Going full circle

[Rockfish9]

OK..this subject is nothing new...it's been talked about over and over... so what's another round..

2 decades ago, I tried switching from J hooks ( then eagle claw 4/0) to Gamakatsu circle hooks.. these were offset of the same 4/0 size I had been using... my motivation was purely for personal gain... my thinking at the time was ( I was commercially bass fishing) that if I could unhook the fish faster, with less leader /hook retying I could make more money... being an eel fisherman, this scenario didn't quite go as planned... I dropped a lot of fish...mostly because the hook doubled back into the eel and often times missed flesh... to add insult to misery I gut hooked nearly as many fish... I stopped the "experiment" in short order...

over the last few year have dabbled in the use of circles... I no longer sell my catch ( and for the record hold no malice towards those that do.. it's their right/choice )so "speed" is not the motivation.. I'm trying to do what's best for the resource. short of not fishing ( and my aging eyes don't coordinate my fingers to tie knots as well as they used to)...I've used them for bottom/ ground fish with great success for quite a few years now...

Both myself, and the circle hook have advanced since my first "test" with them

This past July 4th.. I went to Maine for the weekend.. as most know Maine has a straight circle hook only rule ( prior to this trip I had only used off set circles)... I caught 27 fish of various sizes on cut herring and mackerel chunks( fished from the banks of the Saco while I drank a cold one)..every one of those fish was neatly hooked in the corner of the mouth...

Once back home I decided to revisit using circle hooks for live eels..

I've gone to Gamakatsu 5/0- inline octopus style...and absolutely love the results... I've used them with various sized eels on fish from 3- 40lbs.. the results have been the same... neatly buttoned in the corner of the mouth.. I haven't had a "eel ball" or a gut hooked fish yet.. it doesn't seem to matter if I'm deep water drifting.. or trolling or casting the result is the same... counting those 27 fish I'm close to 80 fish with out a gut hooked fish.. I couldn't say that about a J hook...

[Rockport24]

great stuff Joe - this is timely as I was doing some searching on this subject because I have been gut hooking more fish lately on the gami live bait hooks while live lining macks and was thinking about the circle again (I had similar results as you with circles in the past and didn't trust them). Didn't even think of the inline option thanks

[Grampa Greg]

RF9,
How are you going about "setting" or "not setting" the hook? With a J I always set the hook very hard. With a circle I don't set the hook. I let the fish run and hope that it catches in the corner of the fishes mouth. Are you doing anything different because I have lost a lot of fish using the circle hook.


GG

[Rockfish9]

Originally Posted by Grampa Greg

RF9,
How are you going about "setting" or "not setting" the hook? With a J I always set the hook very hard. With a circle I don't set the hook. I let the fish run and hope that it catches in the corner of the fishes mouth. Are you doing anything different because I have lost a lot of fish using the circle hook.


GG

just reel when the line comes tight..it takes some getting used to....

[Rockfish9]

some thing I have learned is you need to go a size or even 2 larger than you normally would... I like to use the smallest hook I can get away with... I found that by "upsizing" that is the difference, the hook needs to swing around the corner of the mouth like a hinge.. so it needs a little larger arch to do it's business...

[Raven]

Didn't know that Joe on using circle hooks "only" there
so good thread .... good info as always

[Sea Dangles]

I am as anti circle as you could find. Five years ago I was tarpon fishing in Fla and the guides were circle advocates. I pulled the bait out of a few before I got the hang of pointing the tip and reeling. I enjoy catching and don't envision any more experiments. Very seldom do I have a problem with removing the hook (gami 7/0 octopus).
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[Rockport24]

actually surprised you use 5/0, I would think you would need at least a 7/0 for a big fish, live and learn I guess!

[Rockfish9]

Originally Posted by Rockport24

actually surprised you use 5/0, I would think you would need at least a 7/0 for a big fish, live and learn I guess!

I used 4/0 J hooks... my 61 was caught using a 1/0 eagle claw... My style of fishing is totally different then %90 of the people on this site.. I find the bigger the hook the more it takes to "set" it... I use a 7/0 on macks.. but for eeling those big hooks rip( eel) lips and especially In shallow water tend to get the eel hung up...and when the fish are fussy.. I find the smaller hook to give a more natural presenting... I use 16lb line... there is just no need for me to use a monster hook...

[bart]

Originally Posted by Rockport24

actually surprised you use 5/0, I would think you would need at least a 7/0 for a big fish, live and learn I guess!

5/0 didn't choose his screen name for nothing

[niko]

8/0 inline for all my bait fishing for bass - circles are the way to go
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[JLH]

I’ve tried switching to circles a number of times but I never found that they held very well on larger fish. I think my issues have to do with the gap on the hook not being large enough for them to work effectively on bigger fish. I generally tried sizes from 7/0 for eels to 9/0 and 10/0 for cut bait.

Curious if the guys using them effectively are fishing a tight or lose drag and if that is a factor? I usually fish a tight drag with J hooks and bait and did the same with circles. A lot of the fish I dropped were midway through the fight or as I was getting ready to land them so I could just be applying too much pressure for circle hooks?

[Rockfish9]

Originally Posted by JLH

I’ve tried switching to circles a number of times but I never found that they held very well on larger fish. I think my issues have to do with the gap on the hook not being large enough for them to work effectively on bigger fish. I generally tried sizes from 7/0 for eels to 9/0 and 10/0 for cut bait.

Curious if the guys using them effectively are fishing a tight or lose drag and if that is a factor? I usually fish a tight drag with J hooks and bait and did the same with circles. A lot of the fish I dropped were midway through the fight or as I was getting ready to land them so I could just be applying too much pressure for circle hooks?

My drags are 1/4 the breaking strength of the line... try a smaller hook.... you will be pleasantly surprised.

[JohnR]

I have been exclusively Circles on eels for 7+ years now. While I miss crossing their eyes all those hooks in the corner of the jaw rather than deep are great.

[niko]

When I'm in a tight fleet I fish w/ a lot of drag w/ no issues jlh
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[JFigliuolo]

See Joe! The reason I was dropping fish with you was not the hooks... obviously the fisherman. wait.... that's not good.

[Stripersurg]

Been using circle hooks for close to 20 years now. Picked up on how to fish them fairly quickly, no setting the hook, just pull back when the line gets tight.
My favorite hook for chunking bait is the Daiichi circle chunk light hook, hands down the best performing hook, for me at least. Live lining, tend to use a 4/0 to 5/0 Gami with the Macks, doesn't interfere with their ability to swim very much, vs. having a large hook impaled into your back.
Success rate with both types...very high. Pretty much unheard of gutting a fish, unless you let it sit there and swallow away before setting the hook, then you might gut hook one. I snell my own hooks too, that way I can make the leader material any lb test I want, and the length as well.

[Grampa Greg]

So break it down step by step for me then....what exactly are you guys doing right after the hit?



GG

[wdmso]

wont use them with chunk bait.. hook turns into the bait

clams squid or Eel 99% hook up ratio right in the corner of the mouth and if snelled with the correct direction of line pull the hook wont turn out just keeps digging the harder the fish pulls

[JLH]

I don’t have any issues with hooking fish on them they do cut down a little on hooking fish deep which I like a lot. My issue is that I’ve dropped a number of good sized fish on them toward the very end of the fight, I don’t seem to have any issues with fish up to around 30-35 pounds but I’ve lost at least half a dozen fish that were very likely larger than that on them after getting them in close and I just can’t seem to figure out why. Possibly the small barb combined with fish changing angles and rolling when they get in close has been enough for the hook to pop free. I know guys (mostly boat or kayak) who use circles exclusively and land some very big fish on them but I’ve been very frustrated every time I’ve tried to switch over to them.

[tattoobob]

I used to call that an eel donut and dropped many of good fish because of it

[Rockfish9]

Originally Posted by JLH

I don’t have any issues with hooking fish on them they do cut down a little on hooking fish deep which I like a lot. My issue is that I’ve dropped a number of good sized fish on them toward the very end of the fight, I don’t seem to have any issues with fish up to around 30-35 pounds but I’ve lost at least half a dozen fish that were very likely larger than that on them after getting them in close and I just can’t seem to figure out why. Possibly the small barb combined with fish changing angles and rolling when they get in close has been enough for the hook to pop free. I know guys (mostly boat or kayak) who use circles exclusively and land some very big fish on them but I’ve been very frustrated every time I’ve tried to switch over to them.

were the hooks in line circles or offset... there is a huge difference between the two...those were my findings ( your results) using the offset.. thus my returning ( for close to 20 years) to "J" hooks.. every fish I have caught has been hooked solidly in or near the jaw hinge... some requiring the aid of a pair of pliars to remove it... what I had noticed with the off set, they often times were in the soft membrane by the hinge.. leading to a huge button hole...

Tattoo Bob...LMAO.. yes the cursed eel doughnut!

Granda pa Greg.... with cut bait, I use the bait runner... when a fish takes the bait I turn the handle and commence the fight...

When fishing eels... I keep the rod tip high.. when the initial strike is felt , I drop the rod... when the line comes tight, I raise the rod to the fighting position under steady pressure and reel...

I added 23 more fish to the tally last night all neatly buttoned in the side of the mouth..no dropped fish ...no missed fish... including this pork chop and a few of her fat sisters..

[JLH]

Originally Posted by Rockfish9

were the hooks in line circles or offset... there is a huge difference between the two...those were my findings ( your results) using the offset.. thus my returning ( for close to 20 years) to "J" hooks.. every fish I have caught has been hooked solidly in or near the jaw hinge... some requiring the aid of a pair of pliars to remove it... what I had noticed with the off set, they often times were in the soft membrane by the hinge.. leading to a huge button hole...

Last time I gave circles a serious try I was using he owner SSW circle hooks which are inline hooks and used them with bunker chunks. A good number of fish I caught were hooked in the corner of the mouth but some on the upper lip and some in the softer tissue inside the mouth. It could be that the size of the chunk is preventing the hook from consistently sliding into place like it would on an eel or a smaller piece of cut bait. I try to leave as much of the hook exposed as possible while not casting off too many pieces of bunker and used large 9/0 hooks thinking they would have a better chance to catching. I haven't been fishing much bait this season but if I do maybe I'll give them another shot.

[Grampa Greg]

Originally Posted by Rockfish9

Granda pa Greg....
When fishing eels... I keep the rod tip high.. when the initial strike is felt , I drop the rod... when the line comes tight, I raise the rod to the fighting position under steady pressure and reel...

I added 23 more fish to the tally last night all neatly buttoned in the side of the mouth..no dropped fish ...no missed fish... including this pork chop and a few of her fat sisters..

Thanks for the advise!
Hmmm that's pretty much what I do as well. The only thing I was told I was doing wrong was that I should Snell my hooks and not attach the hooks directly to a clip. Apparently the swinging circle hook won't catch as consistently and will come unbuttoned. I snelled a few hooks last night and will try them but if I continue dropping fish like I have done in the past I may just give up on them all together. (I really don't want to do that.)

GG

[Stripersurg]

Grandpa, that is correct, if I'm understanding you correctly, never, attach a bait hook, in this case a circle hook, to any kind of clip, snap etc... always line, then, further up the line a swivel if you want.
If you look closely, you can see the hook has penetrated the upper mouth, near the nostrils. No, I'm not stepping on the fish, in case anyone is wondering, it's laying in a depression, and my foot is on some ledge above it.

[Sea Dangles]

Nice pic
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[Rockport24]

Yeah I've been using 5/0 gami live bait hooks for a long time now, but always felt that the circle needs to be bigger, funny how get set on these unjustified crazy rules!

[FishermanTim]

Circle hooks are what I've been using for quite a few years, both fresh and salt.
Sure, you have to get used to not "setting" the hook but letting the fish set it for you, but unless the fish is utterly starving and inhales your bait and swallows in one motion you will generally have corner hook-ups.

The use of "offset" circle hooks tends to negate the "circle hook" effectiveness and create hookup similar to J-hooks, mainly gut hooked fish.

I had tried (briefly) using offset circles and ended up throwing them away because of the common gut hooking results.

Of course I am more of a lure angler now, but when I do go the bait route I grab the in-line circles.

As for the circles burying into the bait, you have to remember that unless you are live lining an ell, mack or pogie your bait is going to move in the current. I mean it will spin, twirl, flutter and flap.
That action can result in a buried hook point, which will either result in a missed fish or a gut hook.

I do agree with tying directly to the hook....NO snaps or swivels!!!

[N.ShoreFisher]

I'm always absolutely humbled and astonished at the amount of knowledge on here. It's funny how I never really thought of it before.I usually buy whatever is on the shelf (Gami octopus 5/0 or 6/0 offset).