A question for the Obama apologists

[Jim in CT]

When Obama was a senator, he said it was "un-patriotic" and a "leadership failure" that Bush needed to raise the debt ceiling.

http://americaswatchtower.com/2011/0...national-debt/


Today, Obama wants to raise the debt ceiling, and he has no kind words for those who oppose him.

So Spence, and to any other Obama sycophants out there...was Obama right then, or is he right now? Which is it? You can't have it both ways.

Good luck.

[WESTPORTMAFIA]

Easy answer Politics is another word for BULLCHIT which means politicians are BULLCHITTERS. No real story here just everyday/normal political BULLCHIT
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[iamskippy]

Originally Posted by WESTPORTMAFIA

Easy answer Politics is another word for BULLCHIT which means politicians are BULLCHITTERS. No real story here just everyday/normal political BULLCHIT
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WORD! Just like weathermen, they all lie and get away with it!
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by WESTPORTMAFIA

Easy answer Politics is another word for BULLCHIT which means politicians are BULLCHITTERS. No real story here just everyday/normal political BULLCHIT
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Don't forget, Obama was the one who promised to put an end to all of the 'politics as uaual'. All that 'change' stuff.

I just want to see what Spence has to say, see how he tries to say that Obama was brilliantly correct on both occasions.

[WESTPORTMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Don't forget, Obama was the one who promised to put an end to all of the 'politics as uaual'. All that 'change' stuff.

I just want to see what Spence has to say, see how he tries to say that Obama was brilliantly correct on both occasions.

Lmao! Spence has jungle fever
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[fishbones]

Originally Posted by WESTPORTMAFIA

Lmao! Spence has jungle fever
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Lmao. Funniest post of the year!
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[FishermanTim]

Originally Posted by iamskippy

WORD! Just like weathermen, they all lie and get away with it!
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AND...whether they're right or wrong, honest or currupt, GOD fearing or full-blown satan-sinning traitors.....they still get paid with OUR taxes!!!

[Jim in CT]

From today's Reuters news:

"White House spokesman Jay Carney on Thursday called Republican tactics on the debt limit a 'political extortion game.' President Obama repeatedly has warned that he wants a debt limit increase with no strings attached."

When Obama bashed Bush in 2006, Bush was attempting to raise the debt ceiling to $9 trillion. Obama called that a "leadership failure". Now that Obama wants to raise the debt ceiling to what, $17 trillion? And Obama isn't willing to tolerate any interference?

But Spence said he 'explained all that in 2011' (but would not elaborate when I asked), even though what's happening now is occurring at the end of 2013. So in addition to being cool, handsome, and brilliant, Spence feels Obama can also see into the future...

[Raider Ronnie]

Leave Spence alone.
He's busy s#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& off his Obama blow up doll.
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[Raider Ronnie]

This pretty much sums it up !

[spence]

No, he quite simply said he realized his responsibility as President was different than that as Senator.

-spence

[The Dad Fisherman]

Originally Posted by spence

No, he quite simply said he realized his responsibility as President was different than that as Senator.

-spence

Yikes!!!

[spence]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

Yikes!!!

I think he's just being honest, one of those you don't know until you really get there sort of things. Bush said basically the same on other issues if I remember.

Seriously, any of you don't think that suddenly becoming the most powerful person on the planet isn't going to influence how you view some things?

-spence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

I think he's just being honest, one of those you don't know until you really get there sort of things. Bush said basically the same on other issues if I remember.

Seriously, any of you don't think that suddenly becoming the most powerful person on the planet isn't going to influence how you view some things?

-spence

Spence, is Obama black-mailing you, the way J Edgar Hoover used to? Come on.

To support the current spending increase, Obama says we simply need to do it in order to avoid being in default. He said that failure to pay our bills would mean we are a deadbeat nation.

That's simple stuff, Spence, that's not advanced calculus.

Spence wants us to believe that in 2006, it was beyond Senator Obama's abilities to see the danger in defaulting on debt. According to Spence, Obama could not have possibly understood that, until he became President.

Spence, if you are correct (and you are not), then-Senator Obama was way too much of a simpleton to seek the promotion he sought.

And if you are correct, why hasn't Obama apologized for bashing Bush, since Obama now sees that Bush was 100% right then, and he (Obamna) was 100% wrong? And what else was Obama 100% wrong about before he got to be President?

Finally Spence, if Obama's behavior back then was appropriate for a Senator (since as you said, only a President could possibly understand the need to pay your bills), why is everyone attacking the Republican legislators who oppose raising the debt ceiling?

Obama's spokesman, Jay Carney, said that legislators who oppose raising the debt ceiling are playing a "political extortion game". Why didn't Obama tell Carney to say "look, the legislators who oppose raising the debt ceiling, are only doing it because they are doing what's appropriate in their current position."

Spence, I DARE you to try and answer this question...
Spence, if you praise Obama for his opposition of the debt ceiling increase in 2006 (according to you, that's the right thing for a legislator to do), by what logic do you not similarly praise the Republicans who are doing the same thing today? If Senator Obama could not have possibly known any better in 2006, why are the Republicans currently in Congress being held to a higher standard?
God Almighty...

[Sea Dangles]

Keep Junior in karate, he will fit in with the Chinese who will soon own this once great nation being led down a path of despair. This hack and his sycophants(Jeff) have no conscience.
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[Jim in CT]

Spence, I guess you were corrcet when you said that then-Senator Obama was wrong. There, you were correct. You are incorrect when you say that it would be unfair to expect a Senator to be able to understand the correct course or action. Back then, other Senators were saying the opposite of what Obama was saying. EVen you admit they were correct, and Obama was wrong.

So what else was Obama 100% wrong about? Closing Gitmo? Enhanced interrogation? The need for Social Security and Medicare reform?

According to Spence, Obama cannot be expected to knowledgably set policy on any topic beyond the scope of his current job. Those are Spence's words. Last time I checked, Obama has never worked with the economics of public healthcare. So according to Spence's logic, how is Obama qualified to suggest that Obamacare would do more harm than good?

Hmmm?

[spence]

Jim, it has very little to do with anything you just said.

The point is, Congress people will act like Congress people. They're concerned primarily with personal impact and one sided agendas. This is crystal clear with the current House behavior. Cruze's motivation is establishing himself on the National stage to run for President, House Republicans are generally terrified that more Tea Party candidates are going to back stab them in the primaries.

Obama simply said that as President he saw you need a broader perspective.

-spence

[buckman]

Originally Posted by spence

Jim, it has very little to do with anything you just said.

The point is, Congress people will act like Congress people. They're concerned primarily with personal impact and one sided agendas. This is crystal clear with the current House behavior. Cruze's motivation is establishing himself on the National stage to run for President, House Republicans are generally terrified that more Tea Party candidates are going to back stab them in the primaries.

Obama simply said that as President he saw you need a broader perspective.

-spence

You are unbelievable ! Literally .
You have a double standard about everything .
Clearly these idiots in congress and the senate have no business running any part of our life's , let alone deciding on my children's health care. I'm glad you are coming around
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[spence]

Originally Posted by buckman

You are unbelievable ! Literally .
You have a double standard about everything .
Clearly these idiots in congress and the senate have no business running any part of our life's , let alone deciding on my children's health care. I'm glad you are coming around
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There's no double standard here, it's just reality.

Bush went through the exact same thing. All Presidents do, most just aren't as honest about it as Obama.

-spence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

Jim, it has very little to do with anything you just said.

The point is, Congress people will act like Congress people. They're concerned primarily with personal impact and one sided agendas. This is crystal clear with the current House behavior. Cruze's motivation is establishing himself on the National stage to run for President, House Republicans are generally terrified that more Tea Party candidates are going to back stab them in the primaries.

Obama simply said that as President he saw you need a broader perspective.

-spence

OK. So when Obama was bashing Bush, it was just politcs as usual. Sounds like that's what you are saying, and I agree with that.

But if that's the case, where does Obama get off running on a promise to "end politics as usual". If Obama knew that Bush had to raise the debt ceiling, but bashed him anyway to score political points with his base, from where does Obama get the nerve to say he'll do things differently? Isn't that level of dishonesty a character flaw?

Here's the thing, Spence. That type of politics (attacking a proposal that you know is necessary) is dangerous. That's exactly what your side is doing when conservatives suggest necessary cuts to Social Security and Medicare (witness the ads showing Paul Ryan pushing a wheelchair-bound old lady off a cliff, boy that's honest). On some issues, that tactic is very dangerous.

How about we elect someone who is above that? Paul Ryan could have said during the campaign "elect me, and I'll give you all a blank check!". But he didn't. He said cuts were necessary, and your side attacked him for it. Congratulations.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

All Presidents do, most just aren't as honest about it as Obama.

-spence

What honesty has he showed? Did Obama go on TV and admit that Bush was right, and that he, Obama, was lying to our faces?
Has he begged forgiveness for his ill-conceived attacks of Bush? If Obama did that, I missed it.

Spence, Obama opposed raising the debt ceiliing. There are 2 explanations...

(1) Obama was too ignorant to understand that Bush had no choice, or

(2) Obama knew full well that Bush had no choice, but he attacked him to score political points.

Those are the only 2 choices, I don't see a third possibility. In either case, in my opinion, it means he's unqualified. He's either too stupid or too dishonest.

[spence]

(3) Obama gained insight from his new responsibility and regrets his previous position.

-spence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

(3) Obama gained insight from his new responsibility and regrets his previous position.

-spence

To believe your third option, you'd have to believe that a Harvard-educated US Senator has no appreciation for what happens if the US stops paying its bills.

Finally, if that was the case, why hasn't Obama apologized for his Bush-bashing on this issue, if he now has the necessary insight to understand that we have to pay our bills?

[spence]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

To believe your third option, you'd have to believe that a Harvard-educated US Senator has no appreciation for what happens if the US stops paying its bills.

Remember this was pre-recession when the economy was still doing pretty well riding that cheap credit wave. The implications then appeared much less severe than today.

Finally, if that was the case, why hasn't Obama apologized for his Bush-bashing on this issue, if he now has the necessary insight to understand that we have to pay our bills?

Back then the Dems were advocating pay-go. Situation was certainly not the same...

-spence

[buckman]

Originally Posted by spence

There's no double standard here, it's just reality.

Bush went through the exact same thing. All Presidents do, most just aren't as honest about it as Obama.

-spence

We have all heard that before... It's usually in regards to national security . Not basic economics .
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

Remember this was pre-recession when the economy was still doing pretty well riding that cheap credit wave. The implications then appeared much less severe than today.


Back then the Dems were advocating pay-go. Situation was certainly not the same...

-spence

"the economy was still doing pretty well riding that cheap credit wave. The implications then appeared much less severe than today. "

OK. So you claim to work in Finance, and you are saying that with a straight face? Spence, remember the absolute dollars here. You are saying, it was worse for Bush to have us $9 trillion in debt in 2006, than it is for Obama to have us $17 trillion in debt in 2013? You believe that? Our balance sheet is healthier now than it was then?

Whew!

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

Remember this was pre-recession when the economy was still doing pretty well riding that cheap credit wave. The implications then appeared much less severe than today.


Back then the Dems were advocating pay-go. Situation was certainly not the same...

-spence

Can you support that statement please? Do you have any support for your contention, that the consequences of US default would be worse today than in 2006? We had two engaged in two wars in 2006, so presumably we couldn't grind to a halt then?

You keep moving the goalposts. First, Obama couldn't have known about the necessity of raising the ceiling in 2006, because he was only a Senator. Now, it's that Obama was correct to oppose raising the debt ceiling back then, because unlike today, it didn't need to be raised.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

Back then the Dems were advocating pay-go.
-spence

Which Democrats in Washington advocated "pay as you go"? Now you're saying that the Democrats in Washington, were opposed to spending unless we had the funds on hand to pay for it?

Yes, those Democrats are real budget-hawks. Obama is clearly a real penny-pincher with the US budget, I'm so sorry I forgot that...

[buckman]

Btw
Pres. Obama's schedule leading up to the shutdown golf on Saturday, golf on Sunday, golf on Monday
You can't get more arrogant than that
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[spence]

Originally Posted by buckman

Btw
Pres. Obama's schedule leading up to the shutdown golf on Saturday, golf on Sunday, golf on Monday
You can't get more arrogant than that
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Curious if you affectionately refer to your information sources as your "dealer".

-spence