Is the old guard losing it?

[Pete_G]

Originally Posted by #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&

So overall? I dont care to much for the new guard I have met, there are a couple but not more than that. They have no idea that we who have done this for 20yrs or so have seen it all, guys who go all out and then quit after a few seasons, guys who resent you because you wont take them to your spot etc, I have seen and heard it all!

The whole attitude now is different, I will stick with the old timers, and the steves of the world, they just get it!

I don't think that you have met right people then. There are a lot of great young anglers out there, and most don't spend time online. You might even learn something...

When we put on a trash clean up in the spring or fall as many young guys come out as old timers, maybe more. I wouldn't dismiss them. Maybe you're hanging around the wrong shop or the wrong people something, most of the young surfcasters I know have a lot of respect for the old guard and are protective of the future of surfcasting.

I'm sure DZ and many others would back me up on that.

[eelman]

Originally Posted by Eben

ouch...

Eben , seriously there is " no game on" its just the way I feel. Hey look, you went to a spot, on your own and nailed a nice fish because you had a hunch, a feeling whatever, you did it on your own and fished with your gut! Thats Fishing!!

I tell people stuff and the reply is always the same "where do you fish though"
That just turns me right off ! The other thing is "how big were your fish last night" What the heck difference does it make? there fish aren't they? you cant pick size!!

I was told "how too" by many of the older guys but I was very rarely shown a spot, they said go find it on your own, it made me a better fisherman. I have met people along the way, mutual friends that know people etc.. and have lucked out on a few spots. I certainly dont feel bad about it, thats life and it happens, places like the breachways, I completly learned to fish on my own with trial and era, many lost jigs and more than a few guys yelling at me for not doing the rotation right! I fished past that toughened up my skin and became the guy doing the yelling But hey surf fishing is hard work.

Once the old timers new you had what it takes they loosened up and once they new you were not trying to jump in there honey hole, they began to let you in the "circle" man when that happens it just feels good, you have earned your respect!!! welcome to the world of surf fishing! Things in 2005 are not anything like then however and it never will be again.

Pauls partner Gill who passed away, was one tough guy to crack! It must have took me 5 years before he would even sneeeze in my direction! But once I earned my place, he took me fishing, sponsered me to become a member in his club etc... we fished the cape several times, it was just a good feeling.

As far as fish? yes I am impressed when someone gets a good one, but I have so many 30plus pound fish, I am kind of numb to it, what really makes me take notice of a guy is CONSITANCY , one who has learned to catch on a constant basis a few years of that and you get noticed fast, now you have guys asking you!!

Everything I have ever said or done fish wise I could back up! I dont lie! I have pictures, witnesses, and a host of other things to back up my talk! So you can call me many things but a liar...nope....nota....I have nothing to prove at all, if you have caught it, I have caught it several times over, Show me consistancy, a willingness to find fish on your own, and you have earned my respect! You never want to get a rep as a liar in this game! really bad!!

As far as you Eben! I think your ok in my book, we have certainly had a few moments but I think we know where each other stands.We know where each other is fishing and its great that neither of us is stepping on the others toes, But I feel now that you wont do that and vise versa...your earning the trust!

Steve made a comment yesterday to me he said "did you hear what eban said"? I said what " he said, "If you new the hours and time it took to get this fish" That my friend speaks for itself!!!!!

Tight Lines

[eelman]

Originally Posted by Pete_G

I don't think that you have met right people then. There are a lot of great young anglers out there, and most don't spend time online. You might even learn something...

When we put on a trash clean up in the spring or fall as many young guys come out as old timers, maybe more. I wouldn't dismiss them. Maybe you're hanging around the wrong shop or the wrong people something, most of the young surfcasters I know have a lot of respect for the old guard and are protective of the future of surfcasting.

I'm sure DZ and many others would back me up on that.

Sorry pete, I have fished wit DZ, I dont see him holding the hands of these guys, I have taken him to my spots and he has taken me to his.I like dennis alot, great guy.

I stick with what I said

[basswipe]

Originally Posted by spence

You guys kill me...

I'm 34,

I try to get out 1-2 times per week...and know very few locals who fish the same waters where I live. As such it isn't easy to learn the nuances of the spots or even new techniques.

These issues of burning spots, not respecting locations or people etc...have everything to do with immaturity and a lack of class...and nothing with the new guard of surfcasters...

-spence

I'm with Spence.I'm not much older but I have been fishing locally all my life.Surfcasting as most define it here I've only been doing the last few years.

#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& please don't take this personally but if you are a rep of the
"old guard" it doesn't sound all that grand.Fishing 7 nights a week from one end of the season to the other.Only trusting one or two people.Actually being "scared to risk it". I don't know you personally so this is only an observation but from what you've posted its sounds like you live a very lonely exsistance.And it sounds like most of the joy many get from fishing just isn't there for you.Again let me state not knowing you personally what I've said is a logical observation.For the most part your post IS very negative.But I
will agree finding and catching fish all on your own is very satisfying.

For me personally life's too short to be totally consumed by one thing.
There's women to be had or one woman many times if you're married or have a G/F as I do.There's places to go and things to see(a nascar race for example).

To be lumped into a group called the "new guard" doesn't bother me.

That's my .02.I hope none here take offense to it.

[outfished]

This is the way I see it. I never ever mind sharing my spots with a couple of people I can trust(as far as I can judge) and if I can hook a rookie, youngster, newbie, call it what you want, I think protects our future in striper fishing. Think about it, if you went fishing a lot over a number of years and caught nothing because you didn't know what you were doing, would you continue? If on the other hand you went out early in your fishing life and caught some really decent fish because somebody showed where and how and now your hooked on fishing for the rest of your life and now you shared this art with other upcoming fisherpersons, wouldn't that help our sport by continued efficient management and preservation/concern for our sport? Yes I agree, a lot of leg work and detective work is in order for our sport and I have indured/wasted/enjoyed and learned the hard way over the years always yearning for someone to show me how. So now that I'm somewhat wiser in my fishing endevors I jump at the chance to turn someone special on to this great sport with the understanding that they be discreet about whom they blab to. We owe it to the future generations of striper fishing to keep it going long after we're gone.

[eelman]

Originally Posted by basswipe

I'm with Spence.I'm not much older but I have been fishing locally all my life.Surfcasting as most define it here I've only been doing the last few years.

#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^& please don't take this personally but if you are a rep of the
"old guard" it doesn't sound all that grand.Fishing 7 nights a week from one end of the season to the other.Only trusting one or two people.Actually being "scared to risk it". I don't know you personally so this is only an observation but from what you've posted its sounds like you live a very lonely exsistance.And it sounds like most of the joy many get from fishing just isn't there for you.Again let me state not knowing you personally what I've said is a logical observation.For the most part your post IS very negative.But I
will agree finding and catching fish all on your own is very satisfying.

For me personally life's too short to be totally consumed by one thing.
There's women to be had or one woman many times if you're married or have a G/F as I do.There's places to go and things to see(a nascar race for example).

To be lumped into a group called the "new guard" doesn't bother me.

That's my .02.I hope none here take offense to it.

No offense taken, your right its a loney existance. Next to my wife and daughter its all I think about, all I want to do, what everything else revolves around! So Thanks for the compliment.

Sorry if the post is negative , however I have just been used and burned to many times by "inocent newbies" Surf fishing is done at night, its solitary, its dark, its you and the fish! Its not happy hour at hooters, fishing with an entorage.

[eelman]

Originally Posted by Pete_G

I don't think that you have met right people then. There are a lot of great young anglers out there, and most don't spend time online. You might even learn something...

When we put on a trash clean up in the spring or fall as many young guys come out as old timers, maybe more. I wouldn't dismiss them. Maybe you're hanging around the wrong shop or the wrong people something, most of the young surfcasters I know have a lot of respect for the old guard and are protective of the future of surfcasting.

I'm sure DZ and many others would back me up on that.

By the way pete, and I mean no disrespect here but, lest see, you work at a baitshop or own it I dont know...Of course those are the only comments you can make! these people are all customers!!


An being "online" means nothing I am online because I have nothing better to do all day and it passes time, its nice to be retired

[outfished]

#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&

[fishaholic18]

Bill, we gotta fish together one night, we think too much alike..

[eelman]

Originally Posted by fishaholic18

Bill, we gotta fish together one night, we think too much alike..

[fishaholic18]

Originally Posted by #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&

LOL

[outfished]

Originally Posted by #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&

Got room for another slob?

[fishaholic18]

Originally Posted by outfished

Got room for another slob?

Got blindfold?????

[outfished]

Originally Posted by fishaholic18

Got blindfold?????

That bad?

[fishaholic18]

Originally Posted by outfished

Got room for another slob?

If you look like your avitar...You're in!

[outfished]

Originally Posted by fishaholic18

If you look like your avitar...You're in!

If I was my avatar I'd been in by now. I did find a beach last weekend with a couple feeemale nudied sunbathing.

[outfished]

Kinda suuked, had my GF's 14 yr old nephew with me fishing the surf

[fishaholic18]

Originally Posted by outfished

I did find a beach last weekend with a couple feeemale nudied sunbathing.

Lets fish there.....

[outfished]

Originally Posted by fishaholic18

Lets fish there.....

I'll trade ya a spot, better yet I'll take you there. Somewheres in cape cod bay

[fishaholic18]

Originally Posted by outfished

I'll trade ya a spot, better yet I'll take you there. Somewheres in cape cod bay

I don't do trades...........
I want your avitar.....for a plug of course...

[outfished]

Originally Posted by fishaholic18

I don't do trades...........
I want your avitar.....for a plug of course...

I'd give up my avitar for a plug...and a beer

[bassmaster]

Originally Posted by spence

You guys kill me...

I'm 34, raised in Iowa and before a few years ago had never seen a tide chart in my life. I got into surf fishing when I discovered you could catch stripers from shore...had no idea...although I had caught many from boat.

All my gear is new because I've only been at it a few years.

I try to get out 1-2 times per week...and know very few locals who fish the same waters where I live. As such it isn't easy to learn the nuances of the spots or even new techniques.

Granted, I've never known the shore access of old, but it takes only a few seconds to realize how prescious what we have today is, and what a few irresponsible keystokes could do.

People like Piemma, RIRockhound and Eben have shown me a lot, and never asked for anything in return...except for Eben

These issues of burning spots, not respecting locations or people etc...have everything to do with immaturity and a lack of class...and nothing with the new guard of surfcasters...

Now if you'll excuse me, I have to go polish my Versace wading belt.

-spence

this is a way of life here and taken seriously
when You put time in and hard time, the last thing ya need is to have your spot burned
I been fishin all my life and was gifted and caught alot of large fish and alot of small fish also.
countless 30 and 40 lb bass
I have gone 1 year with only 1 fish that was 35.5 inches long any one remeber that decade
I have fished the islands and sold bass , basicly the whole 9 yards.
My old map is gone but there was notes all over it and You know what,,,,
its time to learn other places here on the cape and I know alot of stuff here, to be a guide I gots to but one thing I do know is You never stop learning
the fishing has been hard here as the fish been of shore and isolated pods come in to chow the bait.
quite frank most of this post is friggen stupid
get of Ya duff put ya time in and make your own goddamn reports and stay the hell outa bait shops it aint worth the prize money trust me........

[kippy]

Well said Dave, its all about putting your time in on the water. I have been surfcasting for 5 years and did not get my first keeper until last year. There were alot of fishless nights and self doubt. I stuck to it though and it's paid off. Fishing is not all about catching fish for me though, its about being outdoors. I think you become too frustrated if you expect to catch everytime your out there.

[Back Beach]

The old timers that are still at it now are doing it for love of the sport. In the past, there was a monetary incentive to fish more and talk less. The money kept you at it longer and harder than it does now for the most part. Access on the backside of the cape and elsewhere is part of the issue too. Most of the old timers I know now fished for money in the past as it was good incentive, considering in today's dollars you could earn over $1000 a night if everything went right. If that were the case today, you would see a lot more people on the water during the wee hours.

[Pete_G]

Originally Posted by #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&

By the way pete, and I mean no disrespect here but, lest see, you work at a baitshop or own it I dont know...Of course those are the only comments you can make! these people are all customers!!


An being "online" means nothing I am online because I have nothing better to do all day and it passes time, its nice to be retired

Originally Posted by #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&

Sorry pete, I have fished wit DZ, I dont see him holding the hands of these guys, I have taken him to my spots and he has taken me to his.I like dennis alot, great guy.

I stick with what I said

Trust me, if I feel like it, I'll call anyone or anything out on something. Like I'm doing now...

There are two people who would be considered "old guard" and have caught a lot more then "a 50" from shore that spend plenty of time helping the younger crowd in Newport. They don't give out spots (not their good ones anyways) but they definitely are very generous with everything else including their time. They live anything but "a lonely existence" but they are great surfcasters.

They're the old guard I respect and I can also perfectly respect being protective of spots; reference also any tuna thread on this board, I'm sure you'll notice me slamming the ProJo or anything else related to spot burning. Try taking everyone one at a time instead of assuming everyone younger then you is a useless, spot burning surfcaster.

To say "The whole attitude now is different, I will stick with the old timers, and the steves of the world, they just get it!" is completely ignorant. I really don't think there is a big divide between "new and old guard" anyways.

[eelman]

Originally Posted by Pete_G

Trust me, if I feel like it, I'll call anyone or anything out on something. Like I'm doing now...

There are two people who would be considered "old guard" and have caught a lot more then "a 50" from shore that spend plenty of time helping the younger crowd in Newport. They don't give out spots (not their good ones anyways) but they definitely are very generous with everything else including their time. They live anything but "a lonely existence" but they are great surfcasters.

They're the old guard I respect and I can also perfectly respect being protective of spots; reference also any tuna thread on this board, I'm sure you'll notice me slamming the ProJo or anything else related to spot burning. Try taking everyone one at a time instead of assuming everyone younger then you is a useless, spot burning surfcaster.

To say "The whole attitude now is different, I will stick with the old timers, and the steves of the world, they just get it!" is completely ignorant. I really don't think there is a big divide between "new and old guard" anyways.

If dennis does that, I am glad for him, I have nothing but good things to say about him! always nice always willing to help, on the new guy issue we may have different opinions and that is fine, its a free country. But dennis is good people.

Hey does this mean my money isnt green if I come into your store?

[piemma]

I'd like to respond to Pete's post. I only met "#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&" about 4 months ago although I knew of him from my late partner Gil Guilletone. Gil had always told me that "Bill Nolan is a hardcore surfman and a good fisherman."
Bill is cut from a different cloth than the run of the mill surfcaster. He is passionate about his craft and to him it is a craft. It's not "just fishing" It part of who he is. I fish with a couple of guys who do not post on any internet site and they also believe that surfishing is "part of who we are".

Some of #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&'s post rub some people the wrong way but, as with anyone who is passionate about something, this will happen. Bill is the consummate surfcaster, a dedicated surfman and a decent guy. He may state his opinions in a way that offends some people but who on this board has not offened someone.
let's keep this whole thing is perspecive. Everyone is entitled to their opinions. I see no useful purpose served by calling people ignorant for what they believe in.
Now, that's my opinion, for whatever it's worth.

[eelman]

well, maybe not as hardcore as I used to be but still love it !! And always will

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by capesams

I agree with all the above..method's..plug's...jig's...eel's etc. havn't really change all that much and how to use them over the passed [let's just say a long time]...what I've seen is the loss of fishing turf[land] with all the people that moved in to live near the water. atleast here anyway.Alot of the good fisher's have given up because of this...they had endless mile's of free space with no one coming out to kick them off..not today..it's a whole new game. Yes some have passed, but for the most part they just gave up because of the lack of LOST productive SPOT"S. that and the lack of good fish.The good old day's are gone...enjoy what little is left.

Sounds like birdhunting at my house, I used to walk out the door and take a two hour walk, get lots of shots, now there is a house in every one of my favorite spots. I don't go much anymore.

[Pete_G]

Originally Posted by #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&

If dennis does that, I am glad for him, I have nothing but good things to say about him! always nice always willing to help, on the new guy issue we may have different opinions and that is fine, its a free country. But dennis is good people.

Hey does this mean my money isnt green if I come into your store?

You're always more then welcome in the shop, in fact we'd probably get along pretty well as I really enjoy spending hours talking with McKenna through the winter.

Sorry if I come off a little agressive on this subject; I just really don't share your view on the younger crowd.

We need more surfcasters like Dennis to protect access and generally be ambassadors of the sport; and without influence from guys like him there is the potential, as you put it, for us not to "get it".