Stripers

[clambo]

In my local paper we have a column written by Dave Monti every Saturday, In this weeks column he talks about proposed regulations to contribute to the rebuilding of Striped Bass stocks. They include No targeting, no harvest, shorter season, new slot size. It should be obvious to most fisherman that the measures that have been taken aren't working! In my opinion the most logical solution is the one not taken. It is quite well known that larger Bass produce the most eggs yet they are the very ones that the commercial fishery are required to catch. I have asked marine fisheries in Mass. and R I why is this allowed and can't they change to weight rather than the number of the breeders and I have been told they would have to buy a scale. Are you kidding me? In order to fish one needs a boat, a truck to pull it. No wonder they fail to increase the stocks. I think they are just plain stupid! This is not rocket science folks. Leave the breeders in the water to breed! Am I the only person to see this as the most logical solution to get more Striped Bass biomass into the sea? If the people who are in charge of rebuilding the biomass can't see this solution we are truly screwed!

[piemma]

Originally Posted by clambo

In my local paper we have a column written by Dave Monti every Saturday, In this weeks column he talks about proposed regulations to contribute to the rebuilding of Striped Bass stocks. They include No targeting, no harvest, shorter season, new slot size. It should be obvious to most fisherman that the measures that have been taken aren't working! In my opinion the most logical solution is the one not taken. It is quite well known that larger Bass produce the most eggs yet they are the very ones that the commercial fishery are required to catch. I have asked marine fisheries in Mass. and R I why is this allowed and can't they change to weight rather than the number of the breeders and I have been told they would have to buy a scale. Are you kidding me? In order to fish one needs a boat, a truck to pull it. No wonder they fail to increase the stocks. I think they are just plain stupid! This is not rocket science folks. Leave the breeders in the water to breed! Am I the only person to see this as the most logical solution to get more Striped Bass biomass into the sea? If the people who are in charge of rebuilding the biomass can't see this solution we are truly screwed!

Mike, None of this stuff will solve the problem. There are 2 solutions, 1 short term and 1 long term.

1) Short term is a Moratorium. Shut it down

2) Long term is Game Fish status for everyone. All states. Commercial and recreational can keep nothing.

There will still be a 12 to 15% mortality with C&R but the species will recover.
The slot, shortened season, EEZ, etc does nothing. The "grey" market guys still kill whatever they want because there are dollars attached. Close it down with no keeping. then they will have nowhere to sell. There will still be abuse but not at the level we live with now.

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by piemma

Mike, None of this stuff will solve the problem. There are 2 solutions, 1 short term and 1 long term.

1) Short term is a Moratorium. Shut it down

2) Long term is Game Fish status for everyone. All states. Commercial and recreational can keep nothing.

There will still be a 12 to 15% mortality with C&R but the species will recover.
The slot, shortened season, EEZ, etc does nothing. The "grey" market guys still kill whatever they want because there are dollars attached. Close it down with no keeping. then they will have nowhere to sell. There will still be abuse but not at the level we live with now.

Yup but we wont see it in our lifetime.

[rphud]

Slots, whether they be by weight or length, are set to protect certain year classes of fish that have the most fish. This reduces the overall mortality since larger year populations make it easier to catch those fish. Just straight up probability here. This works to some degree, but they are saying it is likely not enough to achieve the "50%" probability of achieving overall population recovery by the 2029 target date.

The limited closures, whether for targeting or harvest, are much more effective. Essentially a short moratorium each year. If they can't get to this in an effective way soon they will be forced to do something more extreme in the next year or two.

Charter guys will be aligned against no targeting to be sure. Likely C&R as well.

Commercial, while it always seems to look bad is significantly less impactful than recreational. Both should have to give some ground just in the name of shared responsibility and/or feeling the pain for past "sins".

p.s. while larger females have more eggs, there are fewer of these larger fish and their eggs are somewhat less viable (not that I see the viability in the modeling so far).

[JohnR]

Sadly we are long past the time where half measures work. At minimum we have to protect these year classes.


Baldwin had a great post the other day on FB Striped Bass Pledge Group
- will capture a big part of it but also link it:

Let ASMFC know you care about your striped bass fishery and want the previously successful tactics for rebuilding included in the regulation changes scheduled for 2025.


You may or may not have read my posts on the Atlantic Striped Bass Technical Committee’s report on the striped bass Spawning Stock Biomass and options for regulation changes for striped bass in 2025 in response to the estimated chances of the current plan succeeding in rebuilding striped bass Spawning Stock Biomass by 2029. If not, just check my previous post on this site for a link to my FB site and read it if you’d like. Or you can just scan over my notes below.



Either way, it’s important for us to be able to let our fisheries managers know that we care about our fishery and have strong feelings about changing the status quo that has not been working, in favor of sensible and proven tactics that were successful in rebuilding the stocks before.



Below are some of my thoughts on the options, followed by most of my letter I’m sending in. It’s quick and easy to get your letter in, instructions are at the bottom of this post.



1) Keeping the present slot limit would keep the sizeable, though reduced at least to some extent so far by that slot, 2015 year class in the crosshairs as well as including the larger specimens of the 2018 year class. Those 2018s are the last good year class we’ve had, as every one of the 6 years since has seen spawning failure in the Chesapeake, which supplies up to 80% of the Atlantic striped bass stocks. 2023 spawning in the Hudson was way down, as well. I heard the 2024 Hudson recruitment was also low, but I’m not sure about that, as the numbers aren’t out yet.


2) Moving the slot limit up a year to protect the 2018s would keep the 2015s in that slot. That’s the other relatively decent year class that we should be protecting.


3) ASMFC says that there is not a close correlation between the abundance of spawning age females and recruitment success. My thought is that it should be obvious that adding a buffer layer to that spawning biomass is always a good idea. Even a better idea when we’ve been losing year classes for several years in a row.



4) Moving the slot down a few years would fish down much smaller year classes. It’s true that there aren’t many in those more recent year classes to catch, but that’s the point. Better to fish down a smaller bunch than depleting the ones that are our best hope for the future. By the way, protecting the larger year classes is what worked to rebuild the striped bass after the collapse of the late ‘70s, early ‘80s.



5) No Target closures don’t work. Just as fishermen still fish J hooks on bait for stripers, and claim that they’re targeting bluefish, any lure someone casts for stripers can also be claimed to be intended for bluefish or weakfish. Any bait used to catch stripers can be explained as intended for bluefish, fluke, or even sea robins. Conservation Officer: “whatcha fishing for, buddy?” Fisherman: “anything but stripers, officer.” Law enforcement officers are saying that those closures would be impossible to enforce.


6) Seasonal Closures would only be acceptable if equitable. A closure during the 4th wave (July and August) would be devastating to striper fishermen in Maine. That pretty much brackets the entire time the stripers are up there. They don’t get weakfish, fluke, false albacore, bonito or other fish that can be substituted like can be done farther south, either. A Third Wave (May/June) closure or a Sixth Wave (November/December) would be fine with Maine, but would be problematic for New Jersey fishermen. Even separate closures at different times would be inequitable if they were of equal length. Northern states have stripers available for a shorter piece of the year.



Public comment will be accepted until 11:59 p.m. (EST) on Tuesday, December 10, 2024, and should be emailed to comments@asmfc.org

https://www.facebook.com/groups/433685153423751/

[rphud]

I disagree to some level on the closures/no targeting "not working" or being "unenforceable". While there will always be those that disobey, they can still get the desired outcome which is reducing the mortality to a lower target for any given year.

The hard part will be making it equitable. Since we are working to reduce the mortality by a certain percentage of the biomass it would likely be equitable for different durations and at different times/waves. I am not sure they will be able to get things done like that, but there is hope.

In any case, do the right thing this year and make a good assessment of how well or not it worked at the end of the year. Make any needed corrections the following year.

Closures / no target periods are needed to get to the 2029 restoration goal. Even with the cheaters.

[afterhours]

Originally Posted by piemma

Mike, None of this stuff will solve the problem. There are 2 solutions, 1 short term and 1 long term.

1) Short term is a Moratorium. Shut it down

2) Long term is Game Fish status for everyone. All states. Commercial and recreational can keep nothing.

There will still be a 12 to 15% mortality with C&R but the species will recover.
The slot, shortened season, EEZ, etc does nothing. The "grey" market guys still kill whatever they want because there are dollars attached. Close it down with no keeping. then they will have nowhere to sell. There will still be abuse but not at the level we live with now.

This ^^^^^ we've been preaching this for many years. They do not realize that the the world class fishery that we still could have would have an overall greater economic impact than dead fish does.

[rphud]

I have a big problem with this part

3) ASMFC says that there is not a close correlation between the abundance of spawning age females and recruitment success.

[ivanputski]

Any time a group of people in charge of making important changes, make moves that defy logic, you know there is some shady backroom business going on...
I wrote my letter, but I have zero faith in the ASMFC .

[pbadad]

Originally Posted by ivanputski

Any time a group of people in charge of making important changes, make moves that defy logic, you know there is some shady backroom business going on...
I wrote my letter, but I have zero faith in the ASMFC .

Hi Pete. Long time . Hope alls good.
We re on a letter writing mission at the club to show more representation. Yes you probably are right. Money talks and BS walks!
More rec guys need to show support. The other side has a $ motive and recs have a conservative motive. We can only do are part in what we believe is right for the specie. George from the club has been are advocate and getting the club informed throughout years of dealing with ASMFC.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[fishgolf]

Thank you for posting. Letter written and sent.

[ivanputski]

Hey Billy !!! I definitely sent an email... I hope SOMEHOW, they will make some meaningful changes, instead of kicking the can down the road.

[Kierran]

Originally Posted by pbadad

Hi Pete. Long time . Hope alls good.
We re on a letter writing mission at the club to show more representation. Yes you probably are right. Money talks and BS walks!
More rec guys need to show support. The other side has a $ motive and recs have a conservative motive. We can only do are part in what we believe is right for the specie. George from the club has been are advocate and getting the club informed throughout years of dealing with ASMFC.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Came out of the woodwork to say: email sent.

[MAKAI]

The good of the many outweigh the needs of a few.

Letter sent

[ivanputski]

Originally Posted by Kierran

Came out of the woodwork to say: email sent.

I havent been on here, or on ANY fishing related site for most of the season. Now that fishing is over, I can tune in and talk about it since there's no option to go do it.

I came online to see what guys were saying about the ASMFC .

Hopefully I can contribute something of substance on here this winter! hahaha

[clambo]

Remember back when there was a closure for all striper fishing? Well at the time we were told that the population was so depleted that the closure was warranted. At the same time I saw pictures taken offshore by a spotter plane pilot that showed huge schools of Striped Bass. They were feeding on Ocean Herring! Well the inshore Herring were depleted and the food was offshore so that's where they went to eat. If they only check inshore and not count fish offshore how can one get an accurate count? Also how can leaving the breeders in the water to breed not be beneficial to the species? I would love to harvest a 20 inch fish for the table than a 40+ fish any day

[piemma]

Originally Posted by clambo

Remember back when there was a closure for all striper fishing? Well at the time we were told that the population was so depleted that the closure was warranted. At the same time I saw pictures taken offshore by a spotter plane pilot that showed huge schools of Striped Bass. They were feeding on Ocean Herring! Well the inshore Herring were depleted and the food was offshore so that's where they went to eat. If they only check inshore and not count fish offshore how can one get an accurate count? Also how can leaving the breeders in the water to breed not be beneficial to the species? I would love to harvest a 20 inch fish for the table than a 40+ fish any day

Agreed Mike.