Muslim Man VS Gun Range
 

American Civil Liberties Union, which filed the suit claims discriminatory reasons for, "muslim free zone....how quickly some americans forget how the 9/11 terroist trained in our country to fly the 747's....california terroist trained with a friend at a range prior to their attack of fellow workers....should they or not allow muslims at gun rangers?



http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/mus...Kz&ocid=EIE9HP

My heart says, no you can't discriminate against Muslims in this situation. But my brain says, if you own a private company or a private club , You should be able to hire or exclude anybody. It's your choice .
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Exchange Muslim for Jew and go back to the late 1930's Germany. How'd that work out?
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I'm sorry, I missed the part of history when the Jews were attacking the Germans in a jihad .
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Nebe, unless you can show us evidence that the German Jews were flying jets into buildings in Berlin, that comparison is deeply, deeply flawed.

That said, i don't like it.

Ding ding ding!! We have a winner...

Ummmm, might want to revisit your history books there buck.

What are you saying? That the Jews represented a similar threat to Germans in 1935, as the Muslims represent to America today?

With the proper propaganda and lies that were spread by the nazi party, Jews were made out to be just as great a threat to German national security as Muslim extremists are today. Also a bombing by Helmut Hirsch was used as a 9/11 type event to further rally Germans to unite and protect the home land. (Heard that one before?)
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Hitler sure was able to convince a lot of Germans that they were.

Let's also remember the German embassy attack in Paris on November 7, 1938, a young Polish Jew, Herschel Grynszpan shot a few German officers in retribution to how his parents were being treated in Germany. Holy mackerel.... BENGHAZI!!!!!!!
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But the fact is, the Jews WEREN'T a serious threat to german national security in 1935. Today in America, the Muslim community (a small part of it) is absolutely a threat.

Are you kidding?

Nebe, are you suggetsing that the Jews started this fight with the Nazis? And that the Nazis acted in self defense?

No. I'm suggesting that the Germans used a series of events made by a small handful of Jews to completely alienate an entire religious group. Now all German Jews were a threat. Just as.... Wait for it...... Wait for it........ All Muslims are being seen by some as a threat.
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I edited my last post to be a little more clear. I await a rebuttal as to why I am wrong.
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So who's the " Hitler " now ?
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The religious right
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Are you equating todays terrorism with a "handful of events " ?
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Actually maybe it is the .oo1% of wealthy people in the country that is manipulating the religious right through the GOP to push an agenda of deregulation. Or something like that ;)
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That's off the charts insane !
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Nope.
All I'm saying is you should open your eyes
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In this case, I could fill the Pacific Ocean with reasons why you are wrong.

The Jews represented no large-scale threat to innocent Germans, at the time the Nazis began the roundups. Today, Muslims (a small group of Muslims) absolutely represent a serious threat to us. Please don't take my word for it, listen to what they are saying, watch what they are doing. No comparison whatsoever. Hitler was lying when he said "some Jews are a threat". I am not lying when I say "a small part of the Muslim community is a serious threat."

The American Christian right is Hitler, are we? Hmmm. How many innocent people have been murdered by the "religious right" in the last 20 years? Who is the Pope, as well as evangelical leaders, targeting for slaughter, exactly? Who have we declared jihad against?

"All Muslims are being seen by some as a threat."

Who are these "some" you are referring to? Who says that all Muslims are a threat? Someone with credibility, and a large following? Even Trump has said many times that most Muslims are swell, so I hope that's not who you are referring to. Same with Bush. I await your reply. Please tell us who says that all Muslims are a threat.

All I'm saying is, your new neighbor, the AK-47 toting Muslim that likes to go to the gun range every Saturday , would open your eyes .
And if you're saying it would not , then you're lying
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I'm pretty sure there are plenty of Muslims who own guns in this country who are peaceful. All? No. But most are. Keep drinking the cool aid
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In fact I was at addeville shooting sporting clays last year next to 2 saudi guys in their 20's. They were super cool guys.
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I have no doubt. One of my hunting buddies is a Muslim. I don't know if you saw my first response in this thread.
Nowadays it's just a matter of being careful .
Do you remember after 9/11 we were being asked to be on guard for Middle Eastern looking men driving yellow box trucks ? It wasn't being racist, it was being prudent .
I'm not really drinking the Kool-Aid, just being a realist .
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Just so this debate isn't one sided , do you think Muslims could be convinced by radical Islam that they should attack Christians ? I assume that you do
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Actually that was Oklahoma City.

I think it was the first attack by radical Islam on the trade center.

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you what's funny, we have these discussions but nobody every changes their mind about anything. This is true on facebook too. If anything it just strengthens each side's beliefs. Maybe that is why these discussions are worth it? Don't get me wrong I like to mix it up as much as the next guy, but with all the legit craziness going on on Facebook, I'm beginning to question if its even worth it!

i consider facebook a threat

I take Facebook as entertainment....anybody that takes it seriously is a few lures shy of a full tackle box
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Most deaths from murders are people of the same race or ethnic back ground

Black kill blacks Whites kill whites Hispanics kill Hispanics

and Musulims kill Muslims ( not a race )

occasionally these groups kill people outside their circle and the % is so tiny...

But the Fear that it is going to Happen YOU is Just unrealistic

But its reinforced By propaganda not facts . and the un informed run with it

“Since 9/11, foreign-inspired terrorism has claimed about two dozen lives in the United States. (Meanwhile, more than 100,000 have been killed in gun homicides and more than 400,000 in motor-vehicle accidents.) “

"“Since 9/11"

Convenient to start tracking this, the day after 09/11...I bet that if you excluded all the days when there were terrorist attacks, the number of people killed by terrorists would be pretty darn low.

"But the Fear that it is going to Happen YOU is Just unrealistic "

True, for now. And in 1943, the chances of an American civilian being killed by the Nazis or the Japanese was also pretty low. But we were at war then (as we are now), and we had to deal with it.

Also, I'm not worried about a low-level crook in my town getting a nuclear weapon. We need to prevent jihadists from getting one, because if they did, they would use it 10 seconds later.

Street crime happens. But street criminals haven't dcelared war on the law-abiding.

I don't think anyone who wants to be aggressive against jihadists, has ever hinted that we don't also need to be vigilant about everyday, garden-variety street crime. The problem is, liberals are as wrong on how to deal with domestic crime (assume it goes away with gun restrictions, blame white people, and throw money at the problem, and tell the criminals that it isn't their fault), as they are on how to deal with terrorists (pretend the problem doesn't exist).

Thanks for making my point unrealistic Fear ... no different then there coming to take our gun you guy's just re package the same BS and yet theses horrendous things you predict never materlize. . Yet you guys do what you do best disregarded the facts 100,000 gun deaths mutiple mass shootings yearly and barely a word ?. but let a Muslim do the shooting and people are instantly More horrified .. and any rational thinking goes out the window why is it America always needs an enemy real or imagined

Be cool. No need to waste your time and energy spreading the truth. Just relax and enjoy your life. America doesn't have any enemies. Except, as you point out, the enemy is us.

And that can be "interpreted" literally or nonoriginally. Or any way your discretion desires.

Jim these are not new problems terrorism ,Crime they have been around a very long time not just the last 8 year's...

But time and time again these things get packaged as if they showed up Since Obama? the right loves to blame progressives or liberals as if the Republicans have never held the Whitehouse or had any members in congress ...

Then every election cycle they regurgitate How weak we are How our military needs more how tough on crime they are ( currently we have the most combat experienced and ready Military in the world)

And the Democrats regurgitate there own BS as well how things in America are not fair .. Bla Bla Bla

The problem With America there Is no Middle no middle class ! no middle ground !
We have be come a country heading towards the class system ! you stay where you are born rich, middle class or poor ... The American Dream sadly is becoming more of a dream than an actual Concept for success ...

The American Dream is a national ethos of the United States, the set of ideals (Democracy, Rights, Liberty, Opportunity, and Equality) in which freedom includes the opportunity for prosperity and success, and an upward social mobility for the family and children, achieved through hard work in a society with few barriers. In the definition of the American Dream by James Truslow Adams in 1931, "life should be better and richer and fuller for everyone, with opportunity for each according to ability or achievement" regardless of social class or circumstances of birth.[1]

Isnt it the Democrats that never let a good crisis go to waste ? Just look at what happens in the media if a policeman shoots a black man .
When in reality your chances of getting shot by a policeman a much less than being shot by a terrorist . Especially if you're a law abiding citizen
I take it you're in the "global warming is the most important threat " camp .
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All politicians use this.. Let's look at the biggest crisis- 9-11. Afghanistan and then let's sneak in a war with Iraq.
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"Yet you guys do what you do best disregarded the facts 100,000 gun deaths mutiple mass shootings yearly and barely a word ?"

Barely a word? Says who? You think my side is hesitant to discuss this, or unwilling to offer solutions? Not true. It's just that liberals aren't interested in hearing our proposed solutions, because we talk about things like "responsibility", and the liberal platform makes it clear that they aren't big on the notion of individual responsibility and facing the consequences of one's actions (if you don't believe me, look up where both sides stand on abortion).