Originally Posted by Pete F.
If Capitalism is perfect and Socialism is deeply flawed, and therefor all means of production, assets, etc were owned by people and not the government, what incentive would private prisons have to reduce recidivism or even release people?
A person on the street is worth nothing to them, but everyone incarcerated is valuable.
Capitalism is a system. No system is perfect. It is also amoral. No matter how close to perfection it may be, it can be used for immoral purposes, depending on your version of morality. A version of capitalism can be used by authoritarian states as well as free market societies. It can be used by criminals, cartels, religious collectives as well as free private citizens to gather wealth for whatever purpose they wish.
Ultimately, "all means of production, assets, etc" as you put it, are owned by people whether ostensibly by government ("The People") or by individuals or corporate structures. Generally the closer to being owned by an individual an asset is, the more it will be cared for and made to flourish and function properly. Ownership by "The People" is the most inefficient and difficult to properly maintain since it comprises the greatest degree of disagreement among the owners. Nonetheless, for purposes of government, ownership by "The People" of various things and processes is part of establishing forms of government.
When government outsources a function to the private sector, the owner(s) of the business have to handle the asset as well as if it were their own invented and established business if they wish to maintain the contract. Free market, competition, if there is such, would motivate the contractor to do the job well. If private prisons created worse outcomes than government ones, the government would be foolish to keep them. Private prison contactors would be capitalistically wise to handle the assets in such ways that they would keep and perhaps expand the business. Contrary to your notion that "A person on the street is worth nothing to them, but everyone incarcerated is valuable", the persons on the street, "The People," are paying them for their service, and so they are of primary value. And the value of those being incarcerated diminishes if they are handled in ways that encourage recidivism so that "The People" become dissatisfied with the product.
I know I just confused Jim, but that is an example of capitalism that is currently occurring and I think it should bother us.
We live in a socialist democracy/republic (Madison and Marshall argued about democracy/republic hundreds of years ago, nobody won)
We may well be drifting toward socialism but we are not there yet. You may be confusing "welfare state" with "socialism." And we are still not yet a pure democracy. We are still a republic with a quasi-democratic system of electing politicians. Our system is sliding toward authoritarianism more so than socialism because of the unconstitutionally contrived administrative bureaucracy. But that can eventually, as it grows, and in not a short time, transform into actual socialistic, then communistic government.
and here are some examples of what that has gained us:
Public Libraries
Public Schools
Roads
Municipal sewer and water systems
Armed forces
Police departments
Public hospitals
Veterans Administration
Social Security
Medicaid
Public transportation
Public anything
Pretty horrible scary stuff, isn't it?
We have been doing it in this country since 1802 when the Corp of Engineers was permanently established and started mapping, building lighthouses and roads.
Trying to scare people with trigger words is typical of the current Trumplican Party.
Actually, we've been doing just about all those things, in various forms, well before 1802. People do good stuff. Free people do really good stuff. It doesn't require the massive administrative state that we've been growing since the past 70 or 80 years to do those things. Instead of being done more efficiently, economically, and better, by free market, capitalistic, and diverse local governance, most of those things have become cumbersome debt ridden albatrosses concocted by an expanding centralized government around the neck of less free people.
And you're really good at spewing memes, trigger words, and dog whistles, yourself. You're almost as good at it as is the Democrat Party. Or should I say the ever becoming Socialist, Communist, Democrat Party.
I think there is far greater chance of this government becoming totalitarian than communist,
I know you haven't noticed, but our government has progressively been becoming more totalitarian for quite some time. Being associated with and helped by Communists as the Dems have been, more and less and now more, since the 1930's, certainly doesn't slow down that process.
Trump certainly has great appreciation for all the totalitarians he meets and believes them more than his fellow Americans.
Putin on interference, the Saudis on Kashoggi, Kim Jong Un on Warmbier.
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