CAPE WIND

[UserRemoved]

Approved.....

Feds OK building plan for Mass. ocean wind farm - Yahoo! News

[JohnnyD]

Misleading...

There are still a ton of state and local-level hoops to jump through, along with "environmental" groups that keep bringing up lawsuits. My company provided A/V equipment for a three-week hearing that was held with the state. I sat through a few days of hearings out of curiosity.

The main group that has been continuing the legal battle over Cape Wind is the Nantucket version of the Goldenrod Foundation - a bunch of rich people hiding behind and trying to leverage environmental advocacy to further their personal agenda.

Whether you agree with Cape Wind or not (personally, I'm still on the fence), it *is* going to happen. Approval of the project will bring a lot of jobs to Massachusetts and a few foreign manufacturing companies tied in with the project are just waiting for the final sign-off before building plants in Mass. The project has the support of most government agencies - state and federal - and with Obama in the Office, has a powerful advocate in Washington.

With the accelerated increase in the price of Oil and every other source of energy, Cape Wind will gain more and more support from the general public.

[vineyardblues]

After what happened over seas in Japan, I was watching a news broadcast and they said that wind farms are a joke and we need other options to create energy and wind farming is NOT the way

I hope they don't dig a bunch of holes and then find out they are wrong

[UserRemoved]

What does wind farms have to do with Nuclear Peter? It's safer? If we had an earthquake you wouldn't be glowing right now you'd just be picking up lots of scrap? It's free energy without alot of hazmat?

I'm not for it or against it just curious why you'd say that.

Originally Posted by vineyardblues

After what happened over seas in Japan, I was watching a news broadcast and they said that wind farms are a joke and we need other options to create energy and wind farming is NOT the way

I hope they don't dig a bunch of holes and then find out they are wrong

[The Dad Fisherman]

Think of all that added structure to fish

[JackK]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

Think of all that added structure to fish

That is, if you're allowed close to it...

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by JackK

That is, if you're allowed close to it...

You will be.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by Saltys

It's free energy without alot of hazmat?

The truth to the above misconception is actually one of the valid reasons *against* Cape Wind. The energy is anything but free. Turbines need to be greased and inspected very regularly. Also, I'm curious what the reliability of the turbines will be with all that salt water getting into all the crevices.

[PRBuzz]

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

The truth to the above misconception is actually one of the valid reasons *against* Cape Wind. The energy is anything but free. Turbines need to be greased and inspected very regularly. Also, I'm curious what the reliability of the turbines will be with all that salt water getting into all the crevices.

There should be over a 1-2+ decades of reliability data from European installations (Denmark, Germany, etc)

Table 2. Example of German data extracted from Windstats.
Turbine data 1996
MarchJune SeptemberDecember
No of DE turbines reporting1803 1830 1866 1902
Length of reporting period, h2160 2134 2203 2208
Subassembly failures
Rotor 168 99 150 140
Air brake 30 31 18 23
Mechanical brake 25 29 18 21
Pitch control 24 42 36 46
Main shaft 9 7 1 18
Gearbox 29 46 56 42
Generator 37 47 48 100
Yaw system 52 43 50 63
Measurement system 419 29 28 90
Electrical controls 141 127 96 125
Electrical system 166 130 163 163
Hydraulics 82 62 58 45
Sensors 43 69 39 60
Other 84 55 91 58
Total subfailures 1314 816 857 999


From:

ScienceDirect - Reliability Engineering & System Safety : Reliability analysis for wind turbines with incomplete failure data collected from after the date of initial installation

[JohnnySaxatilis]

The environmental groups are nuts if they think they're guna somehow prevent the farm from going in. It just seems ironic that the probably the most wasteful demographic of americans (super wealthy people in Osterville) are trying to fillibuster the process for alternative energy by saying that their environment is going to be tainted..... their view, I mean.

"Year round residents as well as summer residents expressed concerns over the siting of this project. Concerns included ruining the views from people's private property as well as views from public property such as beaches (a concern because it will only be 4.8 miles from the shore of Cape Cod [43]) and therefore decrease property values, ruining popular areas for yachting, and other environmental problems"

What a joke of an argument. The south side beaches on the cape in yarmouth and barstable are probably some of the most expensive parcels of land in the US....

Their main gun is saying that it will adversely effect the birds and other environmental factors...... like what? There arent any that concern them. They're currently conducting studies on the effect on birds.... but plans have been approved, in august of last year actually that superceed the need for local approval. Its goin in. And will account for 75% of the total electricity needed for the cape and islands.

However local fishing groups are AGAINST the wind farm, becuase the grounds will not be opened to fishing vessels, and horeshoe shoal where they're putting the farm in, presumably accounts for a lot of the fish local vessels pull from. And they're claiming it will take their business under.

[MarkB]

My first inclination was to want to see the thing built just to see the Kennedys and their like-minded NIMBYs cry, so you know where I'm coming from. Then I started reading about wind power, and it spoiled my fun.

Wind power is an expensive fraud. When the contract to buy the power produced by Cape Wind was in the news recently, it was because Martha Coakley claimed a great victory for getting 5% off the 100% increase over standard electricity costs. And that is on top of the subsidies you'll be paying as a taxpayer to the company to build the thing.

Wind power in naturally inefficient. First, the turbines produce electricity at far less than there rated level - what they tell you is always a theoretical lie. Then, wind comes and goes. To use wind power at all, you need backup - usually a gas plant - sitting idle, ready to ramp up when the wind dies down. Gas plants - or nuclear - are most efficient running constantly. So any on-off leads to inefficiency.

From Europe - and California, we know that wind turbines are a maintenance headache. In Cali, they actually set broken down turbines to spin free in the wind because they were along a highway, where people could see how many were out of order.

If you're really interested in the truth about wind power, check out this blog:

A free-market energy blog — MasterResource

They have many detailed articles about wind power, plus a section on Cape Wind. Look on the margin on the right for links to various wind power issues, Cape Wind in particular, etc. I really figured why not, it wouldn't hurt to use wind power, etc, until I was exposed to this blog. The guys have a free market prejudice, but just read the details of the articles and you can see they have the facts on their side. And that's not even touching the bird kill issue, or the fact that wind turbines have killed more people than nuclear over the last ten years by a long way. Yes, wind power kills. ;-)

[UserRemoved]

One of the reasons I ask....I'm concerned by what they're going to do once some jackwad hits one at 30 knots...they will shut this entire area down in a heartbeat. I see this as a very serious drawback which coupled with the existing Seal management for the outer beaches and the damn plovers means some pretty serious loss of areas for not only shore fishing but boat fishing now too. What happens when they shut Stellwagen down too..."to let the fish stocks recover" They'll declare it a Federal security zone.

I see this as a potential serious drawback.

That being said I would love to fish the new shoals on at least two tide cycles in my life

Originally Posted by JackK

That is, if you're allowed close to it...

[UserRemoved]

They been doing this in many European countries for years near saltwater. It's a galvanized and painted monopole. Good for 30+ years salt spray finish. These will probably not be made here. They should be...

Yes they need to be maintained, you will see a crew of guys be hired to do this...jobs....jobs to build it...lay the footings, wires, connect to grid. The Govt should be making a kazillion dollars to let them do this. Evidently Capewind stands to make alot of money selling this "green" power. You and I pay for it every month on our electric bills right now..And GE won't pay any federal taxes when they win the bid.

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

The truth to the above misconception is actually one of the valid reasons *against* Cape Wind. The energy is anything but free. Turbines need to be greased and inspected very regularly. Also, I'm curious what the reliability of the turbines will be with all that salt water getting into all the crevices.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by Saltys

Yes they need to be maintained, you will see a crew of guys be hired to do this...jobs....jobs to build it...lay the footings, wires, connect to grid. The Govt should be making a kazillion dollars to let them do this. Evidently Capewind stands to make alot of money selling this "green" power. You and I pay for it every month on our electric bills right now..And GE won't pay any federal taxes when they win the bid.

Just a few of the many reasons why wind power isn't *Free* power.

[PRBuzz]

BOSTON — Gov. Patrick administration officials are asking the federal government to bar potential offshore wind farms from areas that have been identified by commercial fishermen and others as vital to the Massachusetts fishing industry.

Gov. Deval Patrick said the request was designed to protect the state’s fishing industry even as Massachusetts hopes to develop another industry — renewable energy.

The administration’s request would remove from consideration about half of a 3,000 square mile area in federal waters south of Massachusetts originally set aside for possible wind energy development.

[JohnnySaxatilis]

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

Just a few of the many reasons why wind power isn't *Free* power.

who said it was going to be free? Its alternative energy, not free energy

You have to take into consideration the big picture here of paving the way for other forms of alternative energy. Of course wind power isnt the future of the planet but it doesnt hurt for gods sake. This will be the first wind powered farm in coastal waters the United States. MA has always been a progressive state, and this project will determine the success of private ventures into green energy that follow.

the arguments against putting in this wind farm DONT out weigh the benefits. THE ONLY REASON IT HASNT GOTTEN through and been in there yet is becuase the 7% of people against it, own 93% of the political power ($) in the local arena. AND HOUSES IN OYSTER HARBORS AND HYANNIS PORT

9 out of 10 ppl in a MA poll are for the wind farms. And 78% of cape residents are for it (2007)........

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by JohnnySaxatilis

who said it was going to be free? Its alternative energy, not free energy

You must've missed:

Originally Posted by Saltys

It's free energy without alot of hazmat

[JohnnySaxatilis]

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

You must've missed:

mmmm my bad johnny

[MAKAI]

It's like when some one say's " Hey, it must be neat to eat the free fish you catch"

Huh, tackle, truck , boat , gas , time ( when you could be earning money ), permits , bait etc. . . . .

Belgian caviar spoon fed to me by naked centerfolds would be cheaper !



btw. . . . the more I googled the efficiency of windmill power, the more negative toward this I became, check out how Australia's offshore farms have done.

[Liv2Fish]

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

Whether you agree with Cape Wind or not (personally, I'm still on the fence), it *is* going to happen. Approval of the project will bring a lot of jobs to Massachusetts and a few foreign manufacturing companies tied in with the project are just waiting for the final sign-off before building plants in Mass. The project has the support of most government agencies - state and federal - and with Obama in the Office, has a powerful advocate in Washington.

I work for one of the major stakeholders and I can tell you that permits and contracts are in hand. Logistics are the only hold up. construction could start as soon as the end of the 2012 hurricane season. The issue is cost effective infrastructure. There is no port in the state big enough to support the installation.