For the seal lovers(sarcasm): No Recovery for Atlantic Cod Population - Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating

JohnR · 12-05-2008, 02:01 PM

Hat tip to the SNESA Email List:

http://sciencenow.sciencemag.org/cgi...ll/2008/1125/1

Quote:

No Recovery for Atlantic Cod Population

By Cassandra Brooks
ScienceNOW Daily News
25 November 2008
A new study predicts for the first time that a major population of Atlantic cod, near Newfoundland, Canada, will essentially go extinct within 20 years, despite best attempts to manage it. "This is the most shocking and disturbing news I've ever heard about a marine fish population," says fisheries biologist Jeffrey Hutchings of Dalhousie University in Halifax, Canada.

Atlantic cod is a symbol of boom-and-bust commercial fishing. After 50 years of heavy harvesting in the late 20th century, the Canadian cod fishery collapsed in the early 1990s. Total bans ensued, and fisheries managers expected to see a recovery. However, after 15 years of little to no fishing, local populations show no sign of rebounding. In fact, some will continue to spiral downward, according to projections reported in this month's issue of the Canadian Journal of Fisheries and Aquatic Sciences.

Biologists Douglas Swain and Ghislain Chouinard of Canada's Department of Fisheries and Oceans used well-established models of fishery stocks to predict the future of the fourth largest population of cod, in the southern Gulf of St. Lawrence, southwest of Newfoundland. The models took into account the population's productivity, based on the proportion of young fish that mature, the growth of adults, and natural mortality rates. The results were sobering: The southern Gulf cod stock will be extirpated (local extinction defined as less than 0.3% of the species' original biomass) within 20 years if limited fishing is allowed. Even if the fishery is completely closed, the stock will hit rock bottom in 38 years.

The main problem, according to Swain and Chouinard, is that adult cod have been dying at an unusually high rate in recent years. No one knows why, but Swain suspects the cause might be increased predation by seals. The problem may be more widespread: The neighboring Scotian Shelf cod population also took a nosedive in the 1990s based on data from a Canadian report published in 2003. Furthermore, while most other cod populations off Canada appear to be stable, the same could have been said about the southern Gulf population up until a few years ago, says Swain.

Although biologists have traditionally assumed that stocks will rebound if fishers simply stop fishing, Hutchings notes, the new study of cod is an "extremely compelling example of the fallacy of that assumption." As for extirpation of a cod population, Hutchings says he never considered it possible until this analysis. However, fisheries biologist Ralph Mayo of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration in Woods Hole, Massachusetts, says the outlook could be better for smaller U.S. cod stocks in the Gulf of Maine and on Georges Bank. "The Gulf of Maine population has even been increasing," he says. That, of course, is small consolation for Canada.

maddmatt · 12-08-2008, 10:47 AM

easy answer

kill gray seals

start on the cape and work north

bettcha the japanese will do it for free!!

stiff tip · 12-09-2008, 07:09 AM

that is not good

Raven · 12-09-2008, 08:02 AM

there's no such thing as skinny seals...
they are fishermen of extraordinary skill
and must be factored into equation much more
than they have been.... it seems to me

Raven · 12-09-2008, 10:51 AM

http://www.kcra.com/cnn-news/18231810/detail.html

striped bass with brain damage as minows

Nebe · 12-09-2008, 11:25 AM

seals?? DOGFISH....

Raven · 01-14-2009, 11:07 AM

Swimmer · 01-14-2009, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maddmatt

easy answer

kill gray seals

start on the cape and work north

bettcha the japanese will do it for free!!

Ditto on this. It would probably only take a couple of years for them to decimate the seal population.

MakoMike · 01-14-2009, 03:37 PM

Probably as much the fault of the dogfish as the seals, both need thinning.

Rob Rockcrawler · 01-14-2009, 04:28 PM

It makes me wonder what the ecosystem was like 400-500 years ago. Was there a ton of seals around? A ton of dogfish? A ton of great whites to thin the heards of seals? We know there was a ton of cod. Me thinks there was a ton of bait around. There is a combination of causes that are leading to the demise of our fisheries. Lets hope they can figure itout before its too late.

Raven · 01-14-2009, 04:41 PM

Mussel beds were so huge they could filter all the water in 3 days.

eel grass was also 100 times more prevalent than now.

OLD GOAT · 01-14-2009, 04:46 PM

TOLD YA SO

NIB · 01-14-2009, 06:38 PM

I got a call last night 2 seals where sitting on top of my herring pen.I heard they where eating flounder like NIB on a flapjack blitz earlier in the day..If it wasn't 19 degrees I would have went down there with a baseball bat.They are eating machines.And they are not welcome in NJ..They have no idea what they are up against here..
This ain't Massachusetts.The land of fruits an nuts east.

choggieman · 01-14-2009, 07:19 PM

I agree that the dogfish are as much at fault as the seals if not more. I'd love a good seal hunt...........and the doggies will get theirs eventually, even if it one by one

JohnnyD · 01-14-2009, 08:33 PM

I'd think an added pressure on cod created by the seals is the large abundance of cod with parasites in them. My understanding is the parasites are excreted by the seals and head downward. I don't have nearly the experience to state this first hand, but from those I've talked to, this seems to be a source of added stress on bottom fish.

gone fishin · 01-14-2009, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

I'd think an added pressure on cod created by the seals is the large abundance of cod with parasites in them. My understanding is the parasites are excreted by the seals and head downward. I don't have nearly the experience to state this first hand, but from those I've talked to, this seems to be a source of added stress on bottom fish.

I agree - there also seems to be a collapse of the flounder population in areas where the seals are moving in. I was surprised to see a growing population of seals well up the Mystic River, also the herd in the Merrimack River seems to be growing.
With todays economy the old bounty would thin the population real quick.

5/0 · 01-14-2009, 10:04 PM

They taste like chicken so what do you say.....I'll have a party burn many X-Mass trees drink beer and we'll deep fry-em

Problem solved!

BTW Raven nice Photochop LMAO!!!!!

Clogston29 · 01-15-2009, 07:14 AM

so we basically screw up the entire ocean ecosystem by overharvesting, and its the seals fault?

definately a sign of probems that haddock was half the price of cod when i bought some the other day.

big jay · 01-15-2009, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clogston29

so we basically screw up the entire ocean ecosystem by overharvesting, and its the seals fault?

definately a sign of probems that haddock was half the price of cod when i bought some the other day.

I think we screw up the ecosystem by not harvesting ANY of the natural predators.

We have let seal populations run rampant b/c they are cute and cuddly and now they are devastating the fisheries. Fisherman traditional hunted seals to keep the populations down and protect their fisheries -- it wasn't that long ago that towns on the cape paid bounties for seal noses (no need to bring the whole body in to get paid, just the nose for proof).

Eliminate the predator of any species, and that species will run rampant - in this case, we have eliminated man, and now the seal populations will grow unchecked.

Clogston29 · 01-15-2009, 11:01 AM

from what i understand, the seals are expanding their range southbound as fish species such as herring and mackeral are being wiped out / depleted in northern waters - leading to more seals here. basically, they're adapting to our impact on the ecosystem by expanding in search of food. its not their fault that they found very confortable living conditions here.

i'm not saying that seals don't need to be controlled now (although it will never happen) - just that its our fault that they are here and is such numbers. they were never meant to have a predator on any large scale. Sure sharks and man take a few in nature, but they are pretty close to the top of the food chain as adults.

big jay · 01-15-2009, 01:50 PM

That's a good point. My question is are they expanding their range in a search for food, or are they expanding their range due to population increase?

zimmy · 01-15-2009, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Rockcrawler

It makes me wonder what the ecosystem was like 400-500 years ago. Was there a ton of seals around? A ton of dogfish? A ton of great whites to thin the heards of seals? We know there was a ton of cod. Me thinks there was a ton of bait around. There is a combination of causes that are leading to the demise of our fisheries. Lets hope they can figure itout before its too late.

there were tons of everything... now there is barely anything in comparison

maddmatt · 01-16-2009, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karl F

it's FEDERAL LAW Nib... that's Hard Time, or Big Fine... if they catch ya, and they confiscate everything that's with you when they grab you.

or does Soprano law supercede the federalies...... in the Gawden State?

i'll go naked and beat them with a broken hockey stick! the feds can have all the backhair they want.

wait till these things show up in montauk, those guys don't play! there'll be seal bodies everywhere!

maddmatt · 01-16-2009, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clogston29

so we basically screw up the entire ocean ecosystem by overharvesting, and its the seals fault?

ummmmmm. yep

MakoMike · 01-16-2009, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maddmatt

i'll go naked and beat them with a broken hockey stick! the feds can have all the backhair they want.

wait till these things show up in montauk, those guys don't play! there'll be seal bodies everywhere!

They have been in Montauk for years already. They just don't stay around a long as they do in MA.

JohnnyD · 01-17-2009, 02:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MakoMike

They have been in Montauk for years already. They just don't stay around a long as they do in MA.

Don't stay around as long? Do they ever actually leave the Cape?

Stroth · 01-17-2009, 07:26 PM

We actually protect the seals because they are more like us than the fish. Mammalism. We personify them as somewhat human because they are kinda like us. They breathe air, and sort of have some humanistic behaviors, therefore we are much more likely to protect them, then say a whiting....

Why do people get so fired up about whales and manatees, but could give two cents regarding a herring or an anchovy? Same principal, the more something is like you, the more you want to protect it.

IMHO far more damage has been done by dragger type vessels destroying habitat over more than a hundred years than any type of seal. seals are where they are now and hunt where they hunt now because we destroyed their other habitats. we knew of the dangers of dragger type fishing almost since its inception and yet the rampant destruction went on. has more to do with us as a species allowing it to go on than it does for the seal.

you want cod to live forever, well maybe you shouldn't have pulled a dragger over their grounds for a hundred plus years!

blame the seals, blame global warming, on and on it goes, only thing we truly have to blame is us.....

Mr. Sandman · 01-23-2009, 09:18 AM

They stick around all summer here. If you look at them the wrong way...even buzz them with a plane you will be "attacked" by the wackos.

You will never get the environmental wackos to get on the culling the seal heard...never.

Our only hope would be that massive schools of Great Whites move in and wreck havoc with the swimming beaches to the point where a lot of people die. Once that happens (a few hundred are attacked on our beaches) then, maybe we can get community to re-open the seal season to thin them out.

likwid · 01-23-2009, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nebe

seals?? DOGFISH....

Neither.

Where the f()&k do you think Cod in supermarkets comes from? Your ass?

J-golden · 01-23-2009, 10:18 PM

As much as i hate seals, and man do i hate seals, i do not believe they are responsible for the cod issue. seals are an inshore species. if this was about stripers, yes that would be possible. will the seals wipe out inshore cod? sure. but cod are deep dwellers, and offshore they won't have nearly the pressure from seals.