And there it is....

[Backbeach Jake]

http://www.capecodonline.com/apps/pb...NEWS/806120324

[saltfly]

we're here to HELP you.ya right.screw the feds keep it local.

[hyefisherman2]

is this a good thing or a bad thing?

i sure dont have a problem paying 25 bucks, as long as it is helping our fisheries.

[doktorfaustus77]

maybe it will weed out some of the miscreants, litterers, careless types. Personally,I don't have a problem with the fee amount, but who knows what it may lead to once they have their foot in the door. Unfortunately some people who really care for the sport may not be able to muster up the cash.

[kenyee]

hye: you assume it'll be used for what they say it'll be used for. Politicians will think it's some free money in the budget to pay for raises...that's what happened to the gun licensing fees when they cranked that up and made all the laws convoluted; instead of part of it going towards the fish&game department, it went into the "General Fund".
After you watch their antics after a while, you'll understand why the old timers don't trust them. :-)
They'll realize it's "free" money, crank up the fees since they "deserve" a raise, hire more of their buddies for jobs to "manage" the licensing and reporting process, etc. Or maybe I'm just cynical and paranoid...

[Sea Flat]

Exactly!! I wish there could be some way that the $25 went right into a marine fisheries account that performed studies or helped conservation etc. I fear that this money will end up building roads or paying for a war that we shouldn't have started in the first place.

[likwid]

Originally Posted by kenyee

hye: you assume it'll be used for what they say it'll be used for. Politicians will think it's some free money in the budget to pay for raises...that's what happened to the gun licensing fees when they cranked that up and made all the laws convoluted; instead of part of it going towards the fish&game department, it went into the "General Fund".

This is federal, not state.
All signs (so far) pointing to the money staying in NMFS/NOAA.

http://www.st.nmfs.noaa.gov/mrip/
Direct link to the NMFS/NOAA site about this program.

Here's the exact text instead of a dumb article in the paper that more or less says, uh, nothing.

NOAA Proposes Rule to Require Saltwater Angler Registration

NOAA’s Fisheries Service is seeking comment on a proposed rule that requires anglers and spearfishers who fish recreationally in federal ocean waters to be registered before fishing in 2009.

The rule would also require registration by those who may catch anadromous species anywhere, including striped bass, salmon and shad that spawn in rivers and streams and spend their adult lives in estuaries and the ocean.
The proposed rule satisfies the National Academy of Science National Research Council recommendations to establish a national database of saltwater anglers, and meets the requirements under the Magnuson-Stevens Fishery Conservation and Management Act. The proposed rule is a part of a larger initiative of NOAA’s Fisheries Service to improve the quality and accuracy of data on marine recreational fishing and catches. The registry will also help measure the economic effects of recreational fishing on the national and local economies.

“The national registry of saltwater anglers is the key to closing a major gap in information on recreational fishing,” said Jim Balsiger, NOAA acting assistant administrator for NOAA’s Fisheries Service. “It will help us conduct surveys to get a more complete picture of how recreational fishing by an estimated 14 million people is affecting fish stocks. This will lead to better stock assessments and more effective regulations to rebuild and manage these valuable fish.”

NOAA may exempt anglers from registration if they already have a state-issued saltwater fishing license or registration, and the state provides sufficiently complete information to place in the national registry. In certain instances, anglers in states participating in regional surveys of marine recreational fishing may also be exempted. The new rule allows states to apply for exemptions.
States on the West Coast (including Alaska), the Gulf Coast, and the South Atlantic offer saltwater fishing licenses. Hawaii and the states from New Jersey to Maine do not.

“States without saltwater licenses have a strong incentive to adopt licenses,” said Balsiger. “Any fee that a state collects through a license can be used for restoration and fishery management in the state. By law, the registry fee taken by NOAA will offset the cost of issuing the registration. It can not be specifically directed to fisheries management.”

Fishermen would be required to be registered annually and NOAA will not charge a registration fee in the first two years. Beginning in 2011, the annual fee will be an estimated $15 to $25 per angler. Anglers under the age of 16 would be exempt from registering and fees would be waived for indigenous people, such as members of federally recognized tribes. NOAA’s Fisheries Service recognizes that many indigenous people fish for food as part of ancient cultural traditions.

Anglers who fish only on licensed party, charter, or guide boats would also be exempt, since these vessels are surveyed separately from the angler surveys. Also, persons who hold
commercial fishing licenses or permits, and are legally fishing under them, will be exempt from the registration requirement.

Registrations will include an angler’s name, address, telephone number, and the regions where fishing is conducted. This information will not be made public; it will be used only by NOAA to conduct surveys.

The National Academy of Science’s National Research Council advised NOAA’s Fisheries Service in 2006 to redesign its surveys of recreational fishermen for more accuracy, precision, and transparency. The NRC’s independent scientific review resulted in more than 200 recommendations for improving marine recreational surveys, including the recommendation to establish a national database of saltwater anglers. This recommendation became law in the Magnuson-Stevens Fishery Conservation and Management Act, the primary fisheries law for U.S. ocean waters, which was reauthorized in 2007. Please see http://www.st.nmfs.noaa.gov/mrip for additional information on this effort, the Marine Recreational Information Program.

For the last 28 years, NOAA’s Fisheries Service has conducted recreational fishing surveys through random telephone interviews with residents living in coastal counties. NOAA and its regional and state partners conduct an extensive program of dockside interviews of anglers to obtain data on their catch.

The national saltwater registry will enable surveyors to interview only those people who fish, and will reach all anglers, not only those who live near the coast. To read the proposed rule, go to http://www.countmyfish.noaa.gov.

Comments on the proposed rule will be accepted until Aug. 11. They can be mailed to:
John Boreman
Director, Office of Science and Technology
NMFS
1315 East-West Highway
Silver Spring, MD 20910
Attn.: Gordon Colvin

Comments can also be submitted electronically at http://www.regulations.gov.

NOAA is dedicated to enhancing economic security and national safety through the prediction and research of weather and climate-related events and information service delivery for transportation, and by providing environmental stewardship of our nation's coastal and marine resources. Through the emerging Global Earth Observation System of Systems (GEOSS), NOAA is working with its federal partners, more than 70 countries and the European Commission to develop a global monitoring network that is as integrated as the planet it observes, predicts, and protects.

[daceman63]

so when do we have to register our fishing rods, reels and lures? Just another instance of the gov't sticking it up our a$$es.

[likwid]

I love this part:

“States without saltwater licenses have a strong incentive to adopt licenses,” said Balsiger. “Any fee that a state collects through a license can be used for restoration and fishery management in the state. By law, the registry fee taken by NOAA will offset the cost of issuing the registration. It can not be specifically directed to fisheries management.”

NOAA is calling the shots.
No reason for most states to bother if they can't just shove the money in the general fund.

[kenyee]

Originally Posted by likwid

NOAA may exempt anglers from registration if they already have a state-issued saltwater fishing license or registration, and the state provides sufficiently complete information to place in the national registry. In certain instances, anglers in states participating in regional surveys of marine recreational fishing may also be exempted. The new rule allows states to apply for exemptions.

Err...see the dinner bell for the politicians?
It won't be exactly hard for them to extend their freshwater license to include saltwater so they can keep the fees, and of course, they'll increase the license fee since this will include "more" areas...

And the operative part of this "Any fee that a state collects through a license can be used for restoration and fishery management in the state" is "can". They can say the license is for other things and tack on more costs if I read it correctly. Without the full legalese, we're just guessing though...

[likwid]

Originally Posted by kenyee

Without the full legalese, we're just guessing though...

Its all there on the regulations.gov site.
Just very very long.

[Flaptail]

Told you all months ago it was coming. Another fee for nothing. Bait shops will take it up the ass, plain and simple on Cape.

Somne nitwit with a phd and no actual fishing experience dreams this
up as a way to find out who is fishing?

More likely a way to fund the research (ie: his grant) to do this ensuring them of an income for a not needed research project.

[Grapenuts]

Federial Receational Saltwater lisc.

How would you like it up your butt..with or without jelly?

[kenyee]

Originally Posted by likwid

Its all there on the regulations.gov site.
Just very very long.

It's currently in proposal form...not law yet, but I can't find anything in this that says the money can't be thrown into some random General Fund that the politicians can wallow in....or anything that says the states can only charge what's needed to cover their expenses:
http://www.st.nmfs.noaa.gov/mrip/abo...ter_Notice.pdf

As far as I can tell, it lets states claim their licenses are enough if they'll provide the names/addresses/phone#s of all their fishermen so someone can survey them. There's no limit on what fee the states think is "reasonable" for this.

What's amusing is the federal tracking info for this survey is estimated to cost $1.7M. Bet that'll go overbudget as usual

[wheresmy50]

Mark my words - fishing license then stamps for anything you actually want to catch, one at a time with a new one every 5 years.

Look at hunting and guns if you want to see how this will turn out.

“The national registry of saltwater anglers is the key to closing a major gap in information on recreational fishing,” said Jim Balsiger, NOAA acting assistant administrator for NOAA’s Fisheries Service. “It will help us conduct surveys to get a more complete picture of how recreational fishing by an estimated 14 million people is affecting fish stocks. This will lead to better stock assessments and more effective regulations to rebuild and manage these valuable fish.”

No it won't.

I've said it before, you can crticize the NRA all you want, but they don't give an inch without a fight. We need something similar.

[Flaptail]

Whats interesting about the NRA is that there membership is only 1.6 percent of the total legal gun owners in the US. The 98.4% don't actually agree with them and most of thier stances on assault weapons etc. It's their media campagn that gets them places.

To fight this Fed License or whatever it's called we need to have their media/public relations/advertising people whip up something for the fishing community.

Those guys are the pros at making an organization as formidable as the NRA compared to thier actual size.

[chris L]

at least you guys in RI and mass have an ocean to fish . all I have for the license fee is a stagnant pond that is full of weed any time there is wind ..

[Rockport24]

you know what's interesting about this is that you would think that Bush and the boys would actually be against this because it 1) raises "taxes" and 2) proposes to protect the environment

[DZ]

I was resigned to this years ago - like Flap said we knew it was coming. We can all sigh "woe is me" and be pissed or we can figure out what we want from this tax. You can bet individual states will be jumping to beat the feds to the money. Start thinking what you want the money to go for. We did a study here in Rhody a few years back - the state asked us what bennies we wanted from a license - we mentioned among other things free access to all state parks that charged a fee (Example Charlestown Breachway). They said it would be incorporated in the license law that a license gets you into the parks. Just one example but you can see what I'm getting at. We can all be pissed and get nothing or be mad and try and get the best deal for us. Our choice - Think positive.

DZ

[kenyee]

Originally Posted by Flaptail

stances on assault weapons etc. It's their media campagn that gets them places.

Their PR sucks compared to the real media who's in control who figured out how to abuse the words "assault weapons" and "semi-automatic"...I've seen so many news reports say these words and then show a machine gun firing at full auto, even though the words don't mean that (they're one pull one shot), just so they can strike fear and paranoia into the hearts of the clueless who won't take the time to look up what scary technical terms really mean

You can see them doing similar things to the plovers at OBX...and the seals on the cape..."oh the poor things....we have to savvvveeeee them"...LOL.

[Slipknot]

Originally Posted by Flaptail

Whats interesting about the NRA is that there membership is only 1.6 percent of the total legal gun owners in the US. The 98.4% don't actually agree with them and most of thier stances on assault weapons etc. It's their media campagn that gets them places.

WHAT?you mean the reason the other 98.6% of legal gun owners are not NRA members is because they don't actually agree with them or their stances on assault weapons etc. ? Or maybe it's just thta most of them don't feel the need to fork over $ to join an association they should not have to need to keep their right to bear arms. I'd like to keep the choice myself to own a weapon to protect myself and family, but don't feel like sending that org. any of my money, much like I love to fish and want to keep on fishing but don't feel it should be nesscesary to pay the Gov. any money for them to use the excuse they need to have info on rec fishermen. I have never been asked how many fresh water fish I have caught but still pay the required fee for the license, it should cover the ocean as well and I think it should cover the whole country while we're at it.

[Backbeach Jake]

Only Americans would have the genius to charge money for the right to live on the planet on which they were born. Get ready for an air meter on your nostrils.
Growing up, i thought that living off the land was the most natural way to live. My family in Truro clammed , fished and picked whatever berries in season. It was ( compared to today) a great life, a life whose pace was set by the seasons. Today everything seems out of time out of joint and rushed. Just not right, just not natural.
If you needed a fish for dinner, you just went down and caught one, not a big deal, they were there. They were ours.
The idea of paying the government for the right to catch a meal, to me ,is revolting. How dare they tax the dinner on my table? Fishing for me and many others on the Cape and elsewhere for that matter is not a sport but a necessity. Everyone in this country is not well to do(anymore). Just when this economy hits the skids, our table fare is taxed. Let me be first to say this: Screw that , I will not pay on friggin dime for a saltwater permit...Period. I am now and forever, a poacher. I will kill and eat the King's deer.

[Nomad]

For those of you in Maine check this link out. It goes to the DMR and is for an angler logbook. I fill one out each year and it takes about 3 minutes to fill out after fishing.
http://www.maine.gov/dmr/recreational/logbooksurvey.htm

Sorry for you guys in Mass....our socialist governer is pushing hard for a saltwater fishing tax as well......right in the pooper

[Backbeach Jake]

Karl. I haven't bought a freshy license in 10 years, My clamming permits are only 6 bucks , I think, and Tony does a grand job of managing the greatest flats in the World. And I'm just this close to driving the beaches without a permit, 150 bucks and I've been out twice since. Look , I don't drive on vegetation, I don't climb hills, I don't run over birds( and I've seen evidence of that , and it makes me sick), so what's the gripe with me and other guys like myself who just want to fish? What did we do to deserve being "fined" on a yearly basis? I just don't get it. It's never going to end, the pocket picking ,until we somehow make it end. So what do we do?

[Backbeach Jake]

http://www.capecodonline.com/apps/pb.../BIZ/806120309

[BasicPatrick]

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Thursday June 12, 2008

MA Salt Water Fishing Registry (aka: License) Process to Begin
A statement from the Massachusetts Striped Bass Association

This morning, in newspapers across the state, it is being reported
that beginning in 2009, the federal government has announced a plan
through NOAA/Fisheries to institute a recreational angler registry in
states that do not have a salt water angler registration (read:
license), and this includes MA. This action is the result of a
requirement in the Magnuson-Stevens Reauthorization Act passed in
congress last year and has been anticipated for some time. This
announcement will without a doubt trigger the formal process of MA
considering developing a salt water fishing license.

There are many unanswered questions and issues involved in and related
to the upcoming process and MSBA has been preparing our involvement
for over a year. Over the past winter MSBA approached both the head of the MA DMF Sport Fishing Program, Dr. Mike
Armstrong and MA DMF Director Paul Diodati and suggested that the DMF
not wait to be forced into this process by a federal proposal and be
proactive and convene a committee of recreational fishing
representatives to explore options for MA recreational anglers. I am
happy to report that last week, MSBA was invited to participate in
just such a committee. MSBA President Bill Prodouz has appointed MSBA
Past President and Gov't Affairs Officer Patrick Paquette to represent
and also educate and inform the MSBA membership throughout this process.

Historically, MSBA has been opposed to a Salt Water Fishing License
and that position will not change without a vote of the MSBA
Membership. Conversations with and between members both on and off
the floor of MSBA monthly meetings indicates the MSBA membership is
open minded to some sort of registry/license if it contained certain
details that would benefit our fishing community and would not result
in just another tax. Being affiliated nationally with the
Recreational Fishing Alliance also has enabled MSBA to learn about
registry/license details that have and have not worked in other
states. In the coming months, MSBA will communicate accurate
information to our membership via our newsletter and website
www.msba.net and will undergo the process of making decisions and
taking positions. As always, MSBA is prepared for the coming process
and will help lead the MA recreational fishing community through the
upcoming process.

One note of caution: In the coming days and weeks there will be a
great deal of speculation, rumor, confusion and mis-information
written in newspapers and on the internet about the "pending"
registry/license and related processes. MSBA urges all MA
recreational anglers to avoid joining the inevitable emotional roller
coaster and resist the urge to react to every bit of information. Our
state has a fifty plus year history of organized recreational fishing
organizations and the best way to address the issues is through these
organizations that have the experience and relationships needed to
navigate through the political process we now face. In addition to
participating on the MA DMF committee mentioned above, MSBA has
already taken action to provide our membership with accurate
information. At the MSBA membership meeting on June 25th, in addition
to the monthly entertainment, this month supplied by Armand Tetreault
of Rhode Island Poppers, MSBA will shorten it's regular business
meeting in order to hear a 20 minute presentation, without debate,
from the federal agencies developing the angler registration program
announced today.

For more information, attend MSBA monthly meetings, monitor
www.msba.net, read the MSBA monthly newsletter or contact MSBA Gov't
Affairs Officer Patrick Paquette (BasicPAtrick@aol.com).

[jimmy z]

It is what it is. What was once free, isn't anymore. Anyone can say whatever, and justify it anyway they want, but it's all about the buck.
And you're prolly right, the next thing will be a tax on the air we breath.
But ya know what? We allowed this to happen. We just lost our focus.

[Nebe]

How much is it going to cost?

[Backbeach Jake]

I'm in the middle of a book about the "Boston Tea Party". Our Forefathers saw this coming long ago. They boycotted tea over a 3% tax. The tea rotted in warehouses until the East India Company lowered the price to make up the difference and then some, tea was to be actually cheaper than before the tax. The colonists said no way it's about the tax, not the price. The principle, stupid. The Brits forced the tea into American harbors. It was dumped, the Governor's house was ransacked and robbed. Principle. We gotta get one of those, a principle....

[likwid]

Originally Posted by Backbeach Jake

We gotta get one of those, a principle....

And for it to work it needs to be all or nothing.
An internet site or two isn't gonna cut it.