i need longer casts

[Anthony]

hey everyone i have a 10 foot shakespeare ugly stik with a penn power graphite 7000 mounted on it. i am not getting nearly enough distance on my casts. my casts are going only 30 yards (if i am lucky) with say a 1 1/2 ounce jig or popper on. i also get the same distance when i through my bait and weight out.i dont know what i am doing wrong. please instruct me!!!!!

i was looking through cabelas and i saw this bait rig that says it can go out like past 200 yards. its called the "breakaway system" it looks good because you set it up so when you cast your bait and hook is attached towards the end of the line and when it lands the hook comes out of the holder and is standing upwards. it looks good but i am worried about if it will look like too much terminal tackle. you tell me??

[Jaiem]

Never tried them. Looks like a lot of hardware that can get snagged, tangle your main line or collect a ton of grass.

While distance helps, it isn't the Holy Grail people often make it out to be. Many great fish are taken right in the wash or there abouts. Unless you have a very good reason for needing to cast 200 yards (that's 2 football fields!) like having to reach on offshore bar or cut, don't get yourself upset over it.

[Osprey]

Anthony,
I too suffered from the same dilema, and I purchased a Breakaway set. Don't. I say don't for two reasons.

1)it sounds like you are just getting serious about your technique, try different methods. Try "off the ground" casting (its in Compleat Surfcaster) find someone to teach you "pendulum casting" this is where you will gain distance.
Remember the ad says it will add 30% to your cast, so if you have not reached your full potential it will be 30% of a smaller number.
2) I don't like the rigs. I have two Breakaway rods and I like their innovation in the casting area, great company. But the rigs are not for me. If you are looking at stripers, these things have a lot on them to spook a striper.
You see that black piece, kinda cone shaped, you can buy that directly from breakaway if you want to try it. What you will do is have that toward the top of you rig and have a fish finder with a sinker putting pressure on hook (and bait) that is hooked to the black thing. Picture a U with the sinker at the bottom, hook at one end, black thingy at the other. This releases the bait after it hits the water.

Hey it works and it does improve your cast distance but I am always afraid that black thing is spookin' the fish.

But you said jig or popper, these are strickly for bait.

Try those casting techniques and also try:
-lighter test
-release at the eleven o'clock position (preferably swinging around you shoulder in an upward arch (check the book out).
-overload your reel with line

In the future (next time you are shopping for a rod and reel) you should think about going with a conventional. They are fun to learn and offer you a lot more distance.

[TheSpecialist]

Try going to a ball field and casting with just a weight. Practice makes perfect. Also remember to point your rod tip in the direction you want to end up, and keep the tip at the same angle as the line leaving the spool. This is follow through and puts less drag on the line.

[Slipknot]

What kind of line and what pound test are you using?

[steveo]

The lure may be too small for that rod. I know those Ugly Stiks are big beefy things. Try to use something in the 2 1/2oz or greater range. Be careful not to go too heavy, because the results can be the same as not enough. Look on the rod, and there should be recomended lure and line weights. Stay within those guidelines to start, and experiment from there.
If you are still not getting out further with bait and weight, then look at your line size. 15-25 pound test mono should work well. Also have someone watch your technique, and where you are releasing the line in the cast.

[TheSpecialist]

I use 15lb test on a Shimano Naitrunner 4500 and have no problems.

[TheSpecialist]

I use 15lb test on a Shimano Naitrunner 4500 and have no problems, with my 10' uglies.

[Anthony]

I am using berkley trilene 25 pound test on my ten footer and 17 on my 9 footer. well hey look at that, i just found out something i never knew my 10 footer has a range of 1-6 ounces for a lure and my 9 footer has 1-4. Now whay wouldnt shakespeare put that on the rod!!!!!

O yeah one more thing, when i try to cast my bait out and i try to get distance,my line goes one way and the bait goes flying down the shoreline for the crabs to eat. then when i try to gradually make the swing the bait stays on but it dont go too far.

Should i be using braided line or mono like i am. Ok guys here is the survey...post your favorite type of line weather being mono or braided, say the brand, the type, 2 or more pros, and 2 or more cons if there are any.

thanks alot everyone, this helps alot

tight lines

Anthony

[JohnR]

You have a couple things playing against you:

First, the stock 10 foot Ugly stick, although better than most off the shelf rods is a rod that doesn't specialize in any particular area. It's good at tossing bait and it's good for heavy plugs but it's not a champ at distance. It does what it's supposed to do well and that is to provide fair performance for reasonable money for a long time. The high end mass produced rods like the less expensive Penn Power Graph Rods and some Daiwa Sealines can be picked to be a little more specialized and have OK characteristics. The St Croix rods, the factory Breakaways and some Lami's are the high end of the non-custom rods that you can purchase for that but now your getting into big money (relatively speaking). The price of custom rods. Early in my surfcasting adventures, I assumed that longer casting required a 12 foot rod so I went out and bought a 12 foot Daiwa Eliminator and a Penn 8500SS. $225 later I had an outfit that if I used 6 ounces of weight plus bait I couldn't cast as far as someone with a nicely balanced 9 footer and a lighter reel. And I was killing myself while this fellow was catching the fish...

When you look at all of the dfferent options out there, off the shelf or custom, you still won't find a rod that is equal at tossing a 1.5OZ jig or plug AND a 4 ounce sinker draggin' a 4OZ slab of mushy meat. Each rod has a range that it's most happy in. Where the rod loads up on a range of wieght and efficiently sends that power back into sending that weight off into never never land. You're Ugly stick probably won't break on 6 ounces but it may not be efficient with six ounces either. It ain't efficient on 1 ounce as it's not loading up. Unfortunately (fortunately :P ), this is why many of us choose different rods (accumulated over seasons - not at once) that fit various applications. Someone that's been seriously playing the surf for a few years will have 2-4 rods.

First work with the rod you & reel setup you have. Try to improve the quality of your bait. Twice frozen mackeral chunks and mushy herring are going to be prone to seperate from your line, especially if you crank it out there. Like a golf swing, if you properly load the rod in a smooth arc, you can be just as efficient as really trying to crank it. It takes some practice but it will really help. Once you are familiar with loading up a rod and using good bait, fresh or recently thawing from it's first freeze, it will hold up better (in most cases) during the cast. Also try hooking through more meat and flesh so the force of the cast will be spread out more on the bait.

Tell us about what will be the majority of your fishing style. Bait / Plugs (what size) / Metals, Jigs, etc. If you are as sickly hooked as the rest of us ;D you'll accumulate more gear over the next few years too...

One other thing, as Jaiem stated, casting forever and then some is not really necessary in our waters. It's often said that more fish are cast over than cast too. That may not apply on the Gulf coast of Texas or at the Outer Banks but applies alot for New England. Sure, there are times when you'll need a 300 foot cast but there might not be anyone here that can toss 200 yards while FISHING. Think about it. That's as long as the Battleship Massachucetts. That 200 yards stuff WITH a Breakaway Rod AND a souped up Mag Elite AND a competitive DISTANCE caster is possible but you're not going to catch fish that way. Spend $500 and a couple years casting you'll maybe be able to send that rig out 600 feet but you really don't need to.

To give you an idea, this is what I use...

8' G-Loomis (custom home made) with a ABU 5500C3 for schoolies, albies, & small keepers. I use 1/2 ounce to 1.5OZ plugs, jigs, tins, and plastics. Sweet spot is 3/4 to 1.5
9' Sabre 1088 (custom home made [sold]) with a 6500 Mag Elite or Big Game for plugs 1-2.5 ounces, eels, metals and jigs
9' Sabre 1089 (custom from a shop) with a 6500/7000 Big Game or Calcutta 400 for eels, plugs, tins & jigs 2-4 ounces. Some bait tossing and live herring as well.
10 Lami XRA1205 (custom home made) with the 6500 7000 Abus and for big plugs, baits, and eels....

***** BTW - what kind of 9 foot rod do you have and what reels is on it? *****

[Patrick]

I would like to say that your line is too heavy but I don't know where you fish.

If you are fishing a place with very strong currents, big rocks and a small area where you have to control a fish, those are good set ups. You have to control the fish or they will pop your line.

If you aren't fishing an area like this, you can go with lighter line.

Most every reel out there is Fireline Friendly. If the reels you have are balanced to the rods, then the lines I suggest should work on them. If I were you, I would drop some change on Fireline. It's a very userfriendly superline. It's not a true braid like Whiplash but it is very good.

If you are in an area where control is neccessary, on the bait rod, I would put 30/12 Fireline. I've never used that strength but Mike P says it softens up overtime. If you are in an open area where you can play a fish, go with 20/8 Fireline. I'm using this stuff now and it's fantastic.

For the smaller rod for lures, if you are in the area that needs control, go with 20/8 Fireline. If you don't need the control, go with 14/6. I've used the 14/6 and it's great. I have it on my smaller reel.

The key to long casts is letting the rod do the work for you. If you use lures in the area of the rod specs, you will get more distance and will last a lot longer than if you work against the rod.

The rest of the guys on here summed it up beautifully.

You know what we need to do? A lot of golf centers have cameras that see these sensors on the club and the golfer's body and sends it to a computer. You know, so they can look at the trouble areas of their swing. We need to get a golf club to let us borrow their machine.

Practice makes perfect. Every person has a different style so practice practice practice until you feel the cast is right.

[JohnR]

I thought fireline was a bad thing on conventional reels, not friendly at all...

Patrick, a game controller company named (no jokes please) Thrustmaster made a product several years ago that used optical sensors to determine club speed/club face angle, etc and allowed you to use one's own clubs for PC based golf games. It also included a swing analyzer software that could run on a seperate monitor if your computer could handle it. I almost bought one ($700 in 96).

[Saltheart]

It sounds to me like there are a few problems. First , and others have already said it , you need practice. Hate to say it but 30 yards with a 10 foot pole is miserable. You need someone who is reasonably good to take a lokk at you while casting. My guess is its a timing issue.
Next , the line/lure weight is not a good match. Try switching to 17 lb test for the 1.5 OZ lure and try the 17 lb with a 3 OZ jig. If you can get the heavy jig out there , its probably the 25 lb test. If even with light line and a heavy jig yu can't get the thing to fly , then its back on you for practice. Sometimes if you just don't have the action right , you can't get the rod to load up or your release is off and even a perfect set up will give you short casts.

Anyway , I would advise you to get someone who is pretty good at casting to watch you and try your rig. As I stated , 30 yards with a ten foot pole is miserable and someone with some experience should be able to zero in on the problem pretty quickly.

[Fisherwoman]

Hi Anthony, there is some great advise on this topic. I have owned 2, 10 ft ugly sticks since I started a few years back. Only use them now for bait fishing, they do have there pro's and con's.
1st on all ungly sticks the tip is very soft which is meant so that you don't break the rod, which is what ugly sticks are made for. But after using them for a few years, you will not get the casting distance out of these rods that you would like, no matter what you are throwing whether it be bait or plugs. The tip is just not stiff enough for you to properly load the rod. These rods will however handle very large fish if you hook up!!! I have mine each set up with a shimano 4500 baitrunner and use them for baitfishing only now, and even though I am a pretty good caster it just doesn't get out to where I want it. But like some of these other fellows have told you, sometimes those fish are right at your feet so don't think that is critical. I only us 20 test Berkley big game line on it. If you are fishing alot of structure, us a heavier lb test shock leader. The lower the line lb test, the further you will be able to cast, but ONLY go by what the rod is rated for same goes for lure weight.

If you are looking to check into possibley a little beafier stick, check out the new Diawa Sealine rods as John mentioned, they are fairly inexpensive and have a good solid tip to help you get more distance.

Practice is the best way to learn, but it helps if someone is teaching you or giving you instruction while at the shore line. where are you from? I am from the south shore area near Boston and would be willing to put in a little time with you to help you out, so let me know!!!

As for braided lines on spinning reels, I have tried many, whiplash, power pro, cortland, and spiderwire and returned to fireline every time, I use 14lb test on all of my 7 & 8 ft rods. You will get a clean, longer cast. The feel is incredible, and its a dead stick if you hook up because in all of these lines there is no stretch or memory. The only downfall with this line is you should use it on a rod with hard quides as I have noticed on my rods without hard guides it will start to shred & frey the line, which makes it lighter in the air which means wind knot, which means cut and retie, there are very few times you will be able to get the knot out as this stuff is like thread, and once it is tight you can forget trying to work the knot out just retie. The upside is if you are fishing alot, you are not retieing alot, because it is strong and will hold up much longer. Hope this helps, Good luck!!! The offer is there if you want to hook up. Just email us and we will try to get toghether!!!

[jettyjockey18]

anthony-
the 10' stik is a war club, but you should be doubling that distance without breaking a sweat...i have a 9' stik that i used to use as a pogy rod...i could put a weighted snagging hook out 75+ yards with it.
this isn't a knock on your ability, but it does sound like some casting practice is in order.
it also sounds like your plugs are a little light.

[Mike P]

Hey John---are you sure you didn't accidentlu put that hyphen between the "2" and the "4" in that figure for rods the graybeards have in their arsenal? :-D

[JohnR]

??? Pullin' a brainfart here Mike... Whaddya mean? 24 Ouncers :P ? Nordic Cod Jigs? Or do I use 2 to 4 ouncers on a 1089?

[Anthony]

Hey everyone, well i have only been fising salt water for a year now, last year was my first year. I also agree that 30 yards is pathetic. But you must relize that i am only 14. I have bought all my gear myself. Believe my i will be buying a better rod and reel when i get some more money which should be very soon from my pay check. But unfortunatlty i am stuck with these outfits right now.i am thinkin of getting a daiwia sealine rod when i get the money (what is the price range again?) and am lookin intoa better reel for it but dont know what to get. Any ideas would help, please remember i am on a budget with money. again with the distance in casting i am 5'5" tall and about 120 pounds if that matters.

What do you guysuse for teasers. i have been thinking about useing a 3" worm or grub for it. what do you use??

also how do you guys have your bait rig rigged. i am thinking of rigging it like do trout. i will have a hook at the end of say a 6" mono leader then to a swivel and a pyramid sinker that lets the line slide through. this any good??

[jettyjockey18]

14 years old?? well why didn't you say so??...before you go out and drop 3 bills on a custom 11' lami and 6 bills on a matching vs500, i offer the following...better gear will help, but only in the right hands. the setup you have will catch fish and will cast farther, but you have to put the time in and practice.
none of us on this board were born being able to chuck 3 ounces 200 yards. it takes time to develop the strength, technique and ability to do that. practice with the cheap stuff before you spend your college fund on the good stuff.

[Patrick]

There is nothing wrong with the gear you have. You just need more practice and to use it with the ratings that Shakespeare suggests. I would suggest getting another rod if the ones you already have don't have the specs that you want.

Being 14, you haven't really grown all that much. Heck, when I was 14, I didn't even start growing. When I was 14, I was about 5'2" and a 10 foot rod was too long for me. An 8 footer was good though. Now that I'm nearly 6', a 10 foot rod works fine. Also, your muscles haven't grown too much. Like any sport, you need to train during your off season. Once you are old enough, most physicians believe 16 is old enough to start, look at starting weight training. You don't have to be completely ripped but try doing simple things to build up your arms and your chest. Pull ups (palms not facing you on the bar) will work your triceps (the muscles underneath your arm) and chin ups (palms facing you) will work your biceps. Push ups will work your pectorals (the chest muscles) and your deltiods(the muscles on your shoulders). These are the main muscles you use. They are designed for pushing and pulling your arms. Just make sure when you go to the doctor next time, consult him on his feelings and if he gives you the green light, make sure you don't over-do it. Nothing will put you out of commission faster than a pulled muscle.

You will see an improvement in your fishing. I spent a lot of my free time in the school's weight room during gym and afterschool. Not only will it make you stronger but it will give you better stamina and just make you feel better overall.

Good luck, remember, talk to the doctor before you do anything.

[STEVE IN MASS]

Anthony - for the bait ch#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&g rig, that is one way, but go get a plastic fishfinder sleeve. They are only about $0.20 and will work much better than a swivel. I used to use fish finder rigs all the time, but have found that what is better and improves both your casting distance and keeping the bait on the hook is either a hi-lo rig, or something exactly like it with only one hook. This involves about 36" of leader material tied to a barrel swivel. About 12-18" from the swivel, tie a dropper loop and attach a hook. Go another 12-18" and tie another dropper, attach another hook. Go another 12-18" and tie on a snap for the sinker. (Since you are young and still rather short, the 12" between would probably be better to shorten up the whole rig. As you grow taller, you can leave more distance in between). If you only want one hook, just shorten up on your strating length. The areodynamics of this make for a longer cast, and you don't get that "snapping" of the bait following the sinker like you do with a fishfinder set up, allowing for the bait to remain on the hook better. When I fish in New Jersey, the bait of choice down there is clams. With the fishfinder rig, I always had a problem with the clams seperating from the hook. With the hi-lo rig, that problem vanished. Good Luck.....

[JohnR]

With that in mind, switch to the nine foot rod for your plugging. The Powergraph 7000 should be fine for that too. Matter of fact, it's not a bad reel (that I've heard + I have one of the small ones) and shouldn't need to be traded in... Also, like JJ18 says, don't blow the college dough on an entirely new setup. If you choose to buy new gear. Post your wants, needs, and rough budget and we can try to stear you in the right direction... Pretty soon your buddies will be hanging around you want you to teach them how to fish (when you all aren't chasing mermaids that is :P )...

[Sean]

Anthony,
Quit surfishing now! ... while you still have a chance to lead a normal productive life ;D
If you don't you'll turn into one of us sleep deprived zombies who spend their days reading striper message boards when the should be working and contributing to society! Their nights are spent endlessly casting into the dark where the only thing that can be seen is the foam washing onto the beach or jetty. You will spend your life in search of that elusive 40, 50, 60, 70 or 80# fish. It never ends...you'll be addicted...

No seriously, that doesn't happen 8) Keep practicin' & you'll be throwing 80 yds. to the cows in no time. Good luck!

[Jaiem]

Agree with Sean.

The bags under my eyes are for carrying extra plugs!

[TheSpecialist]

Anthony, when I started out out I was your age and used to fish with my dad. At that time I used 8' rods. I think an 8" rod is better suited to someone your size and experience. Also are you casting side-arm or over-head???

[Saltheart]

I think the rod and reel are fine. Perhaps the line needs adjustment or heavier lures are needed or both but the rod and reel should be able to give you 60 yards , no problem.
Casting for a world record may require some adult stremgth but casting a jig 60 yards with a 10 foot pole requires practice and timing , not strength.
Sixty yards should be a good goal for you. I can't cast 200 yards nor can anyone I have ever fished with.

I say again , get some help from someone who knows what they are doing. Except for a possible line swap , you can cast that far with your equipment , even at 14 years old. You can do it!

[Anthony]

haha, being one of those zombies is my destiny!!! haha. i was out tonight and got a new plug, a new mambo minnow, and some plastics for teasers. Thanks for all the support you guys, really helps. Hey everyone guess what!!! i am almost finished with my bike beach buggy. its lookin great. picture will be coming soon.


BTW specialist i cast over head not side arm

anthony

[RickBomba]

Anthony,
I remember as a kid, (9-14), fishing with my dad he would stick me with a 10 foot, super stiff fibergalss boat rod. I had the same problems...20, 30 yards were a stellar cats for me at the time. I looked at what my dad was doing...he had a 12' Fenglass custom rod and weighed 250#.
Most noteably, I watched the way that he would load the rod during a cast. The other guys are right...I started doubling and tripling my casts once I really started to practice my swing.
The weight in the field thing worked wonders for my form. In fact, every time I buy a new rod I practice with it at least once in a field; just to get the hand-eye thing down.
If you really want to have fun, bring some of you're friends out with you one day (preferrably ones that aren't champion surfcasters), and watch how they cast your rod. I guarantee you won't feel so bad after that.
PRACTICE.
Rick