of an election.
It is the remedy provided in the Constitution for an unfit President.
In every prior impeachment the Presidents followers cried the same tale as the Trumplicans are now.

Impeachment came about as a tool for a problem other than unpopularity: unfitness. “If he be not impeachable whilst in office,” William Davie told his fellow delegates on July 20 about the proposed president, “he will spare no efforts or means whatever to get himself re-elected.” In Trump's case this has been very evident. Delegates’ arguments throughout the convention against an impeachment process, including the claim that a reelection of a president would be “sufficient proof of his innocence,” were rejected. Benjamin Franklin even argued that assassination had often been the only recourse for unfit leaders when policies lacked an impeachment process. “It [would] be the best way therefore,” he said, “to provide in the Constitution for the regular punishment of the Executive when his misconduct should deserve it, and for his honorable acquittal when he should be unjustly accused.” Elbridge Gerry, a future vice president, added his view of impeachments: “A good magistrate will not fear them. A bad one ought to be kept in fear of them.” Gerry, along with Davie, Franklin and the others, neither suggested nor obtained any restriction on when in his term the president would be subject to impeachment.

the issue is, your side made no secret that they planned to pursue impeachment, on the first day the guy took office. When you commit to impeachment before he’s done anything and never stop digging, you open your findings to skepticism. that’s why it’s not a good idea to go all in on
impeachment from day one. at a minimum, it creates the appearance of bias, and that's putting it very, very mildly.

he’s such an idiot i wouldn’t bet against him giving them a valid reason to cast him aside. but i don’t see it yet, all
i see are things very similar to things done recently by democrats who were never questioned. another way to give off an appearance of bias, is to have obvious, glaring double standards.
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Impeachment is for Presidents who are "such an idiot", incompetent or otherwise unfit.

All you can muster in rebuttal to an on-point original post is an unattributed stolen pile of crap from a site where leftists go for their periodic programming -- https://www.americanprogress.org/iss...t-kleptocrats/

All that proves is that you are owed no respect, you have neither the intelligence or the integrity to discuss anything besides cheating in fishing tournaments.

SMH.

"All of these whistleblowers have axes to grind. [We need] to f--k these guys, . . . we need to get whatever dirt we can on these guys and take them down" -- Scott Thomasson

It's as if you demand we not remember that before there was a fake whistleblower named Eric Ciaramella, there was a real whistleblower by the name of John Dodson.

please describe the gop efforts to impeach obama, compared to the energy devoted to impeaching trump? you’re going to suggest it was comparable? trying to talk to you like an adult, you don’t make it easy.
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Not nearly as much ammunition in Obama’s administration
You spent years screaming like a girl about Obama, didn’t you?
Trump spent years pushing the birther theory
Google is easy
But you deflect so to get back on task
The U.S. ambassador Gordon Sondland, a key witness in the impeachment inquiry, acknowledged delivering a quid pro quo message to Ukraine in a major revision to his impeachment testimony.
Or have you already moved from no quid pro quo to everyone does that.

Putin’s very proud of your boy and his disinformation campaign.
They’re even going to resume joint cyber security cooperation according to TASS
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i hated obama. the remedy for that is winning the next election, not reversing the previous one.

you dodged, completely. you brought up efforts to impeach obama, i asked you to describe the lengths that republicans went to, to try and impeach him. yes they tried to beat him in 2012, there was no serious talk of impeaching him. even though he did ask russia to postpone missile talks until after he win re-election, because he’d have “more flexibility” to work with the russians the way he wanted, after he no longer needed to worry about re-election. but it’s ok when obama
asks a foreign power ( russia in this case), to do him a favor for the purposes of political gain for himself. impeachable when trump does it, swell when obama
does it.
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Impeachment doesn't "reverse" elections, it removes a incompetent, unethical or otherwise failed president from office.

Nowhere's in the Constitution is anything said about when it could occur.

You keep citing all the false equivalents you are fed by the Trumplicans, to justify Floridaman's actions.

Their wish and I assume yours, public hearings are coming.

It should be interesting to see the performances.

You should donate money to buy Gym Jordan a suitcoat, since he will be on stage.

impeachment/conviction had the effect of un-doing the will
if the people in a national election.

for the third and final time. you, not i, chose to bring republican efforts to impeach obama, into this. please tell us how serious and vast those were, or
kindly admit you made it up.

and you keep calling my equivalents false, but you can’t specify how its false. as if saying false is enough.
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BIOYA

Issa introduced new Whistleblower protection legislation in November 2011. Retaliating against whistleblowers is a crime.

Just what are Floridaman and his Trumplicans doing to this whistleblower?

Two wrongs don't make a right, or perhaps they do in Trumpworld.

Floridaman has no anticorruption agenda for anything other than his political opponents.

He also has no idea how to manage a bureaucracy and therefore can't persuade his administration to push things in the direction he wants them to go.
So he does what he always has, as he was taught by Roy Cohn. Then it was call Michael Cohen, now it's call Rudy Guiliani, and when that falls apart, send Barr and Pompeo to investigate. As they say in Queens: "Just tell em ya ain't getting nuttin unless ya get me da goods"

VEG

Now you can do a round of But Kavanaugh with a chorus of The Economy.

Feel free to use Google
As far as the false equivalency you consistently come up with, it’s asked and answered again and again
Scroll back
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in other words, you know there was no republican effort to impeach obama, but you can’t admit it.

as to clarifying the differences, the best you could come up with, is that trumps quid pro quo was in private, while biden’s was in public. That makes as much sense as saying Trump did it on a Monday, Biden on a Tuesday.

it was asked, it was not answered.
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in other words, you know there was no republican effort to impeach obama, but you can’t admit it.

as to clarifying the differences, the best you could come up with, is that trumps quid pro quo was in private, while biden’s was in public. That makes as much sense as saying Trump did it on a Monday, Biden on a Tuesday.

it was asked, it was not answered.
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Retaliation as defined by the whistleblower legislation is some kind of personnel punishment by the employer such as being transferred, denied a raise, have your hours reduced, be fired, blacklisted, demoted, transferred to a less desirable job, failing to rehire, denying benefits or any other act that would be seen as punishment.

Trumplicans have no ability to administer personnel punishment on the whistleblower. The Floridaman is not making a retaliatory personnel punishment.

That may so . But what has he done . These things aren't made up they actually happened. Hes done it to himself
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More conspiracy theories.

Next phase from Republicans it was quid pro quo. But not an impeachable offense.. as if theres an actual list
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Talking point it’s all the evil dems have thought about, undoing an election, couldn’t possibly have anything to do with the criminal impeachable behavior by our president. It’s just more of the same, here, on Fox aka Trump news and in any interviews of GOP senators. It’s like they all have a weekly briefing so the talking points are echoed by all. No point in debating at this point EVERY single supporter of Trump on this site is an echo chamber and they of course are entitled to their opinions, but everyone on the other side of the issues are pretty convinced of the wrong doing. I’ve chimed in less as I see this as just a merry go round making everyone dizzy, it’s just going round and round.
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quid pro quo, that’s not what biden did though. withholding aid until
ukraine did what he wanted. that’s not quit pro quo? have fun.

conspiracy theory? amazing you know that, yet neither Durham nor the IG have released a single detail yet. so how do you know it’s an unfounded, baseless theory?

answer- all you care about is politics. facts o key matter when they serve your agenda.
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So after today’s reveals and tonights results do the Republican Senators feel safe in Trumptown or are they starting to think they should get out before it really becomes a suicide pact.
Tomorrow Floridaman will start throwing more people under the bus.
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this is hilarious

Why do keep posting lies and revisionist history... on what biden did and why and who sanctioned it.( but a no appointed or elected lawyer doing Trumps bidding is ok with you. What an odd sense of right and wrong...is its all about reversing the election...or removing an unfit POTUS

So the attempt to impeach Clinton was which . Removing an unfit Potus or reversing an election

You speak about moving the goal post maybe you should ask trump supporters. To stop changing their stories [goalpost]
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Keep the echo chamber up, hey Trump predicted how you'd behave long before now.

What lie, specifically, am I telling, with the examples I cite? Please be specific. It's very easy to do lobe baseless insults. How about backing it up?

"but a no appointed or elected lawyer doing Trumps bidding is ok with you"

Ummm, it's pretty common for the executive branch to make policy decisions that are carried out be people not elected. Rahm Emmanuel never carried out orders for Obama when he was chief of staff? What are you even saying? That presidents can only delegate work to people who are elected?

"So the attempt to impeach Clinton was which '

He lied under oath, there is no question, we have DNA evidence. The bar association, probably the sleaziest group of pep[le you can ever find, decided he was too dirty to be a member, and he was disbarred.

Again, when they were saying "impeach the mother*cker" before his first day, a rational person would conclude they made their minds up first, then never stopped digging until they found something to hang their red hats on. That's not how it's supposed to work. STill doesn't mean their claims can't be valid, but at a minimum, standards have been changed, as democrats have done similar things and no one called them out on it, let alone suggested impeachment.

Dig, what are you smoking, nobody needed to dig; Trump’s corruption is always in plain sight.
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This afternoon Colludy is claiming he was working as Floridamans defense lawyer, a short while ago he was working at the behest of the State Department.
“The investigation I conducted concerning 2016 Ukrainian collusion and corruption, was done solely as a defense attorney to defend my client against false charges, that kept changing as one after another were disproven.”
So thanks for admitting it was all for 45's personal gain and had nothing to do with the best interests of the United States.
He’s being represented by Costello. Costello is the lawyer who emailed Michael Cohen saying, “Sleep well tonight, you have friends in high places.”
He’s f’d
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did someone else from the echo chamber say "this is hilarious"?

What is not so funny, is Moscow Mitch proclaiming if the trial gets to the senate, Trump will not be removed. So the judge is also the jury, no fair trail or look at the evidence. Between the public testimony and the Stone trial and Rudy’s trouble, Trump must not be getting any sleep.
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Trump has the local flakes acting like hamsters on a wheel. Great entertainment by the 3 stooges.
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I also found Meadows, Jordan and Nunes quite comical, Graham has had a few slapstick walkons too
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Rudy Haha

Time to get a new lawyer when he constantly gets you in trouble instead of getting you out of trouble.

No answer

A unfit to be Potus

B undo an election

Its not that hard
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1) The new defense of Trump from Trumplicans is a joke.

Their claim now is that, yes, there may have been a quid pro quo, but you can't show Trump himself was behind it.

But the already known facts show this is steaming nonsense.

2) Go step by step.

Trump himself personally ordered the military aid frozen.

White House officials were ordered not to share details about it with lawmakers.

3) Giuliani publicly confirmed the whole plot as early as May, and continued to do so for months.

Here's an important quote from Giuliani:

“I don’t do anything that involves my client without speaking with my client.”

4) Pence himself directly delivered the message to Zelensky about the withheld military aid.

He said Zelensky needed to do more about "corruption."

But prior texts show that Ukraine had already been told the statement had to target Crowdstrike/Biden.

5) After all this, Trump's spinners are actually trying to argue that Sondland freelanced the extortion piece of the plot on his own.