Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronko
This is all just a stage to prove that we are on the moral high ground. It is just a talking point that allows for politicians and pundits to pontificate. Do you really think for a second its going to stop? Every night as we sleep our special-ops and all our players in the shadow game around the globe are doing this. We are constantly snatching people and torturing them for information. State sanctioned... no. But, the people doing it can be linked to us and the information flows upward and ultimately into the hands of the president who has "condemned" it. We don't hear about 1/1000th of the credible threats against out country and our leaders.
Let me give you a hypo:
25 year old Algerian para-military a proficient sniper with a background in bomb making and chemical weapons trained in Iran. A known terrorist suspect. Our intel shows his cousin currently residing in Baltimore bought a 50 cal rifle w/ laser scope. He recently attempted to hack into the President's March 15th itinerary in Boulder. That same day from an internet cafe in Belgium he bought a plane ticket to Boulder for the 14th and sent 5 emails to accounts with IP addresses in the US that were subsequently cancelled, all of the emails were cryptic and in code with the signature line Allah Akbar.
So he walks out the door of his flat in Belgium heading to his favorite falafel stand and we snatch him. He gets taken to warehouse ala Jack Bauer and what do you think happens? Do you really care what happens, deep down? It is along the same lines as the "Dershowitz Hypothetical" mentioned above. I really would like people answering this to speak from the heart and not along party lines, would torturing these individuals really offend you. And yes I am acknowledging there is a margin of error in this line of work.
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It's pretty scary to know you think this way.
Moral high ground has allowed the United States to act with near impunity for the past century. People around the world look up to the USA because more than perhaps any other nation we respect the rule of law as applied to every man.
Or at least we thought we did.
Waterboarding is torture under the law and by the admission of our own VP we've done it. There can be no argument that we've not tortured.
The ticking time bomb scenario is full of holes, and most torture experts will tell you that it's not reliable enough to be of much use anyway. There are numerous insiders who have stated absolutely that the Administration's claims of gaining valuable intel from waterboarding are pure BS.
Perhaps one of the worst things the Bush Administration did to our country was claim the lesson of 9/11 gave justification to cast away our own adherance to the rule of laws we agreed to uphold.
Who we believe in America if we don't believe in ourselves?
-spence