Should "wetsuiting" be its own category of fishing
 

I'm just wondering what others think about wetsuit fishing and whether it should be in its own category of fishing sort of like, Kayaking, surfcasting, boating, etc.

I wonder if when the term 'surfcasting" was developed years ago, those fishing in the surf thought that it would extend beyond those with 2 feet on the ground Fishing from shore (or rocks nearby).

I have nothing against wetsuiting at all. In fact, I'm seriously considering one for 2009. I'm just curious to hear what others think about a type of fishing that allows others to venture out quite a bit further from shore and to avoid many of the same obstacles that "surfcasters from shore" experience.

For example, if I took a kayak or small boat 25-50-75 yards from shore in order to fish a couple of big rocks or island that I could not otherwise get to in my waders, I'm not sure if that is truly surfcasting. Afterall, in this example, the "surf" in "surfcasting" would be missing.

What are your thoughts ?

I agree with you. Once we leave the surf were almost doing something that has never been done. And that is fishing from rocks a hundred feet out.

I put on a dry top and waders and I'm 60yds from shore on a bar in a back bay in chest deep water. Still surfcasting?
I'm 40 yds out on a rock, again dry top and waders, surfcasting?
I'm 40 yds out on the same rock in a wetsuit because it is more comfortable, surfcasting?

I don't use a wet suit when I fish, but do use waders and a dry top so I'm just posing questions.

If you don't have to swim to where you are going to fish, I think you can still call it surfcasting.

wetsuiting is a lot of fun but just be very careful..

back to your question i do think it is still surfcasting...

It's surfcasting with a "pair" depending how far you push the limits. I think you are still surfcasting until you utilize some sort of vessel.

Agreed.

How would you categorize "skishing" then?

Agreed.

I think people who surfcast in a wetsuit are typically arrogant, selfish and otherwise rude people.

That being said, can anyone suggest a decent wetsuit that won't break the bank?

-spence

just becuase you have on a wetsuit does not mean your swimming far out.Heck I know of spots like charles island in ct. and many other sand bars that people wade very far from shore in waders a wetsuit in on of those spots would be a better choice.

Too funny.

Good point about Skiishing ( or I guess those who wear wetsuits and need to swim to point B ).

In the Montauk Locals Tournament, wetsuits have been put into a separate category from waders because wetsuiters are seen as having an advantage.

...and that's the gist of this post. I'm just wondering if others see it that way

Emgred's answer hits it right on the head.

In your example, the boat/kayak would be considered transportation. Not much different than getting off a boat at Cuttyhunk or any other island not connected to the mainland or a spot that's unreachable by car or foot (getting around private property to a public spot). You would still end up surfcasting, right :kewl:?

A distinct sub-culture, and a unofficial cadre of leadership, has already formed around it.
I think there will be a split, but it will be as a result of the sport taking on its own identity, rather than as a result of the traditional surfcasting community rejecting the wetsuiters. In other words, I don't see a surfcasting "purist" movement arising.
It will happen organically. Somebody will write a skishing book, a skishing-specific website will form, skishing tournaments will arise, etc.
Its a very effective method of fishing and the people participating are usually very good fishermen and they definitely have balls.

I am pretty sure this is a 50 year old argument.
Using a wet or drysuit and standing on something is still surfcasting imho, though not in the eyes of some LI tourneys.
Now as to skishers having balls, maybe they just don't know what else swims out there?

If your standing on the ground its surfcasting.....if your skishing then it should have its own category.

Whats the difference between wading/swimming out to a rock in your bathingsuit/shorts or a wetsuit that it warrants its own category.....its more a question of access (and Comfort) than anything else.

by the Way.....Kayaks are Boats.....just like canoes, catamarans, and pontoon boats :hee:

Still surf fishing to me. You enter the water through the surf but you don't accept the limits of having to stand on land. I don't see a whole lot of difference between wading waist deep and being willing to actually swim while fishing. Swimming is just taking it a little further. Your not leveraging technology. Other than the boyancy of a wetsuit all you have to count on is your own physicality.

Again, it just amounts how much sack or stupidity you have depending on how you look at it.

As long as you only use plugs it is all OK. :uhuh:

skishing w/ trebles. :1poke:

Maybe Paul Melnyk will revive his site and organize some of his rants into a book after that :grins:.

Problem with that is some of these guys are swimming far out beyond the longest cast anyone can hope to make "from the surf". It's definitely an unfair advantage and that IMO is when it no longer can be classified as surf fishing.

Of course, the old heave and haul guys likely felt the same way about rods and reels. Curious thing is that with a wet suit, fins, and an eel you probably don't need a rod or a reel to fish effectively. I'll bet that's next.

I still consider standing on a rock to be surfcasting

Why is it unfair? Because you can't or are unwilling to do it? I won't push myself that far and maybe can't either but imo that doesn't make it unfair. I guess I just give the few who do it the credit I feel they deserve. They are taking a higher risk and if it does result in bigger fish then to me they earned it.

The category labeled orbituaries if caution is not exercised.
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wetsuiting to far out rocks that are unobtainable from shore is like kayaking out to small islands or areas that have zero public access to surf cast..

Its a loophole IMO..

where do you draw the line??

I know most of you do not follow sailing or the americas cup, but a few years ago, Dennis Connor showed up with a catamaran and blew away the other team... "Hey it was legal"

I give them lots of credit. They may be just a bit nuts :eek5: to be doing that, but I do give them credit .

I know you already prefaced that the use of a vessel makes it something other than surf fishing, but if one were to replace the wetsuit and fins with a kayak and paddle in the above quote, it would be interchangeable. The kayak would just be keeping you higher up in the water to facilitate casting. That's why I believe the buoyancy of the wetsuit and the fins are an extra technological edge. You use them to propel yourself out to the fish. We'll just have to agree to disagree :cheers2:.

I agree. :tooth:

There are surf fishermen who use wetsuits and are still surfishing ... there are skishers who are a little bit beyond surf fishing ...

... in fact I almost ran a guy over one pre-dawn morning in Montauk about 10-12 years ago, couldn't see the guy in the water ... it was crazy and I wouldn't say that guy was surf fishing, and I don't think he'd say it either ... but wouldn't fault him either ... I hope he caught fish that day and glad I was not a little closer to shore ... that fellow was not on a rock either ...

.... I do know of a few spots where I would have preferred to have a wetsuite on instead of waders, would have been safer ... and I was surfishing ...

... skishing is definitely a little bit beyond surf fishing in my eyes ... but those guys also surf fish too.

Really how ever one wants to classify it for themselves.

lots of good thoughts here as always,,,,,,,,,,,

IMHO, still surfcasting ~~~

BUT with not only bigger cohones, a
decided advantage of access to the "unreachable rocks",
and what i would classify as ULTRA surfcasting.

for me, it remains surfcasting until one introduces;
fiberglass, rubber, or aluminum and you drive/steer/navigate
yerself into position to fish,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

rock hopping, wave riding, island reaching ~~it's ALL the same~~
so long as it's still just you, our beloved prey, and the mighty Atlantic
out there matching wits wit each other. many say that it is INFINITELY safer, as well.

now, tourney fishing is sumthin' completely different!!
the wetsuiters/island reachers/skishers last year CRUSHED
the shore division in the Striper Cup, with us wader types stuck in the
high 40's, for most of them that was the cellar and they bailed fiddies
all season long,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,GREAT for them, MTK is right for categorizing this new breed of surfcrazies~~~

and one day i hope to join them for the ultimate in comfort, access, and adrenilyn!!!
:bl: :bl: :bl:

Time to break out the old innertube .They call them waves when upon the water,only after those waves HIT the beach is it called "surf".

the line is too blury to make it a separate category. too many "what ifs" can be applied. To me, swimming a hundred yards out to a rock = surfcasting, swimming 1/4 mile and bobbing in a rip = skishing.

the way i see it, fishing in a wetsuit doesn't give one an advantage that anyone cannot have if they want it. there is no real economic demand to it, like a boat for example, and no use of electronics, like a fishfinder. if you made fishing in a wetsuit a different category, then why not fishing with waders a separate category over fishing without them.

Pretty much my thoughts and just an extension of going from barefeet to hip boots to waders up to a wet suit. It is "apparel tools" to enhance your fishing from the ground/shore. When you start to use the wetsuit to emulate a boat, that's a different story, and IMO, the line when it extends beyond surfcasting.

For the tourneys at PISC

A Surfcast fish is one Hooked, Fought, and Landed while feet are on the ground.

A Boat fish is one Hooked, Fought, and Landed while feet are in the boat. (this includes kayaks)

in both cases it doesn't matter what you are wearing....

If you catch a fish skishing then its a nice fish and you are more than welcome to come to the banquet and watch the other guys pick up there award. :D

Granted I'm pretty sure we don't have any members that skish so its not really an issue.....if it ever becomes one then we will discuss what to do.

I could see this being an issue with the Striper Cup though.....because it doesn't fall in either the boat or shore category.

I hope it does not end up like the Sunni/Shiite schism - could make for a 1400 year flame war.

I have a real hang up with the Flaptail's and Ed B's of the world too. Standing where us shorter surfcasters can't. Walking by me in hip boots while I'm almost swimming in my waders. Maybe we should implement a .8 multiplier for you guys if you were to fish the Striper Cup.

And while we're at it, the heavy set crowd. I'm taking issue with you too. Long after my Korkers give out and I get blown off a rock you're still out there, firmly attached. The extra down pressure is far too great an advantage. There's no way we can consider you to be surfcasting, either.

And the DZ's. FU guys. :hihi: Standing ankle deep at the most and catching large anyways.

Seriously though, skishing is different and it's a rare sight to see someone even try it in RI or MA, I'm surprised it's even being debated here.

"Wetsuit fishing" is such a broad description that trying to define it is pointless. There's people who wear one simply because they got tired of holes in their waders. Some wear one for safety. Some to fish where they already fish in waders to be more comfortable. Some to go a lot further.

I would add that some of the guys who fished in wetsuits this year would have probably caught the same large fish had they not been in a wetsuit. They're just good fisherman.

DF,

I agreed with you fully last time we had this discussion and agree now.

Skishing is definitely not surf fishing to me. If you're hooking fish while floating or drifting in the water its more like a boat, IMO.

A wet suit is just another tool. Same as comparing bare feet fishing to using waders. You need to cast, hook,fight, and land from terra firma to be considered surf caught, regardless of what's on your feet.

I've seen guys paddle bait out with kayaks off Race Pt., then go back to shore and hook/land the fish and call it "surf" caught. Baloney. You need all the elements.

Wetsuiting is simply extending the surf boundary a bit, but to me it doesn't need its own category, IMO.

Lots of the guys I know who wetsuit are no better than average surfmen without the wetsuits, but the willingness to take risk/go the extra mile in order to succeed is what sets them apart. Its kind of like anything else in a risk/reward sense.

And as everyone will agree, B.F.D.C. :hidin: - :cputin::nailem:

Ya know, I have a couple of spots where a wetsuit would be advisable for comfort considerations given the fact that trying to get off or on at any point beyond half-tide will get ya more than moist - hey, JohnR - do ya remember that spot we fished during The Habs :hihi: And that was on a FAC night -

I guess from my perspective I've gotta say it's a good way to get yourself in trouble in some instances - ask rickhern about wetsuiting to the rocks on MV. One should never be where one does not belong, as Dylan would say.

I've thought about it and nixed it - for me it's just a way to encourage myself to stay in places when conditions are starting to get too dicey to hang around in waders and at that point it's time for a smart guy to get outta Dodge.

Old Uncle Zeke put it in perspective for me in his inimitable way - the first time he saw me putting my USCG rescue strobe on during a big swell he said "Nice - a body retrieval device"...:rotflmao:

Old Zeke is a man of few words. In other words, don't take comfort using equipment that will put ya in spot where you shouldn't be in the first place. That place is up to you to determine.

I guess it's a way of saying wet-suiting is better suited to bullet-proof sub-thirty-somethings than old pharts like me.

Not that there's anything wrong with that - I was young once myself and I've got the scars, busted out teeth and medical dossiers at several different specialists to prove it. :doh:

If given only 2 choices = surf or boat, then I'd have to say wetsuiting or skishing is surf fishing since you certainly are NOT standing on a boat.
who cares? why catagorize it, it's fishing

Because its winter.....:angel:

Eels versus plugs to follow.....Numbskull and I will be hosting the main event at some point..:rumble: